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Sarford
02-20-2012, 12:21 AM
I'm trying to render a scene but LW keeps on freezing all the time. No telling when it will do it of course. This scene is particularly freeze-prone. I think it is a lot of times at the freezing of the model. The scene itself isn't very taxing. Do more people have had this problem, and what can we do about it.

The picture looks like LW is just rendering but it was frozen for more then half an hour at that time. The only way to quit LW then is to force-quit. LW almost never crashes to desktop, it just freezes over. I've had this on multiple scenes.

Sarford
02-20-2012, 12:35 AM
and again...

Lewis
02-20-2012, 12:41 AM
Unless you can provide scene it's hard to tell what could be issue. If you can't provide it here at least send it to T so they can fix possible BUG.

Sarford
02-20-2012, 02:32 AM
Where can I send it so I KNOW something is done with it and can track its status, and it doesn't disappear into the flood? Can't find anything like that on the site.

Lewis
02-20-2012, 02:33 AM
Hmm procedure is same for years (send a fogbugz report) and it's STICKY ;).

http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?t=73226

Sarford
02-20-2012, 02:50 AM
Hmm, I tried that several times during Core and never heard anything on the bugs I send in, that is why I am a bit hesitant. At E-on software you get assigned a developer who keeps in contact with you during the debugging of your problem and they are really on top of it, barely taking a day to respond each time, I think I was looking more for that kind of system.
Anyhow, I'll try again tonight, I'll report a bug again and see how fast it is resolved.

Thanks Lewis.

Lewis
02-20-2012, 03:01 AM
I always get reply from system that my bug is accepted and very often i get mail that it's reproducible (if it is) and sent to developer for fix. Then next thing is that i get reply from system when it's FIXED/closed i.e. when developer replies to bug it get's updated and sends me e-mail automatically.

also if you keep the bug case link you can check often is it "open" or "closed" i.e. still in work or fixed.

lertola2
02-20-2012, 07:09 AM
and again...

I am guessing that you are running into some kind of memory limitation. You have almost 6 million polygons. How much memory do you have in your computer?

I was doing some testing yesterday on a large subpatch object. When I had render subpatch level set to 100 I had 51 million polygons and Lightwave locked up when displaying Displacement Nodal at 90% just like you. Same thing at a setting of 75. At a setting of 50 there were 18 million polygons and the scene did render. I have 14 megs of memory in my computer.

-Joe

Phil
02-20-2012, 07:29 AM
At a setting of 50 there were 18 million polygons and the scene did render. I have 14 megs of memory in my computer.

-Joe

18 million polys in 14 MB? NT have really worked miracles ;) :D

Sarford
02-20-2012, 07:58 AM
I am guessing that you are running into some kind of memory limitation. You have almost 6 million polygons. How much memory do you have in your computer?


I have 8GB in my machine. I don't know about LW but XSI has no problem at all with this scene (where it originally comes from).
The reason I use LW if so I can render on multiple machines at the same time since I only have one (old) licence of XSI.

Dexter2999
02-20-2012, 09:04 AM
I'd be interested in your answer to the question, "What is your subpatch level?"

Just because XSI handles a massive number on your system doesn't mean LW will do as well.

mummyman
02-20-2012, 09:08 AM
Wish I had LW 11 to help test it. can you replicate it in 10.1?

Hard to say without the scene file to mess with and try to debug

lertola2
02-20-2012, 01:45 PM
I have been doing a little more testing with a computer at work that has 36 gb of memory. That computer can render a subpatch object that subdivides into 51 million polygons. I am running another test where I set the subdivision level to 200. I can't tell if it is locked up or not but it has been showing the Mesh freezing progress bar at 100% for the last four hours. I am going to let it go overnight but I don't think it will work.

This does make me think that it is ram that is the limiting factor in the number of polygons that can be rendered. Perhaps you could try adding more memory to your computer. Last week I was able to add 14 gbs to a pc at the office for less than $110. I got the memory from http://www.datamemorysystems.com/.

lertola2
02-20-2012, 01:49 PM
Wish I had LW 11 to help test it. can you replicate it in 10.1?

Hard to say without the scene file to mess with and try to debug

You can have LW11 for a month for free. Just download the trial version.

3D Kiwi
02-20-2012, 02:04 PM
XSI is far better than lw with memory and large scenes. You may need to look at splitting your scene into passes to get it out of LW

Sarford
02-20-2012, 11:53 PM
I'd be interested in your answer to the question, "What is your subpatch level?"

Just because XSI handles a massive number on your system doesn't mean LW will do as well.

My subpatch level is the standard 3 except for 1 object which is 4.
Come on guys, it is 2012, not 1990. 6 Mill polygons isn't that much, if 64 bit LW can't handle even that much with 8 GB...

mummyman
02-21-2012, 07:13 AM
XSI is far better than lw with memory and large scenes. You may need to look at splitting your scene into passes to get it out of LW


Really?? I have nothing but XSI issues with large scenes. Although, we do use a workgroup / network, which kinda bogs things down. I always have to use LW because of the fast-ness. XSI seems to "hang" which to me seems way longer. Forget about displacements in XSI. Need to see them live, like in LW.

3dworks
02-21-2012, 08:46 AM
I'm trying to render a scene but LW keeps on freezing all the time. No telling when it will do it of course. This scene is particularly freeze-prone. I think it is a lot of times at the freezing of the model. The scene itself isn't very taxing. Do more people have had this problem, and what can we do about it.

The picture looks like LW is just rendering but it was frozen for more then half an hour at that time. The only way to quit LW then is to force-quit. LW almost never crashes to desktop, it just freezes over. I've had this on multiple scenes.

memory should't be an issue with that scene. -> you are using LW in 64 bit mode on your mac, right? <-

working on different scenes with around 43 million polys (no subdivision surfaces, no displacements) here for some weeks with LW11 beta and now with the release version. i experience a heavy slowdown of opengl in full textured mode, but no memory issues. the mac pro has 24G of RAM, but layout is using just about 13G. the graphics card is an older nvidia gtx285 mac edition. i'm rendering with maxwell and the scene is setup with heavy instancing which adds to the complexity. will try to setup again the same scene with native LW11 instancing and try to render natively after i've finished with the work for my clients.

Sarford
02-21-2012, 09:08 AM
Yeah, this hardly can be a memory problem. What I had forgotten to mention is that I made a clay render of this same scene with the same displacements and the same displacement maps and that didn't give any issues.

Though I have had several freezes of scenes with rendering in LW11, but none of them as repeatable as this one. I've send in a bug report though, hope they can find the problem.

I'll try to render it at my work tonight, see if that makes a difference. We have HP Z600 workstations here, with 12 GB so if it was a memory problem it should be solved then.

-FP-
02-21-2012, 09:14 AM
I'm encountering a freeze with every click on CONTINUE or ABORT after any render.
Lightwave locks up cold for up to 28 seconds.
The scene specifics don't matter. Even rendering an empty scene produces the same result.
After the program unfreezes, everything proceeds normally.
Lightwave 11 trial, XP Pro, SP3, 32-bit.

3D Kiwi
02-21-2012, 01:37 PM
Really?? I have nothing but XSI issues with large scenes. Although, we do use a workgroup / network, which kinda bogs things down. I always have to use LW because of the fast-ness. XSI seems to "hang" which to me seems way longer. Forget about displacements in XSI. Need to see them live, like in LW.

Its funny you say that. Main reason we moved to xsi is because of issues with large scenes. Had a scene in LW that wouldnt render due to running out of ram. Was going to have to break it down into a huge amount of passes. So send the scene to xsi with PO and XSI rendered it with no issues what so ever. Seeing displacements in xsi like in lightwave can be done with a simple ICE setup. What kind of hangs do you get? I have always found xsi to handle huge scenes better, Not just in rendering but general navagation, modeling etc. Were on a networked workgroup and it really only seam to slow the startup of the app down.

Sarford
02-22-2012, 01:52 AM
Well, it seemed to have rendered properly. Not like that is saying much cause on my mac it did render 73 frames before it froze.
One thing I noticed though, not related to the freeze, is that I get proper depth passes on the PC. I might look into that tonight.

Dexter2999
02-22-2012, 01:56 AM
I almost asked about the frames. I didn't know if you were starting on frame 73 or finishing that many frames before choking. Because that might have signaled a memory leak.

bobakabob
02-26-2012, 11:53 AM
Sure you know this but... Were the frames displaying in the image viewer after rendering as that can eat ram and freeze your system? With ram intensive scenes, good idea to turn everything into bounding boxes, save then boot up computer and load for render.

Sarford
02-27-2012, 03:55 PM
Sure you know this but... Were the frames displaying in the image viewer after rendering as that can eat ram and freeze your system? With ram intensive scenes, good idea to turn everything into bounding boxes, save then boot up computer and load for render.

Thanks for the heads up Bob, but no, the image viewer was off.

I'm working with CS now to get this thing resolved. So far it seems to be a Mac-only problem. Both because the is another bug-report with the same problem, and because I've rendered this scene on different Macs and different PC's and all the Mac's freeze and all the PC's have no problem.

jasonwestmas
02-27-2012, 07:01 PM
Hmm, I tried that several times during Core and never heard anything on the bugs I send in, that is why I am a bit hesitant. At E-on software you get assigned a developer who keeps in contact with you during the debugging of your problem and they are really on top of it, barely taking a day to respond each time, I think I was looking more for that kind of system.
Anyhow, I'll try again tonight, I'll report a bug again and see how fast it is resolved.

Thanks Lewis.

I hear right back most of the time. Just fog it and someone will most likely tell you what is up.

Dodgy
02-27-2012, 08:54 PM
Do you have FFX in the scene?

3dworks
02-28-2012, 03:55 AM
did you watch memory usage during the rendering? how is it looking? you van use activity monitor or http://www.ragingmenace.com/software/menumeters/ to do so. this way at least you get a clue if it is memory related or not. the other obvious part to check is the console, look for the latest layout crash/hang/freeze.