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View Full Version : Cool Camera Configuration using BM ATEM



vanderwielen
10-31-2012, 04:54 PM
Hope this pic came thru...

Here's a cool studio camera configuration I've designed. It's a Canon XF305 on rails, with a integral AB battery, side mounted BM ATEM and rear mounted HDMI monitor ($179). Notice that the flip out is the camera feed and the monitor is the return from the truck. I use the AB Hytron 140. The unit is short enough to fit in a pelican case. The AB Battery constantly charges the ATEM and powers the monitor.

Completely fiber remoted.

108910

PIZAZZ
11-01-2012, 10:41 AM
You showed me yours, now I am going to have to show you mine... :)

Gonna have to get some pics uploaded.



Do you have any other pics Rick? maybe some pics from the side?

I have finally have new boxes made to house our ATEM converters to protect those silly LC connections. We use Neutrik OpticalCON connectors on the cables. Pics to come.

ZachSchuster
11-01-2012, 12:38 PM
You showed me mine, now I am going to have to show you mine... :)

Ummm... that's just weird... and that's before the typo that I think is in this sentence...

PIZAZZ
11-01-2012, 12:42 PM
Yep Zach I did type that wrong, I blame it on the new mac.

Corrected so the whole world doesn't think I am an idiot that can't type.

brians0105
11-01-2012, 09:42 PM
Rick and Jef,

Are you guys using the built in intercom on the ATEM converters or still supplying copper intercom to the camera operators?

PIZAZZ
11-01-2012, 10:29 PM
adapting the ClearCom or Production Intercom com signal to the ATEM Studio Converter which then feeds down the fiber to the ATEM Camera Convertors. All over fiber here. Well for the most part. We also have a wireless COM solution that we use that I will post details about in another thread.

brians0105
11-01-2012, 10:34 PM
Jef, yeah, now I remember that from our conversations. We still struggle with the camera ops being able to hear and communicate effectively using the 1/8" headphone out of the camera converters.

PIZAZZ
11-02-2012, 06:33 AM
Which headsets are you using? And how exactly are you connecting your PI system to the Atem?

vanderwielen
11-02-2012, 07:16 AM
brian, use a skull-candy or other iphone compatible earpiece. they effectively block ambient sounds. my intercom is PI in the truck, atem at the cameras, wireless IFB to the down cameras...who are still on copper. there is absolutely no way i'd ever...ever have my down shots drag fiber. The wireless IFB is connected to the intercom. Wireless also allows your engineer or other roving person to hear com. BTW, don't buy IFB Receivers! it's a waste of money. Get a broadband, handheld general coverage ham radio receiver. It'll will only set you back $200, plus you can program all your wireless devices in memory allowing you to check on the white hat, sideline reporter or perhaps wireless effects mics.

it's interesting that Jeff is independently arriving at the same solution that I have. It's also interesting...and somewhat comical...that alot of producers hang onto the com over audio mixer solution. I did, and I was wrong. In engineering, there's an old adage, NIF. "Not Invented Here", which is a descriptive phrase about the innate shortcomings of technical types who reject anything they didn't think of as being inferior.

PIZAZZ
11-02-2012, 07:46 AM
there is absolutely no way i'd ever...ever have my down shots drag fiber.

Rick, Why is that? Those far reaching cameras were some of the first I wanted to fiber up for the large football stadiums especially. Until a reasonable, affordable, reliable wireless solution presents itself to the industry.



it's interesting that Jeff is independently arriving at the same solution that I have. It's also interesting...and somewhat comical...that alot of producers hang onto the com over audio mixer solution. I did, and I was wrong. In engineering, there's an old adage, NIF. "Not Invented Here", which is a descriptive phrase about the innate shortcomings of technical types who reject anything they didn't think of as being inferior.

Like I said earlier, there are many ways to do this production thing. There is no one way or right/wrong way just different ways to make it work. I frequently have to bite my lip talking to clients we build out systems for. What I consider a priority may not be a priority to others. Then there are things I do not consider a priority that some of those clients do. Shading cameras for instance... COM is another... I agree though that there is practically none of this that hasn't been done in one way or another. We aren't inventing cold fusion here. We are all just working with the scope and budget we have been given.

vanderwielen
11-02-2012, 08:22 AM
Rick, Why is that? Those far reaching cameras were some of the first I wanted to fiber up for the large football stadiums especially. Until a reasonable, affordable, reliable wireless solution presents itself to the industry.



Like I said earlier, there are many ways to do this production thing. There is no one way or right/wrong way just different ways to make it work. I frequently have to bite my lip talking to clients we build out systems for. What I consider a priority may not be a priority to others. Then there are things I do not consider a priority that some of those clients do. Shading cameras for instance... COM is another... I agree though that there is practically none of this that hasn't been done in one way or another. We aren't inventing cold fusion here. We are all just working with the scope and budget we have been given.

Jeff, it's not necessary to drag fiber for the down shots. We own the AB wireless system (1/2 mile of HD!) and a Cam-Wave (200') that we use for football. But more often than not, I'll stretch 300' of copper, reclock it using one of my famous 'dirty bombs' (as john powell calls it) and use an additional 300' of copper. Com is wireless.

Or, you could fiber to the venue, convert to copper and do the same thing, or place the ATEM under the bleachers....so on and so on.

Fiber is glass, brittle and can break. If repair were a piece of cake like a BNC connector, fine, but it becomes problematic in the field. BTW, a MAJOR issue is retraining staff used to 'pulling' cable to not pull fiber...but rather "place it".

I understand budgets. I got your point on that.

brians0105
11-02-2012, 12:54 PM
brian, use a skull-candy or other iphone compatible earpiece. they effectively block ambient sounds.

I'll look into those. Maybe they'll work better than the noise cancelling ones I picked up at Best Buy.


Which headsets are you using? And how exactly are you connecting your PI system to the Atem?

Can't remember which pair we have tested, but they were ~$160 at Best Buy. They're okay, but not perfect at blocking out ambient noise, especially compared to typical PI or ClearCom headsets. Similar to you, we're using the PI Audio In/Out box to send and insert audio from the truck intercom into the ATEM Camera Converters.

PIZAZZ
11-02-2012, 01:00 PM
I remember picking up something somewhere that the magic ohm rating for the ATEM Camera converter headphone out is 32Ohms. Remember they tried to make these so that everyday headsets would work in them. Specifically the iPhone headsets. If you use higher headsets with a higher Ohm rating the volume will be much less.

We use some of the Plantronics ones like from Best Buy but we found the cheaper Microsoft wrap around headset seems a little louder according to my cam ops. Keep in mind we are shooting tennis right now so there is no where near the loud ambient volume of a football or basketball game.


Try sending more volume out of the PI 903. If I remember right the magic settings on the switches up front were low and low. Then tweak out the pots to the max. I went to 11 on ours. :)

brians0105
11-02-2012, 01:09 PM
Makes sense and I'll give all those things a shot. I just wish BMD would come out with a PRO version of the Camera Converter.

Brian

ZachSchuster
11-02-2012, 02:13 PM
We use some of the Plantronics ones like from Best Buy but we found the cheaper Microsoft wrap around headset seems a little louder according to my cam ops. Keep in mind we are shooting tennis right now so there is no where near the loud ambient volume of a football or basketball game.

Except the grunting.


Then tweak out the pots to the max. I went to 11 on ours. :)

Wondering how many people will get the reference.

Otherwise, I have nothing of value to add to this this thread at this time. But I am following it intently.

pdxJoe
11-02-2012, 03:04 PM
Headsets for BM camera converters:

For quiet venues (conferences) we use this: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002WVDJNU/ref=oh_details_o02_s00_i00

For noisy environments (Women's Roller Derby) we use this: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005QUQP7Q/ref=oh_details_o03_s00_i00
These have a nice mic toggle switch inline to the headphones. We are able to clip in the PTT on all the BM Camera Converters and then use the inline mic switch. This allows the camera operator to work without touching the BM Camera Converter which is taped to the tripod. We tried quite a few headsets before finding these. I'm sure there are lots of other good options too.

Cheers!

Joe

PIZAZZ
11-02-2012, 04:05 PM
Fiber is glass, brittle and can break. If repair were a piece of cake like a BNC connector, fine, but it becomes problematic in the field. BTW, a MAJOR issue is retraining staff used to 'pulling' cable to not pull fiber...but rather "place it".
.

One of the major reasons we went the OpticalCON route on our tactical fiber cables. I could so easily see those LCs getting yanked off. I agree we have had to do some retraining on how to handle roll the fiber cable. At first we really treated it like gold. It was definitely priced similarly. I took my gloves off after this...... I was showing a client a sample cable and he wanted to see what is inside the jacket, I pulled out my leatherman which I just had sharpened. I rolled the jacket on my blade like i have done a million times on cable and couldn't believe what I saw. No cut, barely a mark on it. I rolled it harder, still nothing cut. I finally put it down on the serated edge at the bottom of the blade and only then was I able to saw through the outer jacket. I was really impressed. Shocked and awed actually. When cable manufacturers tell you that a tank can roll over it, I didn't feel like it was anywhere close to true. We still protect the connectors but no longer completely regard the cables as super fragile.