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OrvilleB
09-23-2011, 10:29 PM
I may be the last to see this, but I noticed that the price of an upgrade is now $695. I assume that is from version 9 that I own to 10. It is not a suprise because Newtek said they were going to do it, but it is the end of the line for me. I really wanted to learn Lightwave, and I bought several Kurv videos. I spent hours and learned to do the basics, but I could never create anything worth having. I am retired and cannot afford to waste any more money, and besides I fear for the future of Newtek just like I fear for the country and government. I had started back trying to learn, but If I am going to be cut off from future versions, I think it is best that I sell my software and training videos to someone who can use them. I don't yet know what I want, so make some offers. I fully expect to lose most of the money I have invested. I don't want to sell on eBay because I want someone who would know what to do to take my dongel, number, and get it registered with Newtek. If you want this, please email me at [email protected]

JamesCurtis
09-23-2011, 10:39 PM
If you're wanting to sell your LW software you should post it in the "Buy/Sell/Trade - LightWave 3D Related" section of the site.

toeknee
09-23-2011, 11:32 PM
Hey Orville, I am sorry to see you go. I agree that the economy is looking very scary however I would not worry about Newtek. I know with there TriCater tools they are growing and a very positive direction. I have been a dedicated Waver sense 1996 and I have seen many ups and downs with Newtek and I would have to say that this is one of the biggest up times I have seen. The other great thing about Newtek is that it is a privately held company> this means that they can make good business decisions based on what is the best for the company not on what will make are stock go up this week. I have talked to sever people at Newtek and you can see that they are very dedicated to making Lightwave grow.
I think that the best is ahead of us.
That being said if you are doing 3D just for fun and your economic situation is not the best I would really look in to Blender. It is a very powerful tool and its free. The biggest down side I can see to it is that it goes through many massive changes over a short period of time and the charges could be a lot to keep up with.

Serling
09-24-2011, 04:37 AM
Well, for what it's worth, I'd just keep plugging along with what you've got, Orville. You wrote that you're just a hobbyist and that you haven't really produced anything to be really proud of yet, so unless your hobby is just keeping up with the latest versions of software, you've still got a pretty good piece of software on which to keep learning.

I had to make a similar decision with Avid in the last year. My last paid upgrade for Media Composer 3 to Media Composer 4 cost $495. To go from version 4 to 5.5 is going to cost another $695. As I use Media Composer for my freelance editing work, and since freelance has both paid for my upgrades in the past but has dried up in this economy, I simply can't justify the cost of the upgrade now. (Besides, what I've sen of that upgrade leads me to believe the older version is better anyway.)

All that is to say that at some point you have to make decisions that work best for you economically, and if it means getting off he upgrade treadmill for a while, so be it. But I wouldn't let that kill my enthusiasm for modeling, if that's really what you love to do.

Hope this helps.

nickdigital
09-24-2011, 04:45 AM
I spent hours and learned to do the basics, but I could never create anything worth having.

What type of work are you trying to create? If you post your questions the forum can help you out. Since you're a hobbyist it's probably not necessary for you to keep upgrading unless there's a new feature you must absolutely have. But since you're still relatively new to LightWave that's probably very unlikely.

Use the forum as a teaching resource, we'll help you out.

CaptainMarlowe
09-24-2011, 04:45 AM
I agree with Serling. It took me years, as a hobbyist, to create nice things with Lightwave, but 9.6 is still a very capable and stable software, imho, even without upgrading to 10. A lot of models that I created with 9.6 are bringing me enough cash to pay for my upgrades now.
Just enhance it with LWCAD and all DPont plugins, and you get a software that can do almost anything from a hobbyist POV.

hrgiger
09-24-2011, 05:23 AM
I agree that the economy is looking very scary however I would not worry about Newtek. I know with there TriCater tools they are growing and a very positive direction. I have been a dedicated Waver sense 1996 and I have seen many ups and downs with Newtek and I would have to say that this is one of the biggest up times I have seen.

Well I can't agree wtih this assessment. Maybe tricaster is doing well but with LightWave coming off the whole CORE debacle, its been a whole lot of turmoil over the last few years. LightWave has a lot to prove moving forward.

If I were you OrvilleB, I would hold onto your LW9 license. You're not missing a whole lot with LW10, especially if you have Fprime from Worley. Save your money a little bit at a time for an upgrade that's worth investing in. Sure $695 is a lot to invest if you're on a fixed income but if you can set it back a bit at a time, you might be glad you didn't sell. Because once you sell it, if you ever decided you wanted to pick it up again, you'll certainly be cut off from the $1500 price that LightWave is now for a new license.

Personally I think this was a bad time for Newtek to change pricing. I don't have a problem with them adjusting the cost of the software but they could have at least done it when things were not in such a disarray and right after a time that they had to issue a number of people refunds who were unhappy with what was delivered instead of CORE.

SBowie
09-24-2011, 05:43 AM
Well I can't agree wtih this assessment. Maybe tricaster is doing well but ... Unless I am reading incorrectly, 'toeknee' was responding to the comment "... besides I fear for the future of Newtek just like I fear for the country and government." If so, the response was entirely valid in context. NewTek is in very sound condition, as I personally suspect are a lot of companies that are known for offering products with exceptional value for the dollar. Sad to say, but a recession offers such companies significant opportunity, and can they can come out of them quite well.

And as others have said, 9.x continues to be a particularly good version to own, quite apart from upgrading. That said, the recent price hike actually means that Orville's copy of LW could now be worth close to what he paid for it. I'll grant that it might be easier to prove that point after we see for sure that LW 11 is attractive enough to make people want to buy it, in turn making it worthwhile for someone to upgrade a second-hand copy of LW and upgrade it cheaper than they could buy outright. Personally, I'd wait for that if I were thinking about shifting my copy of LW (I'm not). And yes, it could go the other way. What in this world couldn't? Time will tell.

vector
09-24-2011, 06:39 AM
Well, I have a 9.6 version and I'm not going to upgrade till it becomes necessary. At this moment itīs more than enough for me... although Blender and Vue are nice friends also that help where LW is not good.

Remember the most important thing is you not the soft... I remember that Frazetta used in any moment Mickey Mouse watercolours just because he felt nice working with it... Ok you are not Frazzeta and LW is not Mickey Mouse watercolours, but donīt feel bad just because you can afford an update.

Vector

hrgiger
09-24-2011, 07:22 AM
Unless I am reading incorrectly, 'toeknee' was responding to the comment "... besides I fear for the future of Newtek just like I fear for the country and government." If so, the response was entirely valid in context. NewTek is in very sound condition, as I personally suspect are a lot of companies that are known for offering products with exceptional value for the dollar. Sad to say, but a recession offers such companies significant opportunity, and can they can come out of them quite well.



Well in regards to the soundness of Newtek, I couldn't say. They say they're doing fine so that's all we have to go on. Of course, Enron said they were doing good too.

I was looking at this in context to the original throught about upgrading ones LightWave from LightWave 9. My view on it was simply to say that if money is tight or if you're on the fence of upgrading, there's not a lot in LW10 that a hobbyist would be missing other then maybe the VPR which is why I mentioned Fprime. The few other features seem to cater more to production work (Vcam support, stereoscopic, AD geocache, fbx, etc...). If you didn't buy a hardcore membership and get a discount on future updates of LightWave, you don't lose anything by holding off to see if future updates will be more useful to you.

SBowie
09-24-2011, 07:26 AM
Of course, Enron said they were doing good too.Not that the future is ever assured, but I can tell you with 100% certainty that I wouldn't be seriously contemplating moving to San Antonio if there was anything the least bit ephemeral about the outlook.

nickdigital
09-24-2011, 09:17 AM
Another thing to consider is you don't have to upgrade when a new version is out to keep up with the temporary upgrade price. You can skip versions and still only pay the one upgrade price.

Lito
09-24-2011, 09:52 AM
As another hobbyist I can understand your feelings, but unlike Adobe, NT does not rape your wallet for not sending them a check every 2 upgrade cycles. So unless you are sure you will never use the software again or are just sick of doing 3D stuff, then you will be better off just holding on to it and using what you have and maybe upgrade when you see features you think you absolutely must have.

Just work with the version you have and work through the free tutorials on the net. You will improve.

hrgiger
09-24-2011, 10:26 AM
Look at it this way. Your LightWave seat just increased in value. New licenses are now more expensive, so if you choose to sell you can probably do so without any financial loss at all.

True dat.

K-Dawg
09-24-2011, 10:47 AM
Hi OrvilleB,

I'm also just a hobbyist and I "only" have LW 9.6 and will not upgrade to LW 10. I do think LW 10 has some very nice features. VPR and Linear Workspace built in are very nice features (I just found out that Newtek and VPR weren't not the first to have this) but for now I can't afford a Upgrade. I'll be looking into LW 11 and see if I it will be justified for me to upgrade or not. My main criteria for upgrading LW in the future will be if there is a Linux Build or not and how much support will it have.

I work a lot with Linux and also my Systems at home run Linux. Windows is now only my second system and as soon as Windows 7 gets no more updates, I won't use Windows anymore. I'm definitely not getting Windows 8. So if I ever upgrade my Lightwave strongly depends on if Newtek will release a Linux version. Thats the reason why I started looking into Blender a lot more the last 2 weeks.

Besides all that, I never have regretted buying Lightwave and will keep it. As a hobbyist I generally upgrade software every 2-3 releases if it is useful to me.

Greetz

OrvilleB
09-24-2011, 02:21 PM
Someone mentioned Adobe. As much as anything, that is what upset me yesterday. I used Illustrator all the time when I was a teacher to do scientific illustrations. I installed Illustrator CS recently on my machine and found that it had some problems. So, yesterday, I checked Adobe's site to see what an upgrade would cost. Well, it must be infinite, because there was no upgrade.
I guess I'm just old (66) and cranky. I'm sure someone at Netflix did the math and figured I could afford their price increase. I could, but I went back to one CD at a time. It hurts me, but I don't mind so long as it hurts them, and I try to be a reasonable, forgiving person.

Sekhar
09-24-2011, 03:25 PM
Someone mentioned Adobe. As much as anything, that is what upset me yesterday. I used Illustrator all the time when I was a teacher to do scientific illustrations. I installed Illustrator CS recently on my machine and found that it had some problems. So, yesterday, I checked Adobe's site to see what an upgrade would cost. Well, it must be infinite, because there was no upgrade.
I guess I'm just old (66) and cranky. I'm sure someone at Netflix did the math and figured I could afford their price increase. I could, but I went back to one CD at a time. It hurts me, but I don't mind so long as it hurts them, and I try to be a reasonable, forgiving person.
If you do any kind of teaching at all, you should be able to qualify for their academic version of a suite - comes to just $400 or so for a ton of stuff. This is the full version, not upgrade. Adobe has changed their licensing so it isn't as restrictive as it used to be with academic versions and should definitely suffice for your needs.

Cageman
09-24-2011, 07:58 PM
(I just found out that Newtek and VPR weren't not the first to have this)

At the time CORE had VPR with OpenGL overlay in the viewports, I'm pretty sure they were the first to have such technology. Looking at the OGL capability of CORE, I still havn't seen anything like those in other 3D apps.

Good tech is moving into LW, and I think we will understand the increase in price at the November event.

:)

K-Dawg
09-25-2011, 08:04 AM
At the time CORE had VPR with OpenGL overlay in the viewports, I'm pretty sure they were the first to have such technology. Looking at the OGL capability of CORE, I still havn't seen anything like those in other 3D apps.

Good tech is moving into LW, and I think we will understand the increase in price at the November event.

:)

Could be. In terms of Preview Renderer it could be that LW had it first, but AFAIK there is an external renderer called Octane that had such a similar Viewport when creating textures and lighting.

I really don't know or care who had it first, I just found out that LW isn't the only one with that technology out there.

Btw. Blender is getting a similar thing like the LW VPR called cycles though cycles is a full renderegine and not only a preview renderer.

Again, I don't know nor care who had it first, I like VPR and that is the only thing I look at LW10 differently, but it's not enough for me as a privat person to upgrade to. We'll see with LW 11 and I hope Newtek will keep what they mentioned with Core and will release a full Linux version of Lightwave.

Greetz

jeric_synergy
09-25-2011, 12:32 PM
If you're just a hobbiest, and have no library of stuff you're wedded to, I'd say SELL that puppy while it's still worth something, and move over to Blender. use the money (Blender is free) to buy some books and instructional materials.

BTW, personally I've found it's VERY hard to just create something in a vaccuum, you've got to have a project. Select a very short project and it will help with your 3d development.

AND: I just installed my ancient Illustrator CS on my new, W7 machine, no problems at all, so yours should work.

biliousfrog
09-26-2011, 03:06 AM
I use Lightwave almost every day and have done professionally for around 11 years, I've got 9.6 and really can't justify nearly $700 for LW10. 9.6 has not become any less of an application since LW10's launch and, until NewTek can deliver a product which I feel is worth $700, I have no intention of upgrading. I even had to use 9.3.1 last year for a movie project.

My point is that there's no reason to throw in the towel just because you can't afford to upgrade. The software you own is just as capable as the day you bought it, in fact probably more so if you bought it before the point upgrades.

As for using older Adobe apps...if you're running Vista or Windows 7 try running them in compatability mode for XP. I use the CS3 production premium suite and all of the apps run fine as standard except Illustrator which I have to run in 'XP mode'. I believe that the main problem with older applications is the Aero interface so running in compatability mode will disable that along with some other stuff, for everything else you'll want Aero enabled.