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View Full Version : Autodesk 360(Cloud Service) TOS: Have you guys read this stuff?



robertoortiz
08-29-2012, 02:15 PM
The Term of Serive contains the following language:“You hereby grant Autodesk (or warrant that the licensor of such rights has expressly granted) a perpetual, irrevocable, non-exclusive, royalty-free, paid-up, worldwide, sublicensable (through multiple tiers) license to store, display, reproduce, modify, use and transmit Your Content, and further waive “moral” rights or other rights with respect to attribution of authorship or integrity of Your Content that You may have under any applicable law and under any legal theory.”

http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112&id=17784802)

50one
08-29-2012, 02:31 PM
Although I think it's ridiculous as I'm trying to move away from Autodestruct products at the moment, however I started wondering what's your role in creating all those thread about the 'Evil Empire' here?I mean don't get me wrong, but I just do wonder, it's almost like you're trying to provoke trolling and actively promoting fanboy-ism :)

Titus
08-29-2012, 02:43 PM
I'm not sure about the American copyright law, but according to the French copyright law (in use by most latam) you can't give away your moral rights.

robertoortiz
08-29-2012, 02:50 PM
Point made
Believe it or not my issues with the company has nothing to do with their products (I like Softimage a Lot, and I have respected Maya since I started playing with it with version 1.0 ).
I respected them back in day when people like Duncan Brismead and Mark Sylvester were treated with respect.

Having said that I do hope to God you don’t feel I act in a trollish fashion.
If I do please do tell me. (I am not being sarcastic)
I can be passionate, but I like to think I can be reasonable.

My issue with this issue has a bit to do with the fact that I feel strongly that distributed and GPU computing are the future and that "THE CLOUD" is just marketing mumbo jumbo.
These new developments towards full cloud suites are BAD news.
And the scope of what is coming will affect the CG industry.

But getting back ON TOPIC and more to the point,
I feel strongly that this TOS IS MORALLY WRONG.

Titus
08-29-2012, 03:01 PM
I think you're being fair.

IMO, for any company to have a client-server service now called "the all mighty cloud", they need your permission to have your stuff in ther datacenters. In good faith this means you're giving them a right to your stuff so they can keep it and move as the service requires, but you really never know their real intentions. This happened to dropbox and facebook, they tried to extend their rights for more obscure use.

While I'm not a lawyer, I can't believe the text you are copying here. They want your moral rights (http://www.ipo.gov.uk/types/copy/c-otherprotect/c-moralrights.htm). In legal terms, they are taking away some of your human rights. They are asking for your soul.

50one
08-29-2012, 03:17 PM
That's ok, as i said earlier one i was just curious:)
Anyway, i hate all the cloud thing, all the mumbo-jumbo surrounding it, i work for the medical company now and most of the services we're using are now cloud based, starting at apps to view CT scans, network controllers, antiviruses ..you name it, i think it's wrong but since it's taking a lot of stress from your company's shoulder the only downfall is the bandwidth you can afford, the traffic is huge, almost 400 folks are using various cloud based services daily, uploading/downloading files.

I really love the fact that you can just have an ftp server and allow people to upload files to it. Baam! You've got cloud!it's not a server anymore:D

Cageman
08-29-2012, 03:42 PM
I do wonder where all this cloud-mess will eventually lead to?

I have a very hard time imagine that studios such as DD, Weta or ILM, would ever agree to these things, and even more, how could AD even possibly have the storagespace to deal with all that stuff? From what I've heard, most of the workstations at these studios are not directly connected to Internet, and as such, this cloud licensing thing wouldn't work to begin with.

I do think that many of these posts regarding all this is trying to make a chicken out of a feather... Lets be realistic about it... After all, we are LW-users and as such, we will not be too affected by whatever AD does regarding their online stuff.

I do agree that we should be concerned, but...as I said... lets not make a chicken out of a single feather before we see the whole picture.

:)

ShadowMystic
08-29-2012, 06:12 PM
The only thing that I like cloud storage is Steam. I like that only to an extent.

ShadowMystic
08-29-2012, 06:38 PM
I couldn't find the quoted text but I found
" 2.1 Your Rights. As between You and Autodesk, and subject to Section 2.2 (License by You; Disclosure), You and Your licensors have and will own all right, title, and interest in and to Your Content." Not to defend the evil autodesk but I'd need to see the quoted text in context not paraphrased.

robertoortiz
08-29-2012, 07:19 PM
It is not paraphrased.

Here is straight cut and paste (I am tempted to cut and paste the whole darned thing):
Here it is:

2.Proprietary Rights

2.1 Your Rights. As between You and Autodesk, and subject to Section 2.2 (License by You; Disclosure), You and Your licensors have and will own all right, title, and interest in and to Your Content.

2.2 License by You; Disclosure. Autodesk (or its sublicensees) may exercise the license set forth in this Section only for purposes of providing, maintaining, repairing, protecting, organizing or otherwise administering the Service and Service Site in the ordinary course of Autodesk’s (or its designated third parties’) provision of the Service and improving and modifying the Service, including rights to extract, compile, aggregate, synthesize, use, and otherwise analyze all or any portion of Your Content and information, and to disclose Your Content and information and the results of any such analysis in aggregated form or any other form that does not specifically identify You or the source of Your Content or information. Notwithstanding anything in these Terms to the contrary, You hereby grant Autodesk (or warrant that the licensor of such rights has expressly granted) a perpetual, irrevocable, non-exclusive, royalty-free, paid-up, worldwide, sublicensable (through multiple tiers) license to store, display, reproduce, modify, use and transmit Your Content, and further waive “moral” rights or other rights with respect to attribution of authorship or integrity of Your Content that You may have under any applicable law and under any legal theory. In addition, You acknowledge and agree that Autodesk may disclose Your Content to provide the Service to You (including, without limitation, Your election to share Your Content under Sections 3.3 and 3.4), to comply with any legal obligations or governmental or regulatory body request (including subpoenas or court orders) or as part of a legal proceeding involving Autodesk Parties.

Why this is a big deal?

What are MORAL rights:
"Moral rights are rights of creators of copyrighted works generally recognized in civil law jurisdictions and, to a lesser extent, in some common law jurisdictions. They include the right of attribution, the right to have a work published anonymously or pseudonymously, and the right to the integrity of the work.[1] The preserving of the integrity of the work bars the work from alteration, distortion, or mutilation. Anything else that may detract from the artist's relationship with the work even after it leaves the artist's possession or ownership may bring these moral rights into play. Moral rights are distinct from any economic rights tied to copyrights. Even if an artist has assigned his or her copyright rights to a work to a third party, he or she still maintains the moral rights to the work.[2]

Moral rights were first recognized in France and Germany,[3] before they were included in the Berne Convention for the Protection of Literary and Artistic Works in 1928.[4] Canada recognizes moral rights (droits moraux) in its Copyright Act (Loi sur le droit d'auteur).[5] While the United States became a signatory to the convention in 1989,[6] it still does not completely recognize moral rights as part of copyright law, but rather as part of other bodies of law, such as defamation or unfair competition.[7]

Some jurisdictions allow for the waiver of moral rights.[8] In the United States, the Visual Artists Rights Act of 1990 (VARA) recognizes moral rights, but applies only to a narrow subset of works of visual art.[9]
"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moral_rights_(copyright_law)

geo_n
08-29-2012, 11:18 PM
The problem is at the consumer level people don't really care about how the cloud works.
People prefer to have files accessible anywhere they go. New generation of people are more nomadic people. Cloud is going to work at the consumer level which is huge and AD is smart to target this market.
For a company, the cloud could be a problem but I'm sure a high level company can have special privilages. DD, Weta, etc will have special privilages to have stuff on their own servers on their own terms.

Riff_Masteroff
08-29-2012, 11:39 PM
Its well known that Autodesk's building design software represents a larger percentage of its profit than the CG-FX component. In this area of the country, the very area in which Roberto lives, its common for a private company to develop a 'secure' project for rent or sale to GSA (general services administration). That includes a bomb-resistant structure.

In consideration of 'national security' what would AD's misuse of the department's (department of homeland security) building-project design's be called?

Maybe espionage?

erikals
08-30-2012, 04:06 AM
thanks, it's good to know just what policy AD follow, after all, many of us consider buying AD products.

it's good info to have.

i'm just surprised AD chooses to go this rute, again... making themselves unpopular. oh well...

Cageman
08-30-2012, 12:15 PM
The problem is at the consumer level people don't really care about how the cloud works.
People prefer to have files accessible anywhere they go. New generation of people are more nomadic people. Cloud is going to work at the consumer level which is huge and AD is smart to target this market.

I use DropBox to make sure that my workstation at work, my workstation at home and my laptop has the collection of plugins/scripts I use for LW. Regarding LW itself with the new software lic, I store the latest installfile + licfile on my DropBox as well, so I know that I have it on my laptop when I go somewhere.

There, you have my cloud. The difference though, is that I only need internet access for syncing things over.

COBRASoft
08-30-2012, 02:05 PM
Everything becomes CLOUD, if you like it or not. Office 2013 from MS will save your documents on Skydrive. You have to change to local drive to keep 'em local. Windows 8 is also cloud based for many things. So be prepared and learn it early I would say.

geo_n
08-30-2012, 02:30 PM
I use DropBox to make sure that my workstation at work, my workstation at home and my laptop has the collection of plugins/scripts I use for LW. Regarding LW itself with the new software lic, I store the latest installfile + licfile on my DropBox as well, so I know that I have it on my laptop when I go somewhere.

There, you have my cloud. The difference though, is that I only need internet access for syncing things over.

I'm using windows livemesh. No limit. Its also in 2 countries apart and 2 regions in one country. Yeah so I'm cloud user. Hehe.

kopperdrake
08-30-2012, 02:59 PM
This bit might cause people to become unstuck:

"In addition, You acknowledge and agree that Autodesk may disclose Your Content to provide the Service to You (including, without limitation, Your election to share Your Content under Sections 3.3 and 3.4), to comply with any legal obligations or governmental or regulatory body request (including subpoenas or court orders) or as part of a legal proceeding involving Autodesk Parties."

Essentially, it sounds as if you are thought to be working for a party (individual, company, country) that is deemed against the interests of the government to which AutoDesk answers to then you may find your work disclosed. It's a tough-nut, but in some respect you are placing your work, and livelihood, in the hands of a government and its legal system outside that of your own.

That I do not like. Along with the moral rights issue.