PDA

View Full Version : NevronMotion - Motion Cleanup Tools?



2create
07-24-2013, 11:28 AM
Hi All!

I know it's just been released but I really like the look on NevronMotion and am just wondering if it has any nice keyframe cleanup tool's built in or even in 11.6 to automate the refining or smoothing of motion capture data from a Kinect. Similar to iPi Studio's Jitter Removal or Trajectory filtering?

Eagle66
07-24-2013, 01:17 PM
God question, the NevronMotion SIGGRAPH Show is very superficial and inaccurately....

LW_Will
07-25-2013, 01:02 AM
Well, they were taking the data into lightwave and there were no refining or smoothing that I saw. They had a person come from the audience today (Wed) and do a little dance. Then, she turned around, a full 360 degrees. Of course, the data stream was lost, and the model went wonky... and then pick right back up. It never stopped being recorded... well, streamed by the sensor. It is a little more advanced than iPI, and a bit not. See, the goals are a bit different. NM seems to be trying to be stable for the upper half of the body. So it wants a good upper torso/facial recog... period.

The iPI appears to be looking for as near 100% accurate mocap that it can get from the sensor. That's why it has a two step process, capture and tracking. This to me is a deal breaker. Just watching Cody or Dave standing in the capture stage and sending the mocap LW was amazing. I'm already thinking of what I will be doing in my videos.

Having said that iPI is more accurate, I will say that you can adapt the mocap from Nevron Motion in useful stuff. The feet are a bit floaty... but you can just select from the hips down and delete. Then add lower body motion from another take. Or, if you watch how the IK works, you can clean up a walk cycle.

Again, I think it should be said that this plugin does not FIX animation. Oh my gwod, no. It doesn't follow the hands at all. So... morphs for the hands.

But, having said this, this plugin is a great achievement for Lightwave. Does ANYTHING from Autodesk come with built in mocap? Are the rest (iClone et al.) come with a full renderer, character maker, texturing... thing? I think not!

I was a bit upset when I saw that this was a paid plugin. But, I had my $200 ready to plunk down because Nevron seems the best money for value. I mean, replace it for the cost.

Thanks to everyone at the Lightwave Group, esp. Dave and Lino.

Eagle66
07-25-2013, 11:59 AM
Okay, thanks for the report.

But you not really need NevronMotion, if you have iPi Motion or JimmyRig.

So if NevronMotion has not something like a cleanup tool you need other Motion software too, because a recorded Kinect mocap has no realism data quality.

LW_Will
07-25-2013, 02:06 PM
Okay, thanks for the report.

But you not really need NevronMotion, if you have iPi Motion or JimmyRig.

So if NevronMotion has not something like a cleanup tool you need other Motion software too, because a recorded Kinect mocap has no realism data quality.

Ah... yes and no. Remember, the mocap is only half of the capability of the Neveron Motion. Retargeting is the key. It works flawlessly and extensively. I'm not sure how Jimmy uses retargeting... its more like targeting, right?

Greenlaw
07-25-2013, 02:15 PM
I use iPi Mocap Studio 2.0 with dual Kinect controllers, three PS3 Move controllers and Motion Builder, and this combo works perfectly with LightWave, but I still purchased Nevron Motion this week anyway.

In general, if you have the iPi system as described above, I don't believe Nevron with Kinect will give you anything more capable or as accurate for full body capture. Mocap results using iPi MS2 with Dual Kinect (or 4 to 8 PS Eye cameras) is far more accurate and capable than current realtime single Kinect systems, plus with the additional PS3 Move controllers, it can capture wrist and head rotations with great accuracy. The anticipated MYO support should also give you accurate forearm, wrist and finger capture. (MYO is not out yet but that's the plan according to the devs.) And if you have Motion Builder or an account with the web-based Webanimate system, it's fully compatible with LightWave. (FYI, iPi MS2 has its own retargeting but it lacks mocap editing tools. Actually, these days iPi MS2's FBX export should work fine with LightWave but I don't have current experience with this.)

But after seeing the demos at Siggraph, I think I can find productive uses for Nevron even with the gear I currently use. For example, even though iPi with dual Kinect is very easy to set up and calibrate, Nevron with Kinect should be even easier to set up. I'm pretty certain I will continue to depend on iPi MS2 for tricky, complex motions but I may turn to Nevron for more 'simple' motions because it can apply them directly to the rigged character in LightWave. Having created short films using Kinect tech for a couple of years now, I think many common motions can be captured just fine with Nevron and Kinect--this should free me to dedicate more time on the difficult stuff I intend to keep capturing with iPi MS2 and the multiple contollers systems.

Nevron also appears to give you flexibility in how to use the Kinect data in LightWave. I can see myself using it to set up alternative methods of digital puppetry. Imagine, operating a virtual rod or hand puppets thorough pantomime gestures. That would be a literal application of course, but I can also imagine puppetery controls that would be impossible to create in the real world.

I'm also aware that the Kinect SDK includes face capture capability, and I'm assuming that Nevron will leverage this feature in the future. This potential feature is something I'm very interested in because, even though there are several other Kinect based face capture systems currently out there, none of them work directly or easily with LightWave yet.

Also, at $199, Nevron is a pretty cheap purchase right now--a deal too good to pass up, in my opinion. :)

G.