PDA

View Full Version : Hypervoxels letter writing campaign



shrox
08-03-2011, 07:12 PM
I am going to write a real letter on paper and send it to NewTek asking that Hypervoxels be tended to.

Here is what I want.

Proper blending of all states of HVs, surface, volume and sprites. Can you get rid of that "puffball" appearance?

Artifacts appear when HVs are used to replicate rocks on the ground. If the HVs intersect any object I use as "the ground" artifacts appear that change from frame to frame. (I will include screen captures printed out on paper.)

Better interaction with lights, more than just having two selectable.

I encourage other users to do the same. Let's get at least 25 users to write a letter regarding Hypervoxels and our woes.

Here is their mailing address.

NewTek, Inc.
5131 Beckwith Blvd.
San Antonio, TX 78249

UnCommonGrafx
08-03-2011, 07:17 PM
Worked with Motorola...

I'll participate.

shrox
08-03-2011, 07:21 PM
Worked with Motorola...

I'll participate.

Excellent, the three I mentioned are the most troubling aspects of HVs I experience, do be sure to list your own in addition to mine if you experience them too.

Feel free to post this on other relevant forums.

Ernest
08-03-2011, 09:32 PM
But paper is so antiecological. Multiply it by all the LW users sending several pages, printed pictures, envelopes...

Why not create an online petition? http://www.petitions24.com , http://www.petitiononline.com/ , http://www.petitionspot.com or something like that

shrox
08-04-2011, 05:12 AM
But paper is so antiecological. Multiply it by all the LW users sending several pages, printed pictures, envelopes...

Why not create an online petition? http://www.petitions24.com , http://www.petitiononline.com/ , http://www.petitionspot.com or something like that

Because "online petitions" don't make a pile when dumped upon a desk...and aren't these very forums an unheard online petition?

erikals
08-04-2011, 05:51 AM
...put a rock in the envelope, or some hypervoxels...

ps, dont use Hypervoxels for rocks, use instancing instead.

shrox
08-04-2011, 12:01 PM
...put a rock in the envelope, or some hypervoxels...

ps, dont use Hypervoxels for rocks, use instancing instead.

Instancing isn't really practical for large landscapes like Mars. HVs used to work perfectly for such.

erikals
08-04-2011, 01:03 PM
instancing is perfect for this, much better than hypervoxels :]

shrox
08-04-2011, 01:14 PM
instancing is perfect for this, much better than hypervoxels :]

But I don't have to model any rocks with HVs, and with instancing it the same rocks over and over.

Believe me, I have been doing rocks on Mars for over 10 years now, HVs were the bee's knees for this.

erikals
08-04-2011, 01:50 PM
HVs can be good, just thought it would be extremely slow...

shrox
08-04-2011, 01:55 PM
HVs can be good, just thought it would be extremely slow...

So, did you write your letter? Mine goes the mail tomorrow!

aurora
08-04-2011, 01:55 PM
Add in sizing, coloring, transparency ect based on nearest neighbors (radius bound with fall offs, meaning gradients) as well as local density.

True 'transfer functions' for coloring and transparency the above needs in place before transfer functions will work to their fullest potential.

There's also still a VL bug in 10.1 with VPR enabled when using distance to camera and other distance gradients. PLEASE FIX!
Then there's my big nemesis particle/HV limit. 1million is just a small quick test case for me. I have no illusions that having the ability to deal with the 30 billion I'm generating right now can be done in realtime. Although even in IDL I get results in less then 10 minutes per snapshot file (think frames) and IDL is the slowest, ugliest, piece of crap language/app in the scientific viz world.

shrox
08-04-2011, 02:09 PM
Add in sizing, coloring, transparency ect based on nearest neighbors (radius bound with fall offs, meaning gradients) as well as local density.

True 'transfer functions' for coloring and transparency the above needs in place before transfer functions will work to their fullest potential.

There's also still a VL bug in 10.1 with VPR enabled when using distance to camera and other distance gradients. PLEASE FIX!
Then there's my big nemesis particle/HV limit. 1million is just a small quick test case for me. I have no illusions that having the ability to deal with the 30 billion I'm generating right now can be done in realtime. Although even in IDL I get results in less then 10 minutes per snapshot file (think frames) and IDL is the slowest, ugliest, piece of crap language/app in the scientific viz world.


Nope nope, write a letter on paper and mail it to NewTek, emails and posts don't weigh anything.

Ernest
08-04-2011, 03:06 PM
Because "online petitions" don't make a pile when dumped upon a desk...and aren't these very forums an unheard online petition?

A pile of dead trees :(

shrox
08-04-2011, 03:14 PM
A pile of dead trees :(

You don't have to participate, yet you will benefit. Now participate!

shrox
08-04-2011, 06:35 PM
Seriously, are people going to participate? I see so much criticism of Lightwave concerning lack of features or current good features that might be broken, less than they were in previous versions, or less than they could be. Then I see criticism of NewTek for not responding to these issues, and for missing opportunities regarding marketing and promotion.

Much of this is true, but I also see that NewTek is one of the most responsive companies I have dealt with, especially in instant, relevant and often humors replies to problems posted on their own forum. I see this letter writing campaign as a means to do something more tangible and personal than just more web drivel. I'll bet they really do enjoy getting hand written letters, and will certain remember it much more distinctly than...oh look, another 200 emails to skim through.

Just 25 letters about Hypervoxels. Just 25 letters...

WCameron
08-04-2011, 07:19 PM
would it be better to address them to somebody specific as apposed to the generic newtek address? say possibly Rob? or maybe Andrew Cross?
or maybe to the head honcho himself?

anybody remember back-in-the-day all those campaigns to save tv series
that had been canceled (angel, Firefly, etc etc) People would send along something semi related to the cause (Bottles of hot sauce is the only one
that seems to jump to mind). Maybe we should do something like that? heh.

So what product kinda reminds one of Hypervoxels? I was thinking Silly Putty for some odd reason....

anywho, count me in.

- Will.

shrox
08-04-2011, 07:42 PM
Steve, with whom do you think we might have success in writing?

sandman300
08-04-2011, 07:43 PM
Good Idea, who knows it might work this time, I'd like to send a steaming pile of Hypervoxles but since that is illegal, Cotton balls would be an interesting idea, since HVs look a lot like them even when there not supposed to. Imagine if every Lightwave user sent a couple of balls....:devil:

wibly wobly
08-04-2011, 07:50 PM
I forget when hypervoxes first came into LW. was it 6 or 7? either way, it's one of the things that has basically sat idle for a very, very long time. it's worth a shot. for all we know however, they're implementing some kind of bullet fluid sim into the next update so all this could very well be a mute point.

shrox
08-04-2011, 07:52 PM
Good Idea, who knows it might work this time, I'd like to send a steaming pile of Hypervoxles but since that is illegal, Cotton balls would be an interesting idea, since HVs look a lot like them even when there not supposed to. Imagine if every Lightwave user sent a couple of balls....:devil:

Cool! Light weight, compressible through the mail system equipment, and effective visual aid. Excellent idea! Excellent...

Write your letter, put in cotton balls, write HV on the corner of the envelope and send to:

NewTek, Inc.
5131 Beckwith Blvd.
San Antonio, TX 78249

I don't quite know how we will tackle Bones...

shrox
08-04-2011, 07:53 PM
I forget when hypervoxes first came into LW. was it 6 or 7? either way, it's one of the things that has basically sat idle for a very, very long time. it's worth a shot. for all we know however, they're implementing some kind of bullet fluid sim into the next update so all this could very well be a mute point.

Like you just said, it's been a moot point since 6 or 7....so by all rites you should write right now, alright! Word!

dwburman
08-04-2011, 07:54 PM
HV's were first a purchaseably plugin for LW 5(.6?) - I got it with my Newtek Graphics bundle. :D

shrox
08-04-2011, 08:19 PM
HV's were first a purchaseably plugin for LW 5(.6?) - I got it with my Newtek Graphics bundle. :D

Yes, it was the most excited I think I had ever been about a plug in, that and Steamer.

shrox
08-05-2011, 11:18 AM
Bump

Did you write your letter?

erikals
08-05-2011, 12:10 PM
hehe, if you keep going like this i might, LoL... :]

shrox
08-05-2011, 02:57 PM
hehe, if you keep going like this i might, LoL... :]

Like I said, just wait until we get to bones...what will NewTek get in the mail then?

erikals
08-05-2011, 03:04 PM
http://thumbs.dreamstime.com/thumblarge_190/11912062622r66E2.jpg

?

prometheus
08-06-2011, 11:30 AM
Im curious why Newtek has choosen to neglect the hypervoxels system, If someone here at the forums really understand the reasons for that being so, Maybe only then youré able to do something about it?

Is it that wrong people have gotten the forwarded feature requests, or to little people in the development team is unaware..or is it the simple fact that Newtek is very aware of it, but decides to put it on hold because there are more important issues to deal with and lay a foundation for before Hypervoxels.

Or is it Lack of knowledge in the development team for dealing with it?

Or simply..Newteks dev team thinks, the Hypervoxels stands up very well and simply isnīt in need of any updates for a while, and therefore takes a completly different view on the issue than many users here?

Im most sure Itīs something of the mentioned above.

Im working on a graphic mind map, I will expand with images on the topics within that map..a little later.

check the image and see if I am missing something you would like to see and explain a little about it in such case.

I doubt that writing a real letter would do that much thou, not sure ..it might, Im not in the mood thou to go through the postal service and stamps etc.

In the digital world, we can do certain things, write mail to the right people..or to as many of the adresses to newtek you can find, and it wonīt be enough with a few users,( a drop wouldnt break a wall..a flood might)
Also flooding the forum with lotīs of threads might be annoying..and you should do something about annoying things donīt you.

Michael
http://vimeo.com/user680656

erikals
08-06-2011, 11:56 AM
bit off topic, http://vimeo.com/27361681 (did you try VPR?)
 

prometheus
08-06-2011, 12:05 PM
bit off topic, http://vimeo.com/27361681 (did you try VPR?)
 


Uhmm..yeah, I was working and setting it up with the srgb preset, and that looked good when I looked through viper, the f9 render was completly wrong, thatīs why I only rendered out a crappy draft render from viper.

I should have worked and set the hypervoxels up with the disabled color space preset ..(linear)

So I reworked it within that mode, wich meant tweaking color settings in the hv color tab(again)..some gradients with the color difference mode on top a standard color gradient, can make some interesting color spreads.

I just need to make sure to turn off the color space profiles and use the old linear flow I guess, when working with voxels to be able to match earlier scenes etc.

Michael

shrox
08-06-2011, 12:15 PM
Im curious why Newtek has choosen to neglect the hypervoxels system, If someone here at the forums really understand the reasons for that being so, Maybe only then youré able to do something about it?

Is it that wrong people have gotten the forwarded feature requests, or to little people in the development team is unaware..or is it the simple fact that Newtek is very aware of it, but decides to put it on hold because there are more important issues to deal with and lay a foundation for before Hypervoxels.

Or is it Lack of knowledge in the development team for dealing with it?

Or simply..Newteks dev team thinks, the Hypervoxels stands up very well and simply isnīt in need of any updates for a while, and therefore takes a completly different view on the issue than many users here?

Im most sure Itīs something of the mentioned above.

Im working on a graphic mind map, I will expand with images on the topics within that map..a little later.

check the image and see if I am missing something you would like to see and explain a little about it in such case.

I doubt that writing a real letter would do that much thou, not sure ..it might, Im not in the mood thou to go through the postal service and stamps etc.

In the digital world, we can do certain things, write mail to the right people..or to as many of the adresses to newtek you can find, and it wonīt be enough with a few users,( a drop wouldnt break a wall..a flood might)
Also flooding the forum with lotīs of threads might be annoying..and you should do something about annoying things donīt you.

Michael
http://vimeo.com/user680656

Great, print out the picture AND WRITE YOUR LETTER.

prometheus
08-06-2011, 12:26 PM
Great, print out the picture AND WRITE YOUR LETTER.

I have to put in some graphic image mockups wich will showcase more graphicly what I think would be great implemented features with the hv system, Ill try to do that as soon as possible, donīt think there will be a hv 4 release before Im finished with that thou:)

It would be good If some Hv masters here..Mr rid, aurora, or coolest programmer...Elmar Moelzer could check my mind map and see If Im missing feature implementations perhaps, that could be added to what is needed?...I think I missed the 1.000 000 limit.


Michael

shrox
08-06-2011, 03:09 PM
I have to put in some graphic image mockups wich will showcase more graphicly what I think would be great implemented features with the hv system, Ill try to do that as soon as possible, donīt think there will be a hv 4 release before Im finished with that thou:)

It would be good If some Hv masters here..Mr rid, aurora, or coolest programmer...Elmar Moelzer could check my mind map and see If Im missing feature implementations perhaps, that could be added to what is needed?...I think I missed the 1.000 000 limit.


Michael

Your diagramming it out is a very good idea, and I didn't state that enough. It's a great idea and those that are as fluent could more precisely state their own concerns and desired improvements.

Now just imagine that hanging up on someone's whiteboard at NewTek rather than sitting as a suspect attachment to an email...print them out and mail them.

shrox
08-07-2011, 12:48 PM
mmmm Bump.

shrox
08-09-2011, 09:40 PM
Anybody written their letter yet? I was just about to send mine, when I realized I forgot to render and print an example of the artifacts I would see when using HVs intersecting a poly (like a ground object) to simulate rocks, when suddenly I can't reproduce it! Now I can't remember if it was 9.5 or 9.6 I saw this in, and I don't have 9.5 handy. Does anyone happen to recall this?

SonicN2O
08-10-2011, 02:33 PM
it would also be nice to get native lightwave fluids. to quote :censored: , "CORE needs to go bye- bye." That's my opinion, too. How can Newtek create something that brings in countless Emmys and oscars and happy artists (and loyal customers) and stab them in the back by creating something like CORE? :ohmy::ohmy::ohmy: just make the original software better. OK, that's my rant :beerchug: and I will participate if I have time. what should we put in the letter?

shrox
08-10-2011, 03:16 PM
it would also be nice to get native lightwave fluids. to quote :censored: , "CORE needs to go bye- bye." That's my opinion, too. How can Newtek create something that brings in countless Emmys and oscars and happy artists (and loyal customers) and stab them in the back by creating something like CORE? :ohmy::ohmy::ohmy: just make the original software better. OK, that's my rant :beerchug: and I will participate if I have time. what should we put in the letter?

Write your letter about Hypervoxels, particles and such are a different issue.

SonicN2O
08-10-2011, 04:13 PM
OK
:hammer:

shrox
08-10-2011, 05:36 PM
OK
:hammer:

And include cotton balls to point out the puffball effect.

For bones? Chicken bones I guess. Then for particles, sand or maybe glitter?

Matt
08-10-2011, 08:53 PM
Why write a letter when we are right here?

HV is an area we know needs attention, but please, carry on listing idea, thoughts and suggestions in this thread.

shrox
08-10-2011, 10:50 PM
Why write a letter when we are right here?

HV is an area we know needs attention, but please, carry on listing idea, thoughts and suggestions in this thread.

Matt, did you read why I think it would be a good idea?

thomascheng
08-10-2011, 11:02 PM
Voxels are going to be a big part of the future. I would suggesting building tools that supports voxels now. How about voxel modeling/sculpting or texturing tools? Modifier stacks would become more useful as it doesn't have to deal with point order. Elmar, how about some input on this.

realgray
08-10-2011, 11:41 PM
How about Newtek buys out 3dcoat :)

geothefaust
08-10-2011, 11:57 PM
How about Newtek buys out 3dcoat :)

Pilgway is not interested. :)



HV is one of the reasons I still use LW, I'd love to see some updates to them.

prometheus
08-11-2011, 01:21 AM
Write your letter about Hypervoxels, particles and such are a different issue.

Yes..focus..we will deal with particles later even thou particles are close connected to hvīs..later discussion about fluids and dynamics will rise.


Why write a letter when we are right here?

HV is an area we know needs attention, but please, carry on listing idea, thoughts and suggestions in this thread.

Im reluctant of the posting way, thou I understand what shrox means, I think..
Can I get a refund of the stamp money? perhaps asking for a refund due to the core change?
overseas posting..something like..1,86$ ..Huge money:D
There must be ways equally effective like posting in forums with massive
request from everyone, put one up everday or so..almost spamming I guess.


Voxels are going to be a big part of the future. I would suggesting building tools that supports voxels now. How about voxel modeling/sculpting or texturing tools? Modifier stacks would become more useful as it doesn't have to deal with point order. Elmar, how about some input on this.

Agreed to that, sculpting tools for painting in voxel clusters would be awesome features..


How about Newtek buys out 3dcoat
:)

Yes..something like that and the quote above.

Im gathering the data from some people here and from the thread of hypervoxels battle..with requests from aurora and mr rid, and Iīll present it in mind map form this weekend coming up, I need to throw in some images too.

Michael

shrox
08-11-2011, 01:53 AM
Oh, what are we going to send when we get to skin? Either chicken skin or bikini models...

shrox
04-23-2015, 12:50 PM
Zombie necro bump.

prometheus
04-23-2015, 03:43 PM
Zombie necro bump.

Me too..hopefully I get some time this weekend to put up some samples for the fueling of this zombie.

Michael

lightscape
04-24-2015, 12:12 AM
I am going to write a real letter on paper and send it to NewTek asking that Hypervoxels be tended to.

Here is what I want.

Proper blending of all states of HVs, surface, volume and sprites. Can you get rid of that "puffball" appearance?

Artifacts appear when HVs are used to replicate rocks on the ground. If the HVs intersect any object I use as "the ground" artifacts appear that change from frame to frame. (I will include screen captures printed out on paper.)

Better interaction with lights, more than just having two selectable.

I encourage other users to do the same. Let's get at least 25 users to write a letter regarding Hypervoxels and our woes.

Here is their mailing address.

NewTek, Inc.
5131 Beckwith Blvd.
San Antonio, TX 78249


I think there's too much redtape. :D Atleast that's what David Ikeda keeps saying about how things are done at Newtek.

Better to email the one's in charge.

Jim Plant
https://www.linkedin.com/pub/jim-plant/2/13b/819

Tim Jenison
https://www.linkedin.com/pub/tim-jenison/12/a4/325

lino.grandi
04-24-2015, 04:11 AM
Why write a letter when we are right here?

HV is an area we know needs attention, but please, carry on listing idea, thoughts and suggestions in this thread.

Exactly my thought. No need for any letter to be sent.

bobakabob
04-24-2015, 05:58 AM
Line and Matt, thanks for listening, please do work on developing particles in Lightwave (especially volumetrics for clouds and landscapes) as they're so essential for special effects - it would really create a buzz and raise LW's profile.

Wickedpup
04-24-2015, 06:37 AM
Why write a letter when we are right here?


Not to be cheeky but the fact that someone sees the need to write a letter despite of "you being here" should tell you something...... 8~

motivalex
04-24-2015, 07:12 AM
Not to be cheeky but the fact that someone sees the need to write a letter despite of "you being here" should tell you something...... 8~

Especially as that letter and reply was from 2011. It's now 4 years later and Hypervoxels have had only some bug fixes and tiny tiny updates in the past 10+ years.

prometheus
04-24-2015, 07:29 AM
Iīll try to whip up a pdf document ...covering some stuff that I think is important and situations, so it will be available here, think that might give more under the hood description to some issues and potentional new features that just might be able
to implement, some of it is already outlined...but I havenīt just gotten around to it and finishing it.

Letters with just text or even just these forums and text descriptions rantings...it might not work so good for the team to get a proper view on the whole topic...
a pdf doc so they can store it..open and share, that I think would be more valuable for them to looka at..as well as perhaps youtube links to describe issues, just as erikals are showcasing etc.

Reminds me...I stated 2011 that I would post a mindmap etc....and something happened along the way..since it clearly didnīt show up, so no wonder it takes long to develop :) Everything is my fault :(

Michael

shrox
04-24-2015, 10:44 AM
I see the idea of an actual letter writing campaign goes over some heads...

http://www.geeksofdoom.com/GoD/img/2014/02/guardians-of-the-galaxy-drax-the-destroyer-03.png

prometheus
04-24-2015, 02:35 PM
I see the idea of an actual letter writing campaign goes over some heads...

http://www.geeksofdoom.com/GoD/img/2014/02/guardians-of-the-galaxy-drax-the-destroyer-03.png


this will probably be a bark, if nothing happens with hypervoxels...on my command, unleash hell and bite:devil:... and flood it with writings.

Michael

shrox
04-24-2015, 02:42 PM
I see the idea of an actual letter writing campaign goes over some heads...

http://www.geeksofdoom.com/GoD/img/2014/02/guardians-of-the-galaxy-drax-the-destroyer-03.png

After rereading that, it doesn't sound as funny as I thought, sorry.

- - - Updated - - -


this will probably be a bark, if nothing happens with hypervoxels...on my command, unleash hell and bite:devil:... and flood it with writings.

Michael

Do it!

lightscape
04-24-2015, 05:36 PM
this will probably be a bark, if nothing happens with hypervoxels...on my command, unleash hell and bite:devil:... and flood it with writings.

Michael

Unleash hell on the linkedin profiles above. Show you care about lw. :D
Its about time something major happens with hv's. This thread is almost 5 years old.
We don't want somebody calling the lw 2016 upgrade "lame" again. :D

prometheus
04-24-2015, 06:18 PM
Unleash hell on the linkedin profiles above. Show you care about lw. :D
Its about time something major happens with hv's. This thread is almost 5 years old.
We don't want somebody calling the lw 2016 upgrade "lame" again. :D


I have written quite a lot on various threads on what I think could improve hypervoxels..and constantly refering what others also mentioned...so far zippo for those request, but I donīt know whatīs going on behind the scenes either right now, but
to further put some force behind the written words, I think a nice pdf might be of more value rather than repeating the old words over and over again, and probably more effective than unleashing hell on linkedin profiles.

A lot of resource stuff is already here where I started a thread about input feedback on hypervoxels...
http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?139560-INeed-Your-feedback-for-the-next-generation-of-Hypervoxels-features-improvements-etc&highlight=feedback+hypervoxels

Michael

prometheus
04-24-2015, 06:30 PM
Why write a letter when we are right here?

HV is an area we know needs attention, but please, carry on listing idea, thoughts and suggestions in this thread.

yup...itīs coming up.......soon, Iīll be back with that within 3 years:D

meanwhile....
http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?139560-INeed-Your-feedback-for-the-next-generation-of-Hypervoxels-features-improvements-etc&highlight=feedback+hypervoxels

m.d.
04-24-2015, 08:06 PM
Im curious why Newtek has choosen to neglect the hypervoxels system, If someone here at the forums really understand the reasons for that being so, Maybe only then youré able to do something about it?

Is it that wrong people have gotten the forwarded feature requests, or to little people in the development team is unaware..or is it the simple fact that Newtek is very aware of it, but decides to put it on hold because there are more important issues to deal with and lay a foundation for before Hypervoxels.

Or is it Lack of knowledge in the development team for dealing with it?

Or simply..Newteks dev team thinks, the Hypervoxels stands up very well and simply isnīt in need of any updates for a while, and therefore takes a completly different view on the issue than many users here?

Im most sure Itīs something of the mentioned above.

Im working on a graphic mind map, I will expand with images on the topics within that map..a little later.

check the image and see if I am missing something you would like to see and explain a little about it in such case.

I doubt that writing a real letter would do that much thou, not sure ..it might, Im not in the mood thou to go through the postal service and stamps etc.

In the digital world, we can do certain things, write mail to the right people..or to as many of the adresses to newtek you can find, and it wonīt be enough with a few users,( a drop wouldnt break a wall..a flood might)
Also flooding the forum with lotīs of threads might be annoying..and you should do something about annoying things donīt you.

Michael
http://vimeo.com/user680656

A few of these can be taken care of with a signed distance field....all your geometry conversions ect.
This is how Houdini and others handle it. Implement a signed distance volume that can see geometry and particles....can be either positive or negative...so you can cut 3d holes in a volume, or create a volume. Would most definitely need a nodal interface, but would open up Hypervoxels in a whole new way.

Snosrap
04-24-2015, 10:34 PM
The age of this thread just goes to show how slow NT is at LW development.

shrox
04-24-2015, 11:08 PM
The age of this thread just goes to show how slow NT is at LW development.

Yes...Dr. Shrox has done it, it's alive!

meshpig
04-25-2015, 01:09 AM
Mars rocks!

shrox
04-25-2015, 01:22 AM
Mars rocks!

HVs used to be great for making rocks, but not now! Artifacts appear on the ground and on random surfaces.

jburford
04-25-2015, 04:10 AM
A pile of dead trees :(



Then use Rice Paper, or simply some cardboard from an old box!

motivalex
04-25-2015, 04:28 AM
The updated hypervoxels (same programmer) system can be found in Modo 801 :) I just don't understand why it is taking so long to update it in LW, especially as one of LWs selling points is budget tv effects. Oh well, suppose I could use the FREE Blender for a modern implementation of those type of effects that Hypervoxels was originally developed to do. Fusion (free) has a good particle sytem for doing smoke etc and of course there is TurbulenceFD. So there are options about that can work with LW which is maybe why updating it is not top priorty to the team. To be honest revamping/rewriting modeler into the 21st century should be their biggest priorty in my book.

ianr
04-25-2015, 06:34 AM
To Matt & Lino,

Nice Words.. BUT ask the 'Powers that be'

to give us an Approx when, on the Road-map

of SKD updates for better HV's.

The Troops are getting restless & we're not

building the H Bomb, just a Better LightWave.

An official comment IS needed in this Thread,

people now need to know it is being worked???

Thank you & take up ALL of Prom's OGi/ Clouds

experiments & comments too, while your at it.

Or give us H Engine for Houdini/Waverdini

robertoortiz
04-25-2015, 07:56 AM
AMEN,
AND NewTek PLEASE DO TALK TO US.
NT has a great untapped resource in this community that really does want to help.
I can understand that they have been burned before but time has passed and the computer graphics world is not what it used to be.

New users might be willing to give a try to LW but you need to talk to us in a less formal way and establish an actual conversation to hear our suggestions.
And not limit the access to the development staff to a select few in Hollywood.
The is something that was appropriate in the 90's but the industry is now bigger than that.
Road-maps are great but we are in a era that BIG development in computer graphics happen every 6 months.
Somehow some flexibility can be added to the process..
Anyway getting back on topic...
It is embarrassing how OUTDATED HV are. I can tell a LW render on a show thanks to the bad HV.
EDIT having said that Matt & Lino,you guys rock. I do appreciate your efforts.

To Matt & Lino,

Nice Words.. BUT ask the 'Powers that be'

to give us an Approx when, on the Road-map

of SKD updates for better HV's.

The Troops are getting restless & we're not

building the H Bomb, just a Better LightWave.

An official comment IS needed in this Thread,

people now need to know it is being worked???

Thank you & take up ALL of Prom's OGi/ Clouds

experiments & comments too, while your at it.

Or give us H Engine for Houdini/Waverdini

prometheus
04-25-2015, 08:09 AM
AMEN,
AND NewTek PLEASE DO TALK TO US.
NT has a great untapped resource in this community that really does want to help.
I can understand that they have been burned before but time has passed and the computer graphics world is not what it used to be.

New users might be willing to give a try to LW but you need to talk to us in a less formal way and establish an actual conversation to hear our suggestions.
And not limit the access to the development staff to a select few in Hollywood.
The is something that was appropriate in the 90's but the industry is now bigger than that.

Anyway getting back on topic...
It is embarrassing how OUTDATED HV are. I can tell a LW render on a show thanks to the bad HV.

And your suggestions to make it non distinguishable as hypervoxels are? you canīt compare them to fluids, only to equal voxel system like modo,afterburner etc..

prometheus
04-25-2015, 08:16 AM
127990



I have my special folder with some sample images but have more on another machine, and need to gather that..partly the dynamite plugin and modo samples to showcase differences etc.

Then it needs to go in to a doc with descriptions too.

I think even though as Matt mentioned about them being aware of hypervoxels needing attention already in 2011, they got sidetracked and focused on other things, the reasons for that can be many and only speculative from us users.
Maybe they need to find a good volumetric coder, and also set it higher in priority, everyone needs to take the time to get time, or else you donīt have time, maybe they thought that when a fluid volumetric plugin like turbulenceFD showed up, the priority for hypervoxels werenīt that important?


They did a small update not long ago with blending mode in volume mode, but it didnīt turn out so well...at least not when comparing to the dynamite plugin blending or compared to how modo does it today..it blends much smoother and quite fast too compared to dynamite.

robertoortiz
04-25-2015, 04:48 PM
And your suggestions to make it non distinguishable as hypervoxels are? you canīt compare them to fluids, only to equal voxel system like modo,afterburner etc..

Point made...

And your suggestions to make it non distinguishable as hypervoxels are? you canīt compare them to fluids, only to equal voxel system like modo,afterburner etc..
Let start with bleeding edge research on Voxels.....
Snow:
Disney Matterhorn System used on Frozen:
http://www.cgmeetup.net/home/making-of-disneys-frozen-snow-simulation/
Clouds:
http://vterrain.org/Atmosphere/Clouds/index.html
Fire:
http://www.researchgate.net/publication/220943501_Voxels_on_Fire

lightscape
04-25-2015, 09:59 PM
Exactly my thought. No need for any letter to be sent.

Are we going to see any developments at all this year with hv?

Btw nice job on the octane lw videos. Keep them coming.

ianr
04-28-2015, 09:50 AM
Now I Luv Disney Matterhorn System,
& you don't get your clothes!
But Rob I guess it comes with a price tag?

BUt NOW.... HYPERVOXELS..... 2 MATT & LINO,over?

Prom said get this Japanese Gent on Board your Devs
,or buy in his Oki Taiki. A picture is worth 1,000 words
128023

prometheus
04-30-2015, 01:26 AM
A few of these can be taken care of with a signed distance field....all your geometry conversions ect.
This is how Houdini and others handle it. Implement a signed distance volume that can see geometry and particles....can be either positive or negative...so you can cut 3d holes in a volume, or create a volume. Would most definitely need a nodal interface, but would open up Hypervoxels in a whole new way.


Oops..I missed this post from you.

Signed distance field? if that is true for houdini and modo? I donīt really know that technical part.
Anyway ..you say we need nodal interface, well ...dponīt boolean nodes work to cut holes in to voxel volumes, so itīs doable in a crude form right now, I think theres a thread somewhere showcasing that, there is however an issue of the light shadows not casting itīs shading based on the cut out form, rather the base spherical form upon that shaped volume, so it doesnīt look good.

will have to check out where the thread was, you need to enter nodes in hypervoxels through the procedural hack texture called node volume(or node editor)
then add the node boolean tools from there.

Michael

prometheus
04-30-2015, 01:33 AM
Found the boolean thread...page3 especially dealing with dpont boolean nodes on hypervoxels, and in some later pages MrRid goes through some trickery with transparency.
http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?145016-Blocking-hypervoxels-possible/page2&highlight=hypervoxels+node


you could also apply the node in the dissolve channel...but, as mentioned ..the light raycasting donīt follow the cut out volume...would probably need to get light ray data from a signed distance node that takes the input data from the polynormals of the main geometry shape, I donīt know if such node is available today.

http://forums.newtek.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=126286&d=1419612200

prometheus
04-30-2015, 07:03 AM
I will post a sample of boolean on voxels later, this time I just wanted to say that if you would like to do as above, using dpontīs boolean shader in the hypervoxels dissolve channel, you need to use node texture, not node editor or node volume, It just happens that I did that by mistake this time when revisiting.

Michael

prometheus
04-30-2015, 02:02 PM
hereīs more booleans on voxels the "signed distance field" way....to fake volume item.

there are some issues to deal with..

1. The light and shadow information doesnīt behave correctly for the volume... based on the boolean cut out.
2. How textures can cut out the volume in the best ways.
3. In this experimental state...scaling the object and making sure it looks the same with a boolean volume cut out isnīt easy to do, when you scale the object geometry , you also need to make sure the hv particle size/null is scaling with it so it covers the whole are which
the object geometry is supposed to cut.

and a few more...but not necessary right now to cover :)


128052 128053 128054

prometheus
04-30-2015, 03:42 PM
Yeah..you can get all kind of shapes now on hypervoxels with this technique it seems, just need to find a way to get proper light and shadow on it, may have to through a message to dpont and see if he knows something about how to go about it.
Better ways of using hypertextures is also needed.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Xs4BbT3rPI