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View Full Version : Any way to widen commands column?



Sebasvideo
08-24-2013, 07:39 AM
One of the things I hate about Windows as opposed to Mac OS X (which I'd be happy to use if I wasn't forced to buy Apple hardware) is the font rendering. It's thin and has horrible anti-aliasing. So to make it easier to read I set Layout to Verdana @8 pt. which is pretty good as far as size and readability goes, but because the command column on the left seems to be a fixed size, many commands or choices get cut off, as you can see in the screenshot. Is there a way to widen it so I can use larger font sizes?

Thanks,

Sebastian

116584

scallahan1
08-24-2013, 08:15 AM
This has been bugging me a lot as well. Can't wait for a good fix. I use it primarily on a 18.4" laptop screen and changed a Windows setting to make things larger so I can read the menus. I still suffer from the cut off commands. When I bring up the Render Globals window I can only see about 3 characters of each tab.

Steve-o

Wade
08-24-2013, 10:27 AM
Do make a feature request here and in the proper location and you never know it might just get taken care of.

Snosrap
08-24-2013, 10:55 PM
Requires a whole new version of LW I'm afraid.

Sebasvideo
08-25-2013, 08:44 AM
Requires a whole new version of LW I'm afraid.

You mean code wise? It can't be that hard, somewhere in those lines of code there is a number that sets how wide that is, it's just a matter of adding a setting in the preferences to change it, or even without that, to make it 10 or 20 pixels wider. They can do that in the next update if they want.

Snosrap
08-25-2013, 09:14 AM
You mean code wise? It can't be that hard, somewhere in those lines of code there is a number that sets how wide that is, it's just a matter of adding a setting in the preferences to change it, or even without that, to make it 10 or 20 pixels wider. They can do that in the next update if they want. Eventually I am assuming they want to have a completely user configurable interface, but for now it is what it is. A user configurable interface will require a new toolkit or more work done to the current one. My guess is that will part of the new LW - the one with the Hydra engine etc. etc. -as NT will want to make a big splash with it and cool new interfaces sell software. (Along with great new features of course. :))

Sekhar
08-25-2013, 09:17 AM
One of the things I hate about Windows as opposed to Mac OS X (which I'd be happy to use if I wasn't forced to buy Apple hardware) is the font rendering. It's thin and has horrible anti-aliasing...

Not sure what you're talking about. Did you try setting ClearType (Control Panel -> Fonts)? I use pretty small font, and it renders great.

Sebasvideo
08-27-2013, 08:21 AM
Not sure what you're talking about. Did you try setting ClearType (Control Panel -> Fonts)? I use pretty small font, and it renders great.

I have Cleartype set to the maximum possible contrast, and still font rendering in Windows is absolutely horrible compared to Mac OS X, as it always was. You can even see this in tutorials done in either OS, Mac OS X fonts always look a little heavier, not bold, but great to read. Windows fonts always look thin unless you use bold style, but then it looks too fat. But well, I'm not going to spend thousands of dollars on overpriced hardware just to have the pretty fonts. If they release Mac OS X for any PC, that's the first thing I would be in line at the Apple Store for.

Sekhar
08-27-2013, 09:49 AM
I still think it's a setting issue. I go back/forth between PC and Mac through a KVM switch (so the display is the same), and I never noticed any significant quality difference. Perhaps you can post an image to show the difference? We can then check to see if we have the same issue.

Sebasvideo
08-27-2013, 10:00 AM
I still think it's a setting issue. I go back/forth between PC and Mac through a KVM switch (so the display is the same), and I never noticed any significant quality difference. Perhaps you can post an image to show the difference? We can then check to see if we have the same issue.

It's not, google Mac OS X font rendering and you'll find tons of results talking about the same thing. If it was a settings issue some people wouldn't have wasted time writing code for a project called GDI++ to try to mimic Mac OS X font rendering in Windows. Unfortunately, said project has been abandoned a long time ago, and it never worked well in 64 bit Windows anyway. There's even a Firefox plugin that tries but doesn't succeed at mimicking Mac OS X's font rendering, but it's not that necessary because the only place in a Windows system where font rendering is almost as good as Mac OS X is Firefox, with IE9 coming in close. Font rendering is just horrendous in Google Chrome, and it has been for as long as I can remember, with many people complaining about it but Google hasn't fixed it yet.

Regardless, I don't have a Mac so I can't post any screenshots, I had three Macs between 1999 and 2007 but switched to self built PCs which are far better than any Mac or brand PC as far as processing power and stability goes, for a far cheaper price. I just wish Apple would open Mac OS X for any PC, not just Apple ones.

Sekhar
08-27-2013, 10:32 AM
Sorry if I wasn't clear. I wasn't talking about the Windows font being identical to the Mac font or trying to mimic it, but about it being equally legible...which as I see is your problem to begin with and why you're resorting to a bigger font and running into the LW column issue. Anyway, my fonts are pretty small and still render great on Windows with ClearType on. If you're convinced that it's a Windows issue, of course I have nothing more to say.

Sebasvideo
08-27-2013, 10:40 AM
Now I see what you mean. As far as readable, I can read it in its default size. It's just that at 42 my sight is not what it used to be, and I prefer larger fonts as much as possible. That's what I like about Firefox, Ctrl+wheel and I can make the text as large as I want in a snap, and if the website is properly designed, everything resizes properly. I wish it was that easy with software.

Sebasvideo
08-30-2013, 11:54 AM
I tested a lot of different fonts, and the one that seems to make things easier to read in Windows is Segoe UI Semibold. Good thing is that now both Modeler and Layout take a GUI font change, I remember having the LW 11 trial and it was only Layout. The way to change it, for those of you who don't know, it's to add this at the end of the target field in the shortcut's properties: -f"Segoe UI [email protected]"

JohnMarchant
08-30-2013, 01:16 PM
I tested a lot of different fonts, and the one that seems to make things easier to read in Windows is Segoe UI Semibold. Good thing is that now both Modeler and Layout take a GUI font change, I remember having the LW 11 trial and it was only Layout. The way to change it, for those of you who don't know, it's to add this at the end of the target field in the shortcut's properties: -f"Segoe UI [email protected]"

Didnt know that, thanks for the tip

Sebasvideo
08-30-2013, 07:32 PM
One thing I just realized though. If you're using Modeler, you do a Send To Layout and Layout was not open, it will not open with the font you set, but the default one. But, if you open Layout and just leave it open, when you do Send To Layout, Layout will stay open and will show the selected font.

Doctor49152
08-30-2013, 08:22 PM
this type of thing is bad on my 27 inch screen with 2560x1440. Would be beyond horrible on a 4k monitor!

xchrisx
08-30-2013, 10:52 PM
neat trick. I like Segoe better than the default font :)

JohnMarchant
08-30-2013, 11:38 PM
Yes i noticed that. Its a shame we cant put it in the configs, a default font.

Sebasvideo
08-31-2013, 12:54 AM
this type of thing is bad on my 27 inch screen with 2560x1440. Would be beyond horrible on a 4k monitor!

Well, that's a problem of the current times. One is that they make monitors with huge pixel counts but dimensions that are too small for the amount of pixels. 2560x1440 on a 27" is crazy. You need at least a 30" for that. When I wanted a 27" screen I went to a store and realized that the 2560x1440 ones were going to be more expensive not only because of their price, but because I was going to have to buy binoculars to read the text, especially in Windows. So I ended up buying a 1920x1080 and I'm perfectly happy with it. Of course in Windows you can raise the DPI, but more than one application gets screwed up when you do that.

Matt
08-31-2013, 05:16 AM
Requires a whole new version of LW I'm afraid.

For these particular toolbars not really. The width was hard coded in several places, I actually made it possible to widen by passing a variable, if you check back a few versions you'll notice that I did make it wider. Adding a preference for the default width wouldn't be a stretch.

Sekhar
08-31-2013, 07:47 AM
For these particular toolbars not really. The width was hard coded in several places, I actually made it possible to widen by passing a variable, if you check back a few versions you'll notice that I did make it wider. Adding a preference for the default width wouldn't be a stretch.

Actually, we should be able to drag to resize like with other apps.

Sebasvideo
08-31-2013, 07:58 AM
For these particular toolbars not really. The width was hard coded in several places, I actually made it possible to widen by passing a variable, if you check back a few versions you'll notice that I did make it wider. Adding a preference for the default width wouldn't be a stretch.

So is there a chance you can make it happen in a future update? Even if it's not a preference, simply adding about 15 or 20 pixels to it would help a lot.

JohnMarchant
08-31-2013, 08:07 AM
I think through configs would be good for this and the font used.

Snosrap
08-31-2013, 08:36 PM
For these particular toolbars not really. The width was hard coded in several places, I actually made it possible to widen by passing a variable, if you check back a few versions you'll notice that I did make it wider. Adding a preference for the default width wouldn't be a stretch. I'm sure Matt, but I think you know what I'm referring to - a complete overall to the toolkit to give users broader access to the UI configuration. I'm sure you want more flexibility as well so you can do your thing. :)

sami
08-31-2013, 09:05 PM
You are right, font rendering in windows is horrible regardless of LW's interface. However I'd forget about all these fonts you are talking about in this thread (as they need space, better font hinting, and don't render that well at small sizes) and instead just find a nice pixel font. There are many ultra small pixel fonts that are super crisp and readable, but are meant for exact pixel rendering and no antialiasing but still are very usable. Have a look for some pixel fonts you like.

madno
09-02-2013, 12:49 AM
Regarding the high dpi on 27''.
I think it would help to be able to change the size of the "live" text of the new tools in LW. On my display I can't read it anymore in some cases. I have to guess what the text is by identifying its shape and length instead of actually reading it. Foged it some time ago.

116760

Sebasvideo
09-02-2013, 10:50 AM
Regarding the high dpi on 27''.
I think it would help to be able to change the size of the "live" text of the new tools in LW. On my display I can't read it anymore in some cases. I have to guess what the text is by identifying its shape and length instead of actually reading it. Foged it some time ago.

I think in your case it would be necessary to raise the DPi in the screen properties. I can see your screenshot fine, but I have a 1920x1080 27". On one of those 27" with gigantic resolutions like you have, I can see how that would be a problem. Which makes me glad I bought a $350 Samsung consumer 1080p monitor as opposed to the 27" professional one that was going to cost me twice but it was 2560x1440.