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RebelHill
07-23-2013, 10:34 AM
So, the new spline control in 11.6 is a great addition, capable of doing a whole bunch of nifty things, so I figured folk'd probably like to see a tutorial to get them going with it. This is from the tools section of my rigging tutorial series and I thought, seeing as its an all new tool and all, Id post the whole thing for all y'all rather than just a clip bit. Hope you enjoy.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gCVneRb141I

Cheers.

mummyman
07-23-2013, 10:37 AM
Thanks!!!!!

OnlineRender
07-23-2013, 10:49 AM
ty

photoguy1278
07-23-2013, 11:57 AM
Thank you!

Spinland
07-23-2013, 12:08 PM
Most excellent, thank you!

digitaldoc
07-23-2013, 12:10 PM
Perfecto! Thanks.

Ryan Roye
07-23-2013, 12:35 PM
Excellent tutorial. It makes for a great introduction for the tool and explains some of its caveats (and ways to get around them) as well.

Thumbs up!

MannaTheBerserk
07-23-2013, 12:35 PM
Thank you very much!

hrgiger
07-23-2013, 01:26 PM
Awesome Rebel.

Reco
07-23-2013, 02:32 PM
Thank you. That was quick.

Reco

RebelHill
07-23-2013, 02:40 PM
That was quick.

I have the moves like effin Jagger!

Glad ur all liking (:

khan973
07-23-2013, 04:16 PM
RebelHill, I know your secret for being that fast ;)

khan973
07-23-2013, 04:23 PM
BTW, Do you think you' ll upgrade your rigs to make them compatible with Nevron motion so we can benefit from retargeting?

chikega
07-23-2013, 07:20 PM
Excellent addition by the LWG and extremely gracious of you Craig to offer your insights into this new feature that many of us have been clamoring for. Thank you!

Celshader
07-23-2013, 11:39 PM
So, the new spline control in 11.6 is a great addition, capable of doing a whole bunch of nifty things, so I figured folk'd probably like to see a tutorial to get them going with it. This is from the tools section of my rigging tutorial series and I thought, seeing as its an all new tool and all, Id post the whole thing for all y'all rather than just a clip bit. Hope you enjoy.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JBTIXqPPB8&list=PLTds3QePYrWEWipwKkLmyNT4Tf_JTigM2&index=13

Cheers.

Thank you for helping the LightWave community get up-and-running with this multi-purpose tool. :thumbsup:

sukardi
07-24-2013, 12:04 AM
Excellent.

Thanks Craig

bazsa73
07-24-2013, 12:04 AM
I already fell in love with this new feature. From now on I will add at least one spline control to my rigs even if not needed. Waiting so long for this.

CaptainMarlowe
07-24-2013, 12:16 AM
Great tutorial, thanks ! Spline control seems to be a very powerful addition.

Digital Hermit
07-24-2013, 09:20 PM
Thanks RH! Ever since I purchased your radiosity tutorial I knew this would be good stuff going beyond what I expected.

alexs3d
07-24-2013, 11:58 PM
thank you so much for that tutorial ;)

GregMalick
07-25-2013, 08:37 AM
WOW RH!
You're so fast!

thanks!

Hieron
07-25-2013, 02:52 PM
RH, what would be a good way to go about deforming the objects on that spline. Much like using the nodal Spline Deformer by Denis?
As it is a motion control tool, doing it directly won't work. Setting up a bone chain matched to the spline and using bones from item? hmmm, not really working for me. Probably user error?

Would be great if there was a deformer node that picks up on this motion Spline Control and deforms the object accordingly.. (and allowing some extra inputs to play with it nodally too)

ps: great addition this tool, thanks for your tutorial.

geo_n
07-25-2013, 09:46 PM
Thanks for the tutorial RH.

nickdigital
07-25-2013, 10:32 PM
RH, what would be a good way to go about deforming the objects on that spline. Much like using the nodal Spline Deformer by Denis?



The morph through bones technique should work fine with this setup.

allabulle
07-25-2013, 11:06 PM
That was quick. Thanks!

Hieron
07-26-2013, 01:46 AM
The morph through bones technique should work fine with this setup.

But does it? (parented carriages, easily driven and animated like shown here without deform) And even then it is not quite fine... adding bones and morphs just to get it to conform.

DP's spline deformer goes a long way mind you, it just seems that this (great) Spline Control could use the deforming too. Without bones or morph trick. It seems a logical step someone would make.

UnCommonGrafx
07-26-2013, 05:44 AM
Yes, I would like to deform to the spline.
How might one use a Ribbon on the spline without bones.
Raycast node? Haven't had that success, yet.

Afalk
07-26-2013, 06:46 AM
Great walk-through and explanation! Thanks for putting it together and for sharing it!

motivalex
07-26-2013, 06:50 AM
I have dumped dpit spline for this new tool and getting good results using bones to deform a human colon subd to its right shape and animating the nulls to deform it as a medical camera goes through it. Only problem I had was the banking of bones which twisted it which I sorted by setting bank to keyframe only. The straight colon model that I am manipulating to shape is running along the z axis.

I see slowdown problems if number of bones exceed a certain number, but that's a bone problem not the spline tool. It would be good if it worked on deforming a mesh without bones too.

lardbros
07-26-2013, 07:03 AM
Thanks Rebel... nice video!

RebelHill
07-26-2013, 08:18 AM
Nope... this spline control doesnt offer any kind of deformation, unless you stick a chain of bones on it. Notice though that since you cant get the spline length (or put items on the spline as a % of its length) then there's no way to distribute bones down its length (save for the shown "line" example) prohibiting the use of it to create "stretchy" spline deforms in any way using bones.

For doing all that kinda stuff, you'll want the DP spline deformer node tool instead.

khan973
07-26-2013, 10:30 AM
The few improvments I expect is:

the ability to limit the ends so you can move to infinite or until you hit the two ends of the spline
deforming spline so we can use it without bones to deform a mouth, brows and so on.

Tobian
07-26-2013, 11:35 AM
a preset 'make spline and apply to object' would be nice too, as while it is not hard to make, it took me a few times to figure it out myself.

Thanks very much RH, very nice tutorial!

khan973
07-26-2013, 11:42 AM
Why would you want that Tobian?

How LW is supposed to know the path you want? the lenght? the number of knots?
It's so easy and fast that I don't see why we'd need that.
You can record and make a script.


What I'd love to see is a little scipt Python (cough...) to convert Modeler Splines to Layout oneS.
It shouldn't be too hard to apply a master (1st vertex?) and convert the other vertex to Nulls.
Come on fast developpers, a little exercice for the week end :)

Tobian
07-26-2013, 11:54 AM
ok 2 scenarios

1) simply make a basic spline for you.. Most of the time I don't want a 1m cube either, but I'm happy for it to do that by default. You could input number of knots and length maybe. It could be written as a basic lscript or Python

2) Ok so you have a dinosoar tail? How about a script which you say 'add spline to bone chain' you select the root bone for the tail, and it adds a user defined number of nulls down the bone chain...

As i said a 'preset' not a specific tool to the interface. Something to speed things up.

khan973
07-26-2013, 01:21 PM
I like the 'add spline to bone chain' idea!
Or it could be 'make spline from selection' then it just uses the position of the objects, and creates a spline with it.

RT-4-777
07-26-2013, 01:34 PM
This is great stuff, Rebel, you're the best.

Toonwonder
07-26-2013, 02:58 PM
Thank you, Rebel..you are always a solid help in understanding the tools and functions of Lightwave!

RebelHill
07-27-2013, 03:31 AM
I like the 'add spline to bone chain' idea!
Or it could be 'make spline from selection' then it just uses the position of the objects, and creates a spline with it.

Do I have to do everything?? :p

***USAGE***

Select an item or items... run the script... items will get a spline control with the entered number of nodes. "Parent In", when checked, will parent the spline to the first item's parent (making it a sibling, you'd use this for tails, tentacles, etc... leave it off for things like snakes, trains).

Note!!! You choose the FIRST ITEM by selecting it first... then selecting other items. So if selecting a hierarchy, select it from TOP to bottom... not the other way round, or right click the top item to select it and all children... Just give it a go... you'll see.

Cheers.

Tobian
07-27-2013, 05:29 AM
awesome work RH, I shall have to try this later! :-)

raw-m
07-27-2013, 09:54 AM
Another thank you from me won't hurt (also to subscribe incase I miss any of these nice little scripts)! Would also like to see some kind of deformer in future updates. Great Stuff :D

Cageman
07-27-2013, 12:27 PM
Nice walkthrough RH! :thumbsup:

allabulle
07-28-2013, 02:44 AM
Thanks RebelHill!

Ryste3d
07-29-2013, 12:23 PM
I do hope yoy are on the LW payroll... how eles would we ever know this. Thanks

PhotoTekArtWork
07-29-2013, 09:08 PM
Thanks for the tutorial RH.

Hail
07-30-2013, 05:42 AM
Good stuff as usual RH. :)
Thanks you!

Kryslin
07-30-2013, 10:28 AM
*is waiting patiently for how to use the crazy thing as a spine in another RHR 2.0 tutorial*
(My own experiments haven't been too successful...)

This was very useful, though. Thanks!

wyattharris
07-30-2013, 11:02 AM
RH, you are so generous with your time.
This tutorial is a great jump start, thanks for that.

khan973
08-08-2013, 04:47 AM
RH, do you know a plugin to convert a Modeler Spline to Layout Nulls?

dpont
08-08-2013, 05:55 AM
...do you know a plugin to convert a Modeler Spline to Layout Nulls?

As I know, the Spline of Spline Deformer is partially compatible with Spline Control,
except that Spline Deformer uses Z-Scaling for adjusting the tension of the Spline,
which should not be a problem,
I recently improve the Load Spline conversion,
for a better continuity of the knot orientation (tested with a spiral shape).

Denis.

jeric_synergy
09-08-2013, 10:43 AM
Awfully nice of you to post this in full, RH, thank you so much!

I must say, it seems that the behaviour "only items without children become spline controllers" SEEMS like it would be very handy for some clever clever person to exploit for some purpose. I have no idea what that purpose will be, but I sense it lurking out there. My guess is either you or Jen will discover it.

Kryslin
09-08-2013, 04:49 PM
Awfully nice of you to post this in full, RH, thank you so much!

I must say, it seems that the behaviour "only items without children become spline controllers" SEEMS like it would be very handy for some clever clever person to exploit for some purpose. I have no idea what that purpose will be, but I sense it lurking out there. My guess is either you or Jen will discover it.

I've been experimenting with it, trying to get a stable spine set up that plays nice with the rest of the rigging. I think I know what's going on, but I need to experiment more, and review some new training materials.

Use same as Item to lock those nodes to another item, or parent the spline nodes to other items, and use the parents/control items to control the spline. You can change the positions of the nodes to correct curvature, if you need to. One of the many fun things you can do with Spline Control... including crash lightwave. ("This program has been terminated in an unusual way. Please contact the developer for assistance.")(Yes, I know, 11.6 is pre-release, essentially beta software. )

jeric_synergy
09-10-2013, 08:33 PM
I note this is Yet Another LW situation where having "static objects" would be convenient, as it would be a great deal easier for those wanting a static spline to adjust it without continually having to make keyframes on frame zero. Ideally, users could if desired adjust a static spline simply by moving the nodes, period.

(It's been months since I've used LW, and I remember generous user had a solution, but it only worked on a channel by channel basis, IIRC, and patched items to be static. Once channel at a time is not very convenient, though.)

shadowshifter
09-10-2013, 09:02 PM
I'm going to thank you in advance and watch it later as I'm technically supposed to be hacking right now (but reading Lightwave forums is more interesting) :)

Hail
09-11-2013, 01:25 PM
I note this is Yet Another LW situation where having "static objects" would be convenient, as it would be a great deal easier for those wanting a static spline to adjust it without continually having to make keyframes on frame zero. Ideally, users could if desired adjust a static spline simply by moving the nodes, period.

(It's been months since I've used LW, and I remember generous user had a solution, but it only worked on a channel by channel basis, IIRC, and patched items to be static. Once channel at a time is not very convenient, though.)

Isn't move path sufficient for this?

jeric_synergy
09-11-2013, 05:35 PM
Totally different effect.

STATIC OBJECTS are like what you have in After Effects BEFORE you turn on the Stopwatch.

jeric_synergy
09-11-2013, 08:15 PM
I'v been playing w/Spline Control, making essentially a rectangular 'racetrack' for my camera, but around the 4th null I always get a situation where the "road" flips over 180 at which point the camera is upside down. Adding more nulls to correct this just chases the flip-point around, rather reminiscent of chasing bad poly renders around a mesh. Also reminiscent of the flip/jumble one gets at the end of a Path Extrude.

I realize I could UN-splineControl the Bank channel, but what fun is that?

So, if one wants a nice smooth unflipping 'road', in RH's terms, what's the best approach? All my spline nulls have ROT=0/0/0.

SCENE ATTACHED

----Hmph, found a bug in PACKAGES SCENE while I was about this..... :devil:


117062

motivalex
09-12-2013, 04:43 AM
You just rotate the nulls to correct the path. No need to add extra nulls.

jeric_synergy
09-12-2013, 08:34 AM
You just rotate the nulls to correct the path. No need to add extra nulls.
When I tried that with the attached scene, it just moved the flip point around, it did not eliminate it.

motivalex
09-13-2013, 08:50 AM
Jeric. I have downloaded and looking at it now. I think its because your heading rotations are not lined up on the nulls. Will upload my modified version of your scene if I get it corrected.

motivalex
09-13-2013, 08:59 AM
When I tried that with the attached scene, it just moved the flip point around, it did not eliminate it.

Yep. It was your heading rotations not lining up with the path causing the flip. Attached is the updated .lws file. I added an extra keyframe so the camera continues further around the spline to see that it works ok.

117079

jeric_synergy
09-13-2013, 09:10 AM
motivalex, I find that very believable. When I create the nulls, I don't bother rotating them at all, so I can see how that would happen.

To rectify, are you just rotating the H to align w/the spline? (away from LW right now)

If this is the case, to me, this suggests an obvious feature option: ALIGN NULLS TO SPLINE, at least temporarily, to get the smoothest spline possible. 'Cuz tweeking dozens of these would be a huge PITA.

This could either be a persistent state, or a one-shot alignment (i.e. "push a button")

Thanks for looking into this-- I shoulda figured it out, but "whaddaya mean the software isn't telepathic?". ;)

motivalex
09-13-2013, 09:19 AM
....To rectify, are you just rotating the H to align w/the spline? (away from LW right now)

If this is the case, to me, this suggests an obvious feature option: ALIGN NULLS TO SPLINE, at least temporarily, to get the smoothest spline possible. 'Cuz tweeking dozens of these would be a huge PITA.....

That's what I did. I think ALIGN NULLS TO SPLINE would be a useful feature request. :)

Greenlaw
04-30-2014, 05:23 PM
Do I have to do everything?? :p

***USAGE***

Select an item or items... run the script... items will get a spline control with the entered number of nodes. "Parent In", when checked, will parent the spline to the first item's parent (making it a sibling, you'd use this for tails, tentacles, etc... leave it off for things like snakes, trains).

Note!!! You choose the FIRST ITEM by selecting it first... then selecting other items. So if selecting a hierarchy, select it from TOP to bottom... not the other way round, or right click the top item to select it and all children... Just give it a go... you'll see.

Cheers.

Finally got around to trying this today. Should have started much sooner--it's a great timesaver! :)

Thanks for posting this RH.

G.

RebelHill
04-30-2014, 07:30 PM
Finally got around to trying this today. Should have started much sooner--it's a great timesaver! :)

You should get round to launching RHiggits Rigging Toolbox... it has a more advanced version of this, plus plenty other time saving tools.

Greenlaw
05-01-2014, 10:08 AM
Thanks for the tip! Will check it out later today.

Been so busy this past year, I've fallen behind on trying out and using a lot of new tools. Feel like I'm starting to catch up though. :)

G.

Mr Rid
01-16-2015, 02:33 AM
Thr tut lost me at 17:15. I dont get how to associate control nulls with a separate set of nulls in a parented hierarchy. Following the setup (I think), when I set the 3rd or 4th control's Z Position Controller to 'Same as Item', they jump to new positions(?). I have to change the "x/+" value to compensate, which is not done in the tut.

But even then, when I move or rotate the first hierarchy null, the child nulls are not affecting the spline(?). They affect the spline when I move them individually, but not as children.

126572

Mr Rid
01-16-2015, 02:39 AM
Nevermind. I just noticed that 'World' needs to be checked in Controllers and Limits.