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View Full Version : Thanks NT for LW11.6's color picker!!



Snosrap
07-29-2013, 07:48 PM
A big thanks to NT for the upgraded color picker. I've been using the freeware version of Jovian forever and quite frankly always felt some guilt for not throwing Mr.Nign a bone. And now thanks to NT's generosity my sins are forgiven. :) Heck they even gave us the full fledged version! This truly is a fantastic upgrade for LW. NevronMotion and ChronoSculpt are great new additions to the LW family of tools for those that need those solutions, but who doesn't need a great color picker - now we got one! Also I think it's cool that NT said "to hell with the old one" as it's nowhere to be found! Great going NT!

tonyrizo2003
07-29-2013, 11:29 PM
I agree !!! Love Jovian color picker and now that it is native in LW is even better!!

Thomas Helzle
07-30-2013, 04:21 AM
Yeah, great move, but I wish I could get an update to my paid version of Jovian as well. It keeps crashing on Windows 8 and I love using it in Photoshop as well...

The site seems to be down now, my emails got no replies...

Cheers,

Tom

Waves of light
07-30-2013, 04:39 AM
It was the one demo at Siggraph I missed, and it's not available on the Ustream archives. Looks like a nice addition.

khan973
07-30-2013, 04:52 AM
In the About LightWave 3D in 11.6, ken Nign is in the team, so i guess the support is discontinued and it's a part of LightWave 3D now.
Good to know it doesn't work on Win 8, I really love to use it in Photoshop too. I have my client's / projects colors well organised and it makes me work faster.

jburford
07-30-2013, 04:58 AM
Shame that all of the available color libraries are not simply included. And, where is the part about Linear Color Flow in the Jovian/LW Interface? (no longer see it) So, my question, does it automatically select or know what you use, based on the normal CS Settings?

OlaHaldor
07-30-2013, 05:31 AM
Good to know it doesn't work on Win 8, I really love to use it in Photoshop too. I have my client's / projects colors well organised and it makes me work faster.

The new color picker works for me in LW, on Windows 8.

Thomas Helzle
07-30-2013, 05:36 AM
Yeah, I was talking about the paid standalone Jovian, not the one included in 11.6.
It's rather flakey on Windows 8 x64.

Cheers,

Tom

jburford
07-30-2013, 05:46 AM
Interesting, found a 2.0.12 version of Jovian by me and the Color Libraries which were extra.... If I import the color libraries, it comes in, and can select. But if I quit LW and come back in, the color libraries are not there. Not saved. Also not pulled in nor saved, if I copy to the folder where LW 11.6 puts them ( C:\Users\Seven\AppData\Roaming\Jovian ).

Also, could someone check if you select Save Color from the Library part of the new Color Picker if it crashes for you?

Kryslin
07-30-2013, 10:25 AM
I imported the jovian.jcl color library from my Jovian Installation, and it stuck. My collection of color libraries (every one that I found for Jovian, plus a couple of utility libraries I had made) is there, right at my finger tips. Haven't tried the Save Color yet.

wyattharris
07-30-2013, 11:05 AM
After using it for the last week, I can't imagine how I got along before. So many awesome features in that one window.

jwiede
07-30-2013, 11:23 AM
I too miss the paid "system colorpicker add-on" version, but yeah, kind of doubtful those versions will receive further development, alas. Still, glad to have it built into LW, so long as the color library support continues to work (incl. saving new colors/libraries).

Thomas Helzle
07-30-2013, 11:49 AM
Just got a reply from Ken where he said that my last mail must have come in when he just started working for LW and therefore was very busy.
He was on the run but will answer me later in more detail. So I keep my hopes up for a bugfixed full version ;-)

I thought you might want to know. I'll keep you updated.

And yes, Jovian as a replacement for the windows color picker is also extremely awesome. So easy to synchronize colours between apps etc. and have your project colours available everywhere. I guess it would even make sense for the Lightwave Group to make the full version available to LW users to enhance everybody's life :-)
Awesome for web development as well.

Cheers,

Tom

funk
07-30-2013, 01:03 PM
Matt posted some jovian color libraries here (http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?95677-Jovian-Color-Picker&p=840671&viewfull=1#post840671) back in 2009

Waves of light
07-30-2013, 02:01 PM
Matt posted some jovian color libraries here (http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?95677-Jovian-Color-Picker&p=840671&viewfull=1#post840671) back in 2009

Thank you so much for these.

Cageman
07-30-2013, 02:44 PM
Many people seem to be using the windows version of Jovian to use it in pretty much any app. I wonder... wouldn't it be a good idea for LW3DG to continue selling Jovian Standalone, just like they sell ChronoSculpt?

wyattharris
07-30-2013, 03:13 PM
That's what I was thinking. Can't see any down side to it.

DuneBoy
07-30-2013, 07:52 PM
Hello, Ken here (the brains behind the color picker, while Matt's the beauty). :D

Glad you all like the new LightWave Color Picker, I just wanted to try and clear up a few things.

Just to avoid anymore confusion about which version of the color picker we're talking about. The new color picker in LightWave 11.6 is called the LightWave Color Picker (listed as LightWave in the color picker popup). Where it counts, this new color picker has little resemblance to the original LW Jovian plugin. Although the main GUI didn't change, no need to touch Matt's awesome work.

Where do the old Jovian color pickers stand?
LightWave 3D Group/NewTek are now in charge of that code and its future. However 'Jovian' the brand name, I believe would be left behind.

Include other libraries!
Only colors which don't include trade-names are included in the default library. e.g. no Pantone colors.

Where's the Linear Color Options?
The LightWave Color Picker uses LW's Color Space options, which can be found in LW's regular settings panel.

If anyone finds any issues/bugs with the new LightWave Color Picker, please use the LightWave bug reporting system (since it's a part of LW). Whereas Jovian issues can be emailed to me and (after work) I'll try to help.

Snosrap
07-30-2013, 09:09 PM
So Ken, are you now a full-time employee of NT? What are your areas of expertise if I may ask? - Great job on the color picker.

Ma3rk
07-31-2013, 12:34 AM
Hello, Ken here (the brains behind the color picker, while Matt's the beauty). :D

:
Where do the old Jovian color pickers stand?
LightWave 3D Group/NewTek are now in charge of that code and its future. However 'Jovian' the brand name, I believe would be left behind.

Include other libraries!
Only colors which don't include trade-names are included in the default library. e.g. no Pantone colors.

Where's the Linear Color Options?
The LightWave Color Picker uses LW's Color Space options, which can be found in LW's regular settings panel.
:


Good to see you resurface Ken.

I haven't tried yet, but I take it that the "LightWave Color Picker" can still load the Jovian libraries? Do saved libraries have to be stored anywhere special then?

Since your site seems to be down, should questions be sent to you here on the forum then?

M.

Lewis
07-31-2013, 12:35 AM
So Ken, are you now a full-time employee of NT? What are your areas of expertise if I may ask? - Great job on the color picker.

He's going to be extremely picky :) ;) :D.

check this
https://www.lightwave3d.com/assets/plugins/contains/Ken%20nign/

Good to hear some Q/A Ken, thanks.

COBRASoft
07-31-2013, 03:27 AM
I mailed Ken some time ago about Win8 and I got a version from him that works flawlessly. So, he has the solutions, the question is if he's still allowed to give it now he's part of NT.

NT should make this color picker a seperate product too (and provide it for free for LW users). E.g. my brother doesn't own LW, but he's a proud owner of Jovian stand alone for PhotoShop.

creacon
07-31-2013, 05:06 AM
It's a nice addition to LW, but this really should have been a "live" colorpicker, especially in combination with VPR.
In my plugins I issue a "redraw" command when an event occurs, but I'm not sure if that is considered to be safe.

creacon

MSherak
07-31-2013, 11:24 AM
Include other libraries!
Only colors which don't include trade-names are included in the default library. e.g. no Pantone colors.


Here is some of the colors stuffed into a library that I have collected for Jovian.. There are the basics plus pantone, hsk, toyo, paint brands, crayons, color temp, etc.

Snosrap
08-05-2013, 09:12 PM
Hey does anybody know what the "Live Matching" check-box does?

DuneBoy
08-06-2013, 12:04 AM
Hey does anybody know what the "Live Matching" check-box does?

Sorry I haven't had a chance to get back into this thread before now. But I can answer that Q real quick. With the Color Library open, making a color adjustment (say changing the hue) will cause a Matching Color Search to take place (when Live Matching is enabled). Normally a Matching Color Search is done when you click the current color swatch on the lower left.

If you're not getting any results in the search, be sure the Matching Range (in the Color Picker's Settings panel) is set high enough (40-60 seem good). Having lots of colors in your library also helps.

Waves of light
08-06-2013, 02:06 AM
Pick from screen is already coming in handy.

Snosrap
08-06-2013, 06:58 PM
Sorry I haven't had a chance to get back into this thread before now. But I can answer that Q real quick. With the Color Library open, making a color adjustment (say changing the hue) will cause a Matching Color Search to take place (when Live Matching is enabled). Normally a Matching Color Search is done when you click the current color swatch on the lower left.

If you're not getting any results in the search, be sure the Matching Range (in the Color Picker's Settings panel) is set high enough (40-60 seem good). Having lots of colors in your library also helps. That's SWEET!!!

spherical
08-06-2013, 08:19 PM
OK, so what am I missing? In both 11.6 32-bit and 64-bit installs on a 64-bit OS, the LW color picker shows the upper left square in colors as expected. On the 32-bit OS, the LW color picker shows a greyscale gradient in the upper left square but the Jovian plugin shows the upper left square in colors as expected. Configs were not a problem, as the install went into a separate set of directories. Gotta be right in front of me but... I asked this in another thread and nuttin'.

EDIT: Well, for whatever reason, I loaded a new library and chose a Pantone color from it, the greyscale turned into colors and now works fine.

DuneBoy
08-07-2013, 12:19 AM
OK, so what am I missing? In both 11.6 32-bit and 64-bit installs on a 64-bit OS, the LW color picker shows the upper left square in colors as expected. On the 32-bit OS, the LW color picker shows a greyscale gradient in the upper left square but the Jovian plugin shows the upper left square in colors as expected. Configs were not a problem, as the install went into a separate set of directories. Gotta be right in front of me but... I asked this in another thread and nuttin'.

EDIT: Well, for whatever reason, I loaded a new library and chose a Pantone color from it, the greyscale turned into colors and now works fine.

Sorry, I didn't see that other thread. If you want a bug fixed or an issue looked at, the best way to get it in-front of the dev's eyes is to report it via an email to (I think) [email protected] (content, or screen captures in this case, go a long way in helping to track down a potential problem).

The forums are nice, but we simply don't have the time to search them for bug reports.

Two quick questions I'd have when you were getting the grayscale gradient in the main color selection area are:
What color mode you were in (Red, Green, Blue, Hue, Sat, Value, Kelvin, Wave).
And what color value was shown in the RGB and HSV controls for the color being shown.

I ask because when in Saturation mode, and the Saturation is at 0. Then you'll get that gray gradient and it's perfectly normal. Why there may be a difference between the LightWave Color Picker and the old Jovian is that Jovian had a "LW Mode" where it wouldn't update its main color selection area as the saturation was changed (this was to emulate the now gone LW_ColrPickr). This "LW Mode" is no longer present and thus saturation changes will always be reflected in the main selection area.

spherical
08-07-2013, 03:40 AM
Sorry, I didn't see that other thread. If you want a bug fixed or an issue looked at, the best way to get it in-front of the dev's eyes is to report it via an email to (I think) [email protected] (content, or screen captures in this case, go a long way in helping to track down a potential problem).

The forums are nice, but we simply don't have the time to search them for bug reports.

Oh, I've submitted a lot of bug reports; mostly during the 9.x, Core and 10.x Beta programs. This wasn't really a "bug report". It was a "What am I missing?" Bug reports would be composed differently and it turns out that the latter was exactly it.


I ask because when in Saturation mode, and the Saturation is at 0. Then you'll get that gray gradient and it's perfectly normal. Why there may be a difference between the LightWave Color Picker and the old Jovian is that Jovian had a "LW Mode" where it wouldn't update its main color selection area as the saturation was changed (this was to emulate the now gone LW_ColrPickr). This "LW Mode" is no longer present and thus saturation changes will always be reflected in the main selection area.

And that was indeed it, as I said in the edit. The Pro Jovian, now included in LW, operates differently from both the OS-native color picker and Jovian plugin. Now that I see that the saturation column influences the gradient, it all becomes clear.

Great work on this, BTW, but you know that. :thumbsup:

spherical
08-08-2013, 03:37 AM
Something further on this. What threw me off at first was that, when clicking on the color swatch in Surface Editor, the existing color position in the gradient seemed to be located but the saturation was at 0; rendering the gradient in greyscale. It wasn't fully loading the existing color into the dialogue. After "waking it up" by happening to select a random color from a library, it does. No clue why.

DuneBoy
08-08-2013, 08:53 AM
What were the RGB values of the color shown in the Surface Editor's swatch before opening the Color Picker and experiencing this behavior?

spherical
08-08-2013, 10:28 PM
Heck, I don't know now. It was more than a week ago that I upgraded these boxes to 11.6 and the files tested on each would be different anyway. Like I said, the System and Jovian plugin color pickers work the same way, and that is what I was used to. No matter what the saturation level of the material swatch, the gradient would show as color. Only the LW built-in, and probably the Jovian Pro, change the gradient display according to saturation, as chosen in the saturation column.

DuneBoy
08-09-2013, 12:54 AM
No problem, just trying to make sure there wasn't an issue. :thumbsup:

spherical
08-09-2013, 02:14 AM
Most of the issue was me not knowing how Jovian Pro worked and that it was different from the non-Pro version--if indeed its operation is the same as the version now native in LW, that is. When presented with a situation counter to that which one has experienced for years (the gradient is always color, no matter what the saturation may be), things become confusing. Happening to select a color in a library while stumbling around and the greyscale gradient lit up in color also lit the candle.

aquinde
08-24-2013, 10:32 AM
I'm loving the new Color Picker and am so glad I read this thread and found the additional libraries.

But I'm trying to figure out how to make my own folders in the library. Well making the folder is simple enough but how do I get colors into it and then name them? I've got a list of theatrical gel colors that I'd like to get into the color picker.

DuneBoy
08-24-2013, 02:42 PM
With the destination folder selected, chose a color then click the Add Color button. That will add the current color to the selected folder.

Renaming I just found an issue with. But, after the color has been added, you'll have to click it to select it and then you can rename it via the text field below the library (tap Enter to set the name). The issue I found is that after adding the color, the internally stored 'selected entry' isn't updated. I'll get that fixed for the next release, so that you won't have to click the entry after adding it in order to name it (adding folders are affected as well).

aquinde
08-24-2013, 03:11 PM
With the destination folder selected, chose a color then click the Add Color button. That will add the current color to the selected folder.


Ah, OK. I'd tried that before but I was trying to put them into the root of the new folder. Once I made a sub-folder of the new folder(e.g. My Colors/Lighting Colors), then had that selected and hit Add Color, it worked fine.

Thanks DuneBoy

Snosrap
08-24-2013, 09:20 PM
Ken it would be nice if once a color palette was imported it would be persistent between sessions.

- - - Updated - - -

Ken it would be nice if once a color palette was imported it would be persistent between sessions.

DuneBoy
08-24-2013, 10:03 PM
Ken it would be nice if once a color palette was imported it would be persistent between sessions.

It should be. What are the steps you're taking?

Snosrap
08-24-2013, 10:52 PM
It should be. What are the steps you're taking?I downloaded the file Funk provided in this thread and unzipped it in a folder I made called Color Palettes, imported it and used some of the new colors. Closed LW, reopened it and the color palette needs to be re-imported. What steps should I be taking? :)

DuneBoy
08-25-2013, 01:18 AM
Those sound about right. I just tested and it seemed to work fine. Load a Palette file, close the picker, close LW, re-open and the imported palette was still there.

That palette file that the color picker loads is stored in your configs folder, it's named ColorPalette.lcp

I'd check that the file exists and is being written to. It should get saved anytime there's a change to the palette (importing a new one or re-assigning a single color). The save takes place when the picker window is closed.

In the absence of the ColorPalette.lcp file the color picker has the default values stored internally.

aquinde
08-25-2013, 08:04 AM
Load a Palette file, close the picker, close LW, re-open and the imported palette was still there.


I had the same problem as Snosrap. Yesterday I'd imported the Jovian Colour Libraries.jcl and they seemed to 'stick'. Then during my experiments with setting up my Lighting Colors folder they disappeared.

Having seen Snosrap's post this morning I tried importing the Jovian libraries again in a new folder and it looked good but it went away after relaunching Layout. So I tried again but this time I applied a color form the Jovian Library. I think it's the only thing I did differently this second time. This time the library persisted between sessions.

DuneBoy
08-25-2013, 11:46 AM
I still have not been able to replicate the palette not saving. However I did find an issue with the Library, the first time it opens the 'selected entry' is incorrect. Which allows you to import colors outside of the Collections folder. This causes them to not be saved because only the contents of the Collections folder get saved (along with the History folder but that's another file).

Similar to the renaming issue, you'll need to click the Collections folder (or another destination folder before importing a library). I'll fix this issue in time for the next release.

aquinde
08-25-2013, 11:53 AM
I still have not been able to replicate the palette not saving. However I did find an issue with the Library, the first time it opens the 'selected entry' is incorrect. Which allows you to import colors outside of the Collections folder. This causes them to not be saved because only the contents of the Collections folder get saved (along with the History folder but that's another file).

Makes sense. I think on the first go-round this morning the new folder wasn't a sub of the Collections folder. On my second attempt it was.
Thanks.