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WilliamVaughan
10-27-2003, 02:20 PM
Here is a taste of one of the many cool scenes that will ship with LW8....I love this scene....the two guys on the sub are scouting with binocs.....

Leigh
10-27-2003, 02:24 PM
http://www.cgtalk.com/images/smilies/buttrock.gif

Yog
10-27-2003, 02:27 PM
Really nice work !

This is the one that should be demoed at trade fairs.

Good work who ever.

thekho
10-27-2003, 02:30 PM
Very nice!

Who made this scene?

cresshead
10-27-2003, 02:32 PM
...looks nice...

are they looking for the lw 8 install disc with those binoculars?!!??....

or maybe they are trying to setup the download link to newtek for the electronic version but keeping an eye out for other "wannabe" apps like max 6....! :D

maybe they just found nemo! :cool: :cool: :cool:

stee+cats

Wade
10-27-2003, 02:47 PM
Having the Ocean texture and Partical presets in this scene are going to be great!

Thanks :)

pixelmonk
10-27-2003, 02:49 PM
Originally posted by proton
Here is a taste of one of the many cool scenes that will ship with LW8....I love this scene....the two guys on the sub are scouting with binocs.....

finally.. NEW scenes!!!

WilliamVaughan
10-27-2003, 03:23 PM
did I mention that it's animated......


Thank Elmar for this amazing scene!

aurora
10-27-2003, 03:51 PM
Proton thats cruel of you!!!! Wheres the animated version?!?!?!?

cresshead
10-27-2003, 04:17 PM
proton has mentioned before that lw8 is going to have ALL NEW CONTENT!

..can't wait! [though i'll have to!]

steve g

TSpyrison
10-27-2003, 04:40 PM
Originally posted by cresshead
proton has mentioned before that lw8 is going to have ALL NEW CONTENT!


Does this mean its not going to come with the "spacefighter" scene thats been with it from at least version 2?

:D

cresshead
10-27-2003, 04:46 PM
i bet there will be "a spacefighter" scene ust not the one your used to seeing!

steve g

WilliamVaughan
10-27-2003, 05:06 PM
The content that will ship with LW8 is worth the cost of the upgrade 10 times over...but that's just my opinion....

just a few artists that have helped out are:

Policarpo
Jonny Gorden
Kurt Larsen
Bachelorette
Mike blackbourn
Blochi
Can Tuncer
Croteam
Christophe Desse
Elmar
Kuzey
LNT
Gerald Abraham
Shade
Lost Pencil
Werner
and some geek named Proton

TSpyrison
10-27-2003, 05:12 PM
Originally posted by proton
The content that will ship with LW8 is worth the cost of the upgrade 10 times over...but that's just my opinion....


Now thats one hell of a statement ;)

Bytehawk
10-27-2003, 05:15 PM
I just hope us electronic upgraders will get the content as well. I don't mind a 650 mb download btw... (dsl is really comfy innit)

TSpyrison
10-27-2003, 05:21 PM
Me, I dont care how long it takes to download as long as its good stuff :)


Hopefully soon....


<singing> "The waiting, is the hardest part...."
:cool:

WilliamVaughan
10-27-2003, 05:26 PM
Everyone that buys the upgrade will get this content....

yes it is one hell of a statement but that is how I see it when I see thingslike the sub and some of teh models and scenes that we will get....the cars alone that ship with LW8 will pay for the upgrade easy IMHO

Bytehawk
10-27-2003, 05:38 PM
that's cool news.

You're my hero of the day !!!!
:D

FenrirWolf
10-27-2003, 06:00 PM
Veeeery nice! One thing I'm glad to see is Newtek is starting to ship more recent content with LW. I mean, we can look at that forward-kinetics animated mech and planet earth only so many times. :)

A lot of the examples with LW7.5 seem to still cater towards older versions of the program.

cresshead
10-27-2003, 06:38 PM
if your still looking to add content, im sure that there's plenty of artists willing to add their input on the lw content for lw8.

stee+cats

Tesselator
10-27-2003, 07:09 PM
Originally posted by cresshead
if your still looking to add content, im sure that there's plenty of artists willing to add their input on the lw content for lw8.

stee+cats

Hey! That's a good idea! After 8 ships as many of us are not
beta teamers, I'm sure there would be alot of interest in helping
out in this way. I'ld be up for it! -- That's one!

Lightwave3D 8.0b -- the 400Meg update! :D


.

badllarma
10-27-2003, 11:43 PM
You know this is going to sound really lame but not once have I ever used the content of those object or scene files for a project. To be honest I've never really had a look whats in half the folders I may of used the odd reflection map but thats about it!

The sea looks really good in the image Proton showed us so I suppose by loading the scene i'll get to see how the water texture was created but, over all I'm just waiting for the update itself content or no content not really bothered to be honest.:)

hrgiger
10-27-2003, 11:52 PM
Well, badllarma sometimes you can save yourself a lot of time to find yourself an object, or even a scene that will work in any of your projects. I'd definately take some time and look at some of the content. You might be glad you did.

Gui Lo
10-28-2003, 12:55 AM
WOW!,
Just seen it.

Scenes and objects of this quality will really show the quality of LW today. The content in the past has suffered from the lack of an overall WOW facter.

I got a lot of tricks 'n' tips about the new features from the existing scenes so I look forward to the new content.

Gui Lo

grundgedanke
10-28-2003, 01:25 AM
are those things downloadable??? i mean for all the ones with the electronic update?

trick
10-28-2003, 02:08 AM
Is all content for commercial use ??

I know some of the better models from [7] were NOT !!

colkai
10-28-2003, 04:15 AM
Once you've had DSL, there is NO going back to 56k ;)

riki
10-28-2003, 04:33 AM
Proton I know it sounds like I'm stating the obvious but pleaazzzeeee check that someone sets up the content directory correctly. It hasn't always been the case in the past.

cresshead
10-28-2003, 04:49 AM
even if some of the content is not for commercial use like the mennithings folder in lw7 you can learn from looking at the scene/objects and surfaces etc to create yor own scenes and fx.


i've found that to discect a cool scene you'll advance your capability in lightwave and 3d in general.

looking forward to the 4-6 day download [i still have 56k!]

BTW could i get a friend to download the content etc for me seeing as he has a 1mb link?

Also if not i'll probably get the $99 disc based version seeing as
"get me right" software may not be able to be used for incremental downloads.

if you could break up the downloads into several zips that would help.

steve g

riki
10-28-2003, 05:11 AM
Any good OSX apps that let pause and resume downloads. I've tried NS7 and IE5 but the only APP I've found so far that works with this feature is Hotline.

Emmanuel
10-28-2003, 06:48 AM
Well, well, 10 times over ?
Yeah sure.In my opinion, thats the least NT can provide today, really.
Other packages have killer content, too, Max for example has a gazillion more materials and presets than LW.Have a look at the character setup and rigging tuts in the Maya manual !
The standard today would be that LW includes basic training material for character rigging, setup, animation, special effects (HVs, volumetrics, particles), modeling (not the dumb rollercoaster but something You can actually use) etc.
I am *not* happy with just an "advanced IK-scene" without any substantial explanation how it was done in the first place, actually.
Call me lazy, but I am not a fan of ripping a scene apart.
Why not include the appropriate tutorial with the scene ?

hrgiger
10-28-2003, 06:57 AM
Cresshead,

You should just use a download manager like download accelerator, this will let you pause and resume downloads at any time. Plus it will speed up your crappy 56k connection.

Emmanuel,

cresshead
10-28-2003, 06:57 AM
RE:Call me lazy, but I am not a fan of ripping a scene apart.
Why not include the appropriate tutorial with the scene ?

seeing as lw8 is not out, we can't pass judgement on the help files or tutorials or even the written manual just yet...
i hear what your saying though and hopfully newtek will put such things into the help files and documentation for lightwave 8...also don't forget all the very cool video's Lee has made for lightwave over the last month or two....they are very useful to lw artists learning the app.

the one thing that lightwave seemed to lag behind 3dsmax, as i came over from max 4 was a huge material [surface] preset lib like what max 2.5 world creation disc gave you..like 60 wood materials as a single example...

a huge range of presets for surfaces would help out in lw 8 and if they don't arrive i'll be making my own massive set from the textures i have from max and lightscape over the years plus my own textures from my digital camera and scanner.

steve g

pixelmonk
10-28-2003, 08:22 AM
Originally posted by Emmanuel

Call me lazy, but I am not a fan of ripping a scene apart.
Why not include the appropriate tutorial with the scene ?

lucky that's just you. I like both.... finished scenes to look at as well as tutorials.

Nemoid
10-28-2003, 08:37 AM
kILLER CONTENT!! :D
I just can't wait to see Chris Desse models and Werner's too..
the submarine scene is kick ***** :buttrock:

philip
10-28-2003, 08:49 AM
oh yes, this ocean looks real familiar...

but I can't wait to get my hands on the sub :D

jr_sunshine
10-28-2003, 12:56 PM
This is such a tease.......

geoff3dnz
10-28-2003, 01:10 PM
Originally posted by cresshead
...Also if not i'll probably get the $99 disc based version seeing as "get me right" software may not be able to be used for incremental downloads... Usually everything that NewTek have for download is available on their ftp site, which if you use a dedicated ftp program, can be resumed from. :)

TSpyrison
10-28-2003, 01:22 PM
Originally posted by philip
but I can't wait to get my hands on the sub :D



There is a sick joke in there somewhere...
:D

pauland
10-28-2003, 02:23 PM
It's a pirate submarine. The guy with the bins is looking for the dongle.. ;-)

Fantastic.

Paul

Tesselator
10-28-2003, 04:40 PM
Originally posted by badllarma
You know this is going to sound really lame but not once have I ever used the content of those object or scene files for a project. To be honest I've never really had a look whats in half the folders I may of used the odd reflection map but thats about it!

The sea looks really good in the image Proton showed us so I suppose by loading the scene i'll get to see how the water texture was created but, over all I'm just waiting for the update itself content or no content not really bothered to be honest.:)

Ya badllarma, for sure! Do yourself a big no, huge no, gigantic
favor and look through that content!!! The Sigraff Content too!
Taking apart and messing up a scene made by someone who
knew what they were doing is as good or better than any video
tutorial I've ever seen. Ya, Any and Ever... Really. :D

Tesselator
10-29-2003, 02:27 AM
Originally posted by pixelmonk
lucky that's just you. I like both.... finished scenes to look at as well as tutorials.

Yup! I ofcourse also like tuts of every kind. Written, Video,
Person to Person Instruction, etc. etc.... For me however,
trearrng into a well made scene teaches me not only every
thing he had to know in order to create it but teaches it to me
in my own style of doing things - Where I'm not filed into
a mold of mechanically doing it and thinking about it in the
same way as the author like so many step tutorials have a way
of doing.

Anyway, I agree with Proton (WV) that these things are very
valuable. Apparrently there are enough others that think so
too as a considerably sized market has evolved around the
sales and promotion of data sets for 3D apps. [Most of which
are not as good as that sub pic he just posted BTW.]

.

Jimzip
10-29-2003, 02:40 AM
also don't forget all the very cool video's Lee has made for lightwave over the last month or two....they are very useful to lw artists learning the app.


Cresshead, don't forget Larry Shultz :D .

Thank you Proton!
And my goodness, Leigh is still here.
Hi Leigh! :wavey: (Hmm, no emoticon for that..)

I am so looking forward to this update, although I shall not be downloading, I'll have to get the CD. They charge us a downloading fee here in Australia. :mad: :mad: :mad:
Damn 3GB cap..


Jimzip :D

Lamont
10-29-2003, 03:24 AM
Can`t wait to get the upgrade. :)

Karmacop
10-29-2003, 04:58 AM
Jimzip, get a good ISP and you wont have a cap. I go through http://www.dart.net.au ;)

Librarian
10-29-2003, 06:05 AM
Originally posted by riki
Proton I know it sounds like I'm stating the obvious but pleaazzzeeee check that someone sets up the content directory correctly. It hasn't always been the case in the past.
Yes please, and make sure the plugins are named correctly. It was annoying to rename some of them(restonground e.g.) in the 7.5c release.

Jockomo
10-29-2003, 02:23 PM
I wonder how well NewTek's servers will handle all of us trying to download a few hundred Megs all at the same time? I hope they are making plans for this.

Elmar Moelzer
10-29-2003, 02:28 PM
Hey!
Thanks for the kind words regarding the submarine- scene fellows.
I cant speak for the others, but everything I did for the content will be free for commercial, or whatever use (would be cool to see what you make of it in the gallery though).
Trust me there is a lot more in that package than only that submarine scene.
I have yet to see the stuff the others did, but from what I know of them, it will certainly be kick ***.
I have learned a lot from the old LW- content and the blade- runner- scene is still a wonderfull scene, even for todays standards.
The Hummer- scene is great for putting in models for testing with an environment...
I would not say that the old content was bad.
CU
Elmar

PS: In case anyone wonders what kind of sub that is:
It is a german type 21 submarine. I modeled it to scale after pretty precise plans (1:50) I got with a book about it (Eberhard Rössler " der U- Boottyp 21").
In addition I used photographs from the last existing submarine of that type, U2540 "Wilhelm Bauer", which is on display in the museum- harbour in Bremen.

tburbage
10-29-2003, 03:20 PM
Proton,

Glad to see you guys recognized how incredibly old and irrelevant a great deal of the included content had become. I think the bulk of it dated to LW5 --maybe before.

The LW team you are now a part of is definitely doing a better job than the previous regime in trying to provide learning materials relevant to the current state of the product and in communicating with the general user base.

-Tom B

cresshead
10-29-2003, 04:28 PM
newtek seem to be doing what all good companies do..listen to their users then respond to their needs...and not at a huge price either...the more i hear about stuff in lw 8 the better the upgrade deal looks.

...i'm also hoping for some addition to the surface preset lib as well...hint hint!

steve g:cool:

Elmar Moelzer
10-30-2003, 03:05 PM
Here is the link to an older animation- test, that I did with that submarine (just for the fun of it).
A few cuts in it show an older version of the very scene that is part of the LW- content now.
I reworked it for the LW- content (the LW- content- version is a lot better):
http://www.mediastudio-graz.com/html/uboat_eng.htm
Hope you like it.
CU
Elmar

archiea
10-30-2003, 07:08 PM
Proton...
any chance of having the submarine animation available for viewing in the NT gallery while we wait? Its seems like the proper cruel thing to do to us!! :D

Hervé
10-31-2003, 12:23 AM
hello Elmar, excellent U-boat animation... great stuff !!

A little stuff , the U-boat would (I think ) maybe, a little something in the texturing so it looks wet.... dunno , just a pov...

naaahhh, it 's good like this.... xcuse me...

Wonderful...

Last, maybe more wrinkles for the captains cap...

Holly joy to watch animations in LW !

we def need more anims... all I see here is still renders... I mean in the LW gallery...

Hervé

pauland
10-31-2003, 03:27 AM
Originally posted by Elmar Moelzer
Here is the link to an older animation- test, that I did with that submarine

Hope you like it.
CU
Elmar

I really enjoyed the animation. As well as a great animation, you get the prize for the loudest music I've ever heard on any animation!.

Das Boot was a great series. It's a pity they cut it to make a shorter film.

I went through a U Boat in a museum in Malmo. No idea what type it was.

Paul

siproductions
11-01-2003, 08:16 PM
It's a pirate submarine. The guy with the bins is looking for the dongle.. ;-)

:D :D :D LOL

This stuff looks great. I can't wait:)

Elmar Moelzer
11-02-2003, 07:00 AM
Hey Pauland!
Not sure why the music appears so loud at yours...
I think you mean the VII- C that is on display in Laboe.
I looked at it again and I think you are right Herve, it could be a bit more wett- looking.
The surface is pretty rough though, so it wont be much more glossy. Its bit hard to find the right ballance here or it would tend to look too shiny. Ideally it would look more wett near the waterline and maybe have that part animated too, but this is not that easy to do...
CU
Elmar

pauland
11-02-2003, 08:04 AM
I think you mean the VII- C that is on display in Laboe.
A quick search on Malmo and submarine:

"Sjöfartsmuseet is an excellent technology and maritime museum and even includes the U3 submarine, which was launched in 1943 and later decommissioned in 1967. "

Paul

Elmar Moelzer
11-02-2003, 02:29 PM
Ahh ok, hehe.
Seems I was pretty wrong this time.
CU
Elmar

Hervé
11-02-2003, 11:32 PM
Hello Elmar, yes it will be hard to do.... but I think with a plugin like HS from 3D evasion, it will do the trick.... you dont want cheap specularity here, you want reflections, but not the additive ones from LW....

PS. Life is not a quiet river, I am baking here an entire project with more than 300 textures to be baked..... really hardcore stuff.... just to prepare all the UV spaces, it took me 2 weeks.... he he... so I'll buy also a plugin from 3D evasion called Microwave.... coz NT still does the baking in a real old fashionned oven...

Cheers Elmar ! I really liked you animation !

Keep up the good work as they all say...

Elmar Moelzer
11-03-2003, 08:23 AM
Yupp, I would not want to use specularity for that either.
One reason why it is a bit hard to do the waterline is:
Metal usually is coloring the highlights pretty strongly, while the thin waterfilm would not color the highlights.
The problem is that there is no texturing for color highlights yet.
Yeah Hypersmooth might come in handy. To bad I dont have it.
Lets see what NT will do for the next releases of LW.
CU
Elmar

xtrm3d
11-04-2003, 03:54 AM
elmar ,
your u-boat look cool ... i would even say xtrm coll !!!!
really good work on this one ..

did austria have any u-boat ??:p

for my part i just uploaded tonight my humble contribution to the lw8 content

rigged charachter stuff.. 9 of them :rolleyes:

archiea
11-04-2003, 04:09 AM
Elmar...

Thanks for posting the animation....

Your timing was perfect, as I'm on a show involving alot of CG water....

Just some suggestions....

If you have access to DFX+ (with the recent LW deal) I suggest you try to utilize compositing to facilitate the tweaking of your image....

For example, our 3D folks split our water into 3 layers... base water, foam and areation (the translucent green stuff). Dial each in the comp is just a color correction of the base water pass.... You may need to render the foam at 2X the rez or with higher anti aliasing as its flickering.. (or it could be the compression of the video). The areation layer will add translucency and scale to your water.

Also, create a boiling foam element to help hide the contact area between the water and the sub. Man are we having problems with that. try to make sure that the boiling elements follow the dynamics of both the sub and the water. this way it won't look like a pasted on sprite.

Have key events of secondary splashes and foam be triggered by the action of the water against the istelf and the sub. Some areas for example is when the sub surfaces and you see the water cover the bow again as the sub dips a bit. Both ends of the water meeting each other over the bow would seem to trigger a splash.

The over the shoulder view of the capt viewing the binoculars is another... you see the bow dip into the water, but hardly any displacement of the water. Imagine the rushing foam on the beach on either side of the bow, racing to meet the center and then SPLASH!!!

Perhaps a good place to reference such examples of diplacement is the realflow website gallery at nextlimit.com

Also for a reference, got to the beach and tape on DV the tumbling tide (althought the DV COMPRESSION wrecks havoc on the subtlty of the motion) and note how many droplets are present when you look at the top of the foam...

lastly, if you generate these splash elements separately, bring it into DFX... say its a particle splash FX. First frame avg it (if you have AE with twixtor, this works great) so that you smear the motion. then blur that. Dx yor original particle over that result using a screen or mix. Mult down the blurred particles so that its just a fine mist. this will add scale and density to a realitively humble particle FX. Comp that over a globby hypervoxel rendering of a splash that follows the same dynamics and you start to build up a layered splash element that will offer some flexibility in dialing in the desired FX....

If anything, this animation rocks because it inspires such conversation!!!!!

when 8 comes, I'd love to give it a try.....

thanks for sharing....

archiea
11-04-2003, 04:12 AM
found this discussion on the anatomy of a wave, BTW....

http://www.boatsafe.com/nauticalknowhow/waves.htm

hehe.....

Elmar Moelzer
11-04-2003, 06:49 AM
Hey!
Thanks for the kind comments.
Christophe, yes Austria had a few U- boats in WW1.
After WW1 we had lost Trieste and souther Styria.
Austria had no sea anymore.
So I rarely see any oceans and had to use some imagination for that. Looking forward to see you characters!
Archiea, you are of course right and the contact between the submarine and the ocean is the area that I think is the most lacking thing in the whole animation.
It is as you said pretty hard to do. I tried a few solutions but it was hard to get anything useable without the use of compositing.
I am looking forward to see what I will be able to do with LW 8.0 in this regard. Maybe there will be more possible solutions then.
I did not want to use any 3rd party- plugins either.
Plugins like hypersmooth might have helped a lot though.
I had a few solutions, but they were either slow, or required a lot of compositing- work.
All this would be very easy for a still, but for animation, it is a lot harder.
Thanks for the link!
CU
Elmar

archiea
11-04-2003, 09:11 PM
Yeah, Elmar, my point regarding Realflow was their gallery, not their software!!! :D I thought that since it was all CG, that it was a more simplified example, as the point that I was making was part of the selling point to their software....

The challenging thing is to do that with just LW.....

What real footage does is afford you the reference to the overwhelming detail that alot of us strive for...

I still say that compositing is an important aspect to 3D... You can embellish your shot in a manner that is more unique and personal rather than depending on a gag or shader.....

Elmar Moelzer
11-04-2003, 11:50 PM
True, compositing is important and gives you a lot of power.
But this project was more or less for fun only and I wanted to challenge myself a bit by seeing how far I could go without the need for compositing. I really like doing that often, as I learn a lot by doing so.
The good thing about that is that there is now a cool scene in the next LW- content (which would be difficult, had the scene been meant to see a lot of compositing- work later on)
CU
Elmar