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skywalker113
03-18-2012, 07:54 PM
I'm talking to a client who I may accept a job for. Although this will be my very first and i'm hesitant on what to do.

1. He wants a foresty scene with mountains, trees, pathway, etc. I'm thinking I can purchase alot of assets from turbosquid. But who should pay for those? How should that be arranged?


2. When people ask for my rates, I give them this list for examples. Are my prices resonable? Note that the prices listed on turbosquid are alot cheaper because there not custom work. If they were, they would be the prices below.

650.00 for this modeled and textured tank
http://www.turbosquid.com/3d-models/3d-model-tank/633372

550.0 for a modeled, textured, and rigged character like this
http://www.turbosquid.com/3d-models/3ds-max-troll-creature/633908

500.00 for this model. (no texture just color).
http://www.turbosquid.com/3d-models/maya-camaro/632446

450.00 for a modeled, textured, and rigged octopus
http://www.turbosquid.com/3d-models/3d-model-octopus/633511

metahumanity
03-18-2012, 07:58 PM
Way too low.

nickdigital
03-18-2012, 08:00 PM
1. He wants a foresty scene with mountains, trees, pathway, etc. I'm thinking I can purchase alot of assets from turbosquid. But who should pay for those? How should that be arranged?



Your budget should include the cost to buy assets.

DigitalSorcery8
03-18-2012, 08:02 PM
The thing is... all of this can be done in native LW11 with minimal models. A few trees instanced and mountains created in LW or imported from Terragen. There are plenty of free trees around - even some XFrog trees. IMO you don't HAVE to buy anything - at least for the forest scene.

skywalker113
03-19-2012, 12:09 AM
Your budget should include the cost to buy assets.

If im planing on buying the assets instead of modeling. Should that be alot cheaper for the client since there not paying me to model?


The thing is... all of this can be done in native LW11 with minimal models. A few trees instanced and mountains created in LW or imported from Terragen. There are plenty of free trees around - even some XFrog trees. IMO you don't HAVE to buy anything - at least for the forest scene.

Does LW11 have tree building tools? I dont have LW11 but just wondering. Are the free trees royalty free? And is there enough free trees going around that everyones project doesnt look the same.....

Should I direct the client to turbosquid and have them pick the trees they want?

nickdigital
03-19-2012, 12:29 AM
If im planing on buying the assets instead of modeling. Should that be alot cheaper for the client since there not paying me to model?


Only if the cost to buy the asset is cheaper than the man hours to build it. Either way you need to get paid. Paid to buy the asset or paid to build it.

bazsa73
03-19-2012, 12:30 AM
I would rather buy this plugin, this is for LW and with this you can create as many trees as you want. This is 120 dollars and you can use it later. So I guess this is best value for your money
http://www.polas.net/trees/index.php

DigitalSorcery8
03-19-2012, 12:38 AM
If im planing on buying the assets instead of modeling. Should that be alot cheaper for the client since there not paying me to model?
As nickdigital said:

Only if the cost to buy the asset is cheaper than the man hours to build it. Either way you need to get paid. Paid to buy the asset or paid to build it.


Does LW11 have tree building tools? I dont have LW11 but just wondering. Are the free trees royalty free? And is there enough free trees going around that everyones project doesnt look the same.....
In LW you can build ANYTHING. It's just a matter of how much TIME it will take you. There are various free trees here:

http://xfrog.com/category/X.html

In each xFrog library. But bazsa73 has a good idea as well - Pawel Olas has an incredible suite of plugins where you can easily make trees. I think that you'll also need the leaves plugin from there as well.


Should I direct the client to turbosquid and have them pick the trees they want?
Personally I wouldn't. I would just ask the client what type of forest he is thinking of. A "standard" North American forest? A Pacific Northwest forest? From there you should be able to easily figure out the type of trees - or just the LOOK. And then if you've exhausted every avenue, you can always THEN ask the client to pick out the trees.

biliousfrog
03-19-2012, 03:03 AM
When people ask for my rates (which is rare) I just say 30ph (base rate), however, I always price per job. The key to successfully costing a job is to have all the information locked down from the client, only then can to work out how many hours you'll need to spend on the project and how much money to charge.

At the end of the day they are paying for your skills and experience. If those skills include sourcing pre-made models rather than making your own then so be it...The client obviously doesn't have those same skills otherwise they'd do it themselves.

If you're looking at buying assets consider buying collections which can be used for other projects. As an example, I have several Dosch collections where a client has required a specific model (such as a wind turbine) and it has proved cheaper to buy a whole set of assets which I have used in other projects. Also don't under estimate the power of clip-mapped trees ;)

djwaterman
03-19-2012, 03:12 AM
The job ideally should pay for anything you have to do to complete it. You will buy the assets but that cost goes onto the cost of the job, factor in your hourly rate and the time you think you'll need to complete it.

You haven't said what the job is, is it animation, a still or the asset itself?

I charge $650 a day, that's not always what I get, and sometimes I get more. But if you have a set rate at least you can calculate what you think you should be getting and negotiate from there.

Don't let the client know it's your first job, make sure the amount covers the pain that a job could potentially become, if you are confident you can deliver what they want and they will like your work, then hit them with a decent quote and see what they say.

You can always ask them up front what they think the budget range for the job is before you present them anything.

It's your first paid commission, you might want it for that reason alone, don't sell your self short if you know you can deliver quality work and meet their deadline.

roboman
03-19-2012, 11:34 AM
1. He wants a foresty scene with mountains, trees, pathway, etc. I'm thinking I can purchase alot of assets from turbosquid. But who should pay for those? How should that be arranged?

Is he just getting the stills/animation or is he also getting the models, textures, scenes and animation files? The standard is you own the assets unless the client also buys them, but not all clients know that. Sometimes it's also unclear to both parties what is being sold and bought. If the client wants the assets, then they likely need to be bought in the clients name or bought by the client. If you are going to retain the assets, you need to buy them, as they are yours and for your use (just make sure you get paid enough :) ) To keep things friendly and not have hard feelings some time down the road it needs to be clear and should be in writing, as to exactly what is being bought and sold.


2. When people ask for my rates, I give them this list for examples. Are my prices resonable?
Are people willing to pay and can you afford to eat :)

skywalker113
03-19-2012, 12:19 PM
Thanks everyone for the replies.




Are people willing to pay and can you afford to eat :)


Im just asking if my prices are fair and not overpaid or underpaid. A model with greater detail should be worth more than a simple one.

nickdigital
03-19-2012, 01:44 PM
You can make trees with DPVerdure and it's free.
http://dpont.pagesperso-orange.fr/plugins/Verdure/DP_Verdure.html

DigitalSorcery8
03-19-2012, 02:50 PM
Im just asking if my prices are fair and not overpaid or underpaid. A model with greater detail should be worth more than a simple one.

:i_agree: But it also depends on if your client will be getting the model as part of your agreement OR if it's being used in a rendering/animation how much of it will be seen. When we model houses for single image renderings, we only model the front and one side - no need to model everything if it won't be in the shot. The same with the trees - as biliousfrog said, "don't underestimate the power of clip-mapped trees" - distant trees can be single poly clip-mapped versions that render super fast but look great in the distance.

Since only you know what your shot/animation entails, only you can decide. One thing that is extremely important - and as roboman already suggested - will your client get the assets or just the end result? If I did a house rendering I might charge $400. If the client wanted the assets - house, textures, other models within the scene - he would have to pay for all of the textures you bought (at full price) AND several times what the rendering costs for the house model. One client wanted the house asset when we were finished "so he could make minor changes on his own." Okay. I told him it would be $1.5k for the house model without textures. He changed his mind. ;)