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jboudreau
04-25-2013, 01:53 AM
Hi Guys

Fog Bugz seems a bit flawed in my opinion their is no way for a user like myself to know if a bug has already been flagged by another user so if I go and flag a bug that has already been flagged then it is a complete waste of my time and yours. All I am doing is duplicating something that has already been flagged by another user. Seems silly to report stuff that is already been made aware to the dev team.

So I was thinking that instead of waiting for the newtek team to create some sort of fog bugz database where we could search for similar reported bugs that we may be experiencing? that we could all post our fogbugz cases in this forum. I'm pretty sure you would only need to provide one case ticket number then you will be able to see all the cases that were opened by that user.

Having something like this would be great because then the whole lightwave community could test these bugs out on their system (not just the development team) and give feedback of what they found. this would give the development team more info to go on than just one or two users reporting the bug, which in return would result in bugs getting fixed faster and having fewer bugs

Benefits of doing this

- You wouldn't have to waste your precious time reporting bugs that have already been flagged to the dev team (giving them more time to fix other bugs)

- If your working and you get some weird issues instead of spending hours trying to figure out what the problem is you would know if it was a bug or not

- we could all know what bugs have been flagged and if the problem has been fixed or still open because right now we are all in the dark

- we could help other users with a bug they may be having that have not been fixed because the development team can not replicate the problem

- sometimes the fogbugs that were posted get lost in the mix at least this way users would not be so frustrated because a bug slipped through the cracks and never got resolved.

- we could see the bug reports from other users and see if those problems exist on our own system. This way if a bug works on someone else's system we could give
more information to the newtek development team which would result in the bug getting fixed quicker.

- Instead of just having the development team trying to fix bugs we could have the whole lightwave community working together

As you can see their is a real benefit to doing this. Please let me know who would like to participate in this. Once I start getting the fog bugs cases I can create a document, website etc where people can use. I will do my best to keep it up to date. This way everything will be all in one place. I'll see what it takes to create some sort of search functionality and database.

Thanks
Jason

RudySchneider
04-25-2013, 12:44 PM
Jason ---
Pardon me for thinking this, but I get the impression you are "glass half empty," rather than a "glass half full" kind of guy. By that I mean most of your posts seem to be accentuating the negative.

BTW, there's a basic "flaw" in your above argument. Regardless of whether a bug you experienced has been submitted or not, the circumstances that contribute to the flaw may be slightly different in every case. So, it's actually better to build up a database full of as many contributors as possible, because that provides the best means of finding a common cause.

jboudreau
04-25-2013, 01:35 PM
Jason ---
Pardon me for thinking this, but I get the impression you are "glass half empty," rather than a "glass half full" kind of guy. By that I mean most of your posts seem to be accentuating the negative.

BTW, there's a basic "flaw" in your above argument. Regardless of whether a bug you experienced has been submitted or not, the circumstances that contribute to the flaw may be slightly different in every case. So, it's actually better to build up a database full of as many contributors as possible, because that provides the best means of finding a common cause.

Hi

Actually I am the most positive person you would ever know and will help anyone out that I can without asking for anything in return. I know you are basing this on my thread saying 11.5 was extremely buggy well I have apologized for that and it was written during the heat of the moment. I was working very long hours (all nighters in fact) to get a job done for one of my clients and when everything I tried resulted in a crash or a bug then I had to say something. Once I reverted back to 11.03 everything worked fine. It's not like I am the only person on this forumn that complains about bugs.

Actually during the whole lightwave core incident, you never ever heard me say anything about that, their were so many people complaining and saying they were going to jump ship etc. Tons of negativity during that time. I knew from what I was hearing that they were making the right move and lightwave has never looked so strong and has never been so great. I was just trying to make it even better. Their are a lot of people that say what's lightwave? and I always defend lightwave and recommend it any chance I get. Actually lightwave in my opinion is one of the best 3D softwares out there that's why I have been using it for 15 years and never jumped ship. I love what the new development team is doing Rob, Lino everyone. Great work :)

As for the Fog Bugz thread actually if you read the whole message I was actually wanting to do something to help. I was willing to build a website, create a database so people could search and find bugs that may have already been flagged instead of spending time trying to figure out if it was a bug or not. I was going to do this out of the goodness of my heart and ask for nothing in return so I'm not sure how you can make an observation that I am a negative person when all I was trying to do was help. Look on the forumns I am not the only one asking about this fog bugz.

It had nothing to do whether a bug was submitted or not it had to do with us knowing as artists in the lightwave community what bugs were out there and we could all work together to help one another work out some of these bugs. Exactly what I was saying build up a database of as many contributors as possible that users could see so they could help one another. You know having the whole lightwave community and the newtek development team working together. You know how they say 2 brains is always better than one.

P.S. Check out the Thread named "controller confusion" Over 156 views (Their were 80 views before I responded) and I was the only one that responded (please don't take this negatively). I actually took the scene opened it up on my computer found the problem. Fixed the problem and uploaded the scene back to him. Now how is that being negative.

I could of wrote back to him blaming it on another bug in lightwave.

Thanks
Jason

RudySchneider
04-25-2013, 03:16 PM
You'll have to forgive me, again, Jason, but I can't help but have Shakespeare's "Methinks thou dost protest too much" pop into my head.

I'm only a hobbyist, but I'm sensitive to and can understand the frustration you must feel when a tool on which you rely seems unable to do what you need it to. So naturally, like most of the other folks on these forums, you want to help make the tool better. On the other hand, what you're suggesting smacks of open-source, not unlike Blender. I'm wondering if Newtek already has a brigade of users who make up the debug team, and of which you could become a member(?).

jboudreau
04-25-2013, 03:40 PM
You'll have to forgive me, again, Jason, but I can't help but have Shakespeare's "Methinks thou dost protest too much" pop into my head.

I'm only a hobbyist, but I'm sensitive to and can understand the frustration you must feel when a tool on which you rely seems unable to do what you need it to. So naturally, like most of the other folks on these forums, you want to help make the tool better. On the other hand, what you're suggesting smacks of open-source, not unlike Blender. I'm wondering if Newtek already has a brigade of users who make up the debug team, and of which you could become a member(?).

Hi

No problem man, I just wanted to let you know that even though I might sound or come off negative sometimes or in any way that I definitely am not. at least most of the time anyway :) Yes that's all I want to do is help people, I have lots of experience with lightwave why not use it to help people out in anyway I can. If you ever need any help on anything don't hesitate to ask.

As for the fog bugz it was just a suggestion if it won't work then no problem. Well just have to wait for the lightwave team to build something. I was told by one of the lightwave support team members that they are working on something so that's good news.

I would love to become a member if that is possible or a beta tester.

Thanks,
Jason

jwiede
04-25-2013, 05:45 PM
Jason ---
Pardon me for thinking this, but I get the impression you are "glass half empty," rather than a "glass half full" kind of guy.
Is there a particular reason why you've immediately dropped to making personal comments (baseless mischaracterizations, really) about the original poster? There doesn't appear to be any reason or basis for you to turn the thread in the direction of ad hominem attacks, so why are you doing so?

Ernest
04-25-2013, 08:40 PM
They've already worked it out so I don't think there's anything positive that would come from bringing that back.

As to the original idea, I've been a in a couple of beta tests that used forums to track bugs. It works nicely at first but, as the bugs accumulate, it becomes unmanageable. There is no way all the users are going to go through pages and pages of the forum, checking if their bug is already there. Then some people will start flaming posts because that bug is already posted way back in page 30.

I don't know how it is with LW in particular but, if simple mobile games have hundreds of bug reports, a 3D program probably has thousands. A forum is too slow to navigate and to query on that kind of volume.

Snosrap
04-25-2013, 09:20 PM
I think jboudreau makes some good points. If the bug reporting system allowed for additional comments and/or content attachments pertaining to a particular issue, it seems as if it would allow the developers to track down the cause much faster. Say for example a user submits a bug and say's the move tool won't move these 4 points on this model and another user sees the report and ammends it and says that he has the same problem and the move tool won't move these 12 points on this particular object. A pattern is quickly seen and there are then possibly multiple objects of which to test. Makes sense to me anyway. :)

jboudreau
04-25-2013, 10:23 PM
They've already worked it out so I don't think there's anything positive that would come from bringing that back.

As to the original idea, I've been a in a couple of beta tests that used forums to track bugs. It works nicely at first but, as the bugs accumulate, it becomes unmanageable. There is no way all the users are going to go through pages and pages of the forum, checking if their bug is already there. Then some people will start flaming posts because that bug is already posted way back in page 30.

I don't know how it is with LW in particular but, if simple mobile games have hundreds of bug reports, a 3D program probably has thousands. A forum is too slow to navigate and to query on that kind of volume.

Hi Ernst

I didn't mean use the forumns to track bugs that would get crazy and un manageable, I would create a separate webpage and database with a search function. For example you go to the website and choose which version of lightwave you are using, then you can type in for example instance generator, all the bugs that have to do with instances would come up. Then you could choose which bug you are currently having.

All I need to get started is one of the case tickets from the fogbugz website, for example like this https://fogbugz.newtek.com/default.a...adf5omhn31ef5u "this was posted in the forumns already. As you can see just from this one link you can see all the bugs that user Sensei flagged.

It was just a thought maybe it won't work I'm not sure

Thanks,
Jason

PhotoTekArtWork
04-25-2013, 11:57 PM
Have a 'Tag' feature where you could put multiple tags for the search function.