PDA

View Full Version : Audio out of sync when uploaded on Brightcove



erikstripparo
11-12-2012, 01:55 PM
Hi,

I am a newbie with the tricaster 40. It looks like the on demand version of the shows we broadcast work fine as a live stream but the on demand version when uploaded on Brightcove behave very badly, any help would be much appreciated.

jmmultex
11-15-2012, 02:21 PM
Do you have a link to the show that has the problem?

-john

erikstripparo
11-15-2012, 02:56 PM
Do you have a link to the show that has the problem?

-john

John, unfortunately I had to delete it from the server. resta assured though it was not usable. It turns out the only ready for web version the 40 records is 853x480 which is not what I need. 720p is the right aspect ratio.

Lee-AVP
11-15-2012, 03:00 PM
That's... weird. They can handle that resolution fine as a live stream, but the flash file you upload doesn't work right?

Sounds like a Brightcove problem.

erikstripparo
11-15-2012, 03:21 PM
That's... weird. They can handle that resolution fine as a live stream, but the flash file you upload doesn't work right?

Sounds like a Brightcove problem.

Correct, the aspect ratio is wrong.

and it messes up with Brightcove. Even uploading it on youtube generates a warning, but at least youtube can handle that, it takes longer time to encode though

jmmultex
11-15-2012, 03:23 PM
I completely trust that the file isn't usable - just wanted to inspect the problem and, if possible, the file first hand.

Without anything specific to go off of, the first thing I would do is get Adobe's Flash Player (It's a free download here: http://www.adobe.com/support/flashplayer/downloads.html), and verify that the flash file you created looks OK locally before sending it up to Brightcove. I

f all looks good, then either Brightcove has a problem, or the technical details of the file you uploaded are not supported for playback by Brightcove. That may require a reencode

If it doesn't playback correctly locally, then the issue is with the file creation itself. Did you get this file from the XD40's streaming archive, or did you use a QT or MPEG recording and convert it to Flash some other way?

Sorry for asking so many questions - just trying to narrow do the problem...

-john

erikstripparo
11-15-2012, 03:25 PM
Unfortuntately I am not happy. mp4 version is not helping me

- - - Updated - - -

Thanks John, I upload the recorded file from the 40. I am just reuploading it now, so you can see, thanks again

If it doesn't playback correctly locally, then the issue is with the file creation itself. Did you get this file from the XD40's streaming archive, or did you use a QT or MPEG recording and convert it to Flash some other way?

Sorry for asking so many questions - just trying to narrow do the problem...

-john[/QUOTE]

erikstripparo
11-15-2012, 03:46 PM
John,

this is one sample:

http://bcove.me/xfsgqz41

- - - Updated - - -

John,

this is one sample:

http://bcove.me/xfsgqz41

jmmultex
11-15-2012, 03:49 PM
Since you seem to have an issue with YouTube as well, my guess is that there is something about the file that isn't right - even if YouTube is able to handle it.

I seem to remember that Brightcove wants all files H.264 encoded - even if they are in a Flash wrapper. If they don't get H.264, they will reencode it into that. They also create versions to match viewers with various connection speeds. I'm trying to remember Brightcove's file requirements, but don't take this as absolute - the older I get, the less 'absolute' my memory becomes... :(

I would make sure that whatever you upload is already in H.264 - the QT files recorded by the TriCaster should be H.264 already. That would eliminate one possible issue. The frame sizing is also a bit strange - it sounds like a square pixel rendering of an SD widescreen image (16:9). I would take the origional QT file (if available) and encode it into flash with the 16:9 widescreen set. That should create an in-spec file for you. (BTW - where did the 'broken' Flash file come from?)

From everything you are saying, it seems like the file itself is out of spec and is causing problems. That said, without being able to work with it directly, I'm just speculating on some possibilities.

Let me know if there is anything specific I can do to help...

-john

erikstripparo
11-15-2012, 03:54 PM
John,

this is what the tricaster 40 records as "web ready file" as I said, it is the wrong aspect ratio, it seems to me this is a bug. Our clients would like to have the file up and running straight after the gig, which is what we normally do, but tricaster 40 does only offer that weird squared pixels format. I was hoping newtek was going to speed up our workflow and not put another step in the middle (re-encoding)
Thanks for your help though, I will try it. Brightcove by the way nowadays is happy with different formats as long as they are 16:9 or 4:3 aspect ratio. 720p would make me very happy :)

erikstripparo
11-15-2012, 04:09 PM
by the way john, awesome project you are working on. I would love to try that

Lee-AVP
11-15-2012, 04:19 PM
If you need a 720p H264 file, you're going to need to transcode it yourself or build a flash profile that uses H264 (easy in FMLE) and upload the stream archive instead of the internal recording. If, as you say, Brightcove is fine with a different file format, just forget about the "web ready" preset and use either the mpeg recording or the flash recording. That "web ready" file you uploaded looks pretty bad anyway. I'd just skip it entirely and use a full resolution option. Going to take longer to upload, but it'll work and it'll look better.

863x640 is pretty darn close to 16:9, but I wonder if somehow Brightcove's transcoding stuff doesn't like dimensions that aren't divisible by 144.

Lee-AVP
11-15-2012, 04:24 PM
The file size is only strange sounding because it's not a broadcast format. But streaming and internet video should be totally agnostic of pixel dimensions. There should be absolutely no reason any online video service requires anything to be in 720p, as long as the *ratio* is right. And even then... think about all the crazy shaped cell phone videos you've watched online. The only question should be how well do they fit in the player.

Audio and video getting out of sync? Either the file is broken for some other reason (a possible bug), or the service's transcoding is wonky. If the file plays back properly locally (windows media player or quicktime) I wouldn't be so quick to blame the Tricaster.

SBowie
11-15-2012, 05:16 PM
... but tricaster 40 does only offer that weird squared pixels format. I was hoping newtek was going to speed up our workflow and not put another step in the middle (re-encoding) For the record, there's nothing 'weird' about converting to a square pixel format for web use. I find it a bit strange that it's set to an odd number, and not 854 (what I'd have used), but apart from that, it really is a 16:9 image aspect.

I don't know if they'd handle a bog standard SD 16:9 (720x480) any better. Some places do, I think, but not all.

Lee-AVP
11-15-2012, 06:10 PM
True HD is square pixel, whether it's on a broadcast or desktop. There are some cameras (like our Panason HPX170s) that record with wide pixels (1280x1080 or 1440x1080 instead of 1920x1080). It's a perversion of broadcast standard that allows for smaller file sizes and faster write times and lets manufacturers use their old 4:3 ratio pixel manufacturing capability. It's HDV, not a true HD resolution. It's a camera hack that requires rendering times and ratio compensation toggles in NLEs.

Square pixels are where it's at, these days.

SBowie
11-15-2012, 06:52 PM
Square pixels are where it's at, these days.And about time. :)

erikstripparo
11-21-2012, 03:14 AM
Ok I spoke with bright cove support and it turns out the h264 is in an ISOM codec which is Kodak proprietary. Newtek do you think you can update this to make it a more universally accepted codec?
Cheers and thanks fr the attention. Ah right and please constant bit rate

SBowie
11-21-2012, 11:38 AM
Ok I spoke with bright cove support and it turns out the h264 is in an ISOM codec which is Kodak proprietary. Newtek do you think you can update this to make it a more universally accepted codec?I've initiated some inquiries into this, but it being a holiday week, it may be a little while before I get a response. The files play just fine in pretty much any player I tried, including Windows Media Player, so I'm not so sure that it's in any way unusual or involves any sort of licensing issue. I'll see what I can find out.


Ah right and please constant bit rateFWIW, it currently is CBR.

erikstripparo
11-21-2012, 01:58 PM
Thanks Steve, I know it is CBR :) just wanted to make sure :)

erikstripparo
11-21-2012, 02:01 PM
Generally I think it would be great if you offered the possibility to choose between different formats. 360p, 720p :)

erikstripparo
12-09-2012, 04:52 PM
Hi Steve, hope you had nice times :) do you have any news about this particular issue?

cheers

SBowie
12-10-2012, 10:23 AM
OK, let's get back to the original matter. Two different issues are in play in this thread, and that's contributing to some confusion. Let's deal, for now, with the audio sync problem (the 720p format feature request has in this thread can safely stand alone). The audio sync issue is more in the nature of a possible bug, and calls for a different process.

Talking with engineering, it seems we don't really have enough information yet to make any progress. (Just in passing, it's not the codec that is "isom", it's the wrapper). At the moment, no-one here thinks this pose any issue (which is rather supported by the fact that exactly one person has reported an issue), but these things can be complex, and they're quite open to looking into it further. To kick that process into gear, it would be great if you could post a case to Fogbugz (see this thread: http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?110229) with full details. You should include your software version, session format, the type of cameras connected and their Connection settings (from Input Configuration), as well as the recording format. It could be quite useful to see a direct quote from Brightcove's response to your query, as well as a screen shot of the error message you're seeing when uploading to YouTube. If you have a short sample file to upload with the case, all the better.


Hi,

I am a newbie with the tricaster 40. It looks like the on demand version of the shows we broadcast work fine as a live stream but the on demand version when uploaded on Brightcove behave very badly, any help would be much appreciated.