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View Full Version : Lightwave11 and Poser Pro Bundle 2012 offer from NewTek



Snosrap
10-12-2012, 06:17 PM
Title say's it all. Link here:https://www.lightwave3d.com/lightwave_poser_promo/

wesleycorgi
10-12-2012, 09:39 PM
And they just announced the DSON importer for Poser, so you can import all that Daz Genesis goodness into Poser.

Snosrap
10-12-2012, 09:50 PM
They seem to have their mojo, working overtime with importer and exporter features. I hope they find time for Modeler. On Topic: I wonder if early adapters will be entitled to the offer?

EremiticWolf
10-12-2012, 10:57 PM
Wonder if Poser 8 will work with lightwave 11.5 and the new exporter/importer. Bought LW11 back in December.

wesleycorgi
10-13-2012, 02:46 AM
And they just announced the DSON importer for Poser, so you can import all that Daz Genesis goodness into Poser.

http://www.daz3d.com/shop/products/dson-importer

inkpen3d
10-13-2012, 03:30 AM
Should this not also be available to those of us who have already upgraded to LW11?

After all, it's those of us who pay in advance for the upgrades that are keeping LW development afloat - but it seems like we're being penalised for upgrading too quickly!

So come on NT, if you haven't already got plans to do so, how about rewarding us long-term LW users by also providing us with a copy of Poser Pro 2012!

Regards,
Peter

Markc
10-13-2012, 04:46 AM
That's nuts, I was just looking at prices for Poser Pro today (£228 gbp on Amazon).
Think I might wait and see if Newtek offer us a better deal :thumbsup:

rcallicotte
10-13-2012, 05:48 AM
I have Lightwave 9.6 (without the FOB - lost) for anyone wanting to take the upgrade path to 11.5 (when it comes out).

https://www.lightwave3d.com/lightwave_poser_promo/

http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?130543-Lightwave-3D-9-6-1-For-Sale

geo_n
10-13-2012, 08:10 PM
Wow modonauts think they're really in the big leagues now when they got bought by the Foundy. Lol. Here's hoping for a price hike in modo 801. :D
http://forums.luxology.com/topic.aspx?f=42&t=70722&page=0#634226

probiner
10-13-2012, 08:52 PM
Apparently... "This offer is not available in Japan. Please visit www.dstorm.co.jp for LightWave promotions in Japan. Thank You."

Geo_n, brown is dead, long live Blue Fluid Theme :D
Though sometimes we see some look down talk in Modo forums, be careful to not give the impression that's how it's viewed among all "modonauts", there's also very balanced, good sense opinions around there :)

Cheers

geo_n
10-13-2012, 09:02 PM
There's more look down than look up with lw over there. But yeah I know the users that do that. Ex lwvers that cgtalk users term as rabid fanboys who switched from lw to modo carrying the same fanboy attitude. :D
I didn't notice there's blue. Looks a bit dark. The sections are not differentiated well. Needs more highlights and shades. text is gray?

RebelHill
10-14-2012, 02:55 AM
WTF??

So if the folks at Siggraph dont laugh at you for wearing your Core Tshirt... they'll just laugh at your free copy of Poser instead. Nice one NT.

colkai
10-14-2012, 03:08 AM
At least LWCAD was a worthy addition when that was included, as was DFX+.
A free copy of Poser with LW is not what I would of expected, it certainly doesn't send a good signal as to where Newtek think Lightwave aligns in the software market. Especially when you consider that sooner or later, you end up with Poser being provided free at pretty much every release. Coming to a Magazine DVD near you within 12 months or so I'd wager.

Maybe they think Poser will be a useful conversion tool with animation capabilities to "complement" Lightwave? >>shrugs<<

alexos
10-14-2012, 03:56 AM
At least LWCAD was a worthy addition when that was included, as was DFX+...
Maybe they think Poser will be a useful conversion tool with animation capabilities to "complement" Lightwave?

Previous promos were usually far more interesting than this; apart from those you mentioned, the LW+Vue one was a killer - well, on paper... Vue's own shortcomings kind of ruined the whole thing, but that's a different story. Poser... The Modo chaps have a point, it is perceived as a hobbyist tool; and contrary to LWCAD or DFX it has a very specific and limited field of application. Oh and yeah, it's not very good either - my own personal opinion of course, but still. I would be very interested in knowing the reasoning behind this move, because frankly it sounds a lot like a "we had to do something and nobody else agreed to our price" sort of thing. Rebelhill might have put it a bit on the... Harsh side, but he does have a point.

ADP.

Cageman
10-14-2012, 04:03 AM
WTF??

So if the folks at Siggraph dont laugh at you for wearing your Core Tshirt... they'll just laugh at your free copy of Poser instead. Nice one NT.

"People" are stupid though! Poser is one of the best generic character generation tools out there, perfect for non-hero digital characters in both full CG and vfx-projects. I know several studios who have used/use it, including where I work.

Not sure why this is such a bad thing?

RebelHill
10-14-2012, 05:14 AM
Youre right, they are, and it is. However its the first thats important here cos promotional materials or products need to pander to that simplistic outlook on things. Its all about image.

metahumanity
10-14-2012, 06:31 AM
Wow modonauts think they're really in the big leagues now when they got bought by the Foundy. Lol. Here's hoping for a price hike in modo 801. :D
http://forums.luxology.com/topic.aspx?f=42&t=70722&page=0#634226

That has nohing to do with arrogance, and if you read carefully you´ll notice that people go to lengths in that thread not to bash Poser.

They´re just intrigued about such a pairing that doesn´t really reveal a lot of ambition to bring LW into the ...big league, as you call it.

Oedo 808
10-14-2012, 06:42 AM
It fits right in with the visualization angle they've been pushing, I don't see it as bad or wrong as such but Poser does have a stigma associated with it. A demo such as that which formed part of the VFX Minds presentation demonstrating the use of Poser with LightWave as part of the promo would help let people know exactly why the LightWave Group were happy to go with Poser when even many of their own users are going "Poser? Eww!"

I've heard a fair amount of bitching about LW over the years, I can't see it affecting the reputation to any great degree, people have much bigger beefs with performance and the lack of certain features, but it's certainly opens it up to some cheap shots which it could do without, à la 'Modonauts'. Though I'll take the point above that part of it may just be confusion.

It's frustrating because I can see the angle, and Rob is very good at selling it, the presentations I've seen are very good, but that concept needs to be carried through promotions like these and sold hard.

Sell the idea of "Building a Virtual 3D Art Department (https://www.lightwave3d.com/news/article/avatar-building-a-virtual-3d-art-department/)" and link Poser into this concept. The sentence; "The LightWave 11 and Poser Pro bundle is the perfect tool for pre-visualization, design and animation projects that need rapid character creation, rigging, and animation setup." is the bare minimum that could have been done to push this concept. Well perhaps there is more to come because I couldn't see the offer on the LightWave site, unless I missed it.

As to the fact it may not be available to existing users *newsflash* this just in, company in special offer on new licenses to entice new customers shocker.

djwaterman
10-14-2012, 07:28 AM
If it brings in "Hobbyists", sells more licenses, it can only be a good thing, agree the pre-viz concept should have been mentioned to make it seem a more professional pairing.

OnlineRender
10-14-2012, 07:45 AM
to me it actually shows that there is an effort coming from LW3DG to communicate with other companies , for me it's good "prefer Vue though :)"

wesleycorgi
10-14-2012, 09:11 AM
I'm amazed at the reaction to this simple promo. Yes Poser has a certain stigma (maybe rightfully so with all the pron-like content that is created), but has anyone used the tool to make more objective comments?

I've been a Poser user since version 1, when it was basically touted by Metacreations as a "drawing dummy." it has been a great tool for us folks who do not have the time to model, surface, and rig human characters from scratch. The Fusion plugin works well (tbh, I'm thankful there is a LW --- and Mac ---- plug given that many software out there don't). And there are bunch of tools that I haven't even used: lip sync, dynamic cloth, walk cycle, etc. I hoping that between Smith Micro and Daz, that they can eventually become a Motion Builder killer. $500 or free vs. a few thousand would be awesome.

It's just another tool and is advertised in 3D World, just like Lightwave and Modo; so they are targeting the same user base. When I bought into LW on my own dime, I got LWcad and Vue. I never really used Vue, but it was just a nice perk.

wesleycorgi
10-14-2012, 09:19 AM
A Fusion promo would have been awesome to counter the Modo / Nuke pipeline. But maybe they can't because there is no Mac version (although I use my Fusion license in Parallels). The other natural pairing would be 3D Coat.

Or perhaps industry bundles like a LW/Unity promo for gaming, LW/LWCAD for arch viz, etc. As OnlineRender points out, I like the idea that NT is trying to partner.

Hail
10-14-2012, 10:24 AM
Anyone heard the half a loaf is better than none analogy?
Lets be content and enjoy what we get, aftarall poser is quiet useful.

Digital Hermit
10-14-2012, 10:49 AM
You know what I think would be a great promo... If LW invested in its own massive render farm and offered it free to its users or at a significant discount. :D

colkai
10-14-2012, 12:05 PM
The sentence; "The LightWave 11 and Poser Pro bundle is the perfect tool for pre-visualization, design and animation projects that need rapid character creation, rigging, and animation setup." is the bare minimum that could have been done to push this concept.

Good point well made. If that's the thinking behind it, make it plain that it's all about the pre-vis and speed / turnaround.

prometheus
10-14-2012, 12:11 PM
blah

prometheus
10-14-2012, 12:18 PM
poor forum editing sorry for post above....where did the delete post option go??

The only issue I see with this is those of us only updated lw from 9.6 without getting any other software bundled, neither T-shirt which I actually can live without, neither has the technology been implemented fully from what was promised in core..shouldn´t go there but..

Generally this promo is a good thing, and to gain new users..but hey, don´t forget pre existing users who´s not received that much.

Michael

zapper1998
10-14-2012, 12:38 PM
Should this not also be available to those of us who have already upgraded to LW11?

After all, it's those of us who pay in advance for the upgrades that are keeping LW development afloat - but it seems like we're being penalised for upgrading too quickly!

So come on NT, if you haven't already got plans to do so, how about rewarding us long-term LW users by also providing us with a copy of Poser Pro 2012!

Regards,
Peter


I M H O
This poser thing should be given to the people, uprading to LW 11, Its the same thing as me Buying LW 11...


I paid for the Upgrade, Where is My Poser Program, ???????????


Ya Think...

Daa

Mike

jasonwestmas
10-14-2012, 02:40 PM
Reminds me of the days when NT had DAZ models/ images plastered all over their wall at Siggraph in 2004. I can understand the appeal for these cheapo things when doing quick turnaround projects, but I think I'll pass. I want to use LW for something bigger than just that. It just looks tacky imo.

Cageman
10-14-2012, 02:43 PM
Youre right, they are, and it is. However its the first thats important here cos promotional materials or products need to pander to that simplistic outlook on things. Its all about image.

True!

The wording could have been different, as Oedo 808 pointed out... just to clarify why LW-users/studios would benefit from such a combo of applications in rapid production environments. I can also forsee how this would tie in with things like Genoma in the upcomming 11.5.

Oh well...

sukardi
10-14-2012, 08:02 PM
You know what I think would be a great promo... If LW invested in its own massive render farm and offered it free to its users or at a significant discount. :D

I love this idea. The rendering does not even have to be free. Just throw in tons of top quality presets and assets. I mean like with poser, I would rather someone just take some of poser assets and turn it into lw assets complete with motion mixer files etc...

MrWyatt
10-15-2012, 03:59 AM
Poser? Really? Not going for it. Still, NT never ceases to dissapoint me. At least there is some consistency.

zapper1998
10-15-2012, 11:01 AM
would not use the Poser Prgram anyways, I have Modeler that can do more than poser..

GandB
10-15-2012, 11:09 AM
Well; I'm sure it'll be useful for some, and it's an add-on to a program that many would have bought anyways.

Chuck
10-15-2012, 11:34 AM
Regarding requests to provide Poser at no additional costs for previous upgraders, our agreement with Smith Micro and the costs involved only allow us to make the current special offer on new sales of full seats and upgrades at full MSRP. We are not currently aware of any plans at Smith Micro for discounts for LightWave users, but if we understand correctly they do offer such specials from time to time for users of specific software packages, or general specials. We'll certainly pass along to them feedback from users already on LightWave 11 who have an interest in adding Poser to their toolkit. You may also wish to send the request to them directly, if you are interested.

Regarding the appropriateness of this offer versus other potential offers, LightWave sees use across an incredibly wide range of applications, and there is certainly a range of applications for LightWave and Poser together. Folks who work in those areas will appreciate the bundle, and that's all the reason needed for it. As noted by others on the thread, it does have fast production/previs implications, and as opposed to crediting folks with being able to see that for themselves, we can consider being more explicit about it in any other communications we do during the term of this offer. That's a good suggestion, and we appreciate it.

As for any implications on the team management's general positioning of LightWave for the future, the intent is of course to support that wide range of industries and uses mentioned above. Poser isn't the first value-add we've offered and won't be the last. It just represents a moment's opportunity for the folks who find this combination will be useful for them in their work, not a trend in any direction other than that the new management team will continue aggressive marketing of LightWave 3D using the widest possible range of methods and aiming for the widest possible range of market segments. The aim is growth and the innovatively and aggressively developed professional product that growth will allow.

zapper1998
10-15-2012, 11:53 AM
Thanks chuck

If they offered it to us, at 50% off, I would buy It..

:)

prometheus
10-15-2012, 11:59 AM
Oh well, Daz studio is free still, have to do.

Markc
10-15-2012, 12:03 PM
FWIW, in the UK it is vastly cheaper (about 30% depending on exchange rates) on Amazon than direct from Smith Micro :)

DigitalSorcery8
10-15-2012, 12:25 PM
would not use the Poser Prgram anyways, I have Modeler that can do more than poser..

Not make human figures FASTER or a "simple" walk cycle FASTER or a crowd of people FASTER.

For archviz projects, Poser is GREAT and very useful. And has already been mentioned, for non-hero characters used in the background it is a GREAT tool. As with Lightwave, it is HOW you use the tool.

dickbill
10-15-2012, 01:03 PM
Exactly the reason why i bought Poser pro: immediate integration of characters for archviz using the Poser pluging for LW.

Cageman
10-15-2012, 05:01 PM
would not use the Poser Prgram anyways, I have Modeler that can do more than poser..

Situation 1...

You are on a sparse budget... all of a sudden someone asks you to add another 10 characters into the shot, since they think it is a little to stiff (or something). They will run past the camera in both foreground and background to add to the chaos in the shot (your nice hero-character is the focus of the shot). Unfortunately, you will only have a couple of days to do this, obviously with some extra money, if you can pull it off.

Situation 2...

You are asked to do a previs/mockup of a 120 second shot, it needs to be done by Friday... you get the task handed to you on Monday. It turns out to be a crowd-shot that must consist of males, females and kids. The key is to showcase much variation regarding clothes as well as male/female/kid ratio. It doesn't have to be beautiful since it is previs, but if you can pull it off, you will get the job...

I could write many more situations where characters are needed quickly...

Are you still sure you would never use Poser in combination with LW?

DigitalSorcery8
10-15-2012, 05:16 PM
I could write many more situations where characters are needed quickly...

Are you still sure you would never use Poser in combination with LW?
Precisely the point!

You don't dismiss software because of "reputation." That's what MANY do OFTEN with Lightwave.

Cageman
10-15-2012, 05:23 PM
Precisely the point!

You don't dismiss software because of "reputation." That's what MANY do OFTEN with Lightwave.

Yes... not so much these days compared to LW8.x/9.x days though...

Darth Mole
10-15-2012, 06:04 PM
On a bit of a whim I upgraded my old Poser Pro 2010 and installed the Poser Fusion plug-in. I grabbed that big folder full of of BVH files recently, applied one to a skeleton, saved the scene file. opened it in LW, tweaked a few frames to stop it sliding around and I had a pretty spooky skeleton wandering around. It would have taken me days to model, rig and animate that thing. And if I add more to the scene like a mossy brick wall or flickering torches, no-one would ever know it was Poser. Of course it has its limitations but for adding mocapped people or creatures to a scene it's super easy... If people don't rate it, then fine - don't use it.

DigitalSorcery8
10-15-2012, 06:36 PM
Yes... not so much these days compared to LW8.x/9.x days though...

Well, TBH many still look down on LW in other forums. LW will take a LONG TIME to regain a solid reputation. If it keeps moving forward as it has in 11 and 11.5, perhaps somewhere around v14 or 15 it will be regarded by the CG community as a whole as "quality 3D software." But the reputation of LW right now outside of this community is still not quite as respected as it should/could be. Kind of like how many view Poser here in the LW forum.

fablefox
10-16-2012, 05:19 AM
Well, TBH many still look down on LW in other forums. LW will take a LONG TIME to regain a solid reputation. If it keeps moving forward as it has in 11 and 11.5, perhaps somewhere around v14 or 15 it will be regarded by the CG community as a whole as "quality 3D software." But the reputation of LW right now outside of this community is still not quite as respected as it should/could be. Kind of like how many view Poser here in the LW forum.

Before LW can gain the respect of other 3D app users, they better earn the respect of plug-ins developer first. People do buy 3d software based on plug-ins marketplace / availability. But plug-ins developer only consider if there is significant user. Chicken and egg, I guess...

prometheus
10-16-2012, 07:13 AM
Im just wondering if newbies entering and purchasing Lightwave bundled with with other software, has gotten a better deal than those purchased 9.6 and up with the core promise without extra bundles, Noted..I guess
we have gotten a very good price though for the updates, but still..can´t help wondering.

Michael

inkpen3d
10-16-2012, 07:49 AM
Regarding requests to provide Poser at no additional costs for previous upgraders, our agreement with Smith Micro and the costs involved only allow us to make the current special offer on new sales of full seats and upgrades at full MSRP. We are not currently aware of any plans at Smith Micro for discounts for LightWave users, but if we understand correctly they do offer such specials from time to time for users of specific software packages, or general specials. We'll certainly pass along to them feedback from users already on LightWave 11 who have an interest in adding Poser to their toolkit. You may also wish to send the request to them directly, if you are interested.


So, like I said in my previous post, users who upgrade quickly will be disadvantaged compared with others who wait for a few months before upgrading. You are inadvertently forcing us users to adopt a strategy that entails biding our time before going ahead and purchasing an upgrade so as to see what juicy freebies NT are eventually going to bundled with the upgrade. Surely, that would not be to NT's advantage!

Okay, Poser probably ranks as mediocre on the scale of bundled freebies, but the copy of Eyeon DFX+4 that I received with a previous LW upgrade was simply brilliant - and I have just saved myself almost $2000 by upgrading that copy of DFX+4 to Fusion 6.4!

My main concern is that in the future, by jumping on the bandwagon and upgrading LW as soon as possible, I might miss out on some bundled freebie that will prove to be just as useful as DFX+4 has shown itself to be!

Me thinks I'll delay upgrading in the future!

Regards,
Peter

prometheus
10-16-2012, 08:02 AM
So, like I said in my previous post, users who upgrade quickly will be disadvantaged compared with others who wait for a few months before upgrading. You are inadvertently forcing us users to adopt a strategy that entails biding our time before going ahead and purchasing an upgrade so as to see what juicy freebies NT are eventually going to bundled with the upgrade. Surely, that would be to NT's disadvantage!

Okay, Poser probably ranks as mediocre of the scale of bundled freebies, but the copy of Eyeon DFX+4 that I received with a previous LW upgrade was simply brilliant - and I have just saved myself almost $2000 by upgrading that copy of DFX+4 to Fusion 6.4!

My main concern is that in the future, by jumping on the bandwagon and upgrading LW as soon as possible, I might miss out on some bundled freebie that will prove to be just as useful as DFX+4 has shown itself to be!

Me thinks I'll delay upgrading in the future!

Regards,
Peter

Seems to be quite understandable

Oedo 808
10-16-2012, 09:27 AM
Perhaps the LightWave Group can take on board trying to time any future partnerships with version releases.

It's not like belated partnerships have been a recurring theme of late, new customer offers aren't exactly a rarity.

I wouldn't say no to being in on the offer, or perhaps to have Manga Studio EX as an existing user, but I'm not going to be getting hanky out over it.

hrgiger
10-16-2012, 09:35 AM
I only upgraded as quickly as I did because NT said I would lose my hardcore charter pricing if I didn't. Then of course after I upgraded, they changed the policy and there was no time limit on when I could have upgraded. Perhaps in the future they can decide on a promotion and upgrade policy for a release cycle before it happens and then stick with it and then make changes and offer new promotions for the following development cycle so as not to leave the most loyal customers feeling a bit cheated.

Chuck
10-16-2012, 09:44 AM
So, like I said in my previous post, users who upgrade quickly will be disadvantaged compared with others who wait for a few months before upgrading. You are inadvertently forcing us users to adopt a strategy that entails biding our time before going ahead and purchasing an upgrade so as to see what juicy freebies NT are eventually going to bundled with the upgrade. Surely, that would not be to NT's advantage!

Okay, Poser probably ranks as mediocre on the scale of bundled freebies, but the copy of Eyeon DFX+4 that I received with a previous LW upgrade was simply brilliant - and I have just saved myself almost $2000 by upgrading that copy of DFX+4 to Fusion 6.4!

My main concern is that in the future, by jumping on the bandwagon and upgrading LW as soon as possible, I might miss out on some bundled freebie that will prove to be just as useful as DFX+4 has shown itself to be!

Me thinks I'll delay upgrading in the future!

Regards,
Peter

You have pros and cons with any strategy, including the simple fact that bundle offers are not guaranteed to come along, and certainly not guaranteed to be something that turns out to be compelling for your own work and interests. The early adopter is also advantaged by having the software and making use of the new features and functions to make themselves more productive and profitable in their projects. A lot of folks have found a lot in LightWave 11 that lends itself to that. Given the dedication I am hearing from Rob, Matt and Lino to work with the users and our engineers to aggressively speed up the workflow throughout the application, that factor is only going to grow in impact as new upgrades come along in the future.

Chuck
10-16-2012, 10:06 AM
I only upgraded as quickly as I did because NT said I would lose my hardcore charter pricing if I didn't. Then of course after I upgraded, they changed the policy and there was no time limit on when I could have upgraded. Perhaps in the future they can decide on a promotion and upgrade policy for a release cycle before it happens and then stick with it and then make changes and offer new promotions for the following development cycle so as not to leave the most loyal customers feeling a bit cheated.

And there are people who are in fact relieved that in the end NewTek elected to be flexible rather than rigid about the policy, who will be able to purchase at their HardCORE charter and post-charter prices, but would not have been able to do so within that 60-day window, set years ago in an entirely different economy.

Another point to consider now is that there are going to be changes just due to the fact that the management and operation of the group is in the process of a major changeover. Rob is not just managing the development of the product but every aspect of a new, dedicated division for LightWave. Sales, marketing, support and operations are being built, and new managers coming in will be making changes as they ramp up. And now it will be the case that the people working on sales, marketing and the rest have the growth and flourishing of LightWave not as part of their job, but as their whole job. That does mean growing pains, but please rest assured that in dealing with the necessities of the major changes that will happen during the time of the LightWave 11 life-cycle, the team will indeed be making notes on how to make the user experience much smoother for future product generation life-cycles.

hrgiger
10-16-2012, 12:14 PM
And there are people who are in fact relieved that in the end NewTek elected to be flexible rather than rigid about the policy, who will be able to purchase at their HardCORE charter and post-charter prices, but would not have been able to do so within that 60-day window, set years ago in an entirely different economy.



Just to be clear, I am glad that NT in the end decided that there shouldn't be such a small window of opportunity for charter members to upgrade at their fixed price. I just wish I had the same opportunity to upgrade when it would have been more convenient for me, not out of fear that I would lose hundreds of dollars over the next 5 upgrades which I did not know when I bought into hardcore was a possbility.

Should we be concerned about this 'breakaway' from Newtek? If Rob is not only managing the development of LightWave but also sales, marketing, support, etc... It sounds pretty isolated from NT. Is NT moving towards the jettison of LightWave?

DigitalSorcery8
10-16-2012, 01:55 PM
Is NT moving towards the jettison of LightWave?

One can only hope.

bobakabob
10-16-2012, 02:01 PM
An experiment to see if Lightwave can go it alone - hiving it off if it doesn't meet sales targets? It could happen but the latter is unthinkable for those of us dependent on the software. LW could end up in limbo like XSI or worse. Think infini D or Truespace. The recent advertising campaign and Siggraph shows the team have a newfound confidence, enthusiasm and creativity and there is definitely a positive buzz about new developments. It's a ferocious market out there. The LW3D group reaching out to both enthusiasts and pros in their publicity drive, in the classic Lightwave tradition of the mid 90s have got it right. Canon and Nikon would not be able to survive if they aimed their products purely at professionals.

jburford
10-16-2012, 02:18 PM
Just to be clear, I am glad that NT in the end decided that there shouldn't be such a small window of opportunity for charter members to upgrade at their fixed price. I just wish I had the same opportunity to upgrade when it would have been more convenient for me, not out of fear that I would lose hundreds of dollars over the next 5 upgrades which I did not know when I bought into hardcore was a possbility.

Should we be concerned about this 'breakaway' from Newtek? If Rob is not only managing the development of LightWave but also sales, marketing, support, etc... It sounds pretty isolated from NT. Is NT moving towards the jettison of LightWave?


No, not at all, especially if you had been following things the last couple of months on the decision of more Autonomy for the 3D Group! You might want to read up a bit from the past and re-look at things.

bobakabob
10-16-2012, 02:23 PM
And there are people who are in fact relieved that in the end NewTek elected to be flexible rather than rigid about the policy, who will be able to purchase at their HardCORE charter and post-charter prices, but would not have been able to do so within that 60-day window, set years ago in an entirely different economy.

Another point to consider now is that there are going to be changes just due to the fact that the management and operation of the group is in the process of a major changeover. Rob is not just managing the development of the product but every aspect of a new, dedicated division for LightWave. Sales, marketing, support and operations are being built, and new managers coming in will be making changes as they ramp up. And now it will be the case that the people working on sales, marketing and the rest have the growth and flourishing of LightWave not as part of their job, but as their whole job. That does mean growing pains, but please rest assured that in dealing with the necessities of the major changes that will happen during the time of the LightWave 11 life-cycle, the team will indeed be making notes on how to make the user experience much smoother for future product generation life-cycles.

Chuck, will there be a Lightwave evangelist role in the LW3DG? I'm sure there are many LW users on the forum who miss William's creative and technical input.

hrgiger
10-16-2012, 07:08 PM
No, not at all, especially if you had been following things the last couple of months on the decision of more Autonomy for the 3D Group! You might want to read up a bit from the past and re-look at things.

Well, all I have to say to that is how things are presented to public ears rarely match up 100% with the reality of it.

geo_n
10-16-2012, 10:20 PM
Just to be clear, I am glad that NT in the end decided that there shouldn't be such a small window of opportunity for charter members to upgrade at their fixed price. I just wish I had the same opportunity to upgrade when it would have been more convenient for me, not out of fear that I would lose hundreds of dollars over the next 5 upgrades which I did not know when I bought into hardcore was a possbility.

Should we be concerned about this 'breakaway' from Newtek? If Rob is not only managing the development of LightWave but also sales, marketing, support, etc... It sounds pretty isolated from NT. Is NT moving towards the jettison of LightWave?

I didnt get that from Chucks post. It looks like NT is making an aggressive push to bring lw to mainstream circles and compete with current popular appz.

alexs3d
10-17-2012, 03:08 AM
nice little tutorial where you can see the power of the two :)
cool feature to load poser files directly in lightwave

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ksMvTSbkRKY&feature=g-all-u

Chuck
10-17-2012, 03:24 PM
Just to be clear, I am glad that NT in the end decided that there shouldn't be such a small window of opportunity for charter members to upgrade at their fixed price. I just wish I had the same opportunity to upgrade when it would have been more convenient for me, not out of fear that I would lose hundreds of dollars over the next 5 upgrades which I did not know when I bought into hardcore was a possbility.

Should we be concerned about this 'breakaway' from Newtek? If Rob is not only managing the development of LightWave but also sales, marketing, support, etc... It sounds pretty isolated from NT. Is NT moving towards the jettison of LightWave?

There is not a "breakaway". The NewTek LightWave 3D Group is simply a move to provide dedicated marketing, sales and operations resources to the LightWave product to ensure better growth. Instead of one set of people in these areas who have to switch gears between very different products, NewTek will have two, and each concentrating on one product line. A lot of the user community has observed that they felt the product needed more resources than it appeared to be getting, and this organizational change is an effort to do just exactly that. It eliminates any question of whether LightWave is getting appropriate timeshare, because the people in the new group are strictly devoted to the growth and promotion of LightWave.

hrgiger
10-17-2012, 04:40 PM
Well that sounds good Chuck, it just seemed odd even with the initial announcement of the 3D group, new location, new website, etc...

netstile123
10-17-2012, 09:04 PM
I never would have guessed this would be in bundle package. Has this happened in the past with lightwave and other software? I am still happy I made the choice to purchace lightwave. Poser would be a great software to have. If I remember right there is a differance between poser and poser pro.

kopperdrake
10-18-2012, 04:19 AM
Yes Nestile - I have personally had the fortune of having upgraded LightWave and acquiring Vue and LWCAD in the past, as part of a promotion. I am sure there are others. I have upgraded Vue a few times, because it fills a niche for me, namely sky generation. LWCAD I have upgraded and spread to another seat as it is simply fantastic for us - we do a lot of measured modelling. I am sure there are people that neither cared nor needed these two particular promotions when they were launched.

Whilst I personally don't really care for the Poser promotion, I can see why many would - each to their own. I also don't worry about any perceived stigma with the tie-up - I am sure many artists using LightWave in any professional capacity are only really bothered with how well LightWave is being developed in order for it to stay in their creative software armoury, and any other piece of software they may need they will buy as and when they need it. If a piece comes along as a bonus then so be it - it may, or may not, be useful to them in their day-to-day work.

As for the cost implication - do I feel, as a chartered member, that I have been diddled?

The simple answer is no. I bought into the chartered offer to keep my upgrades low for the set amount of time. I have been using LW11 for a while now and it has paid for itself in that time. As an early adopter you get the benefit of the software's advances early. If you wait on the fence for offers to maybe turn up then you lose the time with the new version, but you potentially gain a promotional offer. This happens with many products - not just software. You must make the decision to buy when it is right to do so for you, and not regret that further down the line but take comfort in the knowledge that you have been using the software for a longer period and it has hopefully served you well.

However - if a promotional offer were made within a very short time frame of the new upgrade having only just been made public, then that would look bad. In this case, most companies back-date the offer to avoid upsetting the early buyers. They do not have to do this - but I believe it would show the level of coroporate morality at play. I would hope that NewTek didn't do this as I wouldn't expect it from them, and this current offer doesn't fall into that category.

jburford
10-18-2012, 04:32 AM
Somehow a bit confused from your last para kopperdrake.

dickbill
10-18-2012, 08:49 AM
However - if a promotional offer were made within a very short time frame of the new upgrade having only just been made public, then that would look bad. In this case, most companies back-date the offer to avoid upsetting the early buyers. They do not have to do this - but I believe it would show the level of coroporate morality at play. I would hope that NewTek didn't do this as I wouldn't expect it from them, and this current offer doesn't fall into that category.

Too late for me, I bought PoserPro a few months ago for $300, i believe. It was a promotional offer, already and I guess Smith Micro is desperate to boost Poser's user base. So it's not Newtek's fault as one wouldn't expect them to refuse an offer like that. But corporate morality? this is a scarry concept, better not talk about that.

colkai
10-18-2012, 10:41 AM
But corporate morality? this is a scarry concept, better not talk about that.

I would of thought that was a contradiction in terms. :p The words Corproate and morality are not exactly long time bedfellows. ;)

wesleycorgi
10-18-2012, 12:28 PM
For those who are interested in Poser Pro (and already bought into LW11), Smith Micro has for the past few years had a Black Friday sale on their site where most software on their site is 50% off — it's where I picked up Anime Studio in the past.

Chuck
10-18-2012, 03:20 PM
For those who are interested in Poser Pro (and already bought into LW11), Smith Micro has for the past few years had a Black Friday sale on their site where most software on their site is 50% off — it's where I picked up Anime Studio in the past.

Would that be an annual Black Friday sale in November or a monthly one on a given Friday each month?

wesleycorgi
10-18-2012, 07:44 PM
Would that be an annual Black Friday sale in November or a monthly one on a given Friday each month?

The after (American) Thanksgiving Black Friday. But for the last three years, they've sent me a promo email and I've picked up something (whether it was an ebook or some software). Of course, that's no guarantee this year.

kopperdrake
10-19-2012, 01:27 AM
Somehow a bit confused from your last para kopperdrake.

Sorry :) My long winded way of saying that if an offer like this were brought out very soon after the initial upgrade date for a piece of software, then most software developers would roll back the offer to include everyone who may have already upgraded. That's where the corporate morality comes in - to do the right thing by your customers.

Of course, you could argue that keeping any customer happy is a sensible move and can only profit you in the long term anyway, so corporate morality is just another name for 'looking after your own interests'. But then if you subscribe to the selfish altruism theory then they're just doing what we all do, just on a corporate scale :)

rcallicotte
10-20-2012, 05:18 AM
And if anyone is interested in a quick way to upgrade to 11 (and 11.5 later), here's a good deal for you - http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?131195-Lightwave-9-61-For-Licence-Transfer

KevinL
12-10-2012, 01:00 PM
I'm Back... Was completely put off by the Hard Core fiasco and thankfully didn't buy in. Kept a weather eye on what was happening in the Lightwave development. All the stuff getting discussed here: Poser offer, dedicated corporate group, new and much more professional website... and the actual product itself.

Good job Newtek! and Lightwave Development Group :)

Kevin L

Snosrap
12-10-2012, 09:22 PM
I'm Back... You'll not regret it.

inquisitive
12-11-2012, 01:58 AM
Can LW11.x run in WinXP at all or must it only run in Vista, Win7? I have software that is not supported in Win7 (no upgrades), also have VT5 - on the fence so far how to proceed.

sami
01-11-2013, 05:52 AM
Maybe not the best thread, but I figure Poser ppl might be about here, so hopefully SnoSrap or any other Poser LWers will know:

Does Poser Pro 2010 work with LW 11.03? Particularly the Poser Fusion plugin? It did w 9.6.1 but I havent used it in so long, I thought I'd try (and I don't feel like reinstalling 9.6). Turns out the PoserFusion plugin .exe for PoserPro 2010 won't install since it "can't find Lightwave". So I thought I'd be tricky and I found this awesome utility called Universal Extractor (http://www.filehippo.com/download_universal_extractor/comments/) - which unpacked the Poser plugin install exe and all its resources including the actual .p plugin which I was successfully able to manually install in LW 11.

However the Poser Scene loader brings up a LW dialog saying "PoserSceneConverter will not operate in this application". grrr :cursin:

See Smith Micro is letting the plugin refuse to work and therefore force you to upgrade for $199 to Poser Pro 2012 ;-)

I really don't wanna upgrade Poser since it is not key to my workflow, but just wondered if anyone is successfully using the plugin in LW 11 from Poser Pro 2010... Otherwise is a Poser Pro upgrade worth it...? Oh and if you do upgrade from 2010 to Poser Pro 2012, is it a pain to deal with migrating content or can I just leave all my Poser content in their default Public Documents folder and they will work in 2012? thx for any tips...

Phil
01-11-2013, 07:55 AM
Can LW11.x run in WinXP at all or must it only run in Vista, Win7? I have software that is not supported in Win7 (no upgrades), also have VT5 - on the fence so far how to proceed.

LW 11.0.x works under WinXP, but only with the dongle as a license control system. Dongle-less operation is only available on newer Windows versions due to internal OS limitations. LW 11.5 hasn't been released yet, but NT have not typically felt the need to bump OS requirements for a point release.