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View Full Version : Advice please, C4d to LW and vice versa?



raw-m
03-20-2013, 07:25 AM
I do Motion Graphics, c4d is the industry standard, I've got to learn it, I'm over it now!

I'm doing a bit of research and think I can get the Broadcast flavour of c4d and use LW for dynamics, instancing etc. I can see straight away that, with the exception of the procedual NURBie extrusion stuff and possibly adobe export integration, LW is a far 'better' 3d app for me, especially in terms of render quality. Question is, how can I work between the two? Anyone got any pipeline tips?

Ultimately, I think I want to model, texture and render in LW, using c4d for the more mograph stuff. So FBX/OBJ from LW Modeller. Can I export scenes from c4d to LW keeping camera settings? Are there conversion tools native to c4d?

Really interested to hear from users of both packages on how they could work together.

dee
03-20-2013, 01:39 PM
C4D reads lwo/lws natively, from C4D you can export FBX. Camera comes fine in but you need to adjust the zoom and image size. An examle: a 36mm camera (FOV 53.13 x 31.42) from C4D comes in as 36mm with FOV 83,27 x 53,13. As the horizontal and vertical FOV is swapped, just set horizontal FOV to 53,13 in LW and you're good to go.

And don't forget to bake your mograph stuff. ;)

Celshader
03-20-2013, 02:00 PM
Ultimately, I think I want to model, texture and render in LW, using c4d for the more mograph stuff. So FBX/OBJ from LW Modeller. Can I export scenes from c4d to LW keeping camera settings? Are there conversion tools native to c4d?

As far as I know, C4D can import/export LWS files. It can definitely export MDD files, so it might be able to read them as well.

The one thing I learned while working with C4D artists in 2010 was that C4D (at the time) did not have its LWS importer updated to reflect the ObjectID "license plate" system introduced with LightWave 9.2 in 2007. So I would use "Save 6.0 Scene" whenever I needed to export a LightWave scene file for C4D artists. The 6.0 LWS file format should be fine for basic LW<>C4D interchange.

Darth Mole
03-20-2013, 02:11 PM
C4D can read LW objects and scenes but (in my experience) it's a bit flaky and you will of course lose all your texture data. However it will keep the selection tags, so you can reapply materials in C4D. You can get some sort of interop going but it certainly won't be smooth or easy.

What is it you're trying to do?

raw-m
03-20-2013, 02:28 PM
Hey all, great feedback. Thats sounds pretty painless and gives me a lot more confidence.

Darth mole - I'm just about to buy myself a copy as there's no getting away from it, I'm a freelancer and practically all jobs are asking for C4d experience. I'm pretty sure most of these jobs just mention c4d as a knee jerk reaction when 3d is required but its good to have another feather in the bow and will put me in a stronger position.

ivanze
03-20-2013, 02:46 PM
I've been experimenting a little with C4D. I don't get used to the interface, but mograph is really awesome from what I see.
I was checking this plugin for C4D and I think you are going to need it to bake mograph and all other things painlessly, so you can export them to LW.

http://nitro4d.com/blog/donationware/nitrobake/

souzou
03-20-2013, 03:49 PM
We use both, but have always rendered in the package we animate in (so far). I think we tried the FBX route once and couldn't get it working right, but haven't tried it in latest versions. This thread is a good reminder to try again!

We found C4D network rendering so easy compared to LW btw, if you have a few machines to render on.

jburford
03-26-2013, 09:50 AM
C4D can read LW objects and scenes but (in my experience) it's a bit flaky and you will of course lose all your texture data. However it will keep the selection tags, so you can reapply materials in C4D. You can get some sort of interop going but it certainly won't be smooth or easy.

What is it you're trying to do?


Flaky? Odd, I have just (more recently) gotten bigger into C4D, and I have no problem at all with any LW Objects or Scenes. In fact has been the best implementation of support for them outside of LW that I have seen. Texturing coming across fairly well, basic and glass is glass, but yes will do some other tinkering with it though.

Also found that C4D brings in stuff from Blender real well, had some exports out of Blender with some falling and tumbling of pens into a glass. coming into LW, axis problem, and prob with the mdd, could either get one or the other matched or turned but not both. In C4d, did not have to mess with mdds at all, the fbx just came in with all movement and actions and on the correct Y up axis.


Using Version 14 Prime

Tartiflette
03-26-2013, 12:46 PM
In fact C4D's lws import is flaky when the objects from LightWave are multi-layers objects (which is more than usual since LW v6) as the importer loads every layers each time an object layer is called in the original LW scene.
So with big scenes featuring multi-layers objects this function can be quite difficult to deal with, unfortunately. :(

Well, at least there is an import function for LWS, so it's a good start ! :)


Cheers,
Laurent aka Tartiflette. :)

realgray
03-26-2013, 02:11 PM
I'd be really excited if this gives you the opportunity to work with vrayforC4d. A beautiful renderer that one.

jburford
03-26-2013, 03:50 PM
Tartiflette, Thanks for the information. And not to sound stupid, but would that not be expected and pretty much the same in Lightwave before Instancing was added? I mean, if I tell program X or Y to load a scene with X number of Objects with X number of Layers, wouldn't one expect it to load that exactly so? Unless of course they were referenced or cloned.

Especially since I would want access to each and every one individually.

Asking, since am really curious here. Have not loaded in real large scenes so maybe there is something I am not seeing.

Something real nice though, just loaded a a scene of a baby room, is that C4D is even respecting (even with Texture Tags) and bringing in the Selection Sets from Lightwave! Ok, looks like their is either an issue with the naming of layers, might be how I named in Modeller though.

jburford
03-26-2013, 03:54 PM
I've been experimenting a little with C4D. I don't get used to the interface, but mograph is really awesome from what I see.
I was checking this plugin for C4D and I think you are going to need it to bake mograph and all other things painlessly, so you can export them to LW.

http://nitro4d.com/blog/donationware/nitrobake/


I used to think the same thing around 5-7 yrs ago with it. But is simple. Change it To however you want! There is almost nothing that you can not change and modify fully to your liking and style. Want No Icons, No Problem. Mix it up like one would with the normal Adobe After Effects or Premiere. Put the Panels, and windows and icons where you want them, or delete out. Change any color or interface as suited. Pretty cool. imo

Tartiflette
03-27-2013, 03:08 AM
Tartiflette, Thanks for the information. And not to sound stupid, but would that not be expected and pretty much the same in Lightwave before Instancing was added? I mean, if I tell program X or Y to load a scene with X number of Objects with X number of Layers, wouldn't one expect it to load that exactly so? Unless of course they were referenced or cloned.

I think you are mixing things up ! ;)

In fact, the problem with multi-layers objects from LightWave in Cinema4D is that it loads the entire object (i.e. ALL the layers of that object) each time, instead of just loading the layer.

So, to make it clear, let's say you have a scene with one multi-layers object, for example test.lwo which features 15 layers.
In Layout, this object will be represented as such :
test:01
test:02
test:03
and so on...

When you load the LWS in C4D you will end up with a scene which has the same object "test.lwo" duplicated 15 times with ALL its layers making it a 15*15 objects instead !
So that would make it something like this :
test01:01
test01:02
test01:03
...
test03:01
test03:02
...
test15:14
test15:15

In that case, with big scenes featuring a lot of different multi-layers objects the scene in C4D starts to be screwed quite quickly and the cleanup can take a lot of time.
So if you want to avoid any problem in LWS loading in C4D you have to work with single-layer objects and the scene will then load fine. :)
Hope it's a little bit more clear now !


Cheers,
Laurent aka Tartiflette. :)

djwaterman
03-27-2013, 03:45 AM
If I was to get into C4D, what version should I get, for motion graphics at least however even animation in general? I get confused by all the different versions, what does a regular user recommend?

raw-m
03-27-2013, 03:55 AM
From my research and for what I need, LW is more than capable for modelling, instancing, flocking etc, so don't need the full on "Studio" package. "Broadcast" is the next step down (and more than half the price!) with a sidegrade offer from other packages:

http://www.maxonshop.com/uk/ps/CINEMA%204D%20Broadcast/1/s1/S123-CAT252

Theres also a product comparison on their website somewhere to check the features that are included.

Tartiflette
03-27-2013, 04:11 AM
Yep, for MoGraph stuff in C4D you need at least Braodcast version, which is the least expensive version with the MoGraph related functions or Studio, which is the complete package, much more expensive .

All in all if you "only" want MoGraph you can buy Broadcast version.


Cheers,
Laurent aka Tartiflette. :)