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rcallicotte
07-15-2011, 05:26 PM
Is it possible to never use UVs in Lightwave by just using the surface editor, which would mean not leaving Lightwave for any reason - to do it all in Lightwave. Is this even reasonable?

The surface editor seems so useful, so I'm wondering how far I can take this without being unreasonable.

probiner
07-15-2011, 06:18 PM
How do you project textures to a surface without UVs, in they way UV do it?

What are you trying to accomplish and what are your problems with UVs?

Cheers

nickdigital
07-15-2011, 06:20 PM
Is it possible to never use UVs in Lightwave by just using the surface editor, which would mean not leaving Lightwave for any reason - to do it all in Lightwave. Is this even reasonable?

The surface editor seems so useful, so I'm wondering how far I can take this without being unreasonable.

It's possible. But you can still use UV's and still stay in LW. UVs aren't around just to aid in moving between different apps.

rcallicotte
07-15-2011, 06:23 PM
Textures are a good point. And I understand UVs have use outside of transferring between programs - sorry to sound that dense. LOL What I was wondering is how possible it is to utilize nothing but the surface editing to create the necessary textures for characters, the world, etc. Just wondering, since I've had had only some exposure to doing much in it.

nickdigital
07-15-2011, 07:05 PM
Textures are a good point. And I understand UVs have use outside of transferring between programs - sorry to sound that dense. LOL What I was wondering is how possible it is to utilize nothing but the surface editing to create the necessary textures for characters, the world, etc. Just wondering, since I've had had only some exposure to doing much in it.

In theory yes...but you're restricting yourself to the basic projection options (planar, cylindrical, etc). You can still texture that way as people were getting stuff done before LW ever had UVs. It's just a lot more complicated and cumbersome. And by limiting your toolset your probably ultimately limiting your creativity. As probiner asks, how are you going to texture something without UVs that would be easy with UVs?

rcallicotte
07-15-2011, 09:08 PM
Thanks nick and probiner. I'll keep learning, including UVs. The UVs have always seemed so wretchedly cryptic. But, here's to hoping.

probiner
07-15-2011, 09:13 PM
If you post concrete question about UVs it mgiht be easier to help further, good luck!

UnCommonGrafx
07-15-2011, 09:21 PM
Here's my tip about uvs: stop thinking about them like something technical.
Instead, think of them as what they really ought to be called: Pelts. Think of anything you want to apply a UV to as pelting and it will allow the methodologies mentioned on the web for tutes on other apps to make much more sense.

If you are pelting only in LW, PLG is really the only real tool; all others pale terribly.
From there, it gets better.

Philbert
07-15-2011, 11:59 PM
PLG plugins:
http://www.lwplugindb.com/Search.aspx?At=PLG

Yeah you can do most things I guess without UVs but it would be extremely difficult for most things I think, Frankly I pretty much UV everything that needs a texture map now. I just find it offers the most control and frankly ease of use once you wrap your head around it. Plus if you have a third party program like 3D-Coat UVs become very easy, you're hardly even thinking about it.

probiner
07-16-2011, 05:37 AM
PLG plugins:
http://www.lwplugindb.com/Search.aspx?At=PLG

Yeah you can do most things I guess without UVs but it would be extremely difficult for most things I think, Frankly I pretty much UV everything that needs a texture map now. I just find it offers the most control and frankly ease of use once you wrap your head around it. Plus if you have a third party program like 3D-Coat UVs become very easy, you're hardly even thinking about it.

In what are UVs more easy in 3D-Coat than in LW with PLG?
I can only remember one thing: They are calculated from a subdivided state, but thats just it.

Philbert
07-16-2011, 01:33 PM
3DC is a lot easier with selecting seams than PLG, sometimes I find PLG very frustrating in that respect. 3DC also has nice tools for adjusting the uv islands to clean up any distortions.

rcallicotte
07-16-2011, 04:10 PM
Great interaction and thanks. I will begin to play with UVs and post questions when I can't find the answer. I appreciate the advice.

probiner
07-16-2011, 09:52 PM
3DC is a lot easier with selecting seams than PLG, sometimes I find PLG very frustrating in that respect. 3DC also has nice tools for adjusting the uv islands to clean up any distortions.

Yes, selection can be frustrating. But in 3D-Coat selection tools for relaxing routines, after the UV is done, can be very very tedious, since 3D-Coat is not a 3D Package with all the selection options and speed-ups.

As for distortion, PLG generates UVs with less distortion/stress than 3D-Coat, from what I tested.

Cheers

Philbert
07-16-2011, 10:46 PM
Hmm. I haven't seen the major distortion difference, I just find it very simple to click and drag islands around with a gizmo then using the brush tool to make adjustments, something LW doesn't have even with PLG. For the most part I only need to hold shift with the brush tool to smooth out a few areas small and it's done. LW/PLG doesn't even have the option. I don't want to argue I suppose we all have our favorite techniques.

BTW part of my 3D World mag tutorial covers this stuff:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJLUiPYWRu4&t=3m11s

JeffrySG
07-18-2011, 07:51 AM
Also, if you're just getting started check out the videos here: http://www.newtek.com/lightwave/24hours_training.php
Look in the surfacing/texturing section

You can use all procedural textures and never leave lw for your texturing but it's good to know when bitmap textures might work better. UVs can be used with bitmaps as well as procedurals. Using UVs doesn't necessarily mean you need to leave lw. It's a lot to absorb. Have fun learning!

Fsoto
07-18-2011, 12:44 PM
Hmm. I haven't seen the major distortion difference, I just find it very simple to click and drag islands around with a gizmo then using the brush tool to make adjustments, something LW doesn't have even with PLG. For the most part I only need to hold shift with the brush tool to smooth out a few areas small and it's done. LW/PLG doesn't even have the option. I don't want to argue I suppose we all have our favorite techniques.


Thanks Philbert. Very useful information; that brush and for smoothing the uv map in 3dcoat.

:thumbsup:

dwburman
07-19-2011, 03:40 PM
http://dwburman.com/images/stories/arc_02.jpg

For this project (http://dwburman.com/work/misc/39-arc-racers.html) I actually made the base paint jobs for the car models without UV mapping (procedurals + image maps for decals) and baked them to a UV map. The UV map for the high res car is really quite terrible... I used the technique described in the UV unwrapping with Dynamics video: (http://newtek.com/lightwave/24hours_training.php) but the lines are all wavy.

When I made the Low res version of the car I did a proper UV unwrapping job to the point where you could actually edit the paint job in a paint program. I may have even rebuilt the UVs on the highRes model too, but I can't recall right now.

Ultimately, it depends on your project, and, like in my project here, you can actually combine the methods if you want.

I do like the fact that you don't HAVE to have a UV map on a mesh in order to texture it. :)

You should definitely learn it.