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ar2r
12-05-2011, 07:22 AM
Hi

I'm looking for solution for this problem (belive me I tried almost every setup- scene ...)

I've got 15 computer on render farm (RENDER PAL) I'm trying to calculate scene with radiosity, in a scene , one object rotate (fast speed), I know , that I have to turn on cache radiosity (because on render farm I've got something like flickering shadows, flickering radiosity on every rendered frames if caching is of)

And I don't know why I've got something like dirt, like dark flickering shadow but not in every frames - i think this is radiosity problem,
please help

dulo
12-05-2011, 07:42 AM
You need animated GI cache for this to work. this cache just stores to positions of the samples so that in each frame each computer samples at the same positions thus avoiding flickering and moving blotches ..
on screamer net you also have to be very carefull with the GI Cache file path .
I often write it with a texteditor to ensure that it is right and working. there seems to be a problem with cache file paths which are not relative to the content directory.

ar2r
12-05-2011, 07:47 AM
You need animated GI cache for this to work.

Thx dulo, so I have to turn on Monte Carlo (forget about final gather radiosity?), And turn on animation ? I do it but dirt and radiosity artifacts still exists

3DGFXStudios
12-05-2011, 07:55 AM
You can also not cache it. If you've got a lot of motion going on don't cache it.
What settings are you using? You can get very good results without caching and keep the render time low.

ar2r
12-05-2011, 08:22 AM
You can also not cache it. If you've got a lot of motion going on don't cache it.
What settings are you using? You can get very good results without caching and keep the render time low.

yes I can not caching if I render animation on one computer, but this no make sense I want use renderfarm so I must using cache radiosity because on render farm radiosity flickering without cache, evgerything works ok when I movingf only camera in scene but when I moving an objects there are a problems with dirt render

dulo
12-05-2011, 01:17 PM
Thx dulo, so I have to turn on Monte Carlo (forget about final gather radiosity?), And turn on animation ? I do it but dirt and radiosity artifacts still exists
Can you post some sample renderings showing the artefacts ?
.. and yes for animated GI you need Monte Carlo.

dblincoe
12-05-2011, 01:40 PM
Don't know if it will help you but what I've done in the past for turntable style animations that were render intensive was to bake the AO. I used shader-meister and the camera baker to bake the AO to uv's. Then applied that to the diffuse. Allowed my computers to render it quickly and since they were all using the same baked images there was no artifacts.

ar2r
12-06-2011, 09:25 AM
Can you post some sample renderings showing the artefacts ?
.. and yes for animated GI you need Monte Carlo.

my settings:
http://www.ferkaluk.vel.pl/rd_pro.jpg

problem is on every frame radiosity flickering on objects and sometimes gives shadow on ball sometiemes on every frame another color for flor sphere ...

I DO THAT
1.) bake Radisotiy scene
2.) save scene
3.) render scene on a farm


p.s. thank you to all for helping me

lertola2
12-06-2011, 09:27 AM
I have been very disappointed trying to use our render farm to render animated radiosity so far. I once tried to use it on a job. I got it to work on a small test scene but when I tried to use it on the real scene it made the render times balloon to 12 to 24 hours per frame. On one job I got away with turning off interpolation which is a tremendous render time hit but at least there is no need to bake and no flickering. If you have the time you can just leave the render farm to chew on it.

dulo
12-06-2011, 09:31 AM
And rendered localy it doesnt flicker, rendered with cache ?
If this is the case the solution is simply to open the scene file in a text editor and rewrite the path of the cache file by hand. Correct eg.: r:bob/lisa.cache to r:\bob\lisa.cache then it will work. I have to do this 10 times per week. Its quite anoying because this error doesnt show in the log file. I spotted this with a tool called process monitor with which i monitored the screamer net process. This tool told me that SN was not able to open the cache file ( in the log file was something like reading cache file .. though it could not find or open it .. ) -> SN renders radiosity from the start -> each nodes samples on slightly different positions -> flickering

dulo
12-06-2011, 09:33 AM
I have been very disappointed trying to use our render farm to render animated radiosity so far. I once tried to use it on a job. I got it to work on a small test scene but when I tried to use it on the real scene it made the render times balloon to 12 to 24 hours per frame. On one job I got away with turning off interpolation which is a tremendous render time hit but at least there is no need to bake and no flickering. If you have the time you can just leave the render farm to chew on it.
Radiosity works fine on screamernet if all the nodes have a local copy of the cache file. The Networks share access seems to be much to slow to give a proper rendering speed.
For this purpose i created a little script which makes a local copy of the cache file on the local harddrive of the screamer node -> SN is very fast with cached radiosity

dulo
12-06-2011, 09:35 AM
But this is a nice idea for another feature.
Some caching of the cache file to make it usable over network shares .. or an option to load the whole cache into memory.
Normally my cache files are around 1.5 gig which should be no problem on x64 systems.

ar2r
12-06-2011, 09:48 AM
And rendered localy it doesnt flicker, rendered with cache ?


YES if render lockaly then no flickering (cache is off), now I'm trying
- change the cache addres in LW scene file
-render with off interpolation radiosity

ar2r
12-06-2011, 10:10 AM
OK I do this cache and change in lw scene file
from r:\TEST\cache\radiosity.cache to r:/TEST/cache/radiosity.cache

and it's better but in some frames objects are lighter and flickering but less

hmm... What about setting in GI Preprocess (Locked or Alwyes or another...)

I will try non interpolation GI

dulo
12-06-2011, 10:12 AM
For baking use automatic and locked if finished baking and dont want to change any lighting any more.

dulo
12-06-2011, 10:16 AM
If you have moving objects you must use animated cache !! And before baking clear the cache.
Workflow:
set cache file / clear cache file
set frame range, set right camera
unlock cache ( automatic )
bake radiosity scene
lock cache file
save scene
edit path in scene file
-> screamer net
-> flicker free animation

And if you make a breakout pass for the static background objects you should be lightning fast with interpolated radiosity. ( if you have a local copy of the cache file on the rendernodes. )

ar2r
12-06-2011, 10:16 AM
I render this scene with turn off interpolation radiosity time was longer but it seems that no flickering radiosity problem

so propably this is the way!?

tommorow I'll try repeat gi cache with preprocess Automatic and try to put in every computer gi cache localy

thank you for help

ar2r
12-06-2011, 10:27 AM
If you have moving objects you must use animated cache !! And before baking clear the cache.
Workflow:
set cache file / clear cache file
set frame range, set right camera
unlock cache ( automatic )
bake radiosity scene
lock cache file
save scene
edit path in scene file
-> screamer net
-> flicker free animation

And if you make a breakout pass for the static background objects you should be lightning fast with interpolated radiosity. ( if you have a local copy of the cache file on the rendernodes. )

What do you means -> screamer net , what is this ?

dulo
12-06-2011, 11:02 AM
Sorry. I meant put the job on screamer net. Copy the files to your networkshare which is used by your SN..

ar2r
12-06-2011, 02:40 PM
Sorry. I meant put the job on screamer net. Copy the files to your networkshare which is used by your SN..

thank you dulo and lertola2 for yours all explanations, not to many users work in renderfarm but many users think and give advice: "that is easy turn this do this" but it don't work at all

I'll try to set up tommorow all scenes

ar2r
12-30-2011, 02:00 AM
hi again, the idea with localy cache is the best , I render cache, change the paths in lw scene, and put cache to every computer on SN for example c:\
monte carlo works fine with caching on farm , Final Gather works only when move camera.

maybe this solution will be good for somoene next who fight in render farm :)

Have you got any tips how to render one frame on lightwave with some computers on net (I think about this situation: when you hit F9 one frame is computed by 2 or more computers - this functions have modo, but I don't know that lightwave have to ?)

dulo
12-30-2011, 11:54 AM
hi again, the idea with localy cache is the best , I render cache, change the paths in lw scene, and put cache to every computer on SN for example c:\
monte carlo works fine with caching on farm , Final Gather works only when move camera.

maybe this solution will be good for somoene next who fight in render farm :)

Have you got any tips how to render one frame on lightwave with some computers on net (I think about this situation: when you hit F9 one frame is computed by 2 or more computers - this functions have modo, but I don't know that lightwave have to ?)
There is a little lscript which generates for example four lws out of your scene you want to distribute on SN and those 4 lws are the quaters of your image rendered with limited region. Afterwards you can easily stitch them together with gimp or photoshop. There is quite some work needed for this so its only feasonable for really large images which do render very long ..

Surrealist.
12-31-2011, 02:36 AM
This is a great reference and probably worth the read from the beginning:

http://www.except.nl/lightwave/RadiosityGuide96/index.htm#trouble

JonW
12-31-2011, 09:12 PM
This is a bit old but you can chop up the frame as much as you want, it's just more work on the calculator.

In Global illumination make sure you have "Use Behind Test" on.

http://www.keepandshare.com/doc/2112856/1216713?da=y&ifr=y