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View Full Version : Inteface Facelift?



Psyhke
02-09-2003, 03:26 AM
Howdy. Thought I'd throw out an idea on the LW interface, too. I think the LW interface is pretty good the way it is. I also like Matt's more radical departure ideas.

But if NT were to want a more subtle change to the look of LW that would only require tweaking of the existing OGL programming, some changes could be done this way too.

http://208.42.96.144/linked_img/surface_web.gif

Matt
02-09-2003, 11:09 AM
Very nice, I like that! Simple!

Meshbuilder
02-09-2003, 01:52 PM
I like it..

DaveW
02-09-2003, 04:48 PM
I'm not a big fan of greyscale interfaces, if the button colors were user-definable then I'd be happy.

Meshbuilder
02-09-2003, 05:41 PM
Do you want to see something scary?..
If Apple would buy Lightwave :(

http://www.vinyamar.com/~darkeden/meshbuilder/cp/lwosx.jpg

Memz
02-09-2003, 06:13 PM
Its really good.. Got any more you can show us?

Skonk
02-09-2003, 07:36 PM
Some WinXp styleeeeeeeeeeee, Meshbuilder i chopped out a few bits of yours and put them in mine, hope u dont mind, was just to save time.

http://www.freewebz.com/spankdaddy/SurfEdit.jpg

Just so u know i dont actually want lightwave to look like this :)


James..

Skonk
02-09-2003, 07:38 PM
Hmm first time iv tried linking to this host, u'll have to rightclick and do copy shortcut then paste into the address bar of a new window or drag the link onto the address bar. Or i suppose u could right click and save target as.

Need to find a better host.

James...

DigiLusionist
02-10-2003, 03:20 AM
Meshbuilder, you're right. That is scary.

But also cool in a Borg sort of way...

Meshbuilder
02-10-2003, 04:49 AM
Apple also have another interface design they use on programs like iTunes and Safari.
Brushed metal..
Here's Lightwave in brushed metal..

http://www.vinyamar.com/~darkeden/meshbuilder/cp/lwmetal.jpg

Psyhke
02-10-2003, 05:14 AM
Hehee. Those are great. And funny. Funnily great. I don't know what I'm saying. Actaully, that last one's not bad, if it weren't so 'heavy'.

Memz- I don't have anything more right now... though I'm poking around on a Modeler version. I'll post it when it's done.

WizCraker
02-10-2003, 09:34 AM
If Apple can keep the interface design of shake with butchering it to look macish then Lightwave can stay as the familar grey look.

http://a1008.g.akamai.net/7/1008/51/ae6ad4ca959ec1/www.apple.com/shake/images/index_top_02.jpg

And the Windows Version

http://www.imagereality.com/Images/NewtekImages/Shake.jpg

Panikos
02-10-2003, 09:43 AM
The order in which human eyes see an image is an entire science.
It starts with the highest contrast area and ends with the lowest contrast area.

So, in a Surface Editor, the sample-render box needs to be of the highest contrast and the rest of the Editor to be of low contrast.
Otherwise the unbalanced contrast attacts the attention of eyes into secondary less important things and results in confusion.

Imagine this : if there was no fog in nature, your eyes would find it difficult to estimate distance. Similar principal applies in DOF.
Your eyes are focused on a point always.

If you visit a high-end editting suite, the monitors are the brightest things, and the rest of the room is dark.

The same principle applies in the LW-UI.
If you make a bright UI and the working-animation area is dark,
your eyes will find difficulty in concetrating.

As far as grey-debate or colourish, even my windows-backdrop is grey, to "balance" my eyes into a neutral color.
If I see an almost grey-color with some green tone, I immediately realize it, cause I know 100% how grey is.

A GUI cannot be a rainbow. Some gentrle tone of a color is harmless, but seeing yellow buttons or blue, reminds me of software 15 years ago.

Matt
02-10-2003, 10:13 AM
LightWaves default interface at the moment is light grey with coloured buttons galore!

Eurg! :eek:

EvilE
02-10-2003, 11:14 AM
Id like to see the new ui colorized like combustion http://www.discreet.com/images/events/siggraph2001/screenshots/Eddie_grain_31view.jpg
I think this color scheme is very eye friendly

EE

Matt
02-10-2003, 12:27 PM
Hahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!

That dog cracks me up!

That is sooooooo my avatar now!!!

:D

theosmekhanes
02-10-2003, 02:56 PM
I really like the brushed metal version of LW, yes it needs to be toned down a bit (less contrast in the texture).

It just has a more "solid" look. the feilds are more apperent and seem more stable.

I'm very opinionated when it come to the LW interface. NewTek has done alot of good work but it still seems that they are cluless on a few aspects.

Functional and pleasing use of color and when, where and why to use icons also seem to be subjects over their heads.

I think that total customisation is a cop-out for finer interface design. :rolleyes:

DaveW
02-11-2003, 12:03 AM
Originally posted by theosmekhanes

Functional and pleasing use of color and when, where and why to use icons also seem to be subjects over their heads.


What is not functional about the colors used in LW? Pleasing is a matter of opinion, but I find the current color scheme pleasing. As for icons, they're on the viewports and playback controls. Where else do you think they should (or shouldn't) go?

Jimzip
02-11-2003, 05:25 AM
Hey, anybody seen this one? This is really cool. The only thing I don't like are the tabs at the bottom, not enough space to work with in your scene..

http://www.creactive-design.co.uk/Lightwave_vx/

Jimzip:D

Meshbuilder
02-11-2003, 08:08 AM
Originally posted by Jimzip
Hey, anybody seen this one? This is really cool. The only thing I don't like are the tabs at the bottom, not enough space to work with in your scene..

http://www.creactive-design.co.uk/Lightwave_vx/

Jimzip:D

Yeah cool, Matt have you seen this? ;)

Matt
02-11-2003, 01:06 PM
:)

I may have seen that once or twice on my travels!!!

Ahhhhh, the tabs yes, well, in defense of the tabs:

1) They replace the floating palettes which take up more screen space than tabs

2) The screen size on the examples is not indicative of a real screen size so the viewport is shown smaller than normal (unless you're running 800x600!!!)

3) The viewport could be made bigger by dragging it

4) Double-clicking the tabs causes them to 'fold-away' to the bottom, double-clicking again brings them back (this could be done with a hotkey too)

All of which would mean more screen space, but static screenshots don't show any of that functionality!!!

I should do more Flash simulations I suppose!

Cheers
Matt

:D

theosmekhanes
02-11-2003, 06:21 PM
I like it matt,

I like the subtle ipod like tint to the text feilds. It's slightly warmer in color than the BG so it stands out without screeming at you.

I love the edges and the restrained use of icons in the file menus. the little checker boxes denote the root of a catagory branch and serve as a visual landmark for the eyes scanning the screen. I think you could use this to greater effect throughout the interface. each group of functions could have a symbol or texture to designate their respective family of functions.

I think the shading on the tabs and buttons is inspired. It seems like a trivial thing but it makes a world of difference when you need to know what button you just pushed or which window is active.

My only complaint is that the interface it just a touch too bright. Generally when making color critical judgments it is wise to have a neutral and consistant BG. for photographers that is an 80% grey card. that way you can judge the range from black to white.

feature request:

How about a layout for two screens? tear away the view port and fill one screen with tabs.

Great work, I have been complaining about these finer points of interface design for awhile, but now when you look back at the old LW screen you can see how primitive it is.

keep up the great work, i hope Newtek takes a serious look it this.

P.S. wanna take a crack at making a combined timeline-dopesheet. Newtek still dosent get it.

Matt
02-12-2003, 03:53 AM
thanks for the kind comments, funny you should mention the dopesheet, the 'scene manager' tab is exactly that, and is what I'm working on now.

it's going to be a kind of merge of spreadsheet, scene editor and motion mixer. gonna be interesting to see if I can make it have all the functionality it needs without being over-complicated.

a darker version is on its way too!

:)

Jimzip
02-12-2003, 06:48 PM
Yes well with that tabs issue, now that you've said all that, they are a good idea, I guess to really appreciate something you have to see it in action..
By the way, this is the interface I'm hoping Newtek see as well.
Jimzip:D

DaveW
02-12-2003, 09:38 PM
I don't think the dopesheet should be part of the scene editor, it should be part of the graph editor. The graph editor is a dopesheet that shows curves instead of rows of blocks. All that you would need is a toggle button/shortcut key in the graph editor that swaps the key display to/from dopesheet and curve mode, like Messiah and XSI. The scene editor lacks all the kickass key editing tools the graph editor has, like channel bin, filters, footprints, tracking item selections and layout time, ect. And it makes sense to switch back and forth between curves and key rows when you're editing keys.

Matt
02-13-2003, 03:27 AM
I was thinking the same thing last night when I gave it some more thought!

theosmekhanes
02-13-2003, 06:02 PM
Hey Matt

If you wanna get an idea of what a competent dopesheet/time line looks like, open up Adobe After effects.

scene manager-like list of objects with drop down menues for details. Scaleable timeline, integrated keyframes (cut copy paste drag & drop baby) , graph editor
and a scrubbable audio waveform.

these are the basics for any keyframe based animation program. Why has Newtek not gotten it right yet?

the "dope sheet" was developed to help the animator match his key poses with notated audio queues. therefore any so called dopesheet that does not handle audio, completley misses the mark.

anyone with traditional animation training knows what a dope sheet is, apaently it is knowlege that escapes much of the LW world.

-sorry for the rant I must be crazy or somthing ;)

DaveW
02-13-2003, 08:30 PM
Well in 3d animation dopesheet has come to mean a tool for retiming animation wether it's for sound or not. I never thought "dopesheet" was a good name for the tool but that's what everyone calls it. 3d animation is a different beast so I can see how the term has taken on a different, although similar meaning.

I've always thought the waveform should just be in the timeline like it is now, and when you need to time the animation to sound you would have two choices: one would be a keytrack-like timeline to push around keys, the other would be using the dopesheet/graph editor with the track layout time option enabled. You would have to be able to resize the timeline if you want to get a better look at the waveform, right now it's really hard to see. I can see the benefit from having the waveform directly in the dopesheet though and the more I think about it the more I think it's a very good idea; perhaps when you switch the view to dopesheet mode instead of hiding the expression and curve tabs (since you don't need those in a dopesheet) they could be replaced with the audio waveform. This would help when you don't want to track layout time (due to performance issues) but still need to set the keys to match the soundtrack.