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fresh
10-24-2003, 12:55 PM
hi everybody

i'm a new member on the message board...i was always working with photoshop 7.0 but since a few days i bought lightwave,because i really like designing.

now basicly lightwave is chinese for me....(no offence)

i kind of like tryed out some of the tutorials i could find on the web...

but i have problems like...for instance .....can y'all just tell me how to make a simple 3D cube
:(

also how do i save the 3D cube i'm going to create as a picture lets say .jpg file???

because everytime i want to save sommething its just this file that wont open ...


i would really apreciate iff someone wants to help me out...i know maybe these questions sound dumb ,but we all have to start somwhere wright:(

the program is more difficult than i tought.



kind regards

WizCraker
10-24-2003, 12:59 PM
First of all the manual covers how to cover the box and also save your renders through Layout. I would suggest you read up on that to get a handle on the interface and to know where things are. Second go to Lightwave Tutorials (http://members.shaw.ca/lightwavetutorials/Main_Menu.htm) which is probably the largest Lightwave Tutorial site on the net. They have from basic to advanced.

Aegis
10-24-2003, 03:45 PM
Unlike most other 3D packages, LightWave 3D comes as two separate applications - Layout (or LightWave) and Modeler. You use Modeler to build your objects and Layout to animate and render them.

Create your box in Modeler and save it out as a .LWO object - you can then load this object into Layout and hit F9 to render it - you may need to enable "Image Viewer" from the "Render Options" panel to get a full-size picture. From Image Viewer you can save an image as a JPEG or whatever.

DONGLE THIS!
10-24-2003, 03:49 PM
you spent 1,600 on a high-end software and dont know how make a cube??????????????????????????????????????????????

are you for real?

only highend pros spend that much money for a software like this.
of course, there must be a purpose, design, architecture, CAD.
but most pros already have a general idea and are ready to cover up the cost of the software by making money off this software.
I mean, you can make a living off it. but in your case, it will be long while

good luck.

fresh
10-24-2003, 04:17 PM
hi

thank you both for replying...

i tryed looking into the manual...i also tryed the tutorial on the folowing website

http://www.niklasindustries.com/tutorials/tut_cubes.htm

now everything goed well until i get to step 3 "the point clone +"

when i select the tool there normaly should open a window as showen on the page...but myne does not do that ....

it says "error no points found in background layer" ...:confused:


thats problm one...

but ok

here's annother question about saving a simple cube as a jpg ...etc

tell me if this is correct please...

i open modelar ->objects->box.....

so now i got a cube...ok

what i do next is

file->save object .... (i save it to my desktop but only a file shows that cant be opend )

then what i do is

"send object to lay out"

i place the camera....light

then

Under the Scene tab,i select Volumetrics and in the dropdown menu saying Add Volumetric i select HyperVoxels, then double click on the HyperVoxels 3.0

then i open "VIPER"

-Activate button just above the list. Then click Render in the VIPER window.

then a line comes down and i see a part of the cube....i also tryed it with other tools and i got a white blobby masses...

what do i do wrong ...and what if i just want to save those white blobby masses onto a jpg file as a foto cause they looked kind of cool ...how do i do that

Aegis talked about image viewer from the render options but i cant find those
:confused:

can you tel me what steps i should do just to create a simple white cube in 3d and save it as a picture...

once i get that i know how to go further...i'm really thankull for the help

kind regards

fresh
10-24-2003, 04:23 PM
Originally posted by DONGLE THIS!
you spent 1,600 on a high-end software and dont know how make a cube??????????????????????????????????????????????

are you for real?

only highend pros spend that much money for a software like this.
of course, there must be a purpose, design, architecture, CAD.
but most pros already have a general idea and are ready to cover up the cost of the software by making money off this software.
I mean, you can make a living off it. but in your case, it will be long while

good luck.

l i bought it for few money from a design company that whent bankrupt they sold like everything ...there computers....desks....programs...i bought lightwave and a friend of mine bought photoshop....it was a good price..so..i would have been crazy if i wouldn't have bought it for that amount of money...

so i want to start learning ...its not that i want to go and design the most beautiful things...it would be unrealistic of me to think so ...you have proffesional and talented people for that ...but whats wrong with trying to learn sommething man ...i do design wallpapers and a lil foto editing ...but i would like to know how to create simple things like...3d cubes...special 3d effects stuff like that ...so i can use them on wallpapers...etc

ps excuse my poor english)

bloontz
10-24-2003, 04:38 PM
In modeler, click on the box tool, hit the n key then press enter twice. Save the box as box.lwo or whatever but do add the .lwo. That may be why you can't open the file. In the upper right corner click the downpointing arrow and select "send object to layout". In layout press the 6 key to go to camera view. You'll need to change the orientation of the cube (or the camera but that requires more learning). Click the box to select it then press the y key to activate the rotate tool. Rotate the box to where it looks good. Click on the render drop down list and select render options, under render display chose image viewer. Hit the F9 key to render.

FenrirWolf
10-24-2003, 04:46 PM
Well, then, read the included book. Then go do the tutorials on Newtek's website. If that doesn't satisfy you, go grab Inside Lightwave or some other book.

Lightwave is a huge, complicated program, like most 3d art programs. Expect to be futzing around with it for the minimum of a year or two before you produce anything near what you see coming out of these forums. It just takes practice, practice, practice. If you had prior experience with 3d art, you could shortcut a lot of the key learning steps. (What is a model? What are textures? What is rendering? etc.)

Otherwise, you'll just have to use what's out there for help.

fresh
10-24-2003, 07:03 PM
Originally posted by bloontz
In modeler, click on the box tool, hit the n key then press enter twice. Save the box as box.lwo or whatever but do add the .lwo. That may be why you can't open the file. In the upper right corner click the downpointing arrow and select "send object to layout". In layout press the 6 key to go to camera view. You'll need to change the orientation of the cube (or the camera but that requires more learning). Click the box to select it then press the y key to activate the rotate tool. Rotate the box to where it looks good. Click on the render drop down list and select render options, under render display chose image viewer. Hit the F9 key to render.


ooooooooooow thank you SO SO much!!!!!!:)

i made my first cube :D

i REALLY apreciate it Bloontz!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

@fenrirwolf

i was planing to go buy some books about lightwave:) and i'm already busy on the tutorials
i'm in my last year art at university but i never really drawed annything on the computer exept for photo editing and making some cover designs...etc in photoshop...so i look at this as a chalenge...i wasn't expecting me to be a fine lightwave artist as most people on this message board in a week,so i'm kind of down to earth on that one:D

what i do hope is to learn allot from you fine people...if thats ok ofcourse:D

siproductions
10-24-2003, 07:34 PM
Hi Fresh. Please check your private messages.

pauland
10-25-2003, 03:25 AM
Originally posted by fresh
l i bought it for few money from a design company that whent bankrupt they sold like everything ...there computers....desks....programs...i bought lightwave and a friend of mine bought photoshop....it was a good price..so..i would have been crazy if i wouldn't have bought it for that amount of money...


What exactly did you get for your money?

After you installed the software from CD what else did you need to do to get it to work?

Paul

fresh
10-25-2003, 01:27 PM
Originally posted by pauland
What exactly did you get for your money?

After you installed the software from CD what else did you need to do to get it to work?

Paul

euhhhh....nothing really...it says 7.0 ...should i do something special when instaling?

looks ok to me...whell the 3d cube tool works lol:D so i asume the other things wil work also

i did noticed some pages missing out of the manual do....OH whel...

pauland
10-25-2003, 01:36 PM
So you bought a CD plus a manual with pages missing? What does the manual look like?

Paul

fresh
10-25-2003, 07:27 PM
Originally posted by pauland
So you bought a CD plus a manual with pages missing? What does the manual look like?

Paul

may i ask you where youre going or trying to get at with this?

pauland
10-25-2003, 07:44 PM
Usually people who buy the software are able to get on and at least build a box, particularly with a manual nearby.

Some of the people who ask questions on these forums don't have legitimate copies of the software, sometimes they know this , sometimes they don't.

I'm trying to see which of these scenarios you fit:

1) You've bought what you think is legitimate software, but it isn't
2) You've bought real software, but may soon have your licence expire
3) You have legitimate everything
4) You have cracked software and a cover story.

You'll find that people who have legitimate software get plenty of help and those who don't don't get any help.

It may be that you have bought something in good faith that is going to cause you problems later.

What *exactly* did you get for your money?

Paul

fresh
10-26-2003, 04:47 AM
Originally posted by pauland
Usually people who buy the software are able to get on and at least build a box, particularly with a manual nearby.

Some of the people who ask questions on these forums don't have legitimate copies of the software, sometimes they know this , sometimes they don't.

I'm trying to see which of these scenarios you fit:

1) You've bought what you think is legitimate software, but it isn't
2) You've bought real software, but may soon have your licence expire
3) You have legitimate everything
4) You have cracked software and a cover story.

You'll find that people who have legitimate software get plenty of help and those who don't don't get any help.

It may be that you have bought something in good faith that is going to cause you problems later.

What *exactly* did you get for your money?

Paul

look ...if you don't want to help out because you are thinking i bought craked software than thats your god given right..and i'm ok with that ,i believe that everyone should have right to his own opinion..wether its based on speculation(witch isn't the most smartest thing to do)) or facts

on the other hand ,what makes you think i have to explain myself to you about the things i buy,..where i buy them and why i bought them in the context you asked your question in.

have a nice day paul

kind regards

pauland
10-26-2003, 05:26 AM
Originally posted by fresh
look ...if you don't want to help out because you are thinking i bought craked software than thats your god given right..and i'm ok with that ,i believe that everyone should have right to his own opinion..wether its based on speculation(witch isn't the most smartest thing to do)) or facts
Well your facts are rather weak and I was asking for more information so speculation wasn't necessary.

on the other hand ,what makes you think i have to explain myself to you about the things i buy,..where i buy them and why i bought them in the context you asked your question in.

You don't have to explain yourself, nor do I or anyone else, have to assist you. You did volunteer some information yourself, as some kind of explanation.


have a nice day paul

kind regards

Thank you, I will.

hrgiger
10-26-2003, 07:51 AM
Legititmate software or not, there is a manual on-line if one didn't come with your software. And you really should read it before asking very basic questions like how do you make a box... That, or get used to hearing RTFM.

UnCommonGrafx
10-26-2003, 08:33 AM
And to get used to being ignored for not having answered Paul's questions.

:D

I'll be less diplomatic than Paul: did you get a dongle?

As an investor in NewTek products, though it's not my job, it is my investment I am protecting when I ask these kinds of questions.
See, it makes no sense for someone to spend lots of money on such a product and then 'wander' into a forum to ask one of the most simplest question available to them. Red flags pop up, the hair on the back of the neck stands straight out and we all start to draw to fire. :mad:

So, Fresh, did ya get a dongle? :rolleyes:

wacom
10-26-2003, 08:56 AM
Wouldn't it be great if before enrolling in the LW forum one had to scroll through the top ten most asked, simplest questions- each listing where the answer could be found in the manual.

Example

TOP TEN:

1.) MAKE A BOX see p. 653

2.) Put 2D images on a box! p....


I think hounding people who are new to the forums about IF they bought legit software is kind of rude, but what else are we going to do? If I had bought what I thought was real software, come to this forum, and had people give me a bunch of crap I might think the LW forum community was a bunch of jerks...and then go and buy a competitors 3D package.

Then again...how hard is it to read the manual? Or do a search on these boards to see the other stupid questions first before you re-ask them? Do we really want people using this program who ask such questions on the forum? Try TrueSpace or a program with Icons...it'll be easy to make a "cube" and hard to do much else...

UnCommonGrafx
10-26-2003, 10:23 AM
I think that would be brilliant for NewTek to do!!!


But one has to wonder, why in hell would anyone PAY money for such an app without doing their homework?

I remember when I asked my first question... I got the third degree from folks because my question was so simple. Since that time, I've gone out of my way to assist newbies with simple first questions, but always with the question, "Did ya get a dongle?". One guy was sold it by a 'friend' who said he 'lost all that stuff, but here's a CD...'. To his credit, he shared his story and went out and got the FREE discovery edition.

The FAQ idea is cool. But I don't think necessary if one actually has the manuals. ;)

fresh
10-26-2003, 10:25 AM
just forget i even asked a question.

i'm out of here man.

good luck on your designing people

UnCommonGrafx
10-26-2003, 10:33 AM
We'll always have you in mind, Fresh.
You'll find most communities are protective of their tools.
I understand how you feel. Hope it works out for you.

hrgiger
10-26-2003, 11:05 AM
And I was really looking forward to seeing that box too....

wacom
10-26-2003, 11:16 AM
Hey- if you're a student I suggest you get a Student version of 8 when it comes out. Hang in there! First job you get using it should easily pay for it. At some point we make the leap and buy- but it's hard to know what to buy when a demo is so (and rightfully so) lacking. The student version of LW isn't crippled at all (unlike other packages).

Still- if you've gotten this far you owe it to NewTek and us (the people who pay for this board and the software you're using) to get really good at LW- buy it- and help others in the community in the end. If you plan on never buying it, and never getting good with it just stop right now...

I know for a fact that not every LW user here has ALWAYS used legit software. Some of these people have gone on to do great things for the LW community.

colkai
10-27-2003, 03:48 AM
Hey Fresh,

UnCommonGrafx was just trying to be helpful and give you the benefit of the doubt.

IF the software is legit, you would of got a full manual, a 'Dongle' (a little sort of hardware thing that either goes on your parallel port or USB port), a fully printed Sliver CD with a serial no printed on a label on the case.

You then need to register the software with Newtek in order to get it working, they also need confirmation from your sale point that it is being transferred to you.

If all you did was copy the software from a CDR disc then run it, or unzip it from a ZIP or self-executable into a directory, you have an illegal copy.

In which case, the company who sold it you broke the law and you, by association, are using pirated software. In this case, it is in your interest to "shop" these folks to Newtek.

On the other hand, you may be fully aware that your software is illegal, in which case, you'll get no joy here and do not deserve further help of any type.
Oh, also, you are on Newteks own message boards, I'll leave you to figure out the implications of that!

siproductions
10-27-2003, 12:25 PM
Take it easy on the guy. Maybe he does have a legal version. Besides if some one asked me the way he was asked I would get defensive too.

pauland
10-27-2003, 02:00 PM
Originally posted by siproductions
Take it easy on the guy. Maybe he does have a legal version. Besides if some one asked me the way he was asked I would get defensive too.

How would you ask then?

Paul

UnCommonGrafx
10-27-2003, 02:12 PM
Yeah, my question as well.

I thought the questions were quite polite; heck, even skirting the issue, initially.

But from what I've noticed, this process of asking the question [when it's not obvious that it's a legitimate user] seems to be more of an initiation process into the 'club', as it were. Although it might put some off, most of the people who came across as legit stood up for themselves and told us to f-off, stating that they paid for the software and just want help.

I say those that go away so quickly weren't really in need of help to learn the software in the first place... trolling to see if this community will help them faster than the last... or so goes my supposition...

I think this should be a required read for all those new to fori and the gleaning of knowledge thereof:
http://www.kolumbus.fi/erkki.halkka/LWFAQ/

siproductions
10-27-2003, 03:56 PM
Hi Pauland,

First off, please do not be offended at what I say. I didn't mean to be offensive.

In answer to your question: I would not have asked it the first place. I really appreciate bloontz for just answering the question that Fresh asked. Fresh was asking for help, not for someone to start criticizing him in his wisdom or legality of buying and using the program. If you did not wish to help, then don't post. Or at least say that the information should be in the manual and leave it at that.
If you think that the software is not legal, and want to ask him about it, I would PM him about it, instead of taking over his thread and using it against him. I would try to make him understand that the only reason you are asking him is because you love LW and its community and would not want to help someone that does not honor the money that others have paid to own this software. But for goodness sake, Don't go about insulting him on his own thread, if you do not know if he has illegal software or not.

Also UnCommonGrafx, and I quote you: "But one has to wonder, why in "heck" would anyone PAY money for such an app without doing their homework? "

That was uncalled for. What business is it of yours if he bought every app on the planet with out knowing any thing about any of them? I is not my place to judge some one's wisdom in his buying habits, and besides, Fresh said that he got it for a good price and until I find reason to believe otherwise I can only take his word at face value.

Finally guys we represent Lightwave and Newtek. that is why pauland is concerned, and I understand that concern, but we must do our best to be polite and to bring people toward the groups not sending them away angry. Especially if you are not sure about the true state of his version of LW. Over the last few months I have come to love the LW community, and only through your politeness and willingness to help can we keep these groups a thriving source of information. If every post were taken care of in the manner this post was, the 3dsmax community would have easily past us by.

UnCommonGrafx
10-27-2003, 04:19 PM
I've fallen into that trap myself, Siproductions,

Sometimes a rhetorical question is just that. The snippet you pulled would be an example of such.

No offense taken as your response is one of another concerned community member.

It is none of my business, on the face of it. As it is no ones business, based on the way you've stated it, that I replied in the manner I did. This is not to be a smart asrsed remark, I assure you, but one that seems to be based in the logic of your comment.

As regards our community suffering for the nosier of us out here, I believe that is over-stated: I've read, and been told personally, of people being dealt with much more harshly by the Max crowd AND Discreet.

I agree wholeheartedly with your last paragraph, with the exception of the max part, and have been working in that vein since joining the community in my own independent ownership of NewTek products. Check the archives for my posts and you will find many more helping posts by me than 'hurtful'.
Oh, and I'll add as an afterthought: I'm even a moderator of a board for NewTek products. I love them; I love my tools. Some of them are my friends.

I stand by what I've said here. I stand by my protection of my investments of my NewTek products, as well. Perhaps it ain't pretty, but it works for me. And if it runs folks off, that would be none of my business. If it makes them learn and work the system that much better, I take all the credit. :D

siproductions
10-27-2003, 05:21 PM
Hi UnCommonGrafx,

I'm glad you did not take offense at my statement. However I beg to differ with you on the question of "business". I understand were you are coming from when you state that it is none of my business what you post. However this is not true.

I said that it was not your business to know why he got LW. I said that, because I am a member of this board and thought what you said unkind. If you were a member of his family (for instance his wife) you would have a right to know why he got LW. You are not ( at least to the best of my knowledge you aren't), so you do not have that right. If you are a member of this board then you also have the right to respond to the posts that I put up if you think them rude or unkind or harmful to Newtek. I have the same right and in my opinion there were things being said that were rude and not dealing with the real issue. There is a difference between talking about some one badly or standing up for some one that has been talked badly about. Don't get me wrong, you have every right to be rude as far as the rules allow, but the other members have a right as well to tell you when something is uncalled for. I am not saying that you are rude( you are probably not rude) I am just saying that I think your statement was rude and unkind. So in one sense you are right. You have the right to post what you like, but on the other hand you are wrong because no one has the right to be rude without being stood up to.

Also I think you misunderstood me about the Community. LW has the best Community. Period.... (That's four of them:) I was just saying that what makes this community the greatest, is the members of the Community. If the members are not great to deal with, the community is not great to deal with. So just be careful. Also I meant no offense about 3ds. I have Discreet products and I know how bad the community is for their products. But the way that happens starts with one or two people and snowballs from there.

pauland
10-27-2003, 06:25 PM
Originally posted by siproductions
Fresh was asking for help, not for someone to start criticizing him in his wisdom or legality of buying and using the program.
You'll have to tell me where I criticised him or said he'd bought the software illegally.

If you did not wish to help, then don't post.
I try and help people, if I can. I won't help people who haven't bought the software. In this case, it was difficullt to know what the situation was without more information.

It's kind of you to decide if I should post or not. I don't help pirates. As far as 'fresh' goes, it wasn't possible to tell whether he legitimately owned the software, particularly since he was less than forthcoming.

Fresh never once mentioned his licence key and one reason for my questions was that he may have bought Lightwave, installed it and thought that was all he had to do. I imagined that in 14 days it would stop working when he didn't produce a valid key.

I asked for more information to try and determined his situation. If his explanation had indicated he'd bought everything but was missing the licence key, I'd have mentioned what he'd need to do to get one.

Or at least say that the information should be in the manual and leave it at that.
Do you really think we need to tell someone who can't make cubes, to go and look in the manual?

instead of taking over his thread
Rather an exaggeration.

and using it against him.
I don't think the "used it against him" phrase is pertinent to my posts.

Don't go about insulting him on his own thread
Please quote my insult back so I can see it.

, if you do not know if he has illegal software or not. ..it's because it's impossible to tell, given what Fresh has said.

we must do our best to be polite Tell me where I haven't been.

If every post were taken care of in the manner this post was, the 3dsmax community would have easily past us by.
I can assure you that the 3D max community has certainly passed me by!

Paul

siproductions
10-27-2003, 08:04 PM
Dear Paul,

I looked over the posts again and maybe I got you mixed up with some of the other members. I am sorry if this is so. Perhaps I should have addressed some of the other posts as well. However in answer to your last post:

"You'll have to tell me where I criticized him or said he'd bought the software illegally."

You did not say that he bought the software illegally. You did imply that he did not. Which is reasonable until he gives you information otherwise.

It's kind of you to decide if I should post or not

My friend, if I implied this please forgive me. I simply reserved the right to protest if the post was out of place in my opinion.

As far as 'fresh' goes, it wasn't possible to tell whether he legitimately owned the software, particularly since he was less than forthcoming.

The reason he was not forthcoming was because he asked why you were asking him questions, and you told him that you were basically doing a search on him to see if he was legal. That in my opinion is rude when it is in a public forum. How would you like it if I started questioning you about your software and seeing if it was all legal in a public forum. You would tell me to get out of there. It should have been in a PM.

Fresh never once mentioned his license key and one reason for my questions was that he may have bought Lightwave, installed it and thought that was all he had to do. I imagined that in 14 days it would stop working when he didn't produce a valid key. I asked for more information to try and determined his situation. If his explanation had indicated he'd bought everything but was missing the license key, I'd have mentioned what he'd need to do to get one.

That one statement would have been enough to clear the problem up. You should have just asked him that in a PM instead of beating around the bush.

Rather an exaggeration.

Perhaps, but you did totally change the direction of the thread from helpful to antagonistic. The thread does not help fresh after the first page.

I don't think the "used it against him" phrase is pertinent to my posts.

Perhaps not. It could seem so from fresh's point of view however.

Please quote my insult back so I can see it.

Good point. I was referring to some of the other posts, but looking back on yours I don't see any direct insults,(Other than " Well your facts are rather weak") So I apologize on that point.

..it's because it's impossible to tell, given what Fresh has said.

See Quote 3

Tell me where I haven't been.

Again, I have to say I'm sure you meant to be very polite. However the way your statements were made seemed to incriminate him rather than just asking him a question.

I can assure you that the 3D Max community has certainly passed me by!

:D I certainly agree. Same here.

In conclusion I would like to say that I think that you meant the best, and I have nothing against you. However I think that this could have been handled in a way that would not have made Fresh angry if the version he had was legal. As it is, he is angry and will not likely come back to see us and that is not very kind of us if he has a legal version of LW. Also I would like to thank WizCraker, Aegis, Bloontz, and FenrirWolf for giving good helpful answers to Fresh.

UnCommonGrafx
10-27-2003, 10:14 PM
...How would you like it if I started questioning you about your software and seeing if it was all legal in a public forum. You would tell me to get out of there. It should have been in a PM.

The first question I posed, this was asked of me at 4 (FOUR) lw forums. It happens everyday. That's the community.
Me thinks thee be a bit sensitive about things. I also think you've ascribed to us behaviour that was not presented. Though you may think our statements rude, they weren't in the grand scheme of things.

Ya know, you've got a lot of 'shoulds' in your statements. Pretty presumptuous, me thinks.
Where's my insult? Don't count any rhetorical questions as they weren't directed at anyone in particular.

I appreciate your thoughts and perspective on my comment. I don't agree, of course. :D
I think being candid is a lost art.

Did you notice: I even answered a question for 'Fresh'?
Perhaps we should ask Paul L. and crew to close this thread...

siproductions
10-27-2003, 10:26 PM
When I say "should" I'm just stating my opinion. I'll try to phrase it better next time. Anyway I don't hold this against you guys and I hope you will not hold it against me. We all have different opinions and that's all right.

I agree with you. Perhaps is would be better to close it. I don't want it to get nasty or mean so lets just let it drop, and carry on.

Sincerely,

SI Productions

toby
10-28-2003, 03:02 AM
I think it's good to work out how to deal with this issue, it is rather sticky...

It just burns me how rude it is to steal software from a company and then ask for help from that very company's website, as well as people who paid for the software.

I'd be totally unwilling to help such people, and I wouldn't want other people to answer either, but how do you find out without it sounding like an accusation?

Sometimes it seems obvious that something's wrong, but we can keep cool anyway. I think it's fine to ask if they have a manual and to ask them to read it when they're asking these very basic questions. If they don't have a manual, simply explain our experiences with pirates and why were concerned. I don't think any rational person would take offense if this was explained up front.

Even if we do find a pirate, there's no need to insult or poke fun at them (unless they ask for it!), but simply say, "I'm sorry we don't help pirates here"

pauland
10-28-2003, 03:16 AM
How about this:

"Although I'm sure it's not the case here, we often get users of pirated software on these forums and generally they get short shrift here.

Often it's difficullt to tell apart the good guys from the bad, so can you tells us more about what came with your lightwave purchase and what you needed to do to install it permamently. If you can help us with this, I'm sure we'd be glad to help out. Welcome."

Feel free to read this too, Fresh.

Paul

colkai
10-28-2003, 03:40 AM
Pauland,
That's more or less what I think we are all trying to say.

It is difficult to get across in text that you may *not* be directly questioning the guys morals or the legitimacy of his software.

My prior reply could be viewed as negative, but I was also trying to point out what he should of got, in case he was indeed ripped off.

Having said this, there are pointers normally, and I suppose even the manual these days isn't a protected thing, as you can get PDF versions of it from Newtek. Though then one questions why they don't get it and read it.

Most pirates can be weeded out with the dongle question, it could even be worded so as not to suggest they may be a pirate.
For example, "Are you sure your dongle is seated properly?",
"Is it a USB or Parallel dongle". More often than not, pirates then come back with "What's a dongle?" ;)

One also has to bear in mind "how do I make a box" - well, I mean!
This suggests pirate or lazyness, neither of which are treated very kindly here, after all, how long does it take to go through the basics?
Though I think a new user can be forgiven the business of questioning how to save a surface, not always apparent without reading the manual before using the software. Something most of us don't normally do. ;) (Yeah - I know, this conflicts with my prior statement - Ok, we don't read it *thoroughly* :D)

I guess with things that have gone on lately, folks are a little bit twitchy, me included.

Paul Lara
10-28-2003, 06:56 AM
MODERATOR NOTE:
Now that Fresh has gone away, and left a few to argue back and forth about the best way to broach this subject, let's just call this thread done, shall we?

Thank you all for your assistance to a new user.

'Da Moderatur