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prometheus
02-09-2012, 09:35 AM
Well..I am not that profound with daz exports, but since dazstudio4pro now is free, you might be missing out on a good human figure software to use with lightwave, the most common export option is probably obj and fbx format, object format works quite decently, you get instant correct scale and texture and uv maps, but they all end up in diffuse channel not color channel.

the fbx format is worked on quite a lot from newtek, but is probably aimed to work as flawless it can with for instance maya.

Now the fbx format doesnīt seem to be 100% there to get instant perfect results yet in lightwave.

I want all you skilled experienced guys who knows how to export the best way out to lightwave from daz studio.

I might be able to write my findings but Im sure many others have gotten much further on this.
So I urge you all to put your "pipeline tips" here in this thread.


Michael

Kionel
02-09-2012, 12:08 PM
Since I just picked up the free copy of DAZ Studio Pro for my own personal project, this thread is very relevant to my interests.

I've already asked the following question both on the DAZ forums, and in another thread here. It is as follows:

"I've been unsuccessfully exporting a mesh with the rig via FBX to LightWave.

Steps I've followed.

1. Loaded up Genesis mesh in DS4P
2. Selected "File | Export..."
3. Saved the file out as .FBX, with the option "FBX2012 -- Binary"
4. Checked all but "Lights", "Camera", and "Merge Diffuse and Opacity Textures".
5. Select "Accept"
6. Allow .FBX file to export.
7. Open .FBX file in LightWave 10.1 with "Load Object..."
8. The mesh imports with no bones and no poses.

What works:


Textures transfer fine
Mesh comes in fine
Morphs transfer fine


What doesn't work:


No rig
No poses


I'm running OS X Snow Leopard, LW 10.1 for import, and DAZ Studio Pro 64 bit. The FBX exporter is not a plugin, but comes as part of the DS4P package.

At this point I'm stumped. I know from the "Miri" footage that it can be done, but I'm not seeing how.

Any help would be appreciated. "

That pretty much sums it up.

For what it's worth, I'm really pleased with how well the textures get transferred into LW. That's a win. Now to figure out what else is wrong...

Tony

prometheus
02-09-2012, 12:18 PM
Since I just picked up the free copy of DAZ Studio Pro for my own personal project, this thread is very relevant to my interests.

I've already asked the following question both on the DAZ forums, and in another thread here. It is as follows:

"I've been unsuccessfully exporting a mesh with the rig via FBX to LightWave.

Steps I've followed.

1. Loaded up Genesis mesh in DS4P
2. Selected "File | Export..."
3. Saved the file out as .FBX, with the option "FBX2012 -- Binary"
4. Checked all but "Lights", "Camera", and "Merge Diffuse and Opacity Textures".
5. Select "Accept"
6. Allow .FBX file to export.
7. Open .FBX file in LightWave 10.1 with "Load Object..."
8. The mesh imports with no bones and no poses.

What works:


Textures transfer fine
Mesh comes in fine
Morphs transfer fine


What doesn't work:


No rig
No poses


I'm running OS X Snow Leopard, LW 10.1 for import, and DAZ Studio Pro 64 bit. The FBX exporter is not a plugin, but comes as part of the DS4P package.

At this point I'm stumped. I know from the "Miri" footage that it can be done, but I'm not seeing how.

Any help would be appreciated. "

That pretty much sums it up.

For what it's worth, I'm really pleased with how well the textures get transferred into LW. That's a win. Now to figure out what else is wrong...

Tony

aha...so do you get the textures correct?
I use lightwave 11 prebuild here so , I get rig and pose correctly, using fbx
2012 binary, usually you need to scale import to 1 when importing.
however the bones looks weird in display alignment but seem to be correct anyway.

maybe you should try older fbx.

for textures..well they are all there, and in color channel as opposed to obj format wich only puts it in the diffuse channel.
but with fbx import to lightwave 11 in the color channel the uv map is set to a default surface, not the the uv model surface..so I have to go through each surface and switch to that in layout.

other than that..thereīs no transparency map there for eyelashes etc, wich is correct if you use obj format.

See image.

Michael

Kionel
02-09-2012, 12:57 PM
aha...so do you get the textures correct?


More-or-less. Transparency is an issue, as always, but it's easily fixed. Also, surface smoothing needs to be implemented, as the object come in faceted. Beyond that, works like a charm.

Question: When you load the .FBX, do you load it as an Object ("+" on the keyboard) or do you load it as a scene?



I use lightwave 11 prebuild here so , I get rig and pose correctly, using fbx
2012 binary,


I'll try with my LW 11 pre-build when I get back to the home studio.



maybe you should try older fbx.


I've actually tried older FBX export options (all the way back to 2009) with no luck. I also had it confirmed that the old DS3 FBX plugin is not compatible with DS4P, so that's out of the question.



but with fbx import to lightwave 11 in the color channel the uv map is set to a default surface, not the the uv model surface..so I have to go through each surface and switch to that in layout.


Having gone through that personal hell numerous times using the Poser Pro plugin last year, I'm okay with doing it once, if I end up with a figure I can pose in LW as needed. (Of course, I'll still have to create numerous endomorphs for expressions using "Background to Morph" in Modeler, but that's both another issue, and not really that much of a pain.)

Right now I'm hoping the issue is as simple as my opening up the FBX as an object and not a scene file. Anxious to find out.

Tony

prometheus
02-09-2012, 01:04 PM
More-or-less. Transparency is an issue, as always, but it's easily fixed. Also, surface smoothing needs to be implemented, as the object come in faceted. Beyond that, works like a charm.

Question: When you load the .FBX, do you load it as an Object ("+" on the keyboard) or do you load it as a scene?



I'll try with my LW 11 pre-build when I get back to the home studio.



I've actually tried older FBX export options (all the way back to 2009) with no luck. I also had it confirmed that the old DS3 FBX plugin is not compatible with DS4P, so that's out of the question.



Having gone through that personal hell numerous times using the Poser Pro plugin last year, I'm okay with doing it once, if I end up with a figure I can pose in LW as needed. (Of course, I'll still have to create numerous endomorphs for expressions using "Background to Morph" in Modeler, but that's both another issue, and not really that much of a pain.)

Right now I'm hoping the issue is as simple as my opening up the FBX as an object and not a scene file. Anxious to find out.

Tony

well I have no smoothing errors here..it looks good and they are activated.
Yes I do load in as scene in lw 11.

These are the issues I have now and would like to get some good solution on...

- I need to get a fix for setting uv map for the surface all at once..maybe this could be set in daz, to get rid of default surface?.
- I need to get a fix for transparency channel
- are the bones really suppose to look like that?

- Havent figured out a workflow for getting animate export out proper animations that actually moves, or by using bvh files..wich seems like a complete mess.

Kionel
02-09-2012, 01:13 PM
Yes I do load in as scene in lw 11.

Okay, that is very promising. Looking forward to testing that later.



- I need to get a fix for setting uv map for the surface all at once..maybe this could be set in daz, to get rid of default surface?.


I'm curious what will happen when I load my FBX as a scene. I wonder if I'll lose the textures then.

Let you know as soon as I test it out.



- I need to get a fix for transparency channel


The way I've fixed that in the past is to just work with the transparency channel in Surface Editor and use the eyelash image as a clip map. Works like a charm.

Sadly, I have to do that when it comes across, but it's not too big a deal to change for the results we get from the figure.



- are the bones really suppose to look like that?


I'm wondering if we just can't select "d" on the keyboard in Layout and change the bone size appearance to our liking. I'll check it when I get back.



- Havent figured out a workflow for getting animate export out proper animations that actually moves, or by using bvh files..wich seems like a complete mess.

Yeah, that hasn't worked at all for me yet. I've tried to export a basic walk as an .MDD file. All I got was a big blob of goo slithering across the screen in Layout. Not exactly the look I was going for there...

prometheus
02-09-2012, 01:25 PM
Okay, that is very promising. Looking forward to testing that later.



I'm curious what will happen when I load my FBX as a scene. I wonder if I'll lose the textures then.

Let you know as soon as I test it out.



The way I've fixed that in the past is to just work with the transparency channel in Surface Editor and use the eyelash image as a clip map. Works like a charm.

Sadly, I have to do that when it comes across, but it's not too big a deal to change for the results we get from the figure.



I'm wondering if we just can't select "d" on the keyboard in Layout and change the bone size appearance to our liking. I'll check it when I get back.


.
Dont think you should loose any textures.
and yes we can bring up the preferences and change bone icon size, I do not understand why they are displayed with at that z-axis and not following the object, not the display as if you import bvh or create your own rig.

Michael

prometheus
02-09-2012, 01:40 PM
Just tested to save out the rig from the exported fbx, and then I used it on exported obj format instead, and that works good too, but with the object format you do not get the color channels assigned only the diffuse, but the transparency is okey, how typicle that whatīs lacking in one format...works in the other and vice versa.

Bahh..

Michael

prometheus
02-09-2012, 02:02 PM
Another thingy..

Lightwave to daz, testing morph..extremly easy.

once in modeler, do some changes on the body or face..export out to obj format.

in daz import the morph with morph loader pro under edit/figure/morph loader pro...set your scale from lightwave unit 1m...choose morph file and browse to your object file.

and accept..the parameters can then be found to the right side in the daz interface "parameters" morphs.

Michael

Kionel
02-09-2012, 02:05 PM
One other thing: Have you figured out how to reduce the subpatch level to 0 from the Genesis figures? Worst comes to worst, I bring the character across and rig it with Rhiggit Pro. Then at least the bones won't make the character look like a hedgehog...

prometheus
02-09-2012, 02:19 PM
One other thing: Have you figured out how to reduce the subpatch level to 0 from the Genesis figures? Worst comes to worst, I bring the character across and rig it with Rhiggit Pro. Then at least the bones won't make the character look like a hedgehog...

Uhmm..dunno, do you mean this..check image to the right side where you have mesh resolution control.

Michael

dee
02-09-2012, 02:30 PM
I do not understand why they are displayed with at that z-axis and not following the object

Use Joints instead of Bones, that should work also for animations.

To get correct textures in obj files: go to General Options/OBJ tab in Modeler and check OBJ Reverse Ka & Kd. After that you should get correct Textures in Color, Spec and Bump channels. I needed to increase Diffuse because it was below 2%.

Concerning animation import: set up the anim in DAZ, right click above the timeline (next to where the play/pause stuff is located) an click Bake To Studio Keyframes, after the bakink is finnished export a FBX.

Kionel
02-09-2012, 02:33 PM
Uhmm..dunno, do you mean this..check image to the right side where you have mesh resolution control.

Michael

THANK YOU! That's what I've been looking for! :)

prometheus
02-09-2012, 02:35 PM
Use Joints instead of Bones, that should work also for animations.

To get correct textures in obj files: go to General Options/OBJ tab in Modeler and check OBJ Reverse Ka & Kd. After that you should get correct Textures in Color, Spec and Bump channels. I needed to increase Diffuse because it was below 2%.

Concerning animation import: set up the anim in DAZ, right click above the timeline (next to where the play/pause stuff is located) an click Bake To Studio Keyframes, after the bakink is finnished export a FBX.

Thanks...
I think I tested with joints too..but didnt see much improvements thou, gonna check again thou.

Ahh..now I remember you of course have to bake it to studio keyframes, I think I recall that wasnīt an option for the old daz 3 version thou?

Great about the obj export...gonna check that.

Hopefully when we get enough information here in this pipeline thread, I or someone could gather it and make a nice pdf of it.

Thanks dee.

Michael

Kionel
02-09-2012, 06:39 PM
Okay, just confirmed that my problem was loading the FBX as an object. Loaded the file as follows:

1. Selected "File | Load | Load Scene..."
2. Selected FBX
3. Adjusted scale down from 100 to 1.

Bones and textures came across.

Issues:

1. The specularity, reflection, and glossiness settings were completely out-of-whack. Fortunately, it didn't take too long to update.
2. The bones, as mentioned before, are completely off-axis. Nevertheless, they deform the mesh just fine.
3. The eyelash texture didn't come across. Fortunately, I had another copy of it from my FBX model load experiment, and I just placed it into the "Transparency" panel of the eyelash surface (inverted)

It's not perfect, but it's already a damn sight better than the Poser Pro export option IMO. Also, bear in mind that I did not procedural texture work to sweeten the look; this is pure slightly-adjuted imported texture output.

prometheus
02-09-2012, 06:49 PM
Kionel, you could try the tip from dee and see if you get a more complete obj import with textures fully correct, havent had time to test myself thou.

export out the fbx and load in to lightwave, select the main bonestanding, and export the rig...clear the scene load the obj format instead and import rig.

that might do it, as I mentioned I tested that with the fbx rig and obj format.

By the way...a matter of point of view taste, change the backdrop to some grey color gradient, that will bring the skintones forward perhaps.
drop the polyhair, and if you can..add fiber fx quirky as it is thou.

Michael

Kionel
02-10-2012, 06:12 AM
Kionel, you could try the tip from dee and see if you get a more complete obj import with textures fully correct, havent had time to test myself thou.

Yeah, that was next up on my test process.



By the way...a matter of point of view taste, change the backdrop to some grey color gradient, that will bring the skintones forward perhaps.
drop the polyhair, and if you can..add fiber fx quirky as it is thou.


Oh, yeah, the poly hair came across pretty poorly. Nevertheless, she was really a case of "Can I do this?" Coming forward this far is a big step in the right direction.

(Personally, I do find myself thinking "It might just be faster to rig the characters with Rhiggit Pro", though. They REALLY deform well, and surprisingly fast for how heavy they are on screen. Regardless, that's not part of the goal of this thread. An addendum, perhaps, but not that goal.)

prometheus
02-10-2012, 06:27 AM
To get correct textures in obj files: go to General Options/OBJ tab in Modeler and check OBJ Reverse Ka & Kd. After that you should get correct Textures in Color, Spec and Bump channels. I needed to increase Diffuse because it was below 2%.

.

yepp the colors are assigned correctly now, transparancy is correct too, and specularity values are set to 0 for that.
however there are no textures assigned in bump channel.

You say you get diffuse value below 2%? I get 79.5 maybe depends
on what texture used in daz of course, do you get textures assigned in diffuse channel too?

Michael

blondimage
02-10-2012, 07:20 AM
Hi Guys. good thread to pick up on, thanks.

Is it possible to bring across shape deformations as something that can be used in LW with maybe sliders. Endomorphs were mentioned. So basically the shape functionality in Daz is tranfered over to LW.

I'm currently using 10.1 (haven't been able to get hold of the pre-release, not for want of trying..!) Are there any big differences between 10.1 and 11 which are relevant to this process?

Thanks in advance.
Clinton

safetyman
02-10-2012, 07:57 AM
You guys mentioned that the mesh was quite heavy -- did you try and bump the subdivision level down to 0 in Daz? It takes the mesh down to about 19k polys which would be more reasonable I would think. Just a thought.

littlewaves
02-10-2012, 08:17 AM
You guys mentioned that the mesh was quite heavy -- did you try and bump the subdivision level down to 0 in Daz? It takes the mesh down to about 19k polys which would be more reasonable I would think. Just a thought.

way better than previous daz figures which were just getting higher and higher in poly count.

Having said that in Daz 3 there was an option which gave "levels of detail" for the Victoria 4 mesh including a 1K and 2K model which was great but they don't seem to have these options in Daz 4 unless I'm missing something.

dee
02-10-2012, 09:02 AM
yepp the colors are assigned correctly now, transparancy is correct too, and specularity values are set to 0 for that.
however there are no textures assigned in bump channel.

You say you get diffuse value below 2%? I get 79.5 maybe depends
on what texture used in daz of course, do you get textures assigned in diffuse channel too?

Michael

Indeed, it depends on how it's set up in DAZ. With Victoria 5 I have color, spec and bump images, diffuse is at 1.5238, glossiness is 0.0656 and smoothing is off, so I need to fix this things after import.

This is how it looks like in VPR after fixing. Not bad for a few minutes tweaking. :)

prometheus
02-10-2012, 09:34 AM
Hi Guys. good thread to pick up on, thanks.

Is it possible to bring across shape deformations as something that can be used in LW with maybe sliders. Endomorphs were mentioned. So basically the shape functionality in Daz is tranfered over to LW.



I'm currently using 10.1 (haven't been able to get hold of the pre-release, not for want of trying..!) Are there any big differences between 10.1 and 11 which are relevant to this process?

Thanks in advance.
Clinton

I think that morphs should work..not quite sure thou have to check.

probably some obj fixes and fbx improvements cant say for sure



You guys mentioned that the mesh was quite heavy -- did you try and bump the subdivision level down to 0 in Daz? It takes the mesh down to about 19k polys which would be more reasonable I would think. Just a thought.

the image attached is a genesis figure with level set to zero in daz, artifacts and hard edges will show if using that alone in lightwave thou, works for long distance perhaps, the image attached has been tabbed/subpatched in lightwave from that low res model wich looks much better of course.


way better than previous daz figures which were just getting higher and higher in poly count.

Having said that in Daz 3 there was an option which gave "levels of detail" for the Victoria 4 mesh including a 1K and 2K model which was great but they don't seem to have these options in Daz 4 unless I'm missing something.
Hmm..I donīt see a way to get it lower in base mesh, but if you go to edit..figure or object/geometry... you can add modifiers and increase the mesh also by adding level of detail or convert to subd.
maybe load the lower versions and higher versions of victoria 4 in daz 4..just load in them from the content manager.

No nudity...look, just like barbie and ken (ridiculous)

Michael

littlewaves
02-10-2012, 09:39 AM
Is it possible to bring across shape deformations as something that can be used in LW with maybe sliders. Endomorphs were mentioned. So basically the shape functionality in Daz is tranfered over to LW.

I can confirm that I managed to get genesis into lightwave via FBX with all available morphs so that you can use morph mixer to create a custom shaped figure direct in layout.

Can't off the top of my head remember what setting I used to do this but it was possible.

rcallicotte
02-10-2012, 10:06 AM
This is a great thread. Thank you all for your freely given information including your experiments. This is what I love about this community.

RebelHill
02-10-2012, 10:10 AM
(Personally, I do find myself thinking "It might just be faster to rig the characters with Rhiggit Pro", though. They REALLY deform well, and surprisingly fast for how heavy they are on screen. Regardless, that's not part of the goal of this thread. An addendum, perhaps, but not that goal.)

Then as an addendum, I should probs have to agree that they do and they are... even using the free version will give u a more easily usable rig in LW that you're gonna get just via fbx from daz... If you want to be able to repose or animate easily in LW itself, its by far the quickest route.

Btw... talking of speed in such things, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sqasigvT3qI&list=PLD4AC29B34EBD2D80&index=6&feature=plpp_video

Also... as per the "Daz straight" discussion, dont forget to check out my fbx vids http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL5F0EDCD3471EE8FC&feature=plcp as they'll show u whats what when it comes to how daz bones load into LW... ideally, u should be using joitns from seeing the hedgehog zbones, but this'll give u a weight offset issue, easily fixed, but anyway... its all in there.

Kionel
02-10-2012, 11:18 AM
Then as an addendum, I should probs have to agree that they do and they are...

Absolutely. Once I get this process nailed down, I want to write up the addendum. (Yes, I have Rhiggit Lite and Pro, and freaking love them. Can't live without them in LW, honestly.)



Also... as per the "Daz straight" discussion, dont forget to check out my fbx vids http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL5F0EDCD3471EE8FC&feature=plcp as they'll show u whats what when it comes to how daz bones load into LW... ideally, u should be using joitns from seeing the hedgehog zbones, but this'll give u a weight offset issue, easily fixed, but anyway... its all in there.

I'll re-watch them. I have to admit, I learn something new about rigging every time I review one of your videos. For some reason, the concepts surrounding organic rigging slip off of my brain like a greased-up kid sliding down an icy hill. It's neither an elegant nor an entirely pleasant experience. The results, however, are often hilarious. :)

safetyman
02-10-2012, 11:32 AM
way better than previous daz figures which were just getting higher and higher in poly count.

Having said that in Daz 3 there was an option which gave "levels of detail" for the Victoria 4 mesh including a 1K and 2K model which was great but they don't seem to have these options in Daz 4 unless I'm missing something.

Not sure about V4, but for the Genesis figs, the mesh resolution stuff is in the parameters tab.

prometheus
02-10-2012, 01:32 PM
yepp setting some moves in the animate tab, and bake to studio keyframes and export to fbx..used joints for bones import.

some weird looking results at the fbx bone standin, wich deforms the stomach.

Michael doing heīs moves..:)
Gosh did my former girlfriend and I have som laughs when playing with these
figures...her name was actually victoria, so there was a perfect match between me and her and the figures:)

Michael

Kionel
02-11-2012, 01:03 PM
Okay, additional testing:


Loading the FBX in as a scene file into LW 11 pre-release allows me to select "Joints" instead of "Bones". I get a sane-looking joint structure (no more hedge-hogging here). Unfortunately...
The joints do not deform the mesh at all. I even tried replacing the standing null with a copy of the mesh itself. In the words of Lana from "Archer", "NOOOOOPE."
Curious to see if this was purely a "joints" import issue with weights, I cleared and loaded the FBX into LW 11 again, except this time I selected "Bones". The bones came in looking like a hedgehog, of course, but they did not influence the mesh at all.
I cleared the files again, and imported into LW 10.1. No option exists to select joints on that install. Though the hedge-hogging is still in place, I'm able to deform the mesh quite nicely.

I need to watch RebelHill's videos again, but at this point I'm stumped.

Anybody have any ideas out there?

jasonwestmas
02-11-2012, 01:07 PM
didn't read all this but definitely use LW11 FBX 2012 importer. 2011 import doesn't work well (with 2012 Exporter) especially with weights.

RebelHill
02-11-2012, 01:26 PM
the joints arent rested... they're inactive, which u can tell from their stippled, semi transparent appearance.

Oh, and u shouldnt need the base tranformer bone... check its rotations, if its at 0,0,0, then reparent the hip to the mesh item.

Mr Rid
02-11-2012, 02:30 PM
...

Hmm..I donīt see a way to get it lower in base mesh, but if you go to edit..figure or object/geometry... you can add modifiers and increase the mesh also by adding level of detail or convert to subd.
maybe load the lower versions and higher versions of victoria 4 in daz 4..just load in them from the content manager.


I had a little luck downrezing models in Zbrush using the Reconstruct Subdiv, which works great but it would only accept quads. I would like to know if there was a way to convert a mesh to quads in ZB or other app (LW plugs I tried didnt work). And when I export a model from ZB it would lose all the surfaces which I couldnt figure out how to prevent. I could not find where the hell surfaces are located in ZB.

But I was only able to use this on a Daz hair mesh that was all quads, and I could re-apply the single surface that was lost after ZB export. But allowed me to get the poly count down to something ClothFX could deal with for a practical calculation time.

jasonwestmas
02-11-2012, 02:42 PM
I'm doing the retopo thing for larger Daz creatures in 3Dcoat. It's really the best way to ensure good deformations imo. With birds and such I can get away with using Qemloss which triangulates the mesh.

Zbrush has no way to import surface values from obj files, only UV data.

prometheus
02-11-2012, 02:53 PM
Okay, additional testing:


Loading the FBX in as a scene file into LW 11 pre-release allows me to select "Joints" instead of "Bones". I get a sane-looking joint structure (no more hedge-hogging here). Unfortunately...
The joints do not deform the mesh at all. I even tried replacing the standing null with a copy of the mesh itself. In the words of Lana from "Archer", "NOOOOOPE."
Curious to see if this was purely a "joints" import issue with weights, I cleared and loaded the FBX into LW 11 again, except this time I selected "Bones". The bones came in looking like a hedgehog, of course, but they did not influence the mesh at all.
I cleared the files again, and imported into LW 10.1. No option exists to select joints on that install. Though the hedge-hogging is still in place, I'm able to deform the mesh quite nicely.

I need to watch RebelHill's videos again, but at this point I'm stumped.

Anybody have any ideas out there?

weird...I have no issues with the fbx joint import in to lw 11..it deforms well..are you sure you had deform active or bones on active?

Michael

Mr Rid
02-11-2012, 03:08 PM
I'm doing the retopo thing for larger Daz creatures in 3Dcoat. It's really the best way to ensure good deformations imo. With birds and such I can get away with using Qemloss which triangulates the mesh.

Zbrush has no way to import surface values from obj files, only UV data.

I dont mean surface values are gone, I mean the surfaces no longer exist at all. The mesh is reduced to only one default surface out of ZB.

How easy is that in Coat? I love in ZB to click one button to downrez another level and it maintains poly flow perfectly. I use Qemloss 3 on every dense mesh to make more manageable versions while setting up scenes for final. But it totally wrecks poly flow and often has errors. Am tired of having to insert and learn yet another app into a pipeline for what ought to be a simple conversion.

I often need to just throw some CG people in the background of a scene. I keep trying to find a straightforward workflow for this. Daz is the best way to spit out several hi Q figures and outfits. I want to be able to drop stock mocap on the Daz figure (basic walking, sitting, etc) and export the mesh and rig ready to go, into LW. Or drop mocap onto a Daz rig in LW and go. But there are always so many issues with data conversion that plague CG.

Kionel
02-11-2012, 03:15 PM
the joints arent rested... they're inactive, which u can tell from their stippled, semi transparent appearance.

Oh, and u shouldnt need the base tranformer bone... check its rotations, if its at 0,0,0, then reparent the hip to the mesh item.

Thank you!!!

Okay, so here is what I have for so far for an "DAZ3D to LightWave Import Checklist":

DAZ3D to LightWave Character Import Checklist


Create desired character in DAZ3D.
Once happy with the character, select "File | Export | Save As..."
Select "Autodesk FBX" from the drop-down menu box, name the file as desired, and press "Save". Allow time for expot to occur.
Open LightWave 11 Layout.
Select "File | Load | Load Scene..." and select the .FBX file generated in step 3.
At the "FBX Importer" dialog:
Check the "Scale Scene" option and set the value to "1.0".
Rotation Import: Bake Rotations
Import Joints as: "Joints"
Press "Continue"
Once the figure is loaded into Layout, open "Scene Editor" (Scene Editor | Scene Editor) and select the "Genesis Shape" item.
Drag the "Genesis Shape" item out of the "fbx_bone_hierarchy_standin" heirarchy.
Drage the "hip" joint out of the "Genesis" joint and place it under the "Genesis Shape" item.
Delete the "fbx_bone_heirarchy_standin" null and all of its descendants.
In "Scene Editor", select all of the joints parented to the "Genesis Shape" mesh item.
Rest the pivot rotations for all of these joints (Keyboard shortcut = "r")
Test the mesh deformation by selecting a joint and manipulating as desired.
Once confirmed, take all necessary steps to adjust imported surfaces to provide desired effect.


I know that those steps may seem extraordinarily basic, but those kind of checklists really save me same brainpower. :)

Once again, thanks!

Back to the next steps for testing of the import process: Bringing in animations.

Tony

Kionel
02-11-2012, 03:25 PM
weird...I have no issues with the fbx joint import in to lw 11..it deforms well..are you sure you had deform active or bones on active?

Michael

Michael --

Nope, I was a dolt. Forgot to rest the bones.

See this? This is why I write checklists. They keep me from augering in on even the most basic of tasks. :D

Tony

jasonwestmas
02-11-2012, 03:54 PM
I dont mean surface values are gone, I mean the surfaces no longer exist at all. The mesh is reduced to only one default surface out of ZB.

Right, Zbrush has no understanding of surfaces/materials from LW or any other application, its material system is completely alien to other packages and is unable to export its own materials.


How easy is that in Coat? I love in ZB to click one button to downrez another level and it maintains poly flow perfectly. I use Qemloss 3 on every dense mesh to make more manageable versions while setting up scenes for final. But it totally wrecks poly flow and often has errors. Am tired of having to insert and learn yet another app into a pipeline for what ought to be a simple conversion.

Right, unfortunately I've never had a Daz model that was all quads. Retopo in coat is super easy to do and straight forward, just time consuming to do fingers, toes, inside of the mouth and Ears. I don't believe it understands obj or LW surfaces either, only UV and bitmaps.

With Qem loss I usually cutting the model in half first, applying Qemloss, welding and turning Triangle edges to get good edge flow wit YM_Trichange. Deleting 2 point polys and then mirroring the geometry to complete the model. But these Qemloss models are usually game models that don't need complex normal mapping.




I often need to just throw some CG people in the background of a scene. I keep trying to find a straightforward workflow for this. Daz is the best way to spit out several hi Q figures and outfits. I want to be able to drop stock mocap on the Daz figure (basic walking, sitting, etc) and export the mesh and rig ready to go, into LW. Or drop mocap onto a Daz rig in LW and go. But there are always so many issues with data conversion that plague CG.

If you are referring to the way LW imports FBX files then that I think has more to do with the fact that Daz models tend to be improperly setup for export surface wise (Usually using too many surface names and maps to begin with) and that LW has problems importing/exporting surfaces with several UV maps per surface.

jasonwestmas
02-11-2012, 04:12 PM
Keep an eye out for QRemesher for Zbrush. This might be a quicker answer to our Daz model optimization needs. "QRemesher is result of the collective efforts of both Pixologic and Verold. As it’s name suggests, it is a remeshing solution both automatic and guided. Stay tuned, for a February pre-release Alpha version of QRemesher, available for download and preview inside ZBrush 4R2b. Once completed, QRemesher will be available for purchase and download at Pixologic.com."

jasonwestmas
02-11-2012, 04:18 PM
Mr. Rid, I forgot to mention that Auto-Retopology is available in 3Dcoat though it tends to work best only if you can stand higher polycounts like 10-15 thousand quads for a character. . . and I think you may have to convert your Daz model to Voxels in order to use Auto-po.

safetyman
02-11-2012, 05:55 PM
I've found that, due to it's superior snapping tools, Blender makes a great tool for retopo. Still time consuming compared to 3D-Coat or Topogun and the like, but it's easily done and you control the poly flow.

jasonwestmas
02-11-2012, 06:11 PM
but it's easily done and you control the poly flow.

Yeah the extra effort to control the poly-flow pays off big time for deformations. But in cases where you just need a 10 second shot of something high-detail I can see why some people would be annoyed at having to retopo a model.

sami
02-11-2012, 06:17 PM
Can Daz users please answer this for me? Is there any benefit of using Daz (with LW) if I already own Poser Pro 2010? Is there anything that Daz does that Poser doesn't (and I'm not interested in animating or rendering in Poser or Daz - just rigging and exporting figures). thanks

Philbert
02-12-2012, 02:20 AM
I tried to ask the same question and had people yelling at me to not use either one. Not really very helpful.

safetyman
02-12-2012, 06:35 AM
They both have advantages/disadvantages, but the biggest one is price: DS4pro is now free afterall. I think that DS4 makes rigging clothes & mapping the rigs to new figures much easier than Poser, which really hasn't had a major update in a while (although the new weight mapping feature is really nice). I think the things that give DS4 the edge IMO, is the Genesis figure (which is a universal mesh with TONS of morphs), the auto-fit tool to make any clothing item fit, and the more up-to-date and snappier UI. Genesis alone is enough to push DS4 up front, because you can have all the shapes you'll ever need in one figure, mix and match them for almost unlimited shapes, and almost every clothing item can be easily fit to whatever shape you come up with (within reason of course).

jasonwestmas
02-12-2012, 06:53 AM
I think you'll get better topology out of a poser figure. So less of an operation game.

sami
02-12-2012, 02:32 PM
I think you'll get better topology out of a poser figure. So less of an operation game.

That's what I assumed. Is the content roughly the same? I mean if I buy a unimesh character off Daz3D it seems to work well in PoserPro2010 and with the PoserFusion plugins it seems to be rather seamless to tweak the figure in LW Modeler and repaint or retopo in 3DC if needed.

What other features of Daz go beyond this and are essential (assuming I dont want to animate or render in Daz)? thanks.. :)

jasonwestmas
02-12-2012, 02:56 PM
Well, I really only buy the models for my job and do the retopo thing. If you have lightwave 10+ then you already have a fairly decent animation toolset, especially with Rhiggit. TBH I can't stand the old LW dynamics system, I could never get anything useful out of it. So maybe the dynamics can offer something more in Daz and Poser but I don't know how reliable that stuff is collisions-wise. Probably would have more luck with marvelous designer for collisions. Collisions have always been a real battle in these bargain deals.

Obviously you can distort the models using the slider morphs and then export those changes, so really that's all I can think of as far as the models and animation. Possibly basic mo-cap re-targeting?? Not sure about that either.

safetyman
02-13-2012, 08:39 AM
Poser has a pretty good dynamics system for clothing, so there's that. As I mentioned earlier, Daz has the whole sub-d, level of detail settings for the Genesis figure, which cuts down on the density of the models versus Poser.

I look at Daz and Poser as supplemental tools for LW, saving me from having to model things like animals, furniture, houses, people, etc. I don't normally do animation, so it works out for me.

tischbein3
02-13-2012, 10:44 AM
I had a little luck downrezing models in Zbrush using the Reconstruct Subdiv, which works great but it would only accept quads. I would like to know if there was a way to convert a mesh to quads in ZB or other app (LW plugs I tried didnt work).

zrzzzp:
Blenders Triangle to Quads might be an option, (import model, hit tab to go into edit mode, hit a to select all faces, alt+j to convert to quads, tab to exit edit mode, export model)

Meshlab seems to have some tri to quad function although I didn't get it to work correctly, But I also recomend its polygon reduction functions. (namely Quadric Edge collapse with texture(=uv) preservation)

Didn't think polygon amount is that high when you set the subdiv level to 0 in daz... from my experience, exporting too many morphs is a far bigger problem performance wise.

Edit: Please note meshlab, although open source, sends statistical usage information home. Nothing to worry about, but I still think its important to note.

EditII: As for low rez people, "makehuman" might be a better option for you.

sami
02-13-2012, 02:51 PM
zrzzzp:
Blenders Triangle to Quads might be an option, (import model, hit tab to go into edit mode, hit a to select all faces, alt+j to convert to quads, tab to exit edit mode, export model)

Meshlab seems to have some tri to quad function although I didn't get it to work correctly, But I also recomend its polygon reduction functions. (namely Quadric Edge collapse with texture(=uv) preservation)

Didn't think polygon amount is that high when you set the subdiv level to 0 in daz... from my experience, exporting too many morphs is a far bigger problem performance wise.

Edit: Please note meshlab, although open source, sends statistical usage information home. Nothing to worry about, but I still think its important to note.

EditII: As for low rez people, "makehuman" might be a better option for you.


Probably not what you are after, but if you throw your model into 3DCoat the auto retopo will generate quads and the flow will be good enough, though you can perfect it if you manually retopo in there. It's surprisingly quick once you get the hang of it.

sami
02-13-2012, 02:59 PM
Poser has a pretty good dynamics system for clothing, so there's that. As I mentioned earlier, Daz has the whole sub-d, level of detail settings for the Genesis figure, which cuts down on the density of the models versus Poser.

I look at Daz and Poser as supplemental tools for LW, saving me from having to model things like animals, furniture, houses, people, etc. I don't normally do animation, so it works out for me.

I agree. I also see Poser as a utility for LW, I have no desire to animate or rig in there (though the walk designer is nice enough). I was in a bind recently on a project and purchased a Poser addon called Wardrobe Wizard to make clothing fit other characters, and found it cumbersome and poorly implemented.

There's alot of crap to wade through in the Daz / Poser world (in terms of content), and the Daz store while useful, doesn't really tell you what you need to know to use the assets properly. Like what assets require what source meshes, and what morph targets work with what other ones or will work with the figure but not the clothing?? It's a total mess unless you are a regular Daz user. Also, it the content market certainly is geared to a specific niche of medieval / fairy / pervy cosplay people who seem to only make stills and not animations. Also not many good low to mid poly models in there... Just my 2cts... :bday:

tcoursey
02-15-2012, 03:26 PM
It's not perfect, but it's already a damn sight better than the Poser Pro export option IMO. Also, bear in mind that I did not procedural texture work to sweeten the look; this is pure slightly-adjuted imported texture output.

Looking very promising! little work but worth it. I'm going to be trying the export, then import to Marvelous Designer (trial I better hurry) then back out with MDD into Lightwave. Man all this stuff is cool, but not quite plug and play with LW! doh.

Kionel
02-16-2012, 12:19 PM
Looking very promising! little work but worth it. I'm going to be trying the export, then import to Marvelous Designer (trial I better hurry) then back out with MDD into Lightwave. Man all this stuff is cool, but not quite plug and play with LW! doh.

Nope, it's not. I've been continuing my experimentation and have determined a few things:


The default FBX import appears to work best with no clothes on the figure. Exporting clothes with the mesh from DAZ seems to result in a rig that will not create really useful deforms. (Think collapsing chest cavities.)
Yes, you can get all of the body morphs (expressions, phonemes, you name it) to export with the FBX, but at a cost: You have to create a very long, and very complex set of rules on the DAZ side to ensure that you don't inadvertently remove all of the character customization you spent time on in DAZ.
Just rig the meshes with Rhiggit. You'll get a better result, with none of the trouble.


I'll share more specific details as I create the checklists for myself.

blondimage
02-16-2012, 07:28 PM
Any of you guys actually bought Poser Pro 2012?

On the Smith Micro site it costs about Ģ380 inc VAT, but on Amazon it's about Ģ100 cheaper! Anyone know why please?

sami
02-16-2012, 08:46 PM
Any of you guys actually bought Poser Pro 2012?

On the Smith Micro site it costs about Ģ380 inc VAT, but on Amazon it's about Ģ100 cheaper! Anyone know why please?

Nope I have PoserPro2010, I don't see the benefit of upgrading it for such a high price if I'm using as a LW utility and not using the few new features they added.

blondimage
02-16-2012, 09:08 PM
Ok cheers sami.
All I want it for is to bring morph shapes over, can 2010 do that?

sami
02-16-2012, 09:36 PM
Ok cheers sami.
All I want it for is to bring morph shapes over, can 2010 do that?

I believe if a Poser figure has them, it allows you to export Morph Targets to Lightwave with an export checkbox during the export to LWO. So yes it should work - I havent tried it in awhile so I forget, but I'm fairly certain it does do it, yes.

Kionel
02-17-2012, 11:57 AM
Okay, folks; I just worked out the following process to export all of the facial morphs from DAZ3D Pro to LightWave:

EXPORTING CHARACTER FACIAL MORPHS FROM DAZ3D TO LIGHTWAVE

1. In DAZ3D, select all parts of the character from the "Scene" tab.
2. Select "File | Export..."
3. Ensure that "Files of type:" drop-down box reads "Autodesk FBX (.fbx)
4. Click "Save"
5. Press the "Edit Morphs Export Rules" button in the "FBX Options" screen
6. Click "Add"
7. For the new rule, under "Match" enter "head."
8. Under "Action" select "Export"
9. Press "Accept".
10. Press "Accept" once again.
11. Allow the export to complete.
12. Open up the FBX scene file in LightWave 10.1 or later.
13. Select the "Genesis_Shape" object
14. Press "p" for properties.
15. Select the "Deform" tab.
16. Double-click on the "Morph Mixer" link at the bottom (NOTE: You should see 162 endomorphs)
17. Review the morphs on your character.

It works. It works like a charm.

Just had to share. :)

Kionel
02-17-2012, 12:05 PM
I believe if a Poser figure has them, it allows you to export Morph Targets to Lightwave with an export checkbox during the export to LWO. So yes it should work - I havent tried it in awhile so I forget, but I'm fairly certain it does do it, yes.

Hey, Sami -

I think I tried the morph check-box option in 2010, but had no luck. As it is, I just put up a method of doing this in DAZ3D Pro that works like a charm. :)

safetyman
02-18-2012, 02:07 PM
Thanks Kionel -- really helpful.

sami
02-18-2012, 03:56 PM
Hey, Sami -

I think I tried the morph check-box option in 2010, but had no luck. As it is, I just put up a method of doing this in DAZ3D Pro that works like a charm. :)

Yes thanks. I will revisit how to do that in poser though because I could have sworn it was possible there too

blondimage
02-19-2012, 10:59 PM
Excellent! Thanks Kionel. :)

short223
02-29-2012, 02:29 PM
Thanks for this, but I was unsuccessful to get the morph over to LW. I was not using the Genesis model but Victoria 4.2. The file that exports seems to be loading the morphs on export (final size is larger) but nothing in the morph mixer. Any clues?


Okay, folks; I just worked out the following process to export all of the facial morphs from DAZ3D Pro to LightWave:

EXPORTING CHARACTER FACIAL MORPHS FROM DAZ3D TO LIGHTWAVE

1. In DAZ3D, select all parts of the character from the "Scene" tab.
2. Select "File | Export..."
3. Ensure that "Files of type:" drop-down box reads "Autodesk FBX (.fbx)
4. Click "Save"
5. Press the "Edit Morphs Export Rules" button in the "FBX Options" screen
6. Click "Add"
7. For the new rule, under "Match" enter "head."
8. Under "Action" select "Export"
9. Press "Accept".
10. Press "Accept" once again.
11. Allow the export to complete.
12. Open up the FBX scene file in LightWave 10.1 or later.
13. Select the "Genesis_Shape" object
14. Press "p" for properties.
15. Select the "Deform" tab.
16. Double-click on the "Morph Mixer" link at the bottom (NOTE: You should see 162 endomorphs)
17. Review the morphs on your character.

It works. It works like a charm.

Just had to share. :)

Burchigb
02-29-2012, 07:08 PM
Tony Bruno
WOW, what a cool way to do the morphs
THANKS!!!

ben martin
03-01-2012, 05:33 AM
Okay, folks; I just worked out the following process to export all of the facial morphs from DAZ3D Pro to LightWave:

EXPORTING CHARACTER FACIAL MORPHS FROM DAZ3D TO LIGHTWAVE

1. In DAZ3D, select all parts of the character from the "Scene" tab.
2. Select "File | Export..."
3. Ensure that "Files of type:" drop-down box reads "Autodesk FBX (.fbx)
4. Click "Save"
5. Press the "Edit Morphs Export Rules" button in the "FBX Options" screen
6. Click "Add"
7. For the new rule, under "Match" enter "head."
8. Under "Action" select "Export"
9. Press "Accept".
10. Press "Accept" once again.
11. Allow the export to complete.
12. Open up the FBX scene file in LightWave 10.1 or later.
13. Select the "Genesis_Shape" object
14. Press "p" for properties.
15. Select the "Deform" tab.
16. Double-click on the "Morph Mixer" link at the bottom (NOTE: You should see 162 endomorphs)
17. Review the morphs on your character.

It works. It works like a charm.

Just had to share. :)

Very good.
Fantastic information. Thank you buddy. :thumbsup:

short223
03-01-2012, 06:43 AM
It seems it doesn't work with LW 10.1 but works fine with 11.

Who was successful in getting the morphs in LW 10.1?


Thanks for this, but I was unsuccessful to get the morph over to LW. I was not using the Genesis model but Victoria 4.2. The file that exports seems to be loading the morphs on export (final size is larger) but nothing in the morph mixer. Any clues?

short223
03-01-2012, 08:19 AM
A couple of issues with the FXB export in Studio Pro.

Loaded V4.2 and added Morphs ++
I can see all the Morphs and the Morph Shape in the properties section but when I go to export the FXB and make my selections within the Morph Edit area. I don't see all the Morph Shapes as available. They do list the items that I have selected and those that I did not in the list but a number of Morph Shapes (like nipple morphs for example) are not present in the list.

Also, is there a limit to the number of Morphs that can be exported? I tried for the majority of them (what was available) but I got an error not even half way through, the model had the abdomen disappear and I had to restart if I wanted to use this model again. Any clues?

Kionel
03-01-2012, 11:46 AM
Happy to help, guys. :)

I'm in the process of converting characters over for my comic project. Locking in the facial morph process has been a labor-saver.

Right now, project process has become:


Design character in DAZ3D
Export character per previously-provided steps to .FBX
Resurface the character in LW post-import
Clean-up mesh in modeler to remove unnecessary polys, like limbs under clothing, etc..
Weight map
Rig in Rhiggit Pro
Pose, light, and render


The first included image is one of my converted characters, in an also-converted setting for the comic project. Pretty pleased with the results.

My next challenge now is to reverse the process. I'm testing bringing in some older meshes of mine from LW to DAZ, with the goal of, well, selling them. (Hey, if they're gonna sit on my hard drive and take up disk space, they might as well be working for me, too!) My current test object is this space-age fighter design. So far I've learned:


OBJ material transfer does not appear to work in DAZ
You're going to learn the DAZ surface editor
For moving parts, it appears that you'll have to create morphs of each movement to import via DAZ's morph import tool.
For your textures, ensure that you bake your procedural textures to the appropriate maps


I know those are awfully genera statements, but that's pretty much where I'm at with the process right now.

I'm converting the model shown in the attached images because, frankly, I think it would be a good fit for the DAZ marketplace. After that? It's onto clothes creation via DAZ's (apparently) really good auto-conversion tool.

One step at a time, folks. One step at a time...

mummyman
03-01-2012, 11:47 AM
I couldn't seem to get the morphs to export, or then import into LW 10.1 Not sure what's up with that. Anyone get it to work with 10.1?

Am I not selecting them correctly in Daz before exporting?

mummyman
03-01-2012, 11:58 AM
Nevermind... I'm an idiot. thanks for the tips!!! Very cool.

Kionel
03-01-2012, 12:34 PM
Thanks for this, but I was unsuccessful to get the morph over to LW. I was not using the Genesis model but Victoria 4.2. The file that exports seems to be loading the morphs on export (final size is larger) but nothing in the morph mixer. Any clues?

Hmm...

Let me look at that when I get back to the home office. I've only been working with Genesis figures, so I haven't tried anything with Victoria 4.2 or Michael 4.

I'll let you know what I find out!

Tony

Kionel
03-01-2012, 12:37 PM
Very good.
Fantastic information. Thank you buddy. :thumbsup:

Hey, no problem! Feels good after years of watching tutorials to help OTHERS out for a change. :D

Tony

Afalk
03-01-2012, 03:32 PM
Awesome information, lots to experiment with next chance I get ! Thanks for sharing all this info.

BTW: did want to comment on the Poser 2012 Pro pipeline to LW. Their setup is literally meant to get a scene/character, static or animated into an existing LW scene - as is. You set up in Poser (character, animation etc) then bring the scene to LW to Render. The FBX workflow has the potential to get you a usable asset within LW thanks to the FBX pipeline ... that in a nutshell seems to be the biggest difference. I use Poser 2012 Pro, and DS4Pro both. DS4 can also of course open Poser characters, so that gives me two ways to get their 3rd party content happily into LW for whatever I need. Very fun stuff.

Burchigb
03-01-2012, 05:32 PM
Need to add to this one
For the Genesis morphs
on step Originally Posted by Kionel
6. Click "Add"
7. For the new rule, under "Match" enter "Genesis."
8. Under "Action" select "Export"
9. Press "Accept".

Using above you will be able to bring in all the morphs.
Takes a few to load in LW.
:-)

ben martin
03-02-2012, 03:13 AM
Ah,
I don’t know if you guys already know this one, but if, when exporting from DAZ to LW you choose the FBX2010 filter (or bellow; FBX2009, FBX2006) instead FBX2012 or FBX2011 the DAZ character textures are loaded in LW11 already in place.
Just thought I should share.

prometheus
03-02-2012, 04:14 AM
Ah,
I don’t know if you guys already know this one, but if, when exporting from DAZ to LW you choose the FBX2010 filter (or bellow; FBX2009, FBX2006) instead FBX2012 or FBX2011 the DAZ character textures are loaded in LW11 already in place.
Just thought I should share.

Textures are almost correct in latest fbx export, do you mean that it export absolutly all textures correct in respective color channel and correctly assigned with the UV map?
cause thatīs whatīs missing in the latest fbx export..the UV map is there but you have to go through all surface layer and switch from default UV map to the correct one.

and the transparency is correct?

Michael

ben martin
03-02-2012, 04:41 AM
[edit]... do you mean that it export absolutly all textures correct in respective color channel and correctly assigned with the UV map?[edit]...and the transparency is correct?[edit]

Michael

Hum… no, I didn’t check the transparencies.

I checked the FBX filters bellow 2011 version because I had some problems with FBX2012 and the UV maps were not applied to the figure in LW Layout so, I just decided to try older FBX filters and check how it goes.
In those tests the UV textures were imported right but didn’t bother to check about transparencies since it was a very fast test.

Maybe I should find some extra time latter and check on that again. :foreheads

Burchigb
03-04-2012, 05:04 PM
Tried it on 2010 worked rather well

ben martin
03-04-2012, 05:51 PM
Tried it on 2010 worked rather well

Yeah, but like prometheus pointed out, transparencies need to be fixed anyway.

Burchigb
03-05-2012, 05:09 PM
True just looked at it again. Darn.

short223
03-08-2012, 08:46 AM
Anyone able to see this issue and figure out a reason why some morphs are seen and others (probably shape morphs) are not?

I've experimented with other models and it seems not all morphs are not recognized? Any help or explanation would be appreciated.


A couple of issues with the FXB export in Studio Pro.

Loaded V4.2 and added Morphs ++
I can see all the Morphs and the Morph Shape in the properties section but when I go to export the FXB and make my selections within the Morph Edit area. I don't see all the Morph Shapes as available. They do list the items that I have selected and those that I did not in the list but a number of Morph Shapes (like nipple morphs for example) are not present in the list.

Also, is there a limit to the number of Morphs that can be exported? I tried for the majority of them (what was available) but I got an error not even half way through, the model had the abdomen disappear and I had to restart if I wanted to use this model again. Any clues?

short223
03-08-2012, 08:58 AM
Attached is the screen grab from Daz Studio that shows the character with the morphs listed to the right in the parameters (Morph Eyes, Morph Head) for the "head" parameter. On the left you will see the "Edit Morph Export Rules" window with the "head" parameter listed and the circled list behind that doesn't show any potential morphs to be exported.

I did this procedure with V4.2 and was able to export certain morphs but not all were available. I also noticed that ALL the available morphs (which were a lot) ended up crashing the file so I'm assuming there is a limit as to the number of morphs that can be exported?

Any explanation would be great!

wesleycorgi
03-08-2012, 03:06 PM
cause thatīs whatīs missing in the latest fbx export..the UV map is there but you have to go through all surface layer and switch from default UV map to the correct one.
I exported out FBX2012 ASCII, then replaced:

P: "UVSet", "KString", "", "", "default"

with:

P: "UVSet", "KString", "", "", "Model_UV"

So the textures are now coming in with 2012. I'll keep digging in the FBX file to see which parameter needs to be changed to manipulate transparencies, etc.

Mr Rid
03-08-2012, 03:58 PM
Anyone able to see this issue and figure out a reason why some morphs are seen and others (probably shape morphs) are not?


I dont have time to look into it, but when I exported morphs from Daz3, I thought some morphs had not translated but they were actually showing up misnamed.

wesleycorgi
03-08-2012, 05:56 PM
I dont have time to look into it, but when I exported morphs from Daz3, I thought some morphs had not translated but they were actually showing up misnamed.

Mr. Rid: Did you get transparencies to work correctly or did you just re-texture?

wesleycorgi
03-08-2012, 06:20 PM
I'll keep digging in the FBX file to see which parameter needs to be changed to manipulate transparencies, etc.

I think that on the Daz side, the transparency info is not being passed on via FBX or LW can't read the information. However, Daz's OBJ export seems to work ok with transparencies, but LW reads the color information as the Diffuse parameter. But since OBJ is ASCII, you can do a search on:

map_D /Maps/Lashes1.jpg (map_D is the texture map for Diffuse)

and replace with:

map_Ka /Maps/Lashes1.jpg (map_Ka is the texture map for Color)

So my plan of attack will be:

1) Export an OBJ and FBX2012 version of the same file
2) With a text editor, search/replace the "default" UV problem in the FBX2012 file
3) With a text editor, search/replace map_D/map_Ka
4) Import both models into LW
5) Copy the OBJ textures that have transparencies (mainly eyelashes and hair) and paste over the corresponding FBX texture

I wish I knew Lscript (or perhaps Python), then I could probably automate all this. I know I can quickly write an AppleScript that accomplishes 2 & 3 (and possibly 4). And there is probably a plug-in that does 5. Actually if LWO's were ASCII, then I could AppleScript all of it pretty easily.

Greenlaw
03-08-2012, 07:53 PM
I've been lurking because I'm interested in purchasing a creature from DAZ to use in LW for a test. Anyway, I took advantage of the free DAZ 4 Pro offer the other night and installed it just now.

Just to confirm what others here have already discovered, here's my result after a few minutes of playing around:

http://forums.newtek.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=102446&stc=1&d=1331261216

Used Load From Scene to load the FBX (mainly out of habit.) Did a simple arms down pose in DAZ just to see if that would come through--rig and pose looks fine in LW. Textures came in when using FBX 2010; no transparency as previously mentioned.

This is plenty good enough for my purposes. Actually, I didn't even need the rig. :p

Anyway, thanks for starting this thread! The discussion here has obviously been very helpful.

G.

Greenlaw
03-09-2012, 03:19 AM
I just purchased the DAZ 3D model I was interested in (Upland Troll), and it converted from DAZ Studio 4 Pro to Lightwave 11 just fine, including textures, rig, props and some face morphs. I don't think I got all the face morphs available but I probably just need to expand the rules to get them. Even as is though, this character will be perfect for the LW 11 tests I want to run.

Thanks again for this excellent thread!

G.

http://forums.newtek.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=102449&stc=1&d=1331287992

wesleycorgi
03-09-2012, 11:09 AM
map_D /Maps/Lashes1.jpg (map_D is the texture map for Diffuse)

and replace with:

map_Ka /Maps/Lashes1.jpg (map_Ka is the texture map for Color)


I got this a bit wrong: map_Kd is the texture map for Diffuse.

So you would search for map_Kd and replace with map_Ka (map_D is the transparency texture map). And to be more explicit, you would change this in the .mtl file for the OBJ.

ben martin
03-11-2012, 09:45 AM
Ok,

The transparency issue is (most probably) generated by DAZ FBX exporter since AD FBX viewer is also replicating LW FBX importer behavior regarding DAZ files. (See attached image)

I'm going to report this directly to Ammon Diether (DAZ Studio 4 FBX coder).
I am sure that he will fixes this soon.
If any of you have relevant info that wishes to add, I am willingly open to add/forward such info to him.

By the way, I just made this integration test and the DAZ Studio 4 / Lightwave (FBX) pipe line is working pretty well (see attached mp4 clip example - FBX_Test.rar – The landscape is Lightwave and the figure is DAZ FBX).

prometheus
03-11-2012, 10:58 AM
Ok,

The transparency issue is (most probably) generated by DAZ FBX exporter since AD FBX viewer is also replicating LW FBX importer behavior regarding DAZ files. (See attached image)

I'm going to report this directly to Ammon Diether (DAZ Studio 4 FBX coder).
I am sure that he will fixes this soon.
If any of you have relevant info that wishes to add, I am willingly open to add/forward such info to him.

By the way, I just made this integration test and the DAZ Studio 4 / Lightwave (FBX) pipe line is working pretty well (see attached mp4 clip example - FBX_Test.rar – The landscape is Lightwave and the figure is DAZ FBX).

Additional info and request, fbx seem to export one default uv map and the one for the object, in each layers color channel it is set by default to the default uv map wich isnīt correct, that means we have to go through all layers and switch to the correct one, that is what I had issues with for the 2012 fbx export.

Michael

wesleycorgi
03-11-2012, 03:44 PM
Ok,

The transparency issue is (most probably) generated by DAZ FBX exporter since AD FBX viewer is also replicating LW FBX importer behavior regarding DAZ files. (See attached image)

I'm going to report this directly to Ammon Diether (DAZ Studio 4 FBX coder).
I am sure that he will fixes this soon.
If any of you have relevant info that wishes to add, I am willingly open to add/forward such info to him.
I think there may be an issue with transparency being interpreted on the LW side. Try this: create a cube in LW with 100% transparency. Export the cube as an FBX. Open the FBX in LW; transparency doesn't come across.

This property is in the FBX: P: "TransparentColor", "ColorRGB", "Color", "",1,1,1. But I think LW doesn't interpret this information.

Similarly, if you do an export from Daz3D and you look in the FBX, it carries over the transparency maps. As well, it saves all the transparency maps into the exported images folder. But LW is ignoring it (the example below is for the eyelashes):

;Texture::V5BreeLashes1, Material::6_Eyelash
C: "OP",4748548144,4748546512, "TransparentColor"

I've taken my Daz3D mesh that I added the corrected transparencies in LW and exported it as FBX. And like my cube example, LW can't read the transparency information on its own exported FBX.

That's why I'm looking at OBJ, because LW does interpret the transparencies and transparency maps. However, LW mucks up the diffuse maps — should be the color map. Also the specularity is way off: 2000+%.

wesleycorgi
03-11-2012, 03:49 PM
Additional info and request, fbx seem to export one default uv map and the one for the object, in each layers color channel it is set by default to the default uv map wich isnīt correct, that means we have to go through all layers and switch to the correct one, that is what I had issues with for the 2012 fbx export.

Michael

Yes, in the Daz FBX (2012 but not 2010 and earlier) it sets the wrong property:

P: "UVSet", "KString", "", "", "default"

Should be:

P: "UVSet", "KString", "", "", "Model_UV"

Per my previous post, you can fix the FBX pretty readily with a search and replace all in a text editor.

wesleycorgi
03-11-2012, 03:55 PM
By the way, I just made this integration test and the DAZ Studio 4 / Lightwave (FBX) pipe line is working pretty well (see attached mp4 clip example - FBX_Test.rar – The landscape is Lightwave and the figure is DAZ FBX).

Looks good. I'm also getting nice results. Just wish that I wasn't fiddling with retexturing — then I would be set!

ben martin
03-12-2012, 10:04 AM
So, if I got it all right, we are discussing two different problems with different origins.
One related with DAZ studio FBX exporter regarding 2012 version (Textures problems).

The other problem is related with Lightwave FBX filter not being able to import transparencies (does not matter from where the FBX is coming from or version used).

I requested to Ammon (DAZ Studio 4 FBX coder) to follow this thread when he got some time and he kindly said he will do it.
So it would be important for sum it all clearly to both sides Lightwave and DAZ FBX request improvements.

Anyone wishes to add any relevant info about this issue here?
I 'm going to notify Chuck to peek on this thread and see if something is fixed in the next release (point release).

Amm_
03-12-2012, 10:27 AM
Couple things guys,

#1
--------------------------
Yes there is a bug which causes some morphs not to show up. Hopefully in a month or two, this fix will make it to the public.

Long explanation(yes it is relevant): In order to make the exporter "easy" and powerful, the desire was to make it possible for any slider to be able to generate a morph. Many morphs(like the visimes) are a combinations of bone rotations and a (delta morph)vertex movement. But some sliders have no business being made into morphs. Something like "Point At" is one of those things. So a very complicated algorithm which attempts to figure out which sliders are really "morphs" was devised. This algorthim worked for everything I threw at it, but alas it is insufficient.

This algorithm will be removed and y'all will need to handle sliders that should not be morphs using the rules. For the most part these are easy. Things like "Point At". Some are little more subtle. Like the pose sliders(shoulder shrugs, etc). Better said, any slider that is basically rotation control. Those need to be sent to the ignore pile in the morph list. You don't want them baked in or made into a vertex morph.

Amm_
03-12-2012, 10:35 AM
#2
--------------------------------------------
Don't string me up, but the target application during development of FBX for DS4 was 3dsMax, Maya, and Motionbuilder.

The transparency information came across very well for Max and Maya. Motionbuilder still does not support (or not very well) transparency maps. FBX originated as MotionBuilder's native format and, of course the confusion never stops: Maya and Max both treat the transparency map as on opacity map. This is not too bad because Studio uses an opacity map. But not everyone agrees with this.

It may sound like a rant, but that is the line of thinking that brought about the decision "Make it work for 3dsMax, Maya, and Motionbuilder" and the rest of the application can follow them.

Amm_
03-12-2012, 10:40 AM
#3
---------------------------------
The UVSet thing. This is intriguing because the Autodesk apps seem to handle this fine, but that still does not mean the DAZ Exporter is doing it right. I will look into this and see what I can figure out.

As a note, FBX (it is incredible awesome in its own right, if you read this AutoDesk, don't be mad, I love FBX) has quite a few bugs. The jump to version 7( I think that was 2010 to 2011) jump was especially bad.

Because I said something somewhat critical of AutoDesk, if you would not mind editing your post that has my last name :)

Amm_
03-12-2012, 10:46 AM
#4
-------------------------------
Genesis Morphs, the really cool ones

Many of the genesis morphs require the rig of the character to change with the slider.
Unfortunately, FBX and most 3D programs do not allow for a morph to change the rig of a character. Those morphs will never look right until that happens.

ben martin
03-12-2012, 10:54 AM
Many thanks for jumping in Ammon and address all the relevant points in this thread.
Much appreciated.

About the transparency maps, so I guess nothing is going to change in DS FBX exporter, since it was done based on Max, Maya rules.
I don’t know if it is possible for Newtek to add an option in the FBX filter to deal with transparency maps using the same Max / Maya rule.

Chuck/ NT, any hope to see such option in the import FBX filter?
Is this feasible?

ben martin
03-12-2012, 11:37 AM
Hi Ammon,

About the morphs:
I guess the most relevant morphs (needed to be manipulated inside Lightwave) are the facial ones.

It would be fantastic to have the possibility to choose (check box style) wich morphs would be included in by the FBX export file.

I guess the Genesis face alone has 162 morphs.
Most of them are not needed inside Lightwave.

The most relevant ones would be the ones need to lip-sync (phonemes) and facial expressions related (smile, sad… and so forth).

Makes any sense to include such morph check-box export filter?

Cheers.

Amm_
03-12-2012, 12:26 PM
Hi Ammon,

About the morphs:
I guess the most relevant morphs (needed to be manipulated inside Lightwave) are the facial ones.

It would be fantastic to have the possibility to choose (check box style) wich morphs would be included in by the FBX export file.

I guess the Genesis face alone has 162 morphs.
Most of them are not needed inside Lightwave.

The most relevant ones would be the ones need to lip-sync (phonemes) and facial expressions related (smile, sad… and so forth).

Makes any sense to include such morph check-box export filter?

Cheers.
I usually add a rule like .VSM -> export to get the visimes on genesis.

ben martin
03-12-2012, 01:30 PM
I usually add a rule like .VSM -> export to get the visimes on genesis.

Very well, I didn't know about that. :thumbsup:

wesleycorgi
03-12-2012, 07:48 PM
Yes, thanks for taking a look. I was banging my head against the wall regarding the transparencies! Hopefully, an NT developer can do a little magic and make FBX transparencies work with Daz and just in general.

wesleycorgi
03-12-2012, 07:52 PM
#2
--------------------------------------------
Don't string me up, but the target application during development of FBX for DS4 was 3dsMax, Maya, and Motionbuilder.


This is understandable; you got to go after the biggest market. But I think with your free promotion and the positive feedback from LW friendly sites, you're going to see quite a few LW folks using Daz. Previously I spent a few bucks here and there on Daz assets for use in Poser. Since Daz3D Studio went free, I've spent a couple of hundred dollars on D3D assets because the whole Genesis thing provides an exponential amount of possibilities.

dblincoe
03-13-2012, 04:24 PM
This is understandable; you got to go after the biggest market. But I think with your free promotion and the positive feedback from LW friendly sites, you're going to see quite a few LW folks using Daz. Previously I spent a few bucks here and there on Daz assets for use in Poser. Since Daz3D Studio went free, I've spent a couple of hundred dollars on D3D assets because the whole Genesis thing provides an exponential amount of possibilities.

I did too. It is saving a lot in the long run on a project I'm working on. I've been a poser user since it's infancy, but I am really enjoying Daz3d.

dblincoe
03-13-2012, 04:25 PM
So is the FBX2012 version the one to use if we are using LW11? Or should we use a lower export version?

wesleycorgi
03-13-2012, 09:12 PM
So is the FBX2012 version the one to use if we are using LW11? Or should we use a lower export version?
If you don't want to have to change all your UV maps, someone pointed out to use pre-FBX2012; I think FBX2010 and earlier (or you can open up an ASCII 2012 version and search replace "Default" with "Model_UV").

LW_Will
03-14-2012, 02:06 AM
Also, thinking this is a Daz Studio FBX problem, not a Lightwave problem.

Remember, it was just last month that DAZ finalized the FBX data file structures...

ben martin
03-14-2012, 04:45 AM
Also, thinking this is a Daz Studio FBX problem, not a Lightwave problem.

Remember, it was just last month that DAZ finalized the FBX data file structures...

Well, Ammon (DAZ3D FBX coder) stated in this thread that DS-FBX is working nice with MAX and Maya and was coded using those apps as reference, so I guess it would be nice if NT could do something to add such rules in the FBX import filter. :beerchug:

Amm_
03-14-2012, 12:48 PM
The UV thing is proving to be quite a mystery. I will let you guys know when I figure it out.

dblincoe
03-14-2012, 12:56 PM
Are transparencies suppose to come across too? I used the fix converter and viewer that Autodesk offers as a free download. Transparency doesn't import there either.

Amm_
03-15-2012, 02:05 PM
Are transparencies suppose to come across too? I used the fix converter and viewer that Autodesk offers as a free download. Transparency doesn't import there either.

They do come across in Max and Maya.

Motionbuilder wants opacity in the alpha channel of the diffuse texture. The FBX Viewer is basically a "play only" release of MotionBuilder. There is an option in the DAZ FBX Exporter to combine the diffuse and opacity maps into a single texture.

dblincoe
03-15-2012, 02:30 PM
Thanks Amm. I appreciate you looking at this. Seems like we always get these tools so close to working together. Definitely am enjoying adding Daz3d to the workflow!

fuzzytop
03-24-2012, 11:00 AM
I did this procedure with V4.2 and was able to export certain morphs but not all were available. I also noticed that ALL the available morphs (which were a lot) ended up crashing the file so I'm assuming there is a limit as to the number of morphs that can be exported?

Any explanation would be great!

Did anyone ever sort out the problems with exporting FBM using Victoria 4.2?

Is it impossible to get a good export with these older DAZ files? I have corrected for the weight map issue as per Craig Monins' FBX and LW tutorials (the maps being one joint off in LW when LW loads the FBX scene file). However I still get a mess, completely useless.

Is the only solution to use FBX simply as a mesh exporter, then rig it yerself (perhaps using Rhiggit Pro)? If so then wouldn't it be better to stick with OBJ export since it preserves the transparencies? Fixing up an OBJ file is a well known process, but this FBX stuff seems to be unworkable for older DAZ models (haven't tried Genesis figure since I'm not interested in those models).

Any advice?

fuzzytop
03-24-2012, 12:45 PM
Tried the basic Genesis figure and it loads perfectly, so the problem is with the older Victoria 4.2 model.

I could fool around for a long time here with joint weights on the messy Vicki 4.2 that LW makes of the FBM scene, but it's simply easier to use the mesh alone (with OBJ transparencies brought in) and rig with rhiggit pro.

Since I'm not using mocap for my project, I don't need the FBM joint rig.

I did find Craig Monins' tutorials very helpful on this whole subject:

http://rebelhill.net/html/lwandfbx.html

dblincoe
04-05-2012, 03:17 PM
While you are in the text editor to change your UV's you can also use the text editor to fix the Glossiness setting of 2000%. replace the following text:
P: "Shininess", "double", "Number", "",20
with
P: "ShininessExponent", "double", "Number", "",0.0

change 0.0 to what ever you want the glossiness to be set to in LW (1.0 = 100%).

dblincoe
04-05-2012, 03:57 PM
LW does not export transparencies of any kind in it's FBX exporter either. I've tried export a FBX from modeler and a scene from Layout. I have even moved the transparency to the clip map channel and it does not export. To check it out after exporting I looked at the file in a text editor and also reimported the FBX back into LW.

Is this a LW deficiency in writing and reading FBX or a function of the FBX file format itself?

safetyman
04-06-2012, 05:28 AM
.... but this FBX stuff seems to be unworkable for older DAZ models (haven't tried Genesis figure since I'm not interested in those models).

You're really missing out on a world of possibilities with the Genesis figure, especially if you have the Generation 3 & 4 morph packages for Genesis. I don't have these yet, but IMO it makes V4.2 obsolete, and you don't have to ditch all the clothing you may have. I find the Genesis figure's subdivision settings great for exporting a lower res mesh, which is easier to work with.

Mr Rid
04-06-2012, 02:52 PM
Havent had time to mess with Genesis much, but the problem was that you were looking at having to buy all your characters over again. And no one really used the bland base characters much, but more often the infinite injection morphs available for them. Now supposedly there is a way to modify Genesis characters into your old injection morphs, and also to make any old clothes and hair fit, but I'll bet you anything that is a glitchy, hair-pulling affair that just wont work with everything. Theres enough glitches and hair-pulling when just sticking with old characters, morphs, and accessories. Anyone reliably getting all that to work?

Philbert
04-06-2012, 03:02 PM
BTW I just saw in an email from Daz that the offer of free software was extended to the end of April.

http://www.daz3d.com/i/3d/free-3d-software-overview?

Afalk
04-07-2012, 01:46 AM
Havent had time to mess with Genesis much, but the problem was that you were looking at having to buy all your characters over again. And no one really used the bland base characters much, but more often the infinite injection morphs available for them. Now supposedly there is a way to modify Genesis characters into your old injection morphs, and also to make any old clothes and hair fit, but I'll bet you anything that is a glitchy, hair-pulling affair that just wont work with everything. Theres enough glitches and hair-pulling when just sticking with old characters, morphs, and accessories. Anyone reliably getting all that to work?

Happy to say that in my experimentation with Genesis I've had VERY LITTLE issue using my existing library of content for A4/V4/M4/F4/K4 with the figure. The auto-fit is not quite perfect but its a near thing. I am really pretty blown away by Genesis overall.

safetyman
04-07-2012, 05:33 AM
Shoes seem to give the most problems, mostly around the toes. Really any type of clothing that has "hard" parts that aren't supposed to completely conform to the figure's shape, like buckles and rings. However, the morph transfers are outstanding. From what I've seen, you can't tell the difference between V4 and Genesis with V4 morphs applied.

If you're having problems with clothing, try this: Once you've added your clothing to the Genesis figure, dial up a morph on the section of the figure that appears to be giving you problems. For instance, if you see some poke thru around the hips, dial up "Hip Volume", or "Hip Width", or whatever, to something larger. This transfers the morph to the clothing automatically. Dial it back down to 0 or what you had it set at, then select the clothing, find the morph in the Parameters tab, and dial up the morph until the poke thru goes away. Works great.

rcallicotte
04-15-2012, 07:00 AM
I do not see the bones, though I'm following the workflow suggested at the beginning of this thread.

prometheus
04-15-2012, 07:12 AM
I do not see the bones, though I'm following the workflow suggested at the beginning of this thread.

And you loaded the fbx as a scene not as an object? because if you load as object you wonīt get the correct fbx import options with joints and bones.

rcallicotte
04-15-2012, 08:17 AM
That is what it was. I need to think of an FBX as a scene file. Thanks so much.


And you loaded the fbx as a scene not as an object? because if you load as object you wonīt get the correct fbx import options with joints and bones.

safetyman
04-15-2012, 11:33 AM
Just as an additional tool in the pipeline, I found a group of scripts that allow you to open the Genesis base mesh (.dsf file) into Blender. There's also a morph import script and a UV import script (no textures though). Thread is here (important scripts are found on the second page): http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?thread_id=2834649
The morph stuff works great, importing individual morphs to Blender shape keys. However, since I'm not a Blender expert I noticed that applying partial morphs change a lot of the figure, even when that's not desired. Anyone know how to apply shape keys in Blender that don't affect the majority of the figure, or is it just a limitation of the import script?

prometheus
04-15-2012, 12:17 PM
Ahh...Blender, sorry I do not anything about that, wich means my comments are quite useless:D

I would hate to go the three generation route of exporting, from daz to blender to lightwave..huhh.

Might be useful for others thou.

safetyman
04-16-2012, 05:38 AM
Yeah, it may be a nominal point at best, but it potentially could save me TONS of time with the morph part (getting morphs into LW), because you get to select which morphs you want, rather than creating a rule in Daz for each morph during the export FBX phase.

Sad to say, but if Blender had an FBX import, I would use it for this process, rather than LW due to the community support for scripts like this.

LW works really well with FBX; getting the rig, morphs, textures, etc. so for now it's what works best.

starbase1
04-17-2012, 05:38 AM
Is anyone getting good results into LW version 10?

I'd settle for a static posed figure with props and clothing, plus recoverable textures...

Right now the only thing which seems to preserve the geometry for me is OBJ, which is a bit restricting to say the least. With FBX and DAE I get an entertaining mix of random distortions, including figure posed but clothes in T position, boots floating above the head, and items stretched in odd ways...

prometheus
04-17-2012, 06:28 AM
Is anyone getting good results into LW version 10?

I'd settle for a static posed figure with props and clothing, plus recoverable textures...

Right now the only thing which seems to preserve the geometry for me is OBJ, which is a bit restricting to say the least. With FBX and DAE I get an entertaining mix of random distortions, including figure posed but clothes in T position, boots floating above the head, and items stretched in odd ways...

why isnīt obj format working for you if itīs a static object?

starbase1
04-17-2012, 06:59 AM
why isnīt obj format working for you if itīs a static object?

Well, it sort of works but gets very messy I find.

For example, I often seem to get flipped polygons that 'unify normals' won't fix. Or when I flip them the smoothing looks odd, (renders as well as OGL).

Or if I subdivide smooth for a more smooth mesh it goes odd, (sometimes due to missed polygons that need flipping).

Two point and one point polys coming over.

Add that to the surface issues and its a real slog to get something clean out.


A couple of tips that might help others.

It took me a while to work out that Daz hair uses the transparency map to double as a mask for the specular channel. This to stop shiny highlights appearing between strands of hair.

Also, if you are importing a set of poses, you can save a lot of texturing effort if you can avoid changing the number / order of points by using morph targets:

1. Export a load of poses as OBJ
2. Load them into layers.
3. Clean up the first layer only.
4. Morph targets only use points, so if you set layer X as a morph target for layer 1, and save transformed, you will get the cleaned up model in a different pose.

rcallicotte
04-21-2012, 04:57 PM
Okay, now I realize this is WEIRD, but I hope someone else is seeing this. I even placed a bug report, because I can't see it as anything else.

I updated to LW11.01. In LW11, I could load OBJs and even had some moved over into Layout, rendered, etc. Once I installed LW11.01, I began getting a message like the attachment. Note the // instead of the / after the DAZ folder and just before the Maps folder. The MTL does not have this double backslash.

I cannot use any of the OBJs I had in LW10.1 or LW11, at all.

These same objects load fine in LW10.1.

Any sort of help would be appreciated, especially if you've seen this problem.

DigitalSorcery8
04-21-2012, 05:06 PM
Well, it sort of works but gets very messy I find.

For example, I often seem to get flipped polygons that 'unify normals' won't fix. Or when I flip them the smoothing looks odd, (renders as well as OGL).

Or if I subdivide smooth for a more smooth mesh it goes odd, (sometimes due to missed polygons that need flipping).

Two point and one point polys coming over.

Add that to the surface issues and its a real slog to get something clean out.

This sounds like a DAZ studio problem. I've exported OBJ's out of Poser - props, body's, clothing, etc. - and everything comes through just fine with zero flipped poly's.

ben martin
04-21-2012, 05:22 PM
This sounds like a DAZ studio problem. I've exported OBJ's out of Poser - props, body's, clothing, etc. - and everything comes through just fine with zero flipped poly's.

No it is not a DSStudio problem.
It was working fine with LW10.1 and LW11.
It is a bad habit to blame 3rd party software to excuse recurrent LW update problems.
NT is well known for usually do this kind of stuff, fix something to broke other stuff around. Go figure, maybe it is a clever way to make work assurance (make it going and going). :)

DigitalSorcery8
04-21-2012, 05:38 PM
No it is not a DSStudio problem.
It was working fine with LW10.1 and LW11.
It is a bad habit to blame 3rd party software to excuse recurrent LW update problems.
NT is well known for usually do this kind of stuff, fix something to broke other stuff around. Go figure, maybe it is a clever way to make work assurance (make it going and going). :)

Sorry, I should have mentioned that I was using LW9.6. Exporting from Poser in OBJ works flawlessly. I have not tried DAZ studio with LW, but if exporting from Poser to LW9.6 works fine, it seems that DAZ studio to LW9.6 via OBJ should also work fine. Of course this may be a LW 10 or LW11 problem then.

rcallicotte
04-21-2012, 06:25 PM
It's definitely something with the switch to 11.0.1 - LW11 seemed to be fine, but since the update I cannot use in version 11 or 11.0.1.

Since 10.1 works fine, it's easier to assume something is broken in 11.

Anyone try this to see if what I'm doing is repeatable on your end? All you need to do is create something (anything) in DS4 (I used 64bit) and then export a usual OBJ file with the textures. Nothing fancy. Then open it in Modeler in LW 11.0.1. If you can and nothing is wrong, then I'm stumped.

ben martin
04-22-2012, 09:33 AM
Ok, this time NT is absolutely innocent.

All is working fine.
My bad for talking without checking it first... but you know, it wouldn't be the first time NT does such mistake, so I kinda get used to.
Again, my bad form making a wrong assumption.

Rcallicotte , about the problem.

Just export from DS using the OBJ filter options (seem image 1)
As you can see, all works fine with Layout and Modeler if you use the DStudio OBJ options I mention in image 1.

Good Luck.

rcallicotte
04-22-2012, 04:27 PM
Hi Ben Thanks, but are you using 11.0? It looks like it from the screenshots. When I run 11.0.1, it shows at the top and that is where I started having problems. 11.0 was fine, until I updated.




Ok, this time NT is absolutely innocent.

All is working fine.
My bad for talking without checking it first... but you know, it wouldn't be the first time NT does such mistake, so I kinda get used to.
Again, my bad form making a wrong assumption.

Rcallicotte , about the problem.

Just export from DS using the OBJ filter options (seem image 1)
As you can see, all works fine with Layout and Modeler if you use the DStudio OBJ options I mention in image 1.

Good Luck.

ben martin
04-22-2012, 07:59 PM
You were right about me using 11, but here you have 11.0.1 and the result is the same. It is working.
The specular maps load raised up to 100% but that's easy to correct/set up.

rcallicotte
04-22-2012, 08:17 PM
Okay. I appreciate your time.

Now to troubleshoot what's happening...



You were right about me using 11, but here you have 11.0.1 and the result is the same. It is working.
The specular maps load raised up to 100% but that's easy to correct/set up.

dblincoe
04-30-2012, 02:06 PM
Is it normal for the paths in the FBX file to textures to be absolute paths and not relative. I would think they would be relative to the FBX file, but mine or being written as absolute path. When I transfer my files to another computer the FBX file won't load the textures.

Any ideas. I can change the path in a text editor. Is there a setting to use during export or is this typical for a reason.

ben martin
05-02-2012, 03:20 AM
Is it normal for the paths in the FBX file to textures to be absolute paths and not relative. I would think they would be relative to the FBX file, but mine or being written as absolute path. When I transfer my files to another computer the FBX file won't load the textures.

Any ideas. I can change the path in a text editor. Is there a setting to use during export or is this typical for a reason.

From my point of view, makes sense that the FBX export keeps a relation to the folder were all the export material was initial saved/exported to.

If you keep all files inside the root-folder and move it around, I guess it won't make any difference and all will load up pretty nice.

Instead, if for any given reason, you move the content from the root folder to any other drive/path/folder, probably things will start to get lost in the way.

I dunno, I really didn’t test this, and I’m sorry for that.
Usually I don’t reply about tech stuff if it was not verified first but I can’t do it right now (from where I am) and I’m not sure if I got your question from the correct point of view as well.

sami
01-17-2013, 11:21 AM
Okay, folks; I just worked out the following process to export all of the facial morphs from DAZ3D Pro to LightWave:

EXPORTING CHARACTER FACIAL MORPHS FROM DAZ3D TO LIGHTWAVE

1. In DAZ3D, select all parts of the character from the "Scene" tab.
2. Select "File | Export..."
3. Ensure that "Files of type:" drop-down box reads "Autodesk FBX (.fbx)
4. Click "Save"
5. Press the "Edit Morphs Export Rules" button in the "FBX Options" screen
6. Click "Add"
7. For the new rule, under "Match" enter "head."
8. Under "Action" select "Export"
9. Press "Accept".
10. Press "Accept" once again.
11. Allow the export to complete.
12. Open up the FBX scene file in LightWave 10.1 or later.
13. Select the "Genesis_Shape" object
14. Press "p" for properties.
15. Select the "Deform" tab.
16. Double-click on the "Morph Mixer" link at the bottom (NOTE: You should see 162 endomorphs)
17. Review the morphs on your character.

It works. It works like a charm.

Just had to share. :)

Sorry to revive this old thread, I just tried what you said here in 11.03 coming from Daz3D Studio 4.5 using an M4 character, and the morphs don't show up - nor does the surfacing - plus clothing is not conformed to the chracter anymore and he is floating off the ground. Any ideas? thanks :)

short223
01-17-2013, 02:18 PM
Using characters like M4 or V4 etc is not the same as the Genesis model. Not all the "morphs" will be seen in the list or be exported (since some are a combination of bones and morphs). I don't think conforming object will work with FBX but only an obj export in that particular state. You may want to export the clothing by itself with the OBJ export. The basic surfacing does come through provided it is packaged properly but only the basic settings of color maps, spec, bump and transp. (I think)
The best method would be to export the figure through FBX in the rest position and export the clothing as OBJ by itself after you have conformed it to the rest position.

sami
01-17-2013, 04:34 PM
Using characters like M4 or V4 etc is not the same as the Genesis model. Not all the "morphs" will be seen in the list or be exported (since some are a combination of bones and morphs). I don't think conforming object will work with FBX but only an obj export in that particular state. You may want to export the clothing by itself with the OBJ export. The basic surfacing does come through provided it is packaged properly but only the basic settings of color maps, spec, bump and transp. (I think)
The best method would be to export the figure through FBX in the rest position and export the clothing as OBJ by itself after you have conformed it to the rest position.

Thanks for your reply. I'll try exporting clothing by itself and see if that works. But from what you said is exporting into a posed position possible? It seems the M4 character is coming in zeroed? and no surfaces at all (at least in FBX format) although it does compile the textures to the export folder. Does OBJ out of Daz work better? Does it make a difference that I started out with a Poser Pro 2010 file loaded into Daz? Daz loaded it flawlessly and it looks awesome in Daz - I was hoping that Daz could get me a posed, textured, morphable character with less fiddling about than Poser.

Sorry for all the questions, but can you clarify the posing stuff if I don't want the zeroed "rest position" also which exporter (it's not clear in this thread) is the one to use for FBX - I used the 2012 & 2011 and they both did the same thing. Thanks!

short223
02-19-2013, 07:10 AM
Sorry for the delayed response (haven't been monitoring the posts for a while). I'm not fully versed in DAZstudio as to its export capabilities but my procedure is that if I am planning on adding bones, I will export out an FBX from DAZsudio. If I need a specific pose for a still rendering, I will export out an OBJ file from Poser (which requires more work to properly surface it). Haven't had the time to experiment and find out what the procedure is to get a frozen pose out of DAZstudio.

Pretty much all of the models I use are non Genesis models so I am very interested in finding out if it is possible to export out ANY morphs associated with the files (many don't seem to) or a best procedure to get the bones in without it coming in wrong (for some reason the models get moved off its original center when it is parented to the set of bones.....

Afalk
02-19-2013, 10:25 AM
IMHO ::: Best Practises for using Daz as an anchor in your workflow.

For Animated/Rigged non-Genesis figures -- Daz Studio THREE - ADVANCE or PRO, I say again DS3. Use the Digami Game Developers Kit to get your FBX export. Works like a bloody charm, each time & every time (Daz figures or NON Daz figures)

If you want Animated/Rigged Genesis support --->> Das Studio 4 Pro <-- yep, said DS 4 not 4.5. With Daz release 4.5... behind the scenes Daz seems to be abandoning pre-genesis figures (just like in thier content store) -- so support is miserable at best. Couple that w/the .5 release having being rushed and I am not surprised that even Genesis support can be wonky. I find the 4.0 main release to be more stable for FBX exporting.

Static non-Genesis exports (works for Genesis) :: OBJ export is your friend.

short223
02-19-2013, 02:22 PM
Thanks for the info!

JMCarrigan
02-19-2013, 02:34 PM
I ran across this thread as I was looking for some info regarding the demo for LW 11.5 and Genesis Vicky dancing with the skirt acting with dynamics.
I haven't found that yet but just going through this has put me light-years ahead of my previous location. Thank you thank you. To all actually.

Mr Rid
03-12-2013, 05:19 PM
The MDD export from Daz is working in LW if you select the 'Modo' preset. The 'Lightwave' preset results in a mess when applied in LW.

BVH mocap applies in Daz in a snap. If you just needed a character walking around in a scene background, the easiest thing seems to be to drop a walk mocap on a character in Daz (AniMate is a drag and drop but motion is not usually smooth), then export an MDD and OBJ from Daz, load and tweak in LW. This bypasses messing with rigs altogether.

Afalk
03-13-2013, 06:31 AM
Good suggestion mr Rid !

Magnus81
05-19-2013, 01:54 AM
The MDD export from Daz is working in LW if you select the 'Modo' preset. The 'Lightwave' preset results in a mess when applied in LW.

BVH mocap applies in Daz in a snap. If you just needed a character walking around in a scene background, the easiest thing seems to be to drop a walk mocap on a character in Daz (AniMate is a drag and drop but motion is not usually smooth), then export an MDD and OBJ from Daz, load and tweak in LW. This bypasses messing with rigs altogether.

I must be a moron, because I can't get MDD from daz load without the point order blowing up. Can you give me some more details? You're using MD_Reader under Deform in LW, right? I don't know which application is at fault here. Daz or LW?

Mr Rid
05-19-2013, 06:27 PM
I must be a moron, because I can't get MDD from daz load without the point order blowing up. Can you give me some more details? You're using MD_Reader under Deform in LW, right? I don't know which application is at fault here. Daz or LW?


Be sure to use the Modo preset when exporting from Daz, and yes the MDD Reader. For me, it works out of DS 4.5 Advanced, but not DS4.

I've never understood why ClothFX and SoftFX wont read MDDs from the MDD Baker, or other sources like Daz(?).

digitaldoc
05-19-2013, 07:29 PM
Is it normal for the paths in the FBX file to textures to be absolute paths and not relative. I would think they would be relative to the FBX file, but mine or being written as absolute path. When I transfer my files to another computer the FBX file won't load the textures.

Any ideas. I can change the path in a text editor. Is there a setting to use during export or is this typical for a reason.

If you move your fbx file into the folder with the texture images, it seems to find them perfectly.

Magnus81
05-19-2013, 10:51 PM
Be sure to use the Modo preset when exporting from Daz, and yes the MDD Reader. For me, it works out of DS 4.5 Advanced, but not DS4.

I've never understood why ClothFX and SoftFX wont read MDDs from the MDD Baker, or other sources like Daz(?).
No matter what I do, the point order is corrupted. I've tried this with Daz 4.5 and LW 11.5, and Daz 4.6 and LW 11.5. Nothing works right. Here's what I've tried:
01. Animated the daz character in Daz.

02. export OBJ with MODO preset with the character in both t pose and and another one of it on the animated first frame pose (So I've tried both poses)

03. exported the MDD file with Modo preset (With both poses)

04. Loaded both daz characters, one in posed position, the other in default pose postition.

05. loaded mdd via MD_Reader to both OBJ's, and

point order is blown up everytime!! I can't getthis figured out.
Can anyone help me?!?!:stumped:

safetyman
05-20-2013, 10:22 AM
They just released a new version of Daz (4.6). Haven't used it yet, but maybe they addressed your issue.

Magnus81
05-20-2013, 12:01 PM
They just released a new version of Daz (4.6). Haven't used it yet, but maybe they addressed your issue.

I spent all night testing, and FINALLY got it to work. I wrote down the process step by step so I wouldn't forget! I'm thinking about making a video about it. My problem was the MD_Reader in Lightwave, as soon as I downloaded the DP Kit and used MDD_Pointer everything worked fine. Thanks for the help guys!

Magnus81
05-20-2013, 12:14 PM
Here's a quickly thrown together guide of what worked for me.

Daz Studio 4.6 PRO and Lightwave 11.5
NOTE: you will need to purchase the aniMate2 plugin for Daz studio to export MDD files which currently costs aproxximately $50 USD
available here: http://www.daz3d.com/animate2


01. Load up the Daz scene

02. Animate the Daz characters

03. Hide other layers of characters to isolate just the character without hair or clothes and export as OBJ using Lightwave preset

04. Next export MDD file of animation of that character using Modo preset

05. Goto http://dpont.pagesperso-orange.fr/plugins/nodes/Additionnal_Nodes_2.html and download the DP kit additional Nodes

06. Open up Lightwave Layout and add the DP Kit nodes plugin

07. Import the Daz character OBj into Layout

08. With the object selected, press "P" to open the objects properties, and select the Deform tab.

09. Check the box next to "EDIT NODES" to enable the nodal system, and then open up the node editor

10. If you loaded the DP Kit nodes plugin you should see a "DP Kit" column under the list of nodes.

11. Add the MDD Pointer node found under the under DP KIT->DISPLACEMENT

12. Open the MDD Pointer node and load the MDD file you exported from Daz.

13. Drag the blue output node labeld "Delta" into the Displacement node input labeled "Input"

14. Next step, do a little victory dance!

15. Repeat these steps for each layer in Daz, except for step 14. That one is optional :rock:

JMCarrigan
05-21-2013, 03:01 PM
How does one hide other layers of characters? (Now I'll probable figure it out.) YEP. I figured it out. Thanks.

photoguy1278
05-21-2013, 03:51 PM
I was wondering about a different pipeline from Daz Studio that maybe you folks could add some of your insight to. I want to be able to just generate a Daz character modeled to an approximate shape in Daz, then brought over for me to do everything else in Lightwave: tweak the shape, rig with my own rig, and animate in Lightwave. I tried bringing the Genesis character into modeller via FBX which works fairly well by my noob estimation. The problem I'm encountering is that the mesh may be too dense for rigging and getting nice deformations. 16.5 K polys seems excessive so I was wondering what ideas you have that could make this process more streamlined.

Magnus81
05-21-2013, 04:01 PM
How does one hide other layers of characters? (Now I'll probable figure it out.) YEP. I figured it out. Thanks.
Hehe. Forgot to mention that part!


The reason I'm too interested in importing via FBX is because it doesn't bring in all of the complicated blendshapes and smoothing operations that Daz is applying. I noticed this the most in the traditional trouble areas ( Shoulders and hips area). Believe me, once you compare the deformation in daz studio and lightwave with FBX, the Daz deformations look way better.
Just my two cents!

Magnus81
05-21-2013, 04:04 PM
I was wondering about a different pipeline from Daz Studio that maybe you folks could add some of your insight to. I want to be able to just generate a Daz character modeled to an approximate shape in Daz, then brought over for me to do everything else in Lightwave: tweak the shape, rig with my own rig, and animate in Lightwave. I tried bringing the Genesis character into modeller via FBX which works fairly well by my noob estimation. The problem I'm encountering is that the mesh may be too dense for rigging and getting nice deformations. 16.5 K polys seems excessive so I was wondering what ideas you have that could make this process more streamlined.
not sure about the whole process, but if you need to reduce the poly count, look into this program: http://www.mariussilaghi.com/products/subd-recovery

I haven't used it personally, but it should work for what you want to do. Good luck.

Greenlaw
05-21-2013, 04:17 PM
The reason I'm too interested in importing via FBX is because it doesn't bring in all of the complicated blendshapes and smoothing operations that Daz is applying. I noticed this the most in the traditional trouble areas ( Shoulders and hips area). Believe me, once you compare the deformation in daz studio and lightwave with FBX, the Daz deformations look way better.
Just my two cents!

This is just my opinion:

For CA, the common workflow for FBX would be to rig your character in LightWave using the same hierarchy, and using Lightwave's native deformation and shading options. Don't try to get this stuff through FBX--if you're rendering in LightWave, it's better to set up this part of the process in LightWave. What you want the FBX for is motion data. Assuming the hierarchy between DAZ and LightWave is uninterrupted, you can use Load Items From Scene, select the FBX and enable Merge Only Motion Envelopes--this option will transfer only the motion data from the FBX to your rigged character in LightWave. This is essential the workflow we use FBX for our short films when bringing in mocap data we've recorded to LightWave. We also use FBX to match cameras between LightWave, Motion Builder and Fusion

I don't know if DAZ supports MDD but if you really want the DAZ deformations, MDD or Vertex cache is the way to go. This is what we typically use when we need Maya rigged animations to import to LightWave with the original Maya deformations. As with the above method, for the best results, the shading should be entirely done in LightWave and not transferred from Maya or other 3D programs--otherwise you're creating a lot of extra work for yourself with lesser results.

Hope this helps.

G.

Magnus81
05-21-2013, 04:25 PM
This is just my opinion:

For CA, the common workflow for FBX would be to rig your character in LightWave using the same hierarchy, and using Lightwave's native deformation and shading options. Don't try to get this stuff through FBX--if you're rendering in LightWave, it's better to set up this part of the process in LightWave. What you want the FBX for is motion data. Assuming the hierarchy between DAZ and LightWave is uninterrupted, you can use Load Items From Scene, select the FBX and enable Merge Only Motion Envelopes--this option will transfer only the motion data from the FBX to your rigged character in LightWave. This is essential the workflow we use FBX for our short films when bringing in mocap data we've recorded to LightWave. We also use FBX to match cameras between LightWave, Motion Builder and Fusion

I don't know if DAZ supports MDD but if you really want the DAZ deformations, MDD or Vertex cache is the way to go. This is what we typically use when we need Maya rigged animations to import to LightWave with the original Maya deformations. As with the above method, for the best results, the shading should be entirely done in LightWave and not transferred from Maya or other 3D programs--otherwise you're creating a lot of extra work for yourself with lesser results.

Hope this helps.

G.


I did a qucik and dirty tut on mdd export from daz in post #161 just a few posts back. Took a while to figure it out though.

Greenlaw
05-21-2013, 04:35 PM
Thanks for the info! I thought it might but obviously I just skimmed this thread and wasn't sure. That's good to know that it does. :p

That said, the FBX workflow described above is fairly typical if the intention is to use LightWave for final quality shading and deformation--you shouldn't expect to get the shading and deformation to come through FBX intact, so most users don't bother; they just pull the motion data from FBX and apply it to final shaded setups in LightWave.

G.

Magnus81
05-21-2013, 04:43 PM
Thanks for the info! I thought it might but obviously I just skimmed this thread and wasn't sure. That's good to know that it does. :p

That said, the FBX workflow described above is fairly typical if the intention is to use LightWave for final quality shading and deformation--you shouldn't expect to get the shading and deformation to come through FBX intact, so most users don't bother; they just pull the motion data from FBX and apply it to final shaded setups in LightWave.

G.
ah, i see. Yeah, the mdd method obviously doesn't do a thing for shading. You have to setup texures and images again. If only there were a push button feature......maybe someday!

photoguy1278
05-22-2013, 11:45 AM
The only reason I used FBX from DAZ is because the textures seem to load well in Lightwave. With the various rigging systems I'm pretty sure I can get the mesh to deform well, especially if I can reduce the poly's (even if just in certain areas like shoulders and hips). I'm wondering if anyone has been doing the same thing, rigging, animating, and rendering, genesis in Lightwave. I'm not convinced yet that I need to abandon this idea and do animation in Daz when I have a whole professional program like Lightwave that should be able to do everything. The only reason I use Daz is to quickly grab a high quality figure approximated to any shape to save me modeling time in Lightwave. I guess I'm wondering about several things here ( model import with textures, poly reduction, and rig/deform/anim workflow).

Magnus81
05-22-2013, 12:55 PM
The only reason I used FBX from DAZ is because the textures seem to load well in Lightwave. With the various rigging systems I'm pretty sure I can get the mesh to deform well, especially if I can reduce the poly's (even if just in certain areas like shoulders and hips). I'm wondering if anyone has been doing the same thing, rigging, animating, and rendering, genesis in Lightwave. I'm not convinced yet that I need to abandon this idea and do animation in Daz when I have a whole professional program like Lightwave that should be able to do everything. The only reason I use Daz is to quickly grab a high quality figure approximated to any shape to save me modeling time in Lightwave. I guess I'm wondering about several things here ( model import with textures, poly reduction, and rig/deform/anim workflow).


Several of posts back I put a link to a subdivision recovery program that can restore a figure to it's original subdivision level. Using that you should be able to get the polys down to a manageable level to rig and animate in LW. If you manage to make it all work, please share some details with us.

Greenlaw
05-22-2013, 02:41 PM
not sure about the whole process, but if you need to reduce the poly count, look into this program: http://www.mariussilaghi.com/products/subd-recovery

That's looks great! I can recall many situations when I needed something like this. I'll check it out soon.

G.

Mr Rid
05-22-2013, 05:59 PM
Similarly, Zbrush has a one-click tool for reducing quads, but I wonder if this tool has the same drawback of losing all surfaces on the exported mesh. I had to tediously redefine each surface on a daz character.

Mr Rid
05-22-2013, 06:36 PM
Hehe. Forgot to mention that part!


The reason I'm too interested in importing via FBX is because it doesn't bring in all of the complicated blendshapes and smoothing operations that Daz is applying. I noticed this the most in the traditional trouble areas ( Shoulders and hips area). Believe me, once you compare the deformation in daz studio and lightwave with FBX, the Daz deformations look way better.
Just my two cents!

Each app has its own way of handling deforms that are not going to convert. Daz is doing special things under the hood to get nice deforms, like mysterious 'triaxial weights.' So the crude FBX exported rig, with awful joint deforms is worthless to me.

I dont know why you're MDD reader was not working but am glad MDD_Pointer is. Why Reader, Pointer, Cloth/Soft do not bake/read MDDs interchangeably is something NT should iron out.

But for several years now, this Daz pipeline is something I really think NT, Daz/Poser, iPi, etc, should collaborate on, streamline and promote as a complete character solution, especially for previz that I often do. On dozens of projects, both pro and personal, it is highly inefficient to model, texture and rig generic characters from scratch at this point in CG evolution (since LW5, I've wondered why LW did not come with a generic male and female character, and solid generic rig to switch out custom characters with). I often need crowds or a few CG people with generic behavior in a scene (keyframed and/or mocapped), but the pipeline remains convoluted, with too many apps and glitchy conversions involved (editing in MoBuilder). And I usually want the Daz morphs to export into LW in one step so I can animate facial expressions, speech, muscle flexing, and transformations without rigging, but that feature broke in Daz 4. And I dont think theres a way to have morphs override MDD, as in animating the face on a character baked out of Daz.

photoguy1278
05-22-2013, 07:14 PM
On the daz forum, someone strongly suggested this plug in to reduce polys in quads while retaining textures. It has a 30 day trial after which it would need to be registered to continue. I am yet to try it as I only have a Mac at my disposal. That will change soon, but if anyone feels like trying, go for it. He said he did this on a genesis character in 3D Browser ( a different 3d software) but its available for LW. He posted these attached images. http://www.mootools.com/plugins/us/polygoncruncher/index.aspx

Greenlaw
05-22-2013, 07:28 PM
...I dont think theres a way to have morphs override MDD, as in animating the face on a character baked out of Daz.

I've done it. Here's how:

1. Apply the .mdd using MD Reader.
2. Apply ClothFX then click Scan Motion at the bottom of the the File tab. This basically re-bakes the .mdd for FX Tools.
3. Remove MD Reader.
4 Now, import a second copy of the object and parent it to the first. You can hide the first object now if you wish, but at the very least make it Unseen by Camera.
5. Select the second object and first apply FX_MetaLink, and then apply FX_MetaLink Morph. Finally, add Morph Mixer. Now you should be able to use Morph Mixer data on top of the MDD data.

Yeah, it's convoluted, but it does work. I wish there was an easier way to do this though.

G.

Greenlaw
05-22-2013, 07:32 PM
BTW, if your mesh is really dense, the performance is probably going to slow down--a lot. What I do when I'm finished with the setup is I bake the second object (the one with Morph Mixer applied) so I have a single 'master' .mdd, and then I remove all the junk underneath. I Multi-Baker for the final baking--it's just easier.

G.

Mr Rid
05-23-2013, 03:40 AM
I forgot I did this a few months ago (for a slightly different MetaLink purpose) on a dense mesh, in a long scene, which took forever to rebake using SoftFX. It worked at first, but the first time I reloaded the scene, SoftFX mysteriously ignored the new MDD, and none of the other MDD tools would read it either(?). Annoying, after it took so damm long.

Greenlaw
05-23-2013, 04:43 AM
I forgot I did this a few months ago (for a slightly different MetaLink purpose) on a dense mesh, in a long scene, which took forever to rebake using SoftFX. It worked at first, but the first time I reloaded the scene, SoftFX mysteriously ignored the new MDD, and none of the other MDD tools would read it either(?). Annoying, after it took so damm long.

That might have been a memory issue--it sounds like it was a huge file. One of the DP tools has the ability to load only a single frame of MDD in RAM which helps for rendering incredibly huge MDD files, but you'll be giving up interactivity and of course that won't help with scanning either. :(

Let me think about it. I think I ran into something like this during DmC--I'll check my notes if I still have them.

G

digitaldoc
05-23-2013, 05:00 AM
not sure about the whole process, but if you need to reduce the poly count, look into this program: http://www.mariussilaghi.com/products/subd-recovery

I haven't used it personally, but it should work for what you want to do. Good luck.

Has anyone used this?

Does it preserve UV's at all?

Looks great but can't really test drive before you buy.

Greenlaw
05-23-2013, 09:41 AM
According to the website it does. I'll check it out this afternoon.

Sub-D Recovery interests me over Polygon Cruncher because it attempt to restore the original sub-d level rather than arbitrarily decimate the geometry.

If it's decimation you want, I recommend Balancer nPro (http://www.atangeo.com/products). This let's you apply different levels of decimation on a mesh based on surfaces and other properties, plus it's fully interactive. And yes, it preserves UV maps too! I use it mainly for terrain and other meshes that I don't intend to deform.

If you need to reduce deforming geometry, it's better to retopologize the mesh using 3D Coat, TopoGun or ZBrush. If you use 3DC you can re-bake the textures from the old mesh to conform to the UV maps on the new mesh. (You can do this in ZBrush too but I haven't used ZBrush this way myself yet.) This is definitely more work but it's the proper way to do it.

Otherwise, assuming the mesh exists in quads, use the Sub-D Recovery tool mentioned above. This should at least give you something closer to the origianl base mesh.

G.

photoguy1278
05-23-2013, 10:54 AM
Has anyone used this?

Does it preserve UV's at all?

Looks great but can't really test drive before you buy.

Check out the link I posted a few posts back. This has a 30 day trial but I don't have windows to try it.

digitaldoc
05-23-2013, 10:58 AM
Check out the link I posted a few posts back. This has a 30 day trial but I don't have windows to try it.

Thanks. I had tried that, it converts to tris.

I did buy the 3D Browser Pro for converting my LW models to other formats for sale on Turbosquid.

The nice thing about Sub-D Recovery is that you end up with quads.

Greenlaw
05-23-2013, 12:14 PM
@Mr. Rid, I haven't had time to look for my notes yet, but I did think about it. Would it be possible to scan separate segments of a scene and save an .mdd for each segment range? Then you could render multiple scenes with smaller .mdd files. You may need to manually offset the .mdds to the appropriate frame ranges when you load them into each 'sub-scene' so that the total number of frames render in proper sequence. Just a thought.

G.

Mr Rid
05-24-2013, 03:17 AM
@Mr. Rid, I haven't had time to look for my notes yet, but I did think about it. Would it be possible to scan separate segments of a scene and save an .mdd for each segment range? Then you could render multiple scenes with smaller .mdd files. You may need to manually offset the .mdds to the appropriate frame ranges when you load them into each 'sub-scene' so that the total number of frames render in proper sequence. Just a thought.

G.

Thanks for considering Dennis. When I get a minute I will re-examine the problem MDD again. Its not that big a file.

prometheus
06-05-2013, 08:46 AM
testing daz exports again trough fbx..I thought I knew this and have done it before.
The problem..I was testing a simple walk cycle from cgshare, just an animate block.

I baked it to studio keyframes..and it lasts for 36 frames, export works fine with fbx, and if I play the timeline it walks as it should
for 36 frames, the fbx bone hiearchy standin is not moving though, and I would like to extend the animation by selecting all curves in graph editor and use offset repeat for the post behavior, the problem is as mentioned that the fbx bone hiearchy standin is fixed on the same place and thus deforming the body stronger and stronger depending on how far the genesis shape mesh is from it.
See image attached.

I must be missing something simple here?
Daz 4.0.3.47 pro 64 bit
Lightwave 11.03 32 bit

JMCarrigan
06-06-2013, 03:37 PM
I don't know if it matters but there's a 4.6 DazStudio out - still free

prometheus
06-06-2013, 04:02 PM
I don't know if it matters but there's a 4.6 DazStudio out - still free

Yeah I will try that out...not sure if the fbx export is better now, or if something got ruined though.

I havenīt checked in to my problem with the fbx standin bone, Im sure I am just doing something wrong here, I actually think I knew what I had to do to avoid this, but Ivé lost track of that.

JMCarrigan
06-06-2013, 05:30 PM
Yeah I will try that out...not sure if the fbx export is better now, or if something got ruined though.

I havenīt checked in to my problem with the fbx standin bone, Im sure I am just doing something wrong here, I actually think I knew what I had to do to avoid this, but Ivé lost track of that.

This is beside the point, but I lose track alla time. I've had to get a nice little recorder.

jhinrichs
08-26-2013, 07:20 AM
Anybody tried to load a FBX Daz char with head morphs lately?

I'm using Lightwave 11.5.1 and the latest version of Daz Studio 4.6. I'm loading a basic Genesis character, adding '0 head Export' to the morph export rules and exporting a FBX. (see enclosed) When I try to load the FBX into Modeler or Layout it crashes. I know it used to work, I've done it in the past but it's been a year or so since I tried.

116610

- - - Updated - - -

P.S. the image shows FBX 2011, but I've tried FBX 2012 as well...same deal

GraphXs
08-26-2013, 08:40 PM
It works fine over here. I know if I want a specific morph, I need to key it to come along for the ride on export. One thing I do to keep the rig good is also key a "rest" pose in daz at frame zero. That works pretty good! All poses are correct... The only issue I have is the rotation of the gizmos in lightwave are not aligned to a bones local access? Anyone know how to fix this??? All the bones rotation transforms are always "straight" down a axis. The rest pose bones are slightly bent in the arms, fingers etc. The bone follows the shape correctly but the rotation transform doesn't. I tried re-retesting the bones with no luck. Is there a way to rotate a bone pivot only to fix this???

Anyone?

SPICE
10-12-2013, 01:36 AM
Anybody tried to load a FBX Daz char with head morphs lately?

I'm using Lightwave 11.5.1 and the latest version of Daz Studio 4.6. I'm loading a basic Genesis character, adding '0 head Export' to the morph export rules and exporting a FBX. (see enclosed) When I try to load the FBX into Modeler or Layout it crashes. I know it used to work, I've done it in the past but it's been a year or so since I tried.

116610

- - - Updated - - -

P.S. the image shows FBX 2011, but I've tried FBX 2012 as well...same deal


Same problem here
Try it with 2011 and 2012, Bin and Asci
all workes fine without MORPHs

LW 11.6 /DAZ4.6

LW_Will
10-15-2013, 04:26 PM
Hmm... I can extract a model with morphs (ANY morphs... editable) with Daz Studio 4.5 Pro / FBX 2012 - Binary.

Haven't upgraded to 4.6 yet. Don't think I will... ;-)

starbase1
10-17-2013, 09:34 AM
I've been doing quite a bot of conversion lately, and it'#s all rather repetitive stuff - select all surfaces and set smoothing on at about 25 degrees, remove specular except for eyes and mouth surfaces, check the transparency of the cornea is 100% with a tight highlight...

The surface names for the figures (which is where most stuff needs doing for this) are consistent, so I'm wondering how hard it would be to knock up a script for this. I've not done one before but it should be fairly easy I'd have thought...

Anyone got advice on how to get started with this sort of thing? Is it possible?

Nick

starbase1
10-17-2013, 01:50 PM
We need some pics!

Here's one based on two exported daz objects I sent to lightwave for better lighting and camera and render options...

Afalk
10-20-2013, 10:42 PM
Personally I use Daz Studio 3 Advanced with the Game Developers Kit (covers all V4 and earlier figures for export - with morphs -- plus it works great for Unity)... for Genesis I have a copy of Daz 4.037 that can export genesis -- though I believe 3A can export genesis too. (I even have some old videos on my youtube channel demonstrating the Daz->Unity thing)

For rendering and more general purpose uses though, I have Poser Fusion working with Poser Pro -- which exports flawlessly -- I can use all my Daz/poser animations and do my rendering in LW. I can also get clean base meshes (though w/o morphs) for rigging etc (I plan to use them as references versus an exported model from DAZ and experiment with re-rigging the DAZ 3 ADV characters using Nevron and my library of mocap files), that way I can bring the morph targets with me.

starbase1
10-21-2013, 09:10 AM
When you say poser pro export flawlessly, does that include things like transparency and specular settings?

prometheus
10-21-2013, 10:59 AM
Let us get this straight..
Poser pro..does it really export out bones so you can edit it inside of lightwave? like daz does? or isnīt it just working as a host scenefile.. meaning all edit of bones and animation must be done in poser?

Michael

Afalk
10-21-2013, 11:46 AM
Poser Fusion is exporting transparency as well.

As for the animation side of things :: Poser Fusion exports - are non-rigged models and have no (in LW) usable morphs either. They do however, retain their quads and their surfacing which is brought over accurately.

Daz Studio 3 Advanced w/GameDev Kit exports v4 and earlier characters, with their morphs etc as FBX files. There are still issues as has been discussed in this thread, but the meat of it is there.

So -- if I have a self contained little animation or a character/setting whathaveyou, that I'd like to render in LW -- Poser Fusion is the way I recommend. If I want to animate in Lightwave instead (or anywhere but Daz/Poser) the FBX method from Daz Studio lets me keep my morphs, and can support moderately complex animations itself.

Honestly though, this set of cases was one reason I purchsed Nevron Motion since I have a huge library of MoCap and a few other tools that should make LW centric animating far more doable.

So if I want a "lighter" character, I'll export the figure from Poser and get a clean LWO w/o morphs to animate with and it'll have no bone data there at all (just the poser motion modifier (aka MDD renamed under the hood) ... HOWEVER, if I want morphs embedded and plan on animating from scratch, then it'll be an FBX export from Daz -- after which I will gratefully now, toss their skelly in the garbage and use Genoma/Nevron to rig it up instead, or Messiah I suppose, if I'm feeling particularly hands on.

I hope that helps clarify what i was saying.

Afalk
10-21-2013, 11:49 AM
@Michael : another note for you in terms of animation -- even giving the 'boneless/mdd' nature of PoserFusion, you can animate the whole enchilada within Daz Studio (animate+ etc) or in Carrara for that matter (with the Animate plugin of course hehe) and then export that animation to poser and take the whole enchilada across via Fusion for the rendering side of things.

You have options hehe.

nazia
10-22-2013, 11:28 PM
I like so fire this all information.

prometheus
12-28-2013, 08:22 AM
Sorry for crossposting, but this belongs here too, I had this on itīs own thread, but it does belong here for those using daz studio and lightwave, and since It was I who started this pipeline thread..

Simple walk cycle dummy-Daz genesis to lightwave.

just a simple text dummy on how to use the free daz studio, and a simple animate walk cycle, walk in place, then export to fbx lightwave and remove the bones,mdd scan it, make it loopable and then walking along a path.
Focus here on getting the walk cycle in there in the animation, not dealing with texture correction that might be needed.
And Note..I recomend using lw11.6 since the fbx import is improved and imports textures and uv map designation much better than previously versions.

Daz walk cycle

Daz...
1.pose & animate tab, use animate and drag the forward (1cycle) to the beginning
of animate timline.

2. select the hip on the genesis figure and go to parameters and lock
the z-translate, and also the x-translate, this will make the figure walk in place.

3.click on the high heel rotation offset, (the foot icon with arrow) and adjust the
foot rotation to something along 31 degree. (otherwise you will end up
with toes pointing up in a weird way through the entire animation.


4.Right click just below the animate2 menu text and bake to studio
keyframes, that is important ..you will not get the animation exported out otherwise.

export the scene out as fbx binary 2012, and make sure animation and morph is checked.

In lightwave...

1.load the fbx scene, scale scene checked, 1.0 scale, rotation import/motion plugin,..import joints as lightwave joints.

2.select the genesis shape and hit "p" for properties and under the fx tab
add clothFX.

3. in cloth fx, go to file and scan motion, save it as mdd file with proper name such as walkcycle_mdd somewhere
in a proper folder.

4. clear the scene, and this time only load the genesis object which is located in a subfolder where the fbx scene is located.

5. The object is of course static, and we need to mdd deform it, and you can add clothfx
to the object, this time go to file, and load the mdd file previously saved.

7. now the walk cycle will be to short, and you want it to walk for the entire animation length.
so we need to change the clothfx/file/..playback mode and set it to local.
That will then let us use the loop function next to the playback mode, and the
figure should now walk in place through out the entire length of the animation.

8. select the genesis shape and move it and keyframe it where you want some changes in the path direction.

9. the figure will not orient correctly along the path, so select the genesis shape and then we need to hit "m" for motion
properties, then in the controllers and limits tab/and rotation tab we need to change heading controller from keyframes
to align to path, now this will flip the heading orientation of the genesis figure the wrong way(backwards) but we can fix this
with the align to path look-ahead, and use a minus value (-1).

That should be it...if anything is unclear please let me know, havenīt had the time to record it or provide images..maybe later.
Questions or suggestions are welcome.

Michael

SPICE
12-28-2013, 09:54 PM
Thanks Michael !

but it works only with the naked Char.

With Props, thuch as HighHeels or Hairs, the fbx export failed.

"Error exporting file: C Exception: Memor Access Violation - Attempted to read memory at address 0x00000010"
"Failed to export file: D:\WORK\mitHH.fbx"
"Unhandled exception during operation"

Have you make any changes under "EDIT MORPH EXPORT RULES" ?

EDIT:
The reason are not the Props!
Cannot say it as this time clear, but it seems to me that some Aniblocks (which came with shoes) are the reason.

Mr Rid
04-06-2014, 08:08 PM
Not that interesting, but Daz "Epic Wings" came with Aniblocks ("flap" and "soar") so I rendered out a quick test in LW just to see how it looks. Dropped in a "walk" block, exported obj, and MDD from Daz 4.6. I had to edit a few keys in Animate2, to keep the hands from passing thru the thighs, and some feathers from passing thru the arms. The feet are still sliding a bit.

Aniblocks are so easy to drag-n-drop, layer, and transition preset motions onto characters. If only the feet didnt slide around so much. But its nice to completely bypass rigging or retargeting to get even a basic walk cycle. Human figures are so commonly needed, its time for rigging to be embedded under a button.


https://vimeo.com/88046457

prometheus
04-07-2014, 07:25 AM
Not that interesting, but Daz "Epic Wings" came with Aniblocks ("flap" and "soar") so I rendered out a quick test in LW just to see how it looks. Dropped in a "walk" block, exported obj, and MDD from Daz 4.6. I had to edit a few keys in Animate2, to keep the hands from passing thru the thighs, and some feathers from passing thru the arms. The feet are still sliding a bit.

Aniblocks are so easy to drag-n-drop, layer, and transition preset motions onto characters. If only the feet didnt slide around so much. But its nice to completely bypass rigging or retargeting to get even a basic walk cycle. Human figures are so commonly needed, its time for rigging to be embedded under a button.

Mr Rid do a flight of that guy, send him to me, and letīs put him in some clouds..my animation donīt cut it..lacks wings and some proper motion:)



Yes..true,at least for those who donīt want to embark on deeper rigging and animation skills..and need to get something Fast.

Pretty easy to lock a figure in the hip part in daz, and make it walk in place, foots need correction in daz too..they always comes out with toes pointing up to the skies:)

A problem with doing it in daz..that could be having a character walk on uneven surface and as such legs and feets just shouldnīt do a walk in place animation, so in such case you would have to actually load a dummy terrain in daz and tweak legs/feets there, or skip all daz animations and do all that in lightwave since all keyframes are baked when arriving in fbx..which donīt work well to delete or adjust exactly.

I only have the standard animate plugin, so there isnīt that much of motions to choose from, need to check some of the free mocaps..but there are many of those which arenīt suitable.

Mr rid ..do a fligh of that guy with wings, send it to me and Iīll might replace my flapping guy:) he lacks wings and I donīt know where he got his flying skills from ..must be something whit his arms.:)
https://vimeo.com/86189990

Mr Rid
06-08-2014, 03:04 AM
Does anyone understand how the Morph Export Rules work in DS v4.6? http://forums.newtek.com/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=1382130

tonyrizo2003
07-10-2014, 10:23 PM
For getting morphs into LW 11.6.2 I came across this just today! I made a quick video tutorial as I think it would be too long to write out. I am using Poser Pro 2014 32 bit to do this.

Essentially you will export a collada file from poser.

It is in the export options presets that you really need to concern yourself with.

Simply select the 3ds max/maya 2012+ preset;

another requestor will pop up and ask you what morphs you would like to export as well.

After exporting the .dae file load it into the autodesk fbx converter 2013 program here (http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/pc/item?siteID=123112&id=10775920) then convert.

Next load into modeler, it may take it a minute depending on how many morph targets you exported.

I only exported 6 in my video tutorial here (http://youtu.be/NPlxviUZ8lg) so it did not take too long to import.

I hope that helps!!

Tony

tonyrizo2003
07-11-2014, 12:14 AM
Wow, what a day! I feel like I really made some progress. So something else I had to figure out was how to bring in the hair strands from poser 2014 into LW. You can export an obj or lwo or whatever but it does not remain as a 2 point poly chain. So I had to convert the polys into 2 point polys. I used this plugin curves to poly line https://www.lightwave3d.com/assets/plugins/entry/curvespolygons-to-lines/

my only problem is that it turned everything into a two point poly, so I had to go in manually and delete the bottom edges.

Here is a quick test render of the dude from poser 2012 exported with 50 morphs into LW and using FFX for the hair.

This is only a test and there is an awful lot of texture mapping I need to do before it looks good, I also have no idea of what I am doing with FFX!

Again I hope all of this helps someone out.

122945

tonyrizo2003
07-11-2014, 12:51 PM
Does anyone understand how the Morph Export Rules work in DS v4.6? http://forums.newtek.com/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=1382130

This is what I came up with. Again sorry for the cross posting.

http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?142525-Daz-Studio-4-6-to-Lightwave-Morphs&p=1390251#post1390251

tonyrizo2003
07-11-2014, 02:59 PM
Ok here you go, Edit Morph Export Rules are now demystified!!

Watch these two videos on my youtube channel here;

http://youtu.be/Ud0goYZPwxE - export everything

http://youtu.be/cJgKroCFALo - export head only elements

The first one will show you how to export every morph, and the second will show you how to export just certain items. One thing to note, however, is the tail sections in this object. If we wanted to export all of the tail sections then in the Match name column we would simply type in lowercase tail.

I hope that helps everyone, I know it helped me to figure this as well as how to export morphs from Poser!!

122959

jimbotini
07-12-2014, 08:24 PM
This was causing LW to crash for me exporting FBX out of DAZ 4.5+. As tonyrizo had success with it (and posted screenshots) I noticed the "subD information" was unchecked. The combination of that and morphs apparently cause LW to blow up when loading the FBX scene. Just in case someone else was having the issue.

As a side note, the FBX export from DAZ 4.6 loaded into an Autodesk FBX Review application (I'd assume they'd get their format right) shows a horridly broken up jumble of mess. Just to prove to myself that something isn't amiss, I took the "same" object from LW modeler and export as FBX and it loaded fine in the Autodesk FBX Review app. Chances are that DAZ's export is not correct, but still good enough for LW to figure out.

Yet another side note, being a programmer and a bit of a perfectionist I'm in the middle of writing an application that would read/write DAZ's DSON files and read/write LW object/scene files so I can quickly convert (correctly) between them. Obviously geometry, surfaces (as best translated as possible), animation, bones... as much as I can automatically and programmatically convert. I was also going to have it read DAZ's content management service's database to help categorize things, watch for updates to DSON files, and know when LW files need updating. Is there anyone that would be interested in such an app? These are the only formats I really need, but was going to include poser formats next so I can easily just create poser content files to ship the whole shooting' match off to 3d market places. Would any other formats spur additional interest?

At this point I'm writing something for myself and just curious how well something like this might sell.

tonyrizo2003
07-13-2014, 12:34 AM
This was causing LW to crash for me exporting FBX out of DAZ 4.5+. As tonyrizo had success with it (and posted screenshots) I noticed the "subD information" was unchecked. The combination of that and morphs apparently cause LW to blow up when loading the FBX scene. Just in case someone else was having the issue.

As a side note, the FBX export from DAZ 4.6 loaded into an Autodesk FBX Review application (I'd assume they'd get their format right) shows a horridly broken up jumble of mess. Just to prove to myself that something isn't amiss, I took the "same" object from LW modeler and export as FBX and it loaded fine in the Autodesk FBX Review app. Chances are that DAZ's export is not correct, but still good enough for LW to figure out.

Yet another side note, being a programmer and a bit of a perfectionist I'm in the middle of writing an application that would read/write DAZ's DSON files and read/write LW object/scene files so I can quickly convert (correctly) between them. Obviously geometry, surfaces (as best translated as possible), animation, bones... as much as I can automatically and programmatically convert. I was also going to have it read DAZ's content management service's database to help categorize things, watch for updates to DSON files, and know when LW files need updating. Is there anyone that would be interested in such an app? These are the only formats I really need, but was going to include poser formats next so I can easily just create poser content files to ship the whole shooting' match off to 3d market places. Would any other formats spur additional interest?

At this point I'm writing something for myself and just curious how well something like this might sell.

I would be very interested in this! Like a few other people I have invested considerable amount of resources to my Daz 3D content library. Let me know if you need a guinea pig :)

Afalk
07-13-2014, 10:21 AM
Same here, sounds like a promising tool!

Ma3rk
07-13-2014, 10:40 AM
Add one more to the list of testers.

M.

tonyrizo2003
07-15-2014, 08:21 AM
I was having a problem with exporting from Poser 2014 of course. So I instantly went to tech support, here is their response to my query.

"Most people seem to be exporting via .FBX. There usually will be cleanup/fixing to do on the rigging and materials in your target application. DAZ Studio uses its own tri-axial weight-mapping that doesn't port 100% to FBX (a limitation of the format). I would recommend only exporting the specific morphs you need and baking the rest as morphs can quickly bog down even Lightwave which is known for its speed."

Ok so another question comes to my mind, and Mr. Rid I think has has brought this up before about importing Daz into LW. Since there is some clean up involved, is there a way to edit the .FBX file before opening it into LW? or is it simply just opening up the vertex map requestor and going from there?

jimbotini
07-15-2014, 09:09 AM
I'm not familiar with the FBX format, so I couldn't honestly answer that.

As for the tri-axial weight mapping, I found it interesting that DAZ split the weight maps into x,y,z components. The weight for all components for a vertex has to equal 100% (or maybe it was no more than 100%). I have a few random plans on how it might get converted, but just have to play with it once I get to that point.

I did an FBX export of the Genesis 2 Female with all morphs and it created a hefty, several gigabyte FBX export... several morphs on import didn't do anything and others were suspect that they were not the right morph data attached to the name. ugh... DAZ allows for joint controlled, morph controlled, and user controlled morphs so some of those shouldn't really translate to endomorphs, instead translate to functions.

tonyrizo2003
07-15-2014, 09:20 AM
I'm not familiar with the FBX format, so I couldn't honestly answer that.

As for the tri-axial weight mapping, I found it interesting that DAZ split the weight maps into x,y,z components. The weight for all components for a vertex has to equal 100% (or maybe it was no more than 100%). I have a few random plans on how it might get converted, but just have to play with it once I get to that point.

I did an FBX export of the Genesis 2 Female with all morphs and it created a hefty, several gigabyte FBX export... several morphs on import didn't do anything and others were suspect that they were not the right morph data attached to the name. ugh... DAZ allows for joint controlled, morph controlled, and user controlled morphs so some of those shouldn't really translate to endomorphs, instead translate to functions.

Several gigabytes, ugh! Thanks for the info, good luck :)

tonyrizo2003
07-15-2014, 01:38 PM
OK, well this took some doing. I wanted to export Michael 4 with morph targets through the Daz .fbx exporter. And well that worked, however, I also got 70 other morphs that didn't do anything. I opened up the vertex map list in LW and well I could not highlight more than 1 vertex map at a time. So after some rooting around I finally figured out how to delete those ugly morphs. I exported the file out as a .fbx Ascii file and then opened it in Notepad++ I then did a search for my ugly morphs and deleted all of them in less than 2 minutes. After deleting all of the needless morphs, I saved the file out with a .fbx extension and then loaded it up into LW without a problem. Here is a screenshot. Hope that helps.

123052

jaxtone
07-16-2014, 05:07 AM
Hi all!

If you knew how lucky I became by the fact that this thread excisted your day would be just as bright as mine! I thought I was pretty much left alone when talking of DAZ and Lightwave but itīs really nice to see that some of you Wavers also found out that DAZ Studio has advantages that could as well be used in Lightwave!

The DAX exporter!
I managed to export some really nice zombie moves, hero actions and daily situations from DAZ and then import them to Lightwave for setup and rendering. It all impressed by the easy way to get things done without having to put up a rig every time! In my opinion DAZ have the very user friendly interface that I have questioned in Lightwave for years. Recently I also bought Reallusionīs iClone Pro and Exchange and even if their internal interface for modeling and rendering seems to be immature I already used the character presets and movements with great success when importing to DAZ.

But I also recognized that the characters looked pretty stiff when the clothes and hair didnīt react natural when the characters moved. So I activated my old Sasquatch license and even bought Syflex to get closer to a natural behavior and I also installed the "PLG Simplify Mesh" polygon reducer to eliminate the large amount of polygons that DAZ created. (By the way it seems like DAZ do not export the characters for Lightwave with smooth surfaces turned on or with a subpatch surface. Shouldnīt have mentioned this if it hadnīt seemed impossible to edit the DAZ exported FBX in Lightwave modeler before using it in Layout.)

Lightwave Modeler!
I noticed that the FBX exported mesh from DAZ Studio 4.6 became unnessasary large and that the Syflex and Sasquatch just needed parts of the mesh to act with I thought it would be a good idea to remodel the FBX file and since Syflex also needed some Weightmaps to make clothes react with dynamics and stuff I added one upper body and one lower body Weightmap, exported it as a new FBX file from modeler and thought everything were ok.

Now hereīs the problem. (That might depend on my lack of skills, at least I hope so!)

Lightwave Layout!
My Lightwave modified mesh looks alright and is definitely smaller in size than the original DAZ file! But all movements, morphs and animations seemed to have disappeared and the character just stands there in a T-position without doing anyting at all.I do not know how to get any further with this problem but have some ideas that I canīt realize, but maybe someone smarter than me can help me to sort things out here!


Idea 1. I thought it was possible to use my modified FBX file as a submissive mesh connected to the original FBX exported from DAZ but just canīt figure out how this can be done.
Idea 2. I thought I could rip out parts from the original FBX (scalp for Sasquatch) and (body without limbs for Syflex), set them to "not seen by cconnect them to the original FBX:s animated morphs to use as patterns!
Idea 3. I sell my copy of Lightwave and convert to a lumberjack!

Thanks in advance!

jimbotini
07-16-2014, 11:24 AM
I feel you with finding this thread... I thought I was the only one trying to do this before I ran across this.

Don't trust DAZ for exports. That said, DAZ's FBX export is "broken" for some definitions of broken. Their own forums indicate that they supply the exporter to work with a specific application and that works as far as they're concerned. So I don't expect that to change any time soon. The export can work with lightwave as long as you don't export the SubD information AND morphs... the combination will make Lightwave crash when importing. When importing, the size difference you see is because DAZ has a 1 unit to 1 cm convention and Lightwave has a 1 unit to 1 meter convention. Importing with Layout it gives you an option to import at 1%, but Modeler gives no such option. Modeler also has no concept of bones (outside of skelegons and genoma) and doesn't read the FBX rig, thus it kind of gets lost. So I think that is what makes you lose your movement if you import through modeler first. I think the other option out of DAZ (directly anyways) is the animate2 plug-in which will let you export MDD files of the mesh and animations. I personnaly don't like that option. I know nothing (other than seeing the names and a little reading about) of iClone and Exchange.

You should also not trust the weight maps that are exported from DAZ... they are blown way out of proportion much like all the surfaces' values. Weight maps could be due to the tri-ax weighting that DAZ does, but still no excuse for it. Definitly no excuse for the surfaces' values. For a little while I thought the same 1% scaling was needed to be applied to the surfaces and weights, but that didn't seem to help.

A lot of this I hope to fix, or at least make easier. There is definitly a huge spot for improvement, especially with regard to just keeping different formats updated. It will unfortunatly not be in any worth-while state for months. As for modifying the FBX, anything can be done if you know how. I don't know the format, thus won't comment on it. I know you can hand-edit DAZ DSON formats and Lightwave's lwo and lws formats, but I can see quick cascading reprocussions if you try to change too much.

Lastly, avoid idea 3... at least until the next major release of lightwave is purchased so you can sell it to me really cheap. :)

tonyrizo2003
07-16-2014, 03:45 PM
While I agree with Jimbotini on much of what he has said, I have made some short videos on how to export out of Daz 3D 4.6. These may help you? http://youtu.be/cJgKroCFALo?list=UUnEMpBMaTH4mqXPd-FbJlHg

roadster
07-19-2014, 07:10 PM
I would be interested in any POSER implementation of this.

thanks

Chernoby
08-09-2014, 01:21 PM
Okay, folks; I just worked out the following process to export all of the facial morphs from DAZ3D Pro to LightWave:

EXPORTING CHARACTER FACIAL MORPHS FROM DAZ3D TO LIGHTWAVE

1. In DAZ3D, select all parts of the character from the "Scene" tab.
2. Select "File | Export..."
3. Ensure that "Files of type:" drop-down box reads "Autodesk FBX (.fbx)
4. Click "Save"
5. Press the "Edit Morphs Export Rules" button in the "FBX Options" screen
6. Click "Add"
7. For the new rule, under "Match" enter "head."
8. Under "Action" select "Export"
9. Press "Accept".
10. Press "Accept" once again.
11. Allow the export to complete.
12. Open up the FBX scene file in LightWave 10.1 or later.
13. Select the "Genesis_Shape" object
14. Press "p" for properties.
15. Select the "Deform" tab.
16. Double-click on the "Morph Mixer" link at the bottom (NOTE: You should see 162 endomorphs)
17. Review the morphs on your character.

It works. It works like a charm.

Just had to share. :)

I have been searching for this bit of info everywhere! Huge thanks.

Also, if Lightwave is crashing from FBX with morphs change SubDivision Interpolation in DAZ to "Catmull-Clark (Legacy)"

Mr Rid
08-21-2014, 01:23 AM
The only practical reason I see for exporting FBX from Daz is to have the morphs embedded in the mesh. The nice Daz deforms (special triax weights and such) do not translate to LW, and so the basic rig and weights are not good.

Daz 3 handled morph export selection MUCH better, with a straightforward morph list for shift+selecting morphs you want to export. The 'Rules' thing in Daz 4.6 is just awful, that I assume some tech-brain implemented. Exporting V3 with a "head" rule resulted in an exported mesh that takes too long to load, with hundreds of morphs I don't need, many of which are empty channels. I have to tediously enter ten different rules just to get a few dozen particular head morphs I want, then there is no way to save the rules for later.

I tried an export from Daz 4.6
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRXakzJloEI&feature=youtu.be which is still a messy process (I wish LW and Daz dev would mingle more), but I also wanted to see how cloth dynamics might work on long hair geometry.

The figure motion was exported as MDD from Daz, and the body and hair meshes were each exported separately as OBJ. I made a simple skirt in LW.

Bullet cloth rarely works for me. Bullet only 'exploded' both the cloth meshes and the collision mesh on the first frame of calculation. Syflex weirdly refused to apply cloth to either the skirt or hair mesh, and I could not figure out why- it seemed to not like something about the geometry that I did not pin down(?). ClothFX worked but was slow, but it would not allow a fixed weight falloff from the scalp so the hair is too rigid at top- for some reason, any weight values between say 1% to 100% only apply at 100%. The skirt is a little too bouncy. I threw on SoftFX for jiggle on the breasts and it is almost not noticeable on the thighs and calves. To get slowmo, all the MDDs were set to 50% playback speed.

In order for the hair and skirt to follow the MDD-baked figure motion, the "fixed" portion of the hair and skirt were each parented to a null with a motion derived from points in the figure mesh (one from the scalp, and one from the hip, respectively), exported with SoftFX 'Make Path' edit tool. It was easier to apply dynamics to the hair mesh by separating it into 3 sections.

Simple Skin is the only skin node that I manage to get a decent moist skin look with. But there is a VERY troublesome render glitch when geometry is intersecting with the skin mesh- I kept getting little flickering red and black dots around the eyes. Discussed here- http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?141737-Skin-artifacts-with-transparency Sigma2 seems to be the only SSS shader that does not have this problem, but I could not get as good looking skin. Any problem frames were re-rendered around the eyes, and the good frames were blended in comp. This scene also randomly crashed often during F10, which I have not been able to pinpoint the cause of- I suspect has to do with the skin shader and transparency.

I also tried a different Daz hair mesh that contained too many polys for cloth to practically handle. I used Zbrush to "un-subdivide" it (Reconstruct Subdiv tool, and there is also a standalone Subdiv Recovery Tool), but then LW can no longer read the surfaces/groups on the ZB exported mesh (a LW obj import bug, because Zbrush and Maya maintain the imported groups. If I apply multiple surfaces to any mesh in Modeler, export as obj, then load it again, the groups/surfaces are gone). But the UV remains intact. So the hair mesh had to first be separated into five sections, each by surface. Each section is unsubdivided in Zbrush, then each surface can be re-applied in LW, and the sections are reassembled.

Many people complain about how dense the Daz meshes are, but when I render for photorealism the meshes have to be very dense to minimize LW's inherent shadow smoothing errors. Discussed here- http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?86479-smoothing-not-working Shadow Offset only causes a different artifact with SSS shaders. So the V3 mesh started with about 10k polys. Subpatch was set to 2, for about 42k polys for final render.
123818

prometheus
08-21-2014, 06:53 AM
Looks decent anyway, and thanks for sharing your findings of the troublesome exports, and your cloth effects trials.

Michael

tonyrizo2003
08-25-2014, 12:15 AM
Truart has created a mass vertex map deletion tool that can multi select maps, please check out the thread in this forum as well as I think this will solve what many of us daz/poser users encounter while exporting to LW!

prometheus
11-13-2014, 12:41 PM
just found this..about exporting daz hair to lightwave....and some minor other advices, however...it is not about polystrand hair, just old polyhair with textures.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6pKFExF_sI

jaxtone
11-13-2014, 04:50 PM
But as I understand this is only for still images! Am I right?

Greenlaw
11-13-2014, 07:08 PM
You can use polygon strips for animation. Within limits, it can be a good substitute for actual fiber renders.

I used to use polygonal strips routinely before Sasquatch and FiberFX came along. It's a little tricky to animate long strips of hair convincingly, especially if you need a lot of motion, but in many situations it can look pretty nice. Besides dynamics, one big gotcha is transparency--to get the desired softness, you want to use transparency maps, not clip maps, but you may also need to crank up the Ray Recursion Limit to accommodate the many layers of transparency, which can potentially bring a render to a crawl.

One example that killed my render times was Alex the lion in a Madagascar video game spot we did many years ago. I wanted to use Sasquatch but I was over-ridden and told to use polygonal hair for the mane because it was felt that Sasqutch took too long to render (it really didn't though.) In the end, I had to kill the transparency in the strips and use only clip maps. This sped up the render times to something more reasonable but it didn't really look like Alex's mane any more.

After we finished that job, I did a test using Sasquatch, demonstrated render faster times and higher quality, and we pretty much stuck with Sasquatch (and later FiberFX) after than. One exception was our Fable: The Journey E3 trailer. We went back to using polygonal strips for hair in that cinematic but it was more of a stylistic choice than a technical one.

G.

jaxtone
11-14-2014, 02:11 PM
Ok! Got that... but since I already have Sasquatch it might be an idea trying to figure out how it works!

Mr Rid
11-17-2014, 12:31 AM
just found this..about exporting daz hair to lightwave....

At 14mins, he gives odd advice to remove all spec as a solution to the problem of spec reflecting off transparent polys where no hair appears. Instead, to keep the spec only on the hair, copy the transparency maps into the spec channel as alphas, and uncheck Invert. Likewise, I apply the bump map in translucency. I may also apply the bump map in the Glossiness channel but set to Normal (maybe check Invert and see which looks better), to keep glossiness appropriate to the apparent hair density. I also apply incidence grads in dif, spec, & transluc. Also use 50% color highlights. May do the same with lashes. These settings all depend on your lighting, and specific maps for specific models. Some maps may need editing.

starbase1
11-25-2014, 02:24 AM
Yep, they default to using the transparency map to mask spec, to avoid highlights appearing where there is no hair.

I've also managed to get good results by doubling up the hair polygons, and offsetting the copy slightly.

hunter
12-18-2014, 11:25 AM
Hi all,
I've been following this topic and have had some success withe Daz LW pipeline. Thank you all for the hard work.
I have a question though. The weight maps coming in through FBX are crazy values. See image. when I try to select point by weight map modeller just selects every point in the model. I am at a loss as to why. I just want to adjust the weight maps value to a more reasonable percentage. Any suggestions?
Thanks.
126151

tonyrizo2003
12-18-2014, 04:20 PM
There might be a setting in Daz just before you export it, otherwise you should be able to select and then with the numeric panel reset the weight value to whatever you want.

Mr Rid
12-18-2014, 05:37 PM
Hi all,
I've been following this topic and have had some success withe Daz LW pipeline. Thank you all for the hard work.
I have a question though. The weight maps coming in through FBX are crazy values. See image. when I try to select point by weight map modeller just selects every point in the model. I am at a loss as to why. I just want to adjust the weight maps value to a more reasonable percentage. Any suggestions?
Thanks.
126151

LW weight control leaves MUCH to be desired. Yes, being able to "slide" values by a percentage, is one of many features I wish existed. But using weights for bone control is extremely inefficient, let alone having to use Modeler to control bones in Layout. They really should update limited range bone features to minimize need for tedious weight painting, embedded in meshes, that are so awkward to edit.

dblincoe
12-22-2014, 06:25 PM
Ugh! This thread has exploded! Is there a good up-to-date recap somewhere of exporting daz3D scene to lightwave11.6?

Ma3rk
02-20-2015, 04:47 PM
For getting morphs into LW 11.6.2 I came across this just today! I made a quick video tutorial as I think it would be too long to write out. I am using Poser Pro 2014 32 bit to do this.

Essentially you will export a collada file from poser.

It is in the export options presets that you really need to concern yourself with.

Simply select the 3ds max/maya 2012+ preset;

another requestor will pop up and ask you what morphs you would like to export as well.

After exporting the .dae file load it into the autodesk fbx converter 2013 program here (http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/pc/item?siteID=123112&id=10775920) then convert.

Next load into modeler, it may take it a minute depending on how many morph targets you exported.

I only exported 6 in my video tutorial here (http://youtu.be/NPlxviUZ8lg) so it did not take too long to import.

I hope that helps!!

Tony


Was looking for something else today and came across this. This thread is more DAZ centric of course but with regard to the process here using Poser 2014, I have a question.

Even though I select All Morphs during the exporting process, I'm only getting those associated with the Head. i.e expressions, blinks, phonemes. Nothing for Hands, Body, etc. Any idea why that might be? Might it be with the 2013 preset in the Autodesk converter, or something I'm missing in Poser?

Thanks.

prometheus
03-04-2016, 10:40 PM
Bump reviving this a bit ..and A little of a crosspost, but anyway..this should be here too..
If you are using ik booster and daz genesis fbx export...


The skeleton will be offset from the mesh if you try and apply ik booster as it is...
so open the scene editor and delete these two bone items...

delete fbx_base_bone_transformer..
delete genesis bone..

keep fbx_bone_hiearchy_standin, and keep the genesis shape of course, itīs just the two bone items above that seems to need to be deleted, then apply ik booster on the fbx_bone hiearchy_standin, and you should now be able to move the daz figure with ik booster controls... without the skeleton getting any offset from the actual figure mesh.

Michael

JMCarrigan
03-06-2016, 11:35 AM
Thanks very much.