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View Full Version : Editor for VT - Razor? Tedit? Premiere?



11-11-2003, 09:01 AM
Hoping someone has played around with all the possibles and can advise.

All my source video source material is LW animation or Photoshop image files (titles included). I render image sequences & load them onto VT2

I sometimes render & mix PAL for European jobs, sometimes NTSC for US or Japanese jobs, often get asked for a tape in the wrong one at the end of a job.

I have very limited time for setting up my edits - 99% of my work is the animation, but at any time the boss can say to me "can I have a tape of what we've got so far to take to a meeting this afternoon".

Occasionly someone says 'can I have that on DVD, by courier, tonight.

(I HATE Ulead DVD pro - however I set my mpg output it insists on re-compressing for hour after hour - usually an overnight job))

I don't find the TEdit interface terribly usefull (understatement).

I want to drop sequences/images onto the time line, easily get simple crossfades that don't change the in/out points on my clips when I apply them, use alpha chanels reasonably simply, and have access to other effects if I need them.

I also want to be able to drop .wav files in, cross fade & mix them.

I'm going to upgrade to VT3, I'm tempted by Premiere Pro with the prospect of Bob's VT plugins - mainly because of the integration with Adobe Encore (DVD app) and Photoshop.

Or I could install Razor & upgrade it to 5.5 and hope DVD Pro 2 is a bit less home-video orientated or someone has a better suggestion.

I am not interesed in getting entire movies onto a DVD - 25 minutes is my norm, so I just want maximum image quality and worldwide playability from my DVDs.

P.S. I'm still b****y furious that VT can't output to DVC without time consuming space wasting pre render - I end up having to send component to my Sony DSR11, which is pretty silly.

Could I have some experience-based suggestions please ?

eon5
11-11-2003, 12:44 PM
I did the VT2-->VT3 upgrade

VT2edit was worst

VT3edit works fine

SRazor 4.8 in VT2 sometime work... sometimes dont

PremierePro plugins still are in development


Canyou please post yours system specs?

sugestion:
Try VT3edit

... or

using VT2
drop the imagefolder onto VTedit timereel
RENDER this folder like RTV-clip with alpha
work with the RTV file

... or

Import the images sequence in AURA (uncheck preload)
Select MOD --> RTV
Export the clip
open it in VTedit...
work with the RTV file

11-11-2003, 04:08 PM
Getting the image sequences into .rtv s is not the problem ( I just have a default scene set up in LW Express that composites the image sequence as background and gives me an rtv with about 20 seconds to set up each time - much quicker than importing into VY or Aura).
It's a decent linear editing interface I'm after, and easy DVD production.

Faraz
11-11-2003, 07:07 PM
Get you animations in VT Edit to do the simple editing, and then save your project as a wrapped AVI. (Instant Process)

This instanly loads into Encore, which burns you an incredible DVD. Darn fast, does encoding and authoring of clips.

11-12-2003, 05:09 AM
That gets me the DVD output,
But I still want a better timeline editor than TEdit - in particular I hate having to drop clips ontop of each other to get a crossfade, which alters the in and out of the clips. I want to be able to re-arange my clips as much as I like on several lines, and get transitions between them I can easily adjust.
And I would still love to be able to just drop the result into A DVD creator.
So is this 'avi wrap' simplicity going to be availble to me from Razor or Premier pro ?

Paul Lara
11-12-2003, 05:48 AM
Originally posted by [email protected]
So is this 'avi wrap' simplicity going to be availble to me from Razor or Premier pro ?

That is something unique to VT[3] and VT-Edit.

bradl
11-12-2003, 07:27 AM
AVI Wrapper:

Not sure Paul's comment answered your intent of the question. Yes it is available to all apps that support AVI. ALL APPS- PremierPro, AE, DFX, LW, WMP, etc. The only catch is, it only works on your VT workstation, i.e. not portable (at least not yet...).

SBowie
11-12-2003, 08:50 AM
Originally posted by [email protected]

... in particular I hate having to drop clips ontop of each other to get a crossfade, which alters the in and out of the clips. I want to be able to re-arange my clips as much as I like on several lines, and get transitions between them I can easily adjust.
You do realize you can do this in VT-Edit, right? By default, 1 second is trimmed from each end of a clip so you can add a 1 second DVE without the latter intruding into your carefully chosen edit points. But you can easily override that behavior on a per-clip basis or "permanently."

Likewise, you can modify the way DVE's are added. Basically, if I understand your wish correctly, all you need to do is change the Prefs > VT-Edit Automatic in/our offset to "No offset," and switch the default VT-Edit Storyboard Insertion Mode to "Non-Insertion."

Then position your clips on separate lines in VT-Edit with the overlap you have in mind and drop your DVE on them. You can tweak it afterward at will, but bear in mind that the effect of doing so varies according to whether Ripple is engaged or not.

Kevin_P
11-12-2003, 12:16 PM
I second Steve's comment. VTedit has a lot to offer, it just needs a little exploration.

I too was frustrated with VT2edit and was looking into other options.. SR, Premiere Pro, etc.. But, the more I use VTedit, the more I love it. It has developed into a very feature rich, powerful editor. VTedit's layout and tools are very different from other editors. There are always several ways to do one particular thing. And, the avi wrapper allows you to use any DVD app that you want with your finished program.

I'd also love realtime firewire out. I've heard that they are working on it. You could go realtime SDI out to an SDI compatible deck... of course that's a few more bucks.

Good luck,
Kevin Petajan

Jim_C
11-12-2003, 12:23 PM
The secret of ease lies within the storyboard.




(most of the time)

bradl
11-12-2003, 12:37 PM
Originally posted by [email protected]
I don't find the TEdit interface terribly usefull (understatement).


There is more than meets the eye in the TED interface. When I first started with VT2 I felt exactly the same. I dismissed it as a viable editor. Later learned to tap into the somewhat hidden power of it and began to love it, then VT3 took that to a whole new level. It's not perfect, has some real pitfalls, but it is extremely powerful.

The wide open approach to the timeline at first seems lacking but once you get used to it, you find there are no limits on how you want to arrange it. VTEdit is similar to Lightwave in the way that it is a blank canvas at first, but very powerful tools are at your fingertips.

11-13-2003, 04:20 AM
Ok, so TEdit can do everthing.

So is there somewhere it's all detailed ? - the 61 pages in the VT2 manual are not exactly expansive.

djlithium
11-14-2003, 02:50 AM
In VT-Edit, selecting a clip and using F8 and right click are your two best friends for kicking but.

To be realistic, most NLE's are over done with tools scattered all over hell (hello avid), so be sure to keep it simple in your head and right click that mouse and learn your keyboard short cuts.

Dumb assed obvious stuff that you know in lightwave will come to you in VT-Edit very quickly. I have been using Lightwave for close to 8 years and VT-Edit is a closely releated beast in the methods for getting stuff done. For example, common keyboard shortcuts in modeler are similar in VT-Edit. c is cut for example. Up and down arrows select the next clip on the timeline top down or vice versa (much like fishing through objects in layout) the left and right arrows are well obvious, and the alternates for doing things with those keys are also... well pretty obvious.

Paul Lara
11-14-2003, 06:37 AM
Originally posted by [email protected]
Ok, so TEdit can do everthing...So is there somewhere it's all detailed ?

The F1 key will present all the hotkey combinations available to you in TEd. Unfortunately, TEd was growing in leaps and bounds after the bound manual went sent to press. That's another reason NewTek opted for a 3-hole version of documentation for VT[3].

SBowie
11-14-2003, 10:03 AM
Originally posted by Paul Lara
That's another reason NewTek opted for a 3-hole version of documentation for VT[3]. Where I come from, a 3-holer has a whole different connotation ;)

Tom Wood
11-14-2003, 10:20 AM
Originally posted by Paul Lara
That's another reason NewTek opted for a 3-hole version of documentation for VT[3].

Speaking of which, is there a download site to get new PDF pages as they are published?

TW

bradl
11-14-2003, 11:19 PM
When I was running VT2 I created a custom hotkey printout in Excel. It was just for VTEdit and didn't include everything but most of the major ones and it all fit on one sheet in landscape view. It really looked nice. It wasn't just a repeat of the F1, but a customized list with headings and succinct descriptions. I keep it right next to the monitor. I updated it for VT3 and intended to add all modules, but haven't so far, but the XLS could easily be used to as a template for anyone interested.

I could upload it if anyone is interested on Sunday...

- can you attach documents for download to a post on this forum?

Paul Lara
11-15-2003, 04:46 PM
Originally posted by bradl
I updated it for VT3 and intended to add all modules, but haven't so far, but the XLS could easily be used to as a template for anyone interested.

I could upload it if anyone is interested on Sunday...


Brad, you rock!

e-mail it to me, and I'll upload to the Toaster downloads site, and provide a link here.


Paul

bradl
11-15-2003, 10:03 PM
Ok, will do Sunday afternoon.


You know one day I will get a VT3 of my very own and then I can sit at home have access to all my stuff!

bradl
11-18-2003, 08:11 PM
Here is the file Paul has posted:
HotKeys for VTEdit (ftp://ftp.newtek.com/pub/VideoToaster/Downloads/VTEdit%20Hotkeys%20for%20Web.zip)

For some reason when I opened it here at home, it thinks the sheet is larger than 8.5 X 11, even though it says it is 8.5 X 11. Weird. I will try at work tomorrow. If you want to print it, and have this trouble, try copying the cells to a new sheet, set it to landscape mode and try different scale settings for optimal print size.

I noticed at least two entries that are custom keys and will not work for you, unless you add these hotkeys to the toasterscript. They are: "Fit Selection SHIFT + ENTER" and "Play 2X SHIFT + K"

bradl
11-18-2003, 08:35 PM
full sample:

sywitt
11-19-2003, 08:07 AM
Originally posted by [email protected]
I don't find the TEdit interface terribly usefull (understatement).



I think that if you spend a little bit with Tedit you'll find that it's by far the easiest editor on the market. The thing that's hard to understand when first using it, is that there's a gazillion ways to do just about everything. I think what happens is that when someone finds something that works, but is time consuming and akward, they think "that's the way it works". Yes, but there might be 20 better ways to do it.

As far as doing the things that the original poster wanted, my gosh, the Tedit is EASY. You can drop the clips into the storyboard and click cntl-F and it'll automatically add fades between all of the clips. Want to re-arrainge? Drag a clip to where you want it. OR on the timeline-put the clips where you want them and drag a fade over them. OR what you were doing, which was dragging clips on top of each other (if you use F8 you can fine tune the length of the fade and the in and out points of the clips) OR......(fill in 3-4 or so other ways to do it)

Adding waves??? Drop 'em on the timeline where you want them. Add cross-fades? Drag the fade slider on the audio clip.

If the original poster can figure out lightwave, much of which still baffles me, they should have NO problem finding easy ways to do these easy tasks.

Sy Witt
Ramona Rose Studio, Inc.

Paul Lara
11-19-2003, 03:49 PM
Very nice spreadsheet, Brad!
You left off an important hotkey, though:

The 'Roadruck' | L Shift + R Shift + Left Mouse Button

:D :cool: :p

Jim_C
11-19-2003, 03:59 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Paul Lara


The 'Roadruck' | L Shift + R Shift + Left Mouse Button


Paul I tried that and all I'm getting is a hand cramp and funny looks from my cat.

:rolleyes:

ps.. it aint pretty but you can pull it off better if you left shift with left hand, right shift with right hand and Nose the LMB.

Jim_C
11-19-2003, 04:01 PM
Well I just got more than a hand cramp (using the aint pretty method), and now I just stare.

Message received.

Paul Lara
11-20-2003, 07:35 AM
Happy Easter, Jim!

:D

bradl
12-02-2003, 09:38 PM
Reinstalling my scripts today and noticed another hotkey on the spreadsheet that was custom:

Slip and slide 1 Frame CTRL + ALT + ARROW

This is a very useful feature for me. I got the idea out of the SDK kit (I think). I could post the code or email it if anyone is interested.