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m.d.
04-04-2013, 11:34 AM
http://blogs.adobe.com/aftereffects/2013/04/whats-new-changed-after-effects-next.html

Features dynamic linking with AE..so c4d projects can be imported without rendering....

robertoortiz
04-04-2013, 11:39 AM
Good for Maxon.
This is something that does not surprise me one bit.

Dexter2999
04-04-2013, 11:45 AM
Discussed here, http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?134814-Next-version-of-Aftereffects-revealed!

jburford
04-06-2013, 04:18 AM
http://blogs.adobe.com/aftereffects/2013/04/whats-new-changed-after-effects-next.html

Features dynamic linking with AE..so c4d projects can be imported without rendering....


Makes me look back and say shame that Lightwave Rendition for Adobe Photoshop was not furthered and dropped. Was back around 2008, and had been further developed and perhaps integrated into After Effects by 2010, hmnn. . . what could have been?

motivalex
04-06-2013, 06:31 AM
Makes me look back and say shame that Lightwave Rendition for Adobe Photoshop was not furthered and dropped. Was back around 2008, and had been further developed and perhaps integrated into After Effects by 2010, hmnn. . . what could have been?

Newtek seemed very short sighted in dropping all that. The new team seem different. If it wasn't for LW11.5 I was going to do a full switch to Cinema 4D. The upgrade was worth it from 9.6. The jury is still out. LW12 in one release has to be the leap that 11.5 was over 9.6 at least.

Could the LW Group write a Cinema 4D scene exporter from Lightwave to get stuff into C4D lite in AE?

robertn2k
04-06-2013, 06:36 AM
Sad day for Lightwave in the classroom as this may be the final nail in the coffin for Newtek in the education market. The vast majority of HS and College programs that offer some form of video production courses provide some instruction on Photoshop and After Effects and if AE now comes with a light version of CD4 you'd have to be some kind of sales person to convince your department chairman or budget manager to spend money on seats of Lightwave for your lab when CD4 lite come with AE, a program you're already paying for. Sad day for those of us who have been fighting to keep LW in our course offerings. Not sure if Rob has anymore rabbits to pull out of his hat on this one.

Pavlov
04-06-2013, 08:25 AM
hmm. bad news never stop.
All the rest of CG world is growing, becoming safer and stronger with mergings. I cant see how this cant be bad for NT, which is legendarily staying an island. Let's see and hope.

Paolo

COBRASoft
04-06-2013, 08:33 AM
NT has a great chance to show the world we're still here with LW12. The progress they made from 10.0 to 11.5 is huge IMO.
Rob and others have stated they have a lot of things prepared under the hood but need more time to let it come out and shine. LW12 has to be that moment and I'm quite confident they will deliver.

A good I/O with C4D/AE comes to mind for LW12 :D!

ivanze
04-06-2013, 09:53 AM
Have you read exactly what is C4D Lite??

It lacks a lot of things, that it really looks like a C4D importer with the basic C4D render engine for AE. A really good importer, btw, but it is very limited for other tasks.

And if I'm not wrong you can't model anything with it, except for text.

http://www.toolfarm.com/images/uploads/vendors/maxon/ProductComparison-Full.pdf

Pavlov
04-06-2013, 09:59 AM
Ivanze, my observation is due to the fact that an official hook has been thrown through the two apps. And while C4d has been forever THE mograph soft, now guess which tool all AE users will look at when they'll need some 3d.
I agree LW2C4d is not a huge thing itself. It's a step toward a market configuration where most 3d tools have (or are defending more and more) their strongholds, but LW, which is good for everything, but not as the software of reference in that area. Not as good as cinema for mograph, not as good as max for archviz, not as good as maya/XSI for animation. I dont know if it's good or bad, maybe being the jack for all the trades will pay in the long term.

Paolo

jeric_synergy
04-06-2013, 10:41 AM
People who are semi-familiar with C4D and Maya have not even HEARD of Lightwave. This just raises the noise level further.

jburford
04-08-2013, 04:19 AM
Newtek seemed very short sighted in dropping all that. The new team seem different. If it wasn't for LW11.5 I was going to do a full switch to Cinema 4D. The upgrade was worth it from 9.6. The jury is still out. LW12 in one release has to be the leap that 11.5 was over 9.6 at least.

Could the LW Group write a Cinema 4D scene exporter from Lightwave to get stuff into C4D lite in AE?


C4D has Native LW Object and Scene Import into it, so should not be a problem in any way. . . . . (I was also lucky picked up C4D Prime, great offer, about 3 weeks ago)

jburford
04-08-2013, 04:28 AM
. . . . sec

jburford
04-08-2013, 05:38 AM
Quoted from ivanze . . . . "Have you read exactly what is C4D Lite??

It lacks a lot of things, that it really looks like a C4D importer with the basic C4D render engine for AE. A really good importer, btw, but it is very limited for other tasks.

And if I'm not wrong you can't model anything with it, except for text.

http://www.toolfarm.com/images/uploa...rison-Full.pdf "


What are you talking about?? Not quite. Cinema4D Prime or the newer Lite, is not that limited at all. For a "Fuller" Comparison between the C4D Versions, better off going to Maxons Site, then chose a Product, then Compare Products. There a a few things missing in Prime/Lite, but is not that limiting at all, and is Great at modeling! In fact, after picking up Prime 3 Weeks ago, I have not even started LW and have been modeling and going to town, and enjoying a really sweet package.

jburford
04-08-2013, 05:43 AM
Just researched a bit more, and have a Video link showing the interface of C4D Lite, that it is primarily C4D Prime (with minor chang3s), and Yes, with real modeling, not just Text.

Might want to look @ http://vimeo.com/63301494 (shows the interface briefly, can see the standard layout), then look @ http://vimeo.com/63361794

while the last video is not using the Lite Version, rather Studio Version, it clearly shows some niceties of such a Workflow. The Lite Version, gives After Effects Users the ability to integrate real 3D and model and such, and the C4D Users the ability to have a sweet workflow. (yes, at Version 1.0 is not perfect). . .

but . . . .



Here is a better/fuller comparison between the versions, not a "abgespeckte" list. http://www.maxon.net/en/products/general-information/general-information/product-comparison.html

souzou
04-08-2013, 06:42 AM
Maybe for simple stuff this is great but in a complex project I'm not sure about the workflow. Only thing that looks good to me is the ease of generating compositing buffers. Will be interesting to see performance.

I think this is great for AE users to start dabbling in 3d - I guess Maxon is banking on that to then upsell more Broadcast/Studio licences.

Snosrap
04-08-2013, 06:49 AM
These two items alone make it pretty limited if you ask me.

souzou
04-08-2013, 07:06 AM
These two items alone make it pretty limited if you ask me.

That's only when rendering from Lite though. If you render from Cineware (ie. in AE) you're only limited to the max comp size in AE.

ivanze
04-08-2013, 08:01 AM
Well, this is what I found:

http://www.cgchannel.com/2013/04/after-effects-cs7-to-include-lite-version-of-cinema-4d/

"So what is Cinema 4D Lite anyway?
We can’t find a detailed feature comparison between Lite and other editions of Cinema 4D, but it seems to be a fairly heavily cut down version of the software.

Adobe’s blog describes it as “comparable to Cinema 4D R14 Prime”, but the (unofficial) video above mentions that it doesn’t include polygonal modelling, a full set of deformers.

Perhaps more significantly, like Prime itself, it doesn’t include key features used in motion graphics work, including the MoGraph toolset, advanced rendering options, and the Physical and Sketch and Toon renderers."

jburford
04-08-2013, 08:26 AM
The Information "above" is not cleared and Final with Maxon, as I wrote them around an hour ago and got response back, not finalized as to final features at this moment, and that the site above was not completly factual, post from further up.

Which makes sense, put an App like Cinema 4D Studio at around $3500, into After Effects for free. . .. don't think so. Those needing more power of MoGraph, can most certainly pick up the app.

Motion Graphic Artists need a Physical Renderer??


Yes, there is no "Sketch and Toon" in Prime, and probably not Lite, but there is another Cel-Shader included in it, and there are at least 2 other Cel-Shader Plugins which are Free. Physical Renderers can be added freely in some cases and those really needed are not being stopped (at least not in Prime) Indigo RT costs around $150, Octane around $199 + $99 for C4D Plugin. . ..


But, I do not believe that the "Motion Graphic" Artists are using or needing a Physical Renderer. (of course, I might be totally off track here).

Some Major Tools of Motion Graphic Artists
Adobe Photoshop - No Physical Renderer,
Adobe Illustrator - No Physical Renderer
Adobe After Effects - No Physical Renderer

3D Elements - No Physical Renderer, also NO Raytracing!
Trapcode - No Physical Renderer
Magic Bullet - No Physical Renderer
Particular - No Physical Renderer

And the list goes on, and on, and on. . . . . Physical Renderer for ArchViz, yes, Automotive Renders, yes, Product Placement Showcase/Art Yes . .. but. . .

-EsHrA-
04-08-2013, 08:36 AM
"We can’t find a detailed feature comparison between Lite and other editions of Cinema 4D, but it seems to be a fairly heavily cut down version of the software."

http://www.toolfarm.com/images/uploads/vendors/maxon/ProductComparison-Full.pdf


mlon

jburford
04-08-2013, 11:10 AM
"We canít find a detailed feature comparison between Lite and other editions of Cinema 4D, but it seems to be a fairly heavily cut down version of the software."

http://www.toolfarm.com/images/uploads/vendors/maxon/ProductComparison-Full.pdf


mlon


That is because, the finalized list of what is in or not is not available or given by Maxon at present. . . But, one can pretty much compare it to Prime. Fairly cut down. . . . Yes and no.

As ivanze stated above, there is no physical renderer in Prime. Nor is there in Lightwave! :D

Most of the "limitations" are not really limitations if you are doing Motion Graphics, with exception of MoGraph would have been cool (but not for that price) and there is not much that can not be done without it. It just means animating the old fashioned way and not with Mograph Editor (which can really speed things up or cool effects out of the can).

There is Particles in Prime, just not Thinking Particles. And, one can further add a cooler Particle System X-Particles (Free Version), or learn to use Xpresso (Node Control System).

The Sketch and Toon Shader is not in the Prime Version, but hey another Cel-Shader is, and there are at least 2 Free Versions of Cel Shaders for C4D (and Prime).

GI - I do not need for Motion Graphics. But if I do, I can send to LW!


Physical Renderer - Just like LW. If one needs it, then it like LW can be added. (Free to name any price)

Body Paint 3D - Included in Prime. Not in LW (but hey, I do not need BP, as I have and love 3D Coat)


Hair Fur - Not in Prime. But again, if I need, I have LW 11.5, Messiah, and Blender.

IGES Importer - Not in Prime. (I do not need)

Okono Module - Not in Prime. I do not need, and C4D supports most all natively anyway.

Sculpting - Not in Prime. (see above, I have 3D Coat) And, also not in LW.

Terrain Maker - Not in Prime. ( I do not need generically created terrains. would do like in LW, or simply use my Vue that I have.)

Caustics - Ok, would be nice. Not in Prime But again, Can use in LW or Messiah, or Blend.

Depth of Field post effect / Motion Blur Not in Prime - But can add for free plugins like DPs Tools and Nodes.

SSS - Not in Prime. But again, np, as have LW & Messiah.


Can keep on going for the last couple of points, but not as limiting as one just simply thinks.

jeric_synergy
04-08-2013, 11:17 AM
People talked about the advantage IE had merely because it was already 'in the door'.

C4D is going to enjoy that same advantage with AE users, over LW. It's a real marketing challenge to the LW3DG.

They'll have to really polish their own LW>AE>LW pipeline to compensate. It's gotta be brain dead easy and hold the users' hands every step of the way. No configuration file issues. Two buttons is one too many. IOW, it's gotta be better than whatever Adobe/Maxon cook up.

jburford
04-08-2013, 11:42 AM
Now for the Fun part!

As for the "limitations" that were pointed out, there are actually quite a few things were one sees that LW are lacking against even Prime. When playing with Prime.


1. Full Unified App. - LW No, perhaps in 2-5 years.
2. Undue - It works Everywhere! Including in Texture Editor. (Everywhere)
3. Parametric Modelling Tools and Workflows. Simply Amazing!!!
You can Animate almost every Tool, and every Step of the way.
4. Non-Destructive Modelling / History (hmnn. … LW, naw, don't think so)
5. Great Deformers / Deformer System
6. More types of Splines / Spline Modelling than you can shake a stick at.
7. Nurbs (Sweep, Lathe, Loft, Bezier, Hyper, etc)
8. Workplanes similar to Modo
9. Alembic Support
10. Great FBX Support as well as LW Object and Scene Native
11. Pulling in stuff from Blender via FBX and not baking, no mdd, and coming
in fine, no axis problems, or problems with mutiple effects all at once only one fbx.
12. Great Support to from After Effects, Nuke, Color, FCP, and so on. (ok LW has caught up better)
13. Great AI Support Natively and not so sloppy
14. Better Yet, CV-Artsmart For Free See it and weep!

Check out:

http://www.cineversity.com/vidplaytut/artsmart_overview

15. V-Ray Native Available for C4d (and yes also in Prime)

16. Completely Customize the Interface/ Colors / Panels, any way you want! (just like Journey's Song)
17. Lighting System can actually work in real world units. Lumens/Candela.

18. Majority of all Motion Graphics Shops in Germany use C4D. So expand work base of possibilities from knowing it.

I could go on and on, but am getting thirsty.

Not bashing, just saying, things are all not as Black and White as they seem.

Cheers.

Celshader
04-08-2013, 01:04 PM
People who are semi-familiar with C4D...have not even HEARD of Lightwave.

I wonder what those artists make of the LWS/LWO/MDD importers/exporters in C4D. ;)

jburford
04-08-2013, 01:21 PM
Have to agree with Celshader here. Thought that earlier, as would be no need for otherwise.

COBRASoft
04-08-2013, 02:43 PM
Lightwave and Cinema4D have a long history (Amiga :)). C4D has the I/O, LW not. I wish LW recognizes this and give us good I/O with other packages like Cinema4D.

Celshader
04-08-2013, 03:27 PM
Lightwave and Cinema4D have a long history (Amiga :)). C4D has the I/O, LW not. I wish LW recognizes this and give us good I/O with other packages like Cinema4D.

I agree. LightWave 10.0 added Autodesk XML support and improved FBX. These modest additions gave me two steady years of employment at a studio that relied on Maya for most of its creature/character animation. GoZ, GoAE, Unity support (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2NHKIwvBJw) and FiberFX motion vectors continue to move LightWave in the right direction.

I do not know if C4D has kept its LW I/O tools up-to-date, however. When I last worked with C4D artists in 2010, I had to export my LightWave scenes as 6.0 scenes so that C4D could read them. C4D did not understand the ObjectID setup introduced with LightWave 9.2.

Lewis
04-08-2013, 03:34 PM
I do not know if C4D has kept its LW I/O tools up-to-date, however. When I last worked with C4D artists in 2010, I had to export my LightWave scenes as 6.0 scenes so that C4D could read them. C4D did not understand the ObjectID setup introduced with LightWave 9.2.

Not sure about LWS but i loaded LW 11.5 saved mesh just fine in C4D R13 today and it loaded it 3x times faster than Modeler (115 MB LWO, 4 Mil polys ) :(. Even if Cinema can't load newest LWS (whcih I'm sure it'll have problems with instances and all other similar new things 'coz loader of scenes was always basic) on the other hand LW can't load any *.c4d format at all so it's still C4D advantage ;).

ivanze
04-08-2013, 03:48 PM
I think that .C4D is like the .max extension. It can only be opened in Cinema4D. May be it has some parametric things as in 3D Max format.

Lewis
04-08-2013, 04:02 PM
Yep, propeiteray formats are good and bad in same time but still point more for Cinema ;).

ivanze
04-08-2013, 04:06 PM
Yep, propeiteray formats are good and bad in same time but still point more for Cinema ;).

Absolutely!!

I remember talking to Rob Powers in NAB 2011 and telling him how important would be an AE/LW connection for us when we showed him some videos of the work that we did in an Ipad.

And here we are with LW 11.5 making life better for us doing motion graphics. :) Of course it could be better in newer versions of LW, but thanks Rob for listening. :)

Lewis
04-08-2013, 04:15 PM
And here we are with LW 11.5 making life better for us doing motion graphics. :) Of course it could be better in newer versions of LW, but thanks Rob for listening. :)

No doubt there, they are doign great work on makign LW feature rich, I just hope they can change/make it completely unified (to chage pardigm/concept) so we can use every tool in conjunction with other tool and not that every new feature be it's own "island" or separate section of app. It's time for BIG under the ghood changes/leaps ;).

jeric_synergy
04-08-2013, 04:43 PM
I wonder what those artists make of the LWS/LWO/MDD importers/exporters in C4D. ;)
In truth, I rather think they never even give them a single thought.

I agree. LightWave 10.0 added Autodesk XML support and improved FBX. These modest additions gave me two steady years of employment at a studio that relied on Maya for most of its creature/character animation. GoZ, GoAE, Unity support (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2NHKIwvBJw) and FiberFX motion vectors continue to move LightWave in the right direction.
I've always thought that was a master-stroke by Rob, keeping Lightwave relevant when it was on the brink of....errr.... irrelevancy.

::cough::

Anyway, playing nice with others is always going to be a Good. As long as it doesn't drain too many coding resources it should remain a significant goal.

cresshead
04-08-2013, 07:37 PM
c4d lite is an interesting move for AE users as it opens door for feature rich versions of cinema via upgrades i'm guessing.
the rendering side of lite and prime is pretty dire mind you.

the lite version doesn't even have Ambient Occlusion never mind Global Illumination.
so you'll get a perfectly comped in 90's render...whoo hoo....

:D

jburford
04-09-2013, 02:08 AM
I agree. LightWave 10.0 added Autodesk XML support and improved FBX. These modest additions gave me two steady years of employment at a studio that relied on Maya for most of its creature/character animation. GoZ, GoAE, Unity support (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2NHKIwvBJw) and FiberFX motion vectors continue to move LightWave in the right direction.

I do not know if C4D has kept its LW I/O tools up-to-date, however. When I last worked with C4D artists in 2010, I had to export my LightWave scenes as 6.0 scenes so that C4D could read them. C4D did not understand the ObjectID setup introduced with LightWave 9.2.


Yes, the additions to LW lately has been great! Something we use often, though have not been having too much luck with Blender FBXs where multiple items are falling.

Having no problem, getting any of the latest LW Objects or Scenes into C4D, works great at my end. While others say there might be issues with huge scenes in regards to the layer(s) naming. There I found best splitting the objects also based on Surface upon inport into C4D, then grouping them for better overview in the Scene Editor.

Also, just put the Body Paint plugins into LW 11.5 Modeler and Layout, and it works. So for those not having 3D Coat or Z-Brush, they can pop the models over and LW patiently waits in background for round trip back.

Cheers.

jburford
04-09-2013, 02:14 AM
c4d lite is an interesting move for AE users as it opens door for feature rich versions of cinema via upgrades i'm guessing.
the rendering side of lite and prime is pretty dire mind you.

the lite version doesn't even have Ambient Occlusion never mind Global Illumination.
so you'll get a perfectly comped in 90's render...whoo hoo....

:D


Cresshead, After Effects and the other Tools, and C4D Lite are about Motion Graphics, which are not using GI. . .. It is not about putting out stuff where one needs GI. I do not know any tools that Motion Graphic Artists are currently using that has Raytracing, let alone GI.

This is something that people keep forgetting. Lite is not to replace the "Bigger Boys".

Or is there any After Effects Version or any of the Great Motion Graphic Plugins out there with Raytracing or GI, that I have not heard of?



Also, the deal with Adobe and Maxon, is not all about C4D "Lite". . . .

It is connectivity in a Big way between any package/variant of Cinema 4D with After Effects in nice ways which also give full access to Multipass(es) without even Rendering. And trust me, there are a lot of places out there doing Motion Graphics who have the fuller packages wanting this. Also not to mention all of the Schools already training in Adobe After Effects and Photoshop, now getting such connectivity to the eyes of all the upcoming Artists.

dee
04-09-2013, 02:45 AM
the lite version doesn't even have Ambient Occlusion never mind Global Illumination.

:D

According to yesterday's C4D livestream from NAB it will have both.

dee
04-09-2013, 02:50 AM
Lightwave and Cinema4D have a long history (Amiga :)). C4D has the I/O, LW not. I wish LW recognizes this and give us good I/O with other packages like Cinema4D.

Alembic support in LW would be a good start. ;)

jburford
04-09-2013, 03:00 AM
the rendering side of lite and prime is pretty dire mind you.

:D

I apologize for responding here on this point but I have a problem letting this set.

First off, Lite's Purpose in Life is NOT a Standalone Renderer. There is NO Limitations on Resolution with Lite when used as intented within Adobe After Effects. Hear Again (has been said multiple times other threads already). There Is NO Limitation on Resolution of Lite within its Adobe After Effects Environment. Yes, it can be used standalone, and there it has limitations on its Output Resolution.


Limitations in Rendering in Prime (Resolution)

Render up to 128,000 pixels square / 32 bits per pixel

I have known you here (not personally) through the Forums for Years and have respected, but the statement Rendering Side of Prime is pretty dire, bothers me. If the limitations of an entry level Package (but still having lots of advantages where (add package name) still does not have after 20+ years) does not meet you needs, then state that.

But to say the Rendering Side is Dire, to me is brazen and outright . . . (will leave out)

Have you ever seen a Render out of Cinema 4D Prime? Well?

And, is it not about the Artist using and pushing his Tools to achieve what he wants/needs? If someone using Max or Maya, or C4D or Blender sees 1 Image from anyone with LW, and says the Render is Trash therefore LW's Renders and Renderer is Trash/Dire, would you accept this and say is fair. Is it not in the hands of the Artist?

In regards to the limitations on GI, and Physical Rendering, you can read my post above to see my view on it.

I can only say after liking/loving Renders out of LW the past 20 yrs or so, was nothing but amazed at my first renders out of Prime, at the beauty, clarity, speed and ease. I mean amazed. Was lucky to pick up C4D Prime for 379 Euros, and IF I ever have the need to have (Fill in Blanks ) above and beyond LWs Renders used with my Prime. Then for another 700 Euros, I can add vRay to it!! (1100 Euros Total Price including vRay). Having Full Native support of all aspects of vRay and it's Materials within Prime.

Peace.

jburford
04-09-2013, 03:02 AM
According to yesterday's C4D livestream from NAB it will have both.


damn it, then they had better add it into my Prime that I just got then!!! (side note, up late watching the livestream also, great stuff . .. . so tired now!)

jburford
04-09-2013, 09:29 AM
GAME Changer

For Newtek / Lightwave could simply be to do the same with Native Integration of the LW Objects/Scene into After Effects with the VPR Render Engine! That would be a killer and hard to beat by anyone, as the VPR has great quality and . . . .


just thinking outloud.

geo_n
04-09-2013, 11:28 AM
Modo running inside Nuke? Competition is getting tougher.

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/1038024/MODOHIERONUKESMASH.MOV

geo_n
04-09-2013, 11:36 AM
So Foundry did buy Lux to integrate modo into nuke. Benefit now is modo will be on high end facilities where only AD existed. Smart sell.

Celshader
04-09-2013, 01:06 PM
So Foundry did buy Lux to integrate modo into nuke. Benefit now is modo will be on high end facilities where only AD existed. Smart sell.

My supervisor's first question after the MODO 701 announcment was whether or not modo/MODO now offered support for the Autodesk XML format. When the answer was "no," he returned to his regular LightWave/Maya/VRay workflow.

Perhaps the AD facilities will pressure MODO to add XML support.

cresshead
04-09-2013, 01:24 PM
comparison chart for lite amd prime

note no gi for prime or lite and no ao for lite

http://www.toolfarm.com/images/uploads/vendors/maxon/ProductComparison-Full.pdf

also note render size is limited to 800 x 600 pixels

jeric_synergy
04-09-2013, 01:41 PM
I think a lot of mograph artists really won't care about AO and GI.

ivanze
04-09-2013, 02:50 PM
That 800x600 limit is not applicable for the AE version.

jburford
04-09-2013, 03:30 PM
:bangwall:
That 800x600 limit is not applicable for the AE version.

He should know by now, we have only told him 2-3 Times. ... :bangwall: also Again, missed multiple posts on the GI, especially from the NAB where was said would be in. (though I think Not. )

Please Read the Thread Through Cresshead. . ....

And, AGAIN.... Where does anyone doing Motion Graphics have/need GI???? :bangwall:



Grin, if you don't start reading the Thread/Posts, might hop on the next Ferry across the Channel to make sure you are listening. :beerchug:

dee
04-09-2013, 03:34 PM
comparison chart for lite amd prime

note no gi for prime or lite and no ao for lite

http://www.toolfarm.com/images/uploads/vendors/maxon/ProductComparison-Full.pdf

also note render size is limited to 800 x 600 pixels

Yes, I need to correct myself, watched another presentation today and the guy clearly said that AO and GI only works in the higher versions.

cresshead
04-09-2013, 04:08 PM
...i love being right!

yeh 'me' !!

show me written evidence to the contrary or a official video that clearly states that the lite version has AO and gi.
...you may not use Gi or AO in motion graphics but i do.

TheDynamo
04-09-2013, 05:03 PM
If I read correctly I don't think that 800x600 limitation is going to mean much when you import the C4D element into AE to use the render in there. Especially if "hinted" future features include CUDA accelerated renders in Cinema (Not a confirmed feature but Todd Kopriva says that feature is VERY high on their to-do list). Here's an After Effects specific list of features in case it hasn't been linked yet.

http://provideocoalition.com/cmg_keyframes/story/after-effects-technology-preview

-Rob


...i love being right!

yeh 'me' !!

show me written evidence to the contrary or a official video that clearly states that the lite version has AO and gi.
...you may not use Gi or AO in motion graphics but i do.

Lightwolf
04-09-2013, 05:45 PM
Perhaps the AD facilities will pressure MODO to add XML support.
Why, if it supports Alembic? Legacy pipelines?

Cheers,
Mike

jburford
04-09-2013, 06:10 PM
...i love being right!

yeh 'me' !!

show me written evidence to the contrary or a official video that clearly states that the lite version has AO and gi.
...you may not use Gi or AO in motion graphics but i do.


Rather mute, as the intended Market is not about that.

cresshead
04-09-2013, 07:24 PM
point taken and of course you are right in regards AE, as for 3d specific needs it's defo limited but as you point out you can go buy Vray for it.

jeric_synergy
04-09-2013, 07:25 PM
Rather mute, as the intended Market is not about that.
"Moot", not "mute".

geo_n
04-09-2013, 10:03 PM
My supervisor's first question after the MODO 701 announcment was whether or not modo/MODO now offered support for the Autodesk XML format. When the answer was "no," he returned to his regular LightWave/Maya/VRay workflow.

Perhaps the AD facilities will pressure MODO to add XML support.

There's alembic. And modo integrated within nuke has a bigger impact on potential new users.

ivanze
04-09-2013, 11:49 PM
Now Nuke is going to get very buggy. :D

geo_n: That Text to 3D looks very interesting.

jburford
07-31-2013, 04:59 PM
...i love being right!

yeh 'me' !!

show me written evidence to the contrary or a official video that clearly states that the lite version has AO and gi.
...you may not use Gi or AO in motion graphics but i do.



Not to be throwing out on an old thread. ...


But. . . . .

You were Not right!!


Gi was added into C4D Lite, and because of that, Gi is now also added to Prime (R15 coming 1 September)


like I was sayin, before . . . . it"s not over til the fat lady sings.

AbstractTech3D
07-31-2013, 06:30 PM
GAME Changer

For Newtek / Lightwave could simply be to do the same with Native Integration of the LW Objects/Scene into After Effects with the VPR Render Engine! That would be a killer and hard to beat by anyone, as the VPR has great quality and . . . .


just thinking outloud.

quite right.

I haven't tried the c4d text engine yet, but if it beats LWs (no mangled geometry) then case in point on LW dropping the ball.

It's a huge marketing leg-up for Maxon. Familiarity with a toolset certainly leads to purchases. Every AE boy and girl will get their hands wet with C4D.



LW has to get the hydra engine integrated into LW on the double, get text tools working properly (Adobe and Maxon are very much about easy usability), and provide also a 'lite' version inside AE - with the VPR. Also get NevronMotion into AE. To ignore the motion-graphics market is very short sighted. And indeed what motion-graphics is (GI or no-GI etc…) will be defined by ease of access and use to the artists.

jeric_synergy
07-31-2013, 10:27 PM
Text is the ONE thing that 2d designers REALLY understand, so getting better text is a Big Effin' Deal.

cresshead
08-03-2013, 06:27 AM
Not to be throwing out on an old thread. ...


But. . . . .

You were Not right!!


Gi was added into C4D Lite, and because of that, Gi is now also added to Prime (R15 coming 1 September)


like I was sayin, before . . . . it"s not over til the fat lady sings.


cinema4d Prime having Gi is a big deal....that certainly has my attention as i look forward to 3ds Max 2015 (out in april 2014) when i need to decide on continuing subs for 3dsmax or not.

robertoortiz
08-03-2013, 11:17 AM
Text is the ONE thing that 2d designers REALLY understand, so getting better text is a Big Effin' Deal.
Amen brother...

Having said that.

I wonder how long will it be before Maxon is gobbled up by Adobe?
And if THAT happens, (I know that it is a big IF) how long before Cinema is only available on the CC?

cresshead
08-03-2013, 12:25 PM
Amen brother...

Having said that.

I wonder how long will it be before Maxon is gobbled up by Adobe?
And if THAT happens, (I know that it is a big IF) how long before Cinema is only available on the CC?

do you think that's is at all possible?
drat my long term options for 3d software are getting smaller and smaller by the day!

long term it's looking like:
lightwave
blender
houdini

plus:
zbrush
3d coat
sketchup
form z
rhino
messiah

everyone else is now owned by a big corporation.:
maya, max(dying), softimage(dead), motionbuilder, muddbox, modo, cinema4d (maybe soon??)

Surrealist.
08-03-2013, 01:59 PM
I don't care who owns the software. I prefer to keep my artistic options wide open at all times.

It is a great time to be in 3D. Lots of great tools available.

Megalodon2.0
08-03-2013, 02:29 PM
I wonder how long will it be before Maxon is gobbled up by Adobe?


do you think that's is at all possible?

Someone mentioned this over at CGTalk a while ago and the consensus was that this would not happen. C4D is privately owned and the owners apparently have little to no interest in selling. I don't use C4D at all, but just from the stand poijt of competition I hope that this does not happen.

digitaldoc
08-03-2013, 03:14 PM
From my perspective C4D owned by Adobe with a subscription would be fantastic! Right now the C4D buy-in and subscription is very cost prohibitive. $19/month would be a steal!

AbstractTech3D
08-03-2013, 06:33 PM
Concerns across the industry. As a user of software, the implications are effecting my purchasing choices. Who knows, once acquisitions occur, what the effects will be for the usefulness of invested finances, skills and IP relating to usage of either the software bought-out, or for competing packages. ie LW3D has to work all that much harder against an integrated Adobe+ Maxon combo - especially at cloud pricing accessibility. Maybe that's a good thing for us (driving competitive forces benefitting LW development), or maybe its bad - if it results in LW ultimately losing out.

Interested that AfterEffects is getting a total re-write: https://www.newschoolers.com/ns/forums/readthread/thread_id/752012/

Concerned also that Avid is not looking good financially. Speculation that they might get bought up: http://www.screenlight.tv/blog/2013/03/05/will-avids-accounting-woes-spark-big-change-or-an-acquisition/

Maybe this all points to an ultimate media software showdown between Autodesk and Adobe.

I prefer there to be lots of competition. It's healthy.

It's all making me very cautious about spending money now. Just not enough confidence in the combined longevity + usability of any given solution.

Interesting times indeed.

jeric_synergy
08-03-2013, 07:05 PM
Panicking based on a speculation? EYEROLL.

Heck, it's hardly even a speculation, more like a conjecture. sheesh.

Personally, I'm >>LOVING<< Adobe's CC: I would have NEVER purchased all this software separately. A dollar a day for a continually updated AE? Shut up and take my money.

AbstractTech3D
08-03-2013, 07:14 PM
Panicking based on a speculation? EYEROLL.

Heck, it's hardly even a speculation, more like a conjecture. sheesh.

Personally, I'm >>LOVING<< Adobe's CC: I would have NEVER purchased all this software separately. A dollar a day for a continually updated AE? Shut up and take my money.

Exactly. See how ridiculously easy it now is to find Maxon installed on your machine.

Hail
08-04-2013, 01:28 PM
Personally, I'm >>LOVING<< Adobe's CC: I would have NEVER purchased all this software separately. A dollar a day for a continually updated AE? Shut up and take my money.

hmmm.. hopefully Microsoft and apple will follow adobe's lead soon and one would be required to pay just to boot his os.
Now that would be interesting:devil:

Riff_Masteroff
08-04-2013, 04:55 PM
do you think that's is at all possible?
drat my long term options for 3d software are getting smaller and smaller by the day!
. . . . .
everyone else is now owned by a big corporation.:
. . . . .

What of Fusion? 3d compositing program it is. Not 'owned by a big corporation'.
Many LW's use it, myself included.

Much better than AE, better than photoshop, except that it is harder (more options) to use.

3dworks
08-04-2013, 05:03 PM
cinema4d Prime having Gi is a big deal....that certainly has my attention as i look forward to 3ds Max 2015 (out in april 2014) when i need to decide on continuing subs for 3dsmax or not.

where do you guys know this from? haven't see any particular announcement of this yet. afaik prime 15 only has an ambient occlusion mode, but no real GI. however i have a subscription with maxon for prime anyway, so i will see in september what's gonna look like ;-)

jwiede
08-06-2013, 04:02 AM
where do you guys know this from? haven't see any particular announcement of this yet. afaik prime 15 only has an ambient occlusion mode, but no real GI. however i have a subscription with maxon for prime anyway, so i will see in september what's gonna look like ;-)

Srek specifically stated that the Standard renderer gets GI (not just AO) in 15, see here (http://www.c4dcafe.com/ipb/topic/77033-maxon-announces-release-15/page-8#entry543601).

3dworks
08-06-2013, 11:34 AM
ah thanks, interesting. i wonder why this is not part of the new feature announcements. maybe because the absence of GI in prime R14 was too ridiculous? :D