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djwaterman
03-03-2012, 09:50 AM
I don't know why I feel I need to post this, it's a blender plugin, and I don't know if it will impress others as much as it impressed me, but I think we need to know what's out there.

http://www.bsurfaces.info/

I've actually considered buying it just to play around even though I don't use blender at all. I wonder if Lightwave would ever think about incorporating something similar, anyway, see for yourself, skip the retopoly segment at the beginning, the best stuff is after that when he models a violin.

vector
03-04-2012, 02:09 AM
It is supposed to be implemented in Blender soon. The only thing "some similar" I've found is http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=ja&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.3dcel.jp%2Fsketchmesh%2F

but I havenīt tested it. It looks not be updated for a long time

Vector

OFF
03-04-2012, 02:27 AM
a great tool!

bazsa73
03-04-2012, 07:51 AM
Must break through somehow that GUI barrier in blender, I tried several times but failed :)

OFF
03-04-2012, 09:01 AM
yep, me too :)

safetyman
03-05-2012, 06:42 AM
I've been using it quite a bit, and the more I use it the more I like it. Go to CGCookie and watch some of the amazing tutorials they have and you might have to give it a second look.

Surrealist.
03-05-2012, 06:58 AM
Must break through somehow that GUI barrier in blender, I tried several times but failed :)

When you first load up Blender, there are some settings that will help. In the User Preferences, in the Input Tab click on the tick that says "Emulate 3 button Mouse".

Once you do that your first inclination is to want to tumple around the screen.

LMB ALT. hey! Same as LightWave!

Start building up a series of familar things.

Example: Going in and out of Subpatch Mode in LightWave modeler. TAB key. Well.... not the same at all but.... TAB key gets you in and out of Edit Mode in Blender. If you are doing a subpatch model and with the default settings of the modifier. Pressing TAB gets you "in and out of Subatch Mode".

It is the small things that help.:)

You can also switch the preferences to select things with the LMB. But you loose some other cool functions.

If you have an inclination to try it out again a good idea is to register with the Blenderartists forums to get help.

By the way a beta version of Bsurfaces has been added to Trunk as far as I know. But you have to enable the addon in the User Preferences under Addons/Mesh.

Using Blender for modeling is a matter of trade offs. It depends on the individual I guess. But I'd say I can do most things much faster and easier in Blender than in Modeler. Usually it is the basic everyday working things that are faster. Much faster. Modelers tools go deeper. But I don't usually have a need for the deeper things. It is the everyday push and pull, roatate, scale add edges and loops, selections and so on that are so much faster in Blender. Seems when I go back to Modeler anymore it is like... what? I have to do this. to do that?. Two strokes in Blender... done! this is for, as I say most of the basic stuff. But you have to get your head around a different workflow.

bazsa73
03-05-2012, 07:27 AM
Thanks for you efforts Surrealist, I appreciate that. :) I will install first the latest release. Blender evolves at a great speed, I dont want to fiddle with 2.5.

Surrealist.
03-05-2012, 10:22 AM
Cool. Another good tip. In User Preferences Under Editing check the "Transform: Release Confirms". This means that when you Right Click and drag on a component (Face Edge or Point) it won't stick to your mouse when you let go. If this is unchecked you have to right click to confirm the translation.

These are just some quick tips to make the interface more familiar.

Here is a very quick tutorial:

Open Blender and it will have a default scene with a cube.

Press Tab to enter edit mode.

Hover your mouse over the icons at the bottom of the 3D View window where the cube is. There are little tool tips that display to tell you what they do.

Find the icons that represent the different component select modes. Change the compoent to your desired one by clicking on it.

Now shift click each one to select them all.

Now if you have applied the settings I mentioned, you can use your same keyboard shorts to tumble pan and zoom as you do in LightWave. (Zoom is up and down not side to side).

Then using the RMB to click and drag on a component. This is how easy and basic the every day simple functions are in Blender. You don't have to know even where the drag tool is or the shortcut. Just click and drag. That is it. Click on polys, edges and points all in the same selection mode if you want (The shift click method) or keep it to one component at a time.

Get adventurous and use Shift A to see the other kinds of objects you can add and edit away.

X key or Delete Key brings up a menu to select what you want to delete.

A selects all and Deselects all.

Hover your mouse over more icons below to see what they do.

Shift S brings up the most handy and oft used set of commands while modeling.

Have fun.

bazsa73
03-05-2012, 11:08 AM
Thanks Richard! One more question. You deem blender is production safe I guess.

Surrealist.
03-05-2012, 01:12 PM
Well it just depends on what you use it for and what you expect from it. I use it daily as my main modeling tool. I was hired by a company that uses it and I supply them with models that they rig and bring into a game engine. There are absolutely no hitches in that precess and Blender has some very nice constraint tools.

It is something you can only evaluate on a project by project basis. But I don't see it in its current state as being adapted by a lot of large studios with heavy demands. It has some limitations to be sure.

For instance I will not be using it for my personal animation production which I started using it for a few years ago. I kind of grew out of it. I think it is almost there. In fact if the rendering was better and more fully developed it would be a strong contender in its current state.

It is just not something you can answer in a blanket way one way or the other. It is however a very well rounded app with some fairly advanced features. You just have to evaluate how far advanced each feature is based on what you need it for. And that takes cracking it open and taking a look.

So I use it professionally, it pays my bills. I am not alone in that.

Also watch the current Blender Foundation film project and the releases that come out of that as they get closer. They really need a rendering solution that will give them realistic renders to match CG with live action. And that is why they are developing cycles. Will be interesting to see how far that gets before production rendering starts. Right now it is a little slow, but then so is Maxwell. And that is the sort of direction they are headed. If they pull it off, this will take Blender to another level.

bazsa73
03-05-2012, 01:21 PM
I see. Well the thing is that at the present I use LW as the Main App, ZBrush for zbrushing and Maya when I get stuck. I tried Blender's fluid system and a shattered glass explosion which kind of worked but rendering was slow so I slowly estranged from Blender as I haven not really used it since. But from time to time I'm amazed what blenderpeople are doing with it so I'm naturally curious.

Surrealist.
03-05-2012, 01:39 PM
Blender can not compete with that lineup in my opinion. Sculpting no where near Z brush. Rendering can not touch LightWave - or Mental Ray for that matter. And if you use Maya there would be little reason to turn to Blender unless you are one of those people who for whatever reason hate Maya and find Blender refreshing. But Blender is a step down from Maya. A long step down.

But maybe you can find some things in Blender you find quicker. Modeling would be one thing I'll put above LightWave in many ways. Worth it for that alone. For me it is much quicker and more capable especially in the areas that Modeler lacks. UV mapping is also much better. New tools fore that recently as well.

akademus
03-06-2012, 01:52 AM
A question from a dumb one. How do you activate Bsurfaces lite addon in Blender? Is there a documentation or something on Bsurfaces.

bazsa73
03-06-2012, 02:05 AM
And if you use Maya there would be little reason to turn to Blender unless you are one of those people who for whatever reason hate Maya and find Blender refreshing. But Blender is a step down from Maya. A long step down.


It's not Maya I hate, but its pricing :)

vector
03-06-2012, 02:20 AM
For those who canīt afford Maya price (like me) not a bad solution...

Vector

Surrealist.
03-06-2012, 10:51 AM
A question from a dumb one. How do you activate Bsurfaces lite addon in Blender? Is there a documentation or something on Bsurfaces.

http://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Doc:2.6/Manual/Extensions/Python/Add-Ons

http://www.bsurfaces.info/

Surrealist.
03-06-2012, 10:56 AM
For those who canīt afford Maya price (like me) not a bad solution...

Vector


Yeah, Like I said, it depends on a user by user project by project basis.

Blender has some nice Character Animation tools. That and the modeling make it a great addition to a tool set.

But if you are looking for the full features of Maya you won't find it. If you can not afford Maya but still want the features, you're out of luck. But you can get a lot done with Blender. It won't replace Maya, but it will give you a well rounded toolset if you take the time to learn it. If you are willing to live with some limitations then it is a great app.

safetyman
03-07-2012, 05:23 AM
What really "sells" Blender are the open movie projects (Big Buck Bunny, Sintel, etc.) If you haven't seen those -- they really show off what Blender can do with CA. They've recently added motion/camera tracking, a GPU-assisted real-time renderer, improved UV tools, and more. I sound like a fan-boy, but sometimes when I use it, I can't believe it's free.

Tonttu
05-01-2012, 08:41 AM
It has now been liberated: http://www.mediafire.com/?3ji4rsj4p071ked

paulhart
05-01-2012, 04:51 PM
Please follow the authors link for the download (http://www.bsurfaces.info), look at the video, and donate!! Just a good practice for the Open Source community. My "rule" if I use it I try to donate something.
Paul

rcallicotte
05-02-2012, 07:18 AM
Good idea. But, now it's part of Blender.


Please follow the authors link for the download (http://www.bsurfaces.info), look at the video, and donate!! Just a good practice for the Open Source community. My "rule" if I use it I try to donate something.
Paul

Tonttu
05-02-2012, 09:43 AM
But, now it's part of Blender.

What do you mean? It's a Blender plugin that was GPL'd because enough people bought it. It can't be part of the current Blender release, because it was liberated after 2.63 came out.

DrStrik9
05-02-2012, 12:35 PM
It sure looks COOL.

probiner
05-07-2012, 11:38 AM
This is a nice kickstart for the 1.5 version that as now been released with GPL.

http://www.blendtuts.com/bsurfaces_review

http://www.bsurfaces.info/

Ernest
05-08-2012, 10:08 PM
This is a nice kickstart for the 1.5 version that as now been released with GPL.

http://www.blendtuts.com/bsurfaces_review

http://www.bsurfaces.info/

Looking at that tutorial, I have a very heartfelt gratitude for the LW dev team.

In Modeler you never (ever) (anywhere) have to create a dummy piece of geometry just so that you can switch to a different mode and delete the dummy geometry while you work, until you have to edit something and then, to return to where you were, you have to create another dummy piece of geometry, switch modes, delete it, and repeat.

Thank you! That is awesome!
I LOVE that about Modeler! and trying to follow that tutorial only made me appreciate it more.

Looking at that tutorial, I also have a very heartfelt request for the LW dev team.

In Layout, you sometimes have to create a null in order to carry out modeling tasks that don't (themselves) require nulls.

While it is nowhere near as skullfracturingly frustrating as the greasepencil maneuver (especially because it's an animation environment), I still beg you to not have something like that if you unify modeler and layout. Try using grease pencil in Blender and see just how how tartarically horrendous that can get after a while.

Other than that, bsurfaces is awesome... though I'd rather use it with LW-like splines than greasepencil overdense splines.

jeric_synergy
05-08-2012, 11:09 PM
In Layout, you sometimes have to create a null in order to carry out modeling tasks that don't (themselves) require nulls.

?? When?

Sensei
05-08-2012, 11:14 PM
In Layout, you sometimes have to create a null in order to carry out modeling tasks that don't (themselves) require nulls.

These native modeling commands are thinking they're run in Modeler, where you don't need to have object prior work.

In Core SDK the first step of modeling tool was to create null item, if scene was empty.

LW doesn't know what modeling tool will be doing- whether it'll be generating new geometry, or whether it'll be modifying existing geometry. So user has to make null first, modeling tool can't do that because it's Modeler tool, where is no items at all.

Sensei
05-08-2012, 11:15 PM
?? When?

Any generating geometry in Layout..

jeric_synergy
05-08-2012, 11:58 PM
Any generating geometry in Layout..

Oh, I never have used those. Everybody bad-mouthed 'em so much, I didn't bother.

safetyman
05-09-2012, 05:32 AM
Looking at that tutorial, I have a very heartfelt gratitude for the LW dev team.

In Modeler you never (ever) (anywhere) have to create a dummy piece of geometry just so that you can switch to a different mode and delete the dummy geometry while you work, until you have to edit something and then, to return to where you were, you have to create another dummy piece of geometry, switch modes, delete it, and repeat.

Thank you! That is awesome!
I LOVE that about Modeler! and trying to follow that tutorial only made me appreciate it more.

Looking at that tutorial, I also have a very heartfelt request for the LW dev team.

In Layout, you sometimes have to create a null in order to carry out modeling tasks that don't (themselves) require nulls.

While it is nowhere near as skullfracturingly frustrating as the greasepencil maneuver (especially because it's an animation environment), I still beg you to not have something like that if you unify modeler and layout. Try using grease pencil in Blender and see just how how tartarically horrendous that can get after a while.

Other than that, bsurfaces is awesome... though I'd rather use it with LW-like splines than greasepencil overdense splines.

Not sure what you mean by "...dummy piece of geometry, switch modes, delete it, and repeat". Blender allows you to create separate "layers" if you will, of different "objects", all within the same working layer. Reminds me of working in Illustrator with its isolation mode -- working on one object without necessarily affecting the others. You can select between them easily, even use them as snapping objects without them getting altered accidently. As for the grease pencil -- it works with its own layer system. If it gets in your way, simply hide or delete the grease pencil layer. Works great as a guide to map out a polyflow for characters.

Blender has its annoyances, but what software doesn't. Name another piece of 3D software that is updated as frequently for free. It won't replace LW for me any time soon, but when companies are tightening their budgets more and more, Blender is fast becoming a viable alternative.

Lewis
05-09-2012, 05:54 AM
Looking at that tutorial, I have a very heartfelt gratitude for the LW dev team.

In Modeler you never (ever) (anywhere) have to create a dummy piece of geometry just so that you can switch to a different mode and delete the dummy geometry while you work, until you have to edit something and then, to return to where you were, you have to create another dummy piece of geometry, switch modes, delete it, and repeat.
.

Well that depends on how you look at it. For instance in Modeler you can't edge bevel or round at open edges (it'll break/screw model) so to do that you have to make dummy geometry (polys) and then do command and then delete excessive geometry = tiresome and long process of somethign what shuld be second to none operation. So yeah i guess it just depends how do you classify "dummy geometry" :D.

Sensei
05-09-2012, 05:59 AM
Rounding open edge is like boolean operation without having second object ;)

Lewis
05-09-2012, 06:05 AM
Rounding open edge is like boolean operation without having second object ;)

Works fine in MAX, Maya, modo, Core.... so it's LWM only issue so NO your comparison is not good, actually it's pretty lame 'coz this is LWM bug reported 5+ years ago and still dragging around.

P.S. It does similar in certain situations with Ege Bevel on pols (which is crazy enough by itself as to be able even to start it on polys ;)), Destroys and cracks complete mesh (also reported) :).

Sensei
05-09-2012, 06:19 AM
Mine point is that open edge can't be rounded. Such edge should be ignored.

Destroying mesh if it happens is completely different story. Author of tool probably never thought somebody will try using his tool with something that it can't be used, thus didn't make any security checks nor tested tool in such unusual circumstance.

Maybe they don't have original source code of Rounder, so can't fix it without rewriting it from scratch. Who knows.

Sensei
05-09-2012, 06:31 AM
I am trying to use Rounder with open edge, but it's just showing error message that I should immediately save object, because Modeler might be unstable.. :D

Lewis
05-09-2012, 06:37 AM
Mine point is that open edge can't be rounded. Such edge should be ignored.


I guess you didn't understand what I wanted to say (or i didn't express it in detail 'coz i though it's common knowledge in LWM by now :))). You can edge bevel edge just fine unless one (usually last or first) point of edge is at open side/edge. Then Edge Bevel (that's native) screws that last part and twists point/edge or don't even bevel it sometime. So you have to Extend that open side/edge and reselect why you need and do it again so that you can delete "junk geometry" later - workaround but only way to make it :(.



Destroying mesh if it happens is completely different story. Author of tool probably never thought somebody will try using his tool with something that it can't be used, thus didn't make any security checks nor tested tool in such unusual circumstance.

I agree we shouldn't use tools in specific tasks but then again there it comes CONTEXT sensitive stuff which is DEVs responsibility or even better why do we have several Bevel tools instead one which does Points/Edges/Polys :D.



Maybe they don't have original source code of Rounder, so can't fix it without rewriting it from scratch. Who knows.

True (and they probably don't) but then again it does same error on native EdgeBevel so i guess it's problem with Edges then or tools don't understand them as edges and that should be fixed long ago.

check this BUG (attached video and mesh), that's reported long ago on BugBot system (which was active before Fogbugz) and on Fugbugz it's since March/2007 and still same in LW11 :).

BTW Yeah Rounder gives a "funny warning message" that i might crash but doesn't do anything, at least modeler "survives" that operation 9/10 times :) :).

Sensei
05-09-2012, 06:40 AM
I played a bit with Rounder and Edge Bevel tools right now. And I think they were made in times there was not yet edge support in LW v9.0 and they're doing their stuff interpreting selected point pairs as edges.

So if you select polygon and then use Edge Bevel, it's exactly the same effect as selecting all polygon's points and using Edge Bevel tool.

Lewis
05-09-2012, 06:49 AM
I played a bit with Rounder and Edge Bevel tools right now. And I think they were made in times there was not yet edge support in LW v9.0 and they're doing their stuff interpreting selected point pairs as edges.

So if you select polygon and then use Edge Bevel, it's exactly the same effect as selecting all polygon's points and using Edge Bevel tool.

Yes i know about rounder - Rounder was included in LW 8.0 and Edges were added at 9.0 but not sure about "EDGE Bevel" wasn't added before 9.0 when Edges were introduced ? Or ? Why would we need "edge bevel" before we had edges :D? Also since normal "Bevel" don't work on edges or points I guess Edge bevel is newer i.e. from 9.x era when Edges were introduced :).

But when i said many time sin past that Edges in LWM are hack/unfinished implementation, etc.. there is certain LWavers who said they aren't, then it's a BUG, problem, workflow issue whatever but it doesn't work :):).

Sensei
05-09-2012, 07:12 AM
Legacy tool, which is not using LW v9.0 SDK API with edge support, has to scan all polygons, then search for selected point(s) in currently scanned polygon.

If it finds polygon which has one point selected and the rest not selected, then it knows it's "tail" or "head", and quad is divided into 5-gon and triangle. If 2 points in pair are selected in quad - polygon is split in half, to 2 quads.

Procedure is working with just scanned polygon. Doesn't know about the rest of selected points. They will be processed later, when scanning routine will reach them.

That's old school modeling tool. Prior LW v9.0 edge support, I had to work this way too..

Lewis
05-09-2012, 07:17 AM
Legacy tool, which is not using LW v9.0 SDK API with edge support, has to scan all polygons, then search for selected point(s) in currently scanned polygon

Heheh then it's even worse, having edges but no tools to work with edges sounds even more bad :D. But point is that LWM also has to work with temp/dummy geometry to use some tools, regardless of who made it this way and when/why it's a fact :D.

Let's hope NT will find some time (and will) to fix that in next iteration of LW :).

cheers

jeric_synergy
05-09-2012, 08:18 AM
Author of tool probably never thought somebody will try using his tool with something that it can't be used, thus didn't make any security checks nor tested tool in such unusual circumstance.
That whole "I never thought it'd get used that way" is a very weak programming stance. Tools always get used every which way. It's equivalent to "I never thought a zero would get in there and crash the application". That just means someone didn't THINK hard enough. Feh.

Lewis, what do the applications you approve of do in the case you are citing?

Lewis
05-09-2012, 08:25 AM
Lewis, what do the applications you approve of do in the case you are citing?

Bevel edge all the way and not stop on last point or break mesh with adding some nasty glitches. I'll make video when i get home.

jeric_synergy
05-09-2012, 08:44 AM
I'll make video when i get home.
Pictures will definitely help this discussion.

Lewis
05-09-2012, 10:50 AM
Ok here is quick demonstration video
www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/temp/LW/Bevels_bad.mp4.mov

and attached mesh for testing :)

cheers

probiner
05-09-2012, 11:40 AM
Other than that, bsurfaces is awesome... though I'd rather use it with LW-like splines than greasepencil overdense splines.

You're crazy :p Grease pencil is limited but it's great and much, much, better than our LW Sketch Tool in Modeler.

You can use it to make a annotations in a scene: Skip to 17m20s on this video (http://vimeo.com/8921999) . How cool is that?

Also you can see in the dev video (http://vimeo.com/26339130) at 20m30s, that he uses a lot of beziers and yes I would probably use these over raw grease pencil for precise modeling too. But(!)... Grease is made of dense Bezier Splines: Skip to 18m00s of that video to see grease pencil making 2 vertices. Notice then in the panel (n shortkey) he ticks the "Handles" in Curve Display... voilá... editable Beziers. How cool is that?
Plus Blender 2.6 comes with a addon called curve simplify (http://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Extensions:2.6/Py/Scripts/Curve/Curve_Simplify) so you can tone down that density.
So it mixes, speed and precision, it's your pick.
As for dummy geometry, it's always a bit annoying. LW doesn't have the monopoly of workarounds you know? :D
The undos of the pencil are not great either.

All this bling bling is making me consider to use blender for some modeling task instead of LW, but sucks to keep jumping back and forward.
I guess the only thing it would make it even cooler would be to have also the modifer path, where you would be able to animate the bezier curves and the mesh would change.



Cheers

jeric_synergy
05-09-2012, 03:57 PM
Ok here is quick demonstration video
www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/temp/LW/Bevels_bad.mp4.mov

and attached mesh for testing :)

cheers
That makes your concerns much clearer.

Was that 2nd example Blender?

probiner
05-09-2012, 04:47 PM
Ok here is quick demonstration video
www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/temp/LW/Bevels_bad.mp4.mov

and attached mesh for testing :)

cheers

Yes... =/

Strangly enough, WedgeBevel (http://www.lwplugindb.com/Plugin.aspx?id=bde48208) (the Lscript Version) does it without errors (although if you cancel the operation you get junk geometry). While the plugin version, found in DTools (http://www.lwplugindb.com/Plugin.aspx?id=18878981), presents some errors.

Hopefuly in the future LW will solve this like "the other package" ;)

Ernest
05-09-2012, 06:08 PM
Not sure what you mean by "...dummy piece of geometry, switch modes, delete it, and repeat".

I mean that, according to the tutorial, if you want to use grease pencil, you have to be in edit mode. But you can't go into edit mode without selected geometry. So you have to create an object that you don't need, select it, go to edit mode and delete the object and you remain in edit mode and can start penciling. That's not too bad so far. It is kind of useless, since we can remain in edit mode without the geometry and that implies that you don't really need geometry in that mode, but I wouldn't complain about that.

So you start using grease pencil to create bsurface guides and need to edit your guides. No problem, you switch to guide editing mode and happily modify them.

Now comes the part that I have a problem with. In order to continue using bsurfaces, or creating more grease pencil guides, you have to get back into edit mode. So you have to create another object, select it, switch to edit mode, and delete the object.

I tried making a quick cuckoo clock to test this and it seemed that greasing guides around and them proportional modeling them into a fine tuned shape would be a great workflow IF it wasn't for that super-useless object creating and selecting and deleting which simply murders the workflow dead.

If the powerful bsurface tools were added to LW, I'd expect to press 1 key to start drawing grease guides, then press 1 key and already have the proportional modeling tool selected and ready to move the guides around, 1 key and I could grease new guides. That's the general LW modeling workflow that I'd prefer that they keep, if they can (which ties to the next point).


Blender has its annoyances, but what software doesn't. Name another piece of 3D software that is updated as frequently for free. It won't replace LW for me any time soon, but when companies are tightening their budgets more and more, Blender is fast becoming a viable alternative.

This particular annoyance is not present in LW, but it seems very possible that it could be introduced into LW when modeler and layout get unified. The null object thing thing in Layout that Sensei so eloquently explained is the reason why I feared that this problem could be introduced into LW. I wanted to make sure the LW devs realize how massively important this issue is (since the Blender devs, amazing as they are, did not realize it).

I wasn't really writing about problems with Blender or with bsurface. I was writing about a specific problem that I don't want to get into LW.


You're crazy :p Grease pencil is limited but it's great and much, much, better than our LW Sketch Tool in Modeler.

Oh, yes I am, absolutely; but not because I don't appreciate grease pencil. If I don't love a feature, its bugs do not bother me at all in the slightest. Much less would I let it frustrate me. It frustrates me so much because I can see that using grease pencil and bsurfaces would/could be life changing IF not for the architectural roadblocks... It's like building the autobahn and adding a pothole every 2 miles.


Well that depends on how you look at it. For instance in Modeler you can't edge bevel or round at open edges I can :hey: (of course not with rounder), but the fact that plugins can means that LW can and I have no problem with that.

probiner
05-09-2012, 06:26 PM
Oh, yes I am, absolutely; but not because I don't appreciate grease pencil. If I don't love a feature, its bugs do not bother me at all in the slightest. Much less would I let it frustrate me. It frustrates me so much because I can see that using grease pencil and bsurfaces would/could be life changing IF not for the architectural roadblocks... It's like building the autobahn and adding a pothole every 2 miles.

Please explain this... I don't understand... You can use grease pencil (Sketch or Pen), you can edit the pencil's beziers or do them from scratch like you would do with splines in LW.

What bugs? What roadblocks? Why is not fluid for you and how it should be?

Sorry Ernest I don't understand. I'm not that Blender savy, so I might be missing something you assume I know.

Cheers

Ernest
05-09-2012, 07:18 PM
Please explain this... I don't understand... You can use grease pencil (Sketch or Pen), you can edit the pencil's beziers or do them from scratch like you would do with splines in LW.

What bugs? What roadblocks? Why is not fluid for you and how it should be?

Sorry Ernest I don't understand. I'm not that Blender savy, so I might be missing something you assume I know.

Cheers
The whole "having to create an object, select it, switch modes, and delete it, every time you have to switch between editing the guides, and either adding more guides or bsurfacing them" thing in the bsurfaces tutorial.

probiner
05-09-2012, 07:53 PM
I agree it's a faff, I don't agree it's a show stopper. In LW you also need several layers to keep your splines and what not. Sure, you can easily swap from one another (if they are in the same 10 layer lane), I'll give you that, and that will probably be a downside of unification for LW.

The actual developer video is better I think. I just posted that one because it's more beginner friendly.

jeric_synergy
05-09-2012, 11:58 PM
I'm no Blender wizard or even user, but why not just leave the dummy geometry there until clean up?

Lewis
05-10-2012, 12:34 AM
Was that 2nd example Blender?

Nope :D.

jeric_synergy
05-10-2012, 12:42 AM
Was that CORE again?

Lewis
05-10-2012, 12:51 AM
Was that CORE again?

http://emoticoner.com/files/emoticons/smileys/no-comment-smiley.gif (http://emoticoner.com)
http://emoticoner.com/files/emoticons/skype_smileys/lipssealed-skype-smiley.gif (http://emoticoner.com)
:D

Lewis
05-10-2012, 12:54 AM
I can :hey: (of course not with rounder), but the fact that plugins can means that LW can and I have no problem with that.

Which plugins you are referring to exactly ? Are they freeware? can you make video ?

thanks

Tartiflette
05-10-2012, 03:40 AM
http://emoticoner.com/files/emoticons/smileys/no-comment-smiley.gif (http://emoticoner.com)
http://emoticoner.com/files/emoticons/skype_smileys/lipssealed-skype-smiley.gif (http://emoticoner.com)
:D
As Lewis is really shy, i will just say for him that it's... modo of course ! :D
Easy to recognize the GIU here ! ;)


Cheers,
Laurent aka Tartiflette :)

safetyman
05-10-2012, 05:19 AM
The whole "having to create an object, select it, switch modes, and delete it, every time you have to switch between editing the guides, and either adding more guides or bsurfacing them" thing in the bsurfaces tutorial.

I guess you just have to weigh the minor annoyance (IMO) of having to create a dummy object with the power of the BSurfaces tool itself. And if all you are doing is retopo, there's no dummy object involved at all, unless you count the high res mesh as a dummy. What bothers me more than anything is the grease pencil lines disappearing occasionally as I'm drawing them -- but that could be user error.

If I'm not mistaken, the grease pencil's original intent was for help-type purposes (writing notes to yourself or other artists working on the same project, making "guides" for modeling, etc.). For it to be used in this way is an added bonus.