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rcallicotte
04-21-2011, 02:46 PM
I just asked someone at SolidAngle about Arnold and Lightwave. Here is what was sent to me -

We don't have plans to plug into Lightwave. Developing a solid plugin for any 3D platform is quite expensive. So we are focusing on the ones we know we get a good return out of. It's not clear to us that we would sell enough Arnold/LW licenses.


I thought Lightwave had a pretty decent raytracer built-in, plus there's Kray?


Cheers,


Marcos [Fajardo]


I'm a little disappointed, but it is good to know

OnlineRender
04-21-2011, 02:56 PM
Infinite-Realities has been doing stunning work with arnold and softimage

Matt
04-21-2011, 03:36 PM
Well, in fairness, I think he probably has a point. The VRay guys clearly feel the same way. It's something we need to address, as like anyone else, we want LightWave to benefit from third party technology, it all adds to helping people choose LightWave.

Failing that, well, we're just gonna have to give them a run for their money! :)

Cageman
04-21-2011, 03:53 PM
I honestly think that LWs renderengine have room for improvments..

*Much, much faster Brute-force MC (or any other algorithm that can deal with deforming geometry without flicker).

*Micropolygon displacements

*Bucket-rendering

If these are not possible in classic LW, I assume they will be in CORE.

:)

calilifestyle
04-21-2011, 04:13 PM
Not to hijack the thread but here's what i got from "Faceware"

Hi

The software works as a plug-in currently to both Max and Maya so you can export whatever format those programs allow. Faceware itself outputs animation curves onto character rigs within those programs. I have logged requests for Lightwave and Project Messiah. Given enough demands we can look at prioritising this for future releases. Feel free to stop by the forums if you have any further questions.

Thanks
Nick

rcallicotte
04-21-2011, 04:22 PM
It does make business sense to me why someone might not see the investment, but it might say something about Newtek's past reputation for a decent render engine in Lightwave.

One can hope.

Dexter2999
04-21-2011, 04:29 PM
Let's face it, people who use AutoDesk products have "discressionary funds" above what the average LW user has. They spend the cost of LW every year just in subscription fees. So this demographic should also be able to pay more for a plug-in like Vray or Arnold. Whereas marketing to LW is marketing a minority of the market and of that market it is a minority that would be willing to shell out considerable funds.

We are very fortunate that the makers of Realflow haven't taken this attitude.

Cageman
04-21-2011, 04:39 PM
We are very fortunate that the makers of Realflow haven't taken this attitude.

... those are the makers of many things... Next Limit that is... It was pretty cool to see Maxwell Fire working directly inside of LW. :)

If Arnold is as good as everyone says it is, I would gladly fork out $600 for a LW-version.

Ernest
04-21-2011, 05:38 PM
If Arnold is as good as everyone says it is, I would gladly fork out $600 for a LW-version.Per CPU?

Cageman
04-21-2011, 05:54 PM
Per CPU?

At this point? No...

But for a personal lic that I can use with LW, even if it would be limited to 1 machine, hell yes.. I would pay for it!

:)

Pixelight
04-21-2011, 08:41 PM
I have to say I’m really surprised with all the users wishing for a better render for LW. I know there’s always room for improvement, but LW’s internal renderer has a great reputation. It’s probably what the application is most famous for and the best it has going for it apart from the price. When I was trying to decide which 3D program to go with, what my research turned up was that LW and Modo had the best internal renders and that they were on pair with Mental-ray etc. This was a big reason why I chose LW.
I have been pretty impressed with how fast and easy to use and how great the render engine is.




I thought Lightwave had a pretty decent raytracer built-in, plus there's Kray?


Cheers,


Marcos [Fajardo][/COLOR]
[/B]



Maybe this is what he meant? Like, they wouldn't sell many licenses to LW users because the internal render is already very good?

Is there really a need for Kray or even Octane?



It does make business sense to me why someone might not see the investment, but it might say something about Newtek's past reputation for a decent render engine in Lightwave.

One can hope.

What does past reputation mean? It's not longer decent?


.

Ernest
04-21-2011, 09:11 PM
What does past reputation mean? It's not longer decent?
.

I think it means that it has been decent for some time now. It's not something recent.

moussepipi2000
04-21-2011, 09:54 PM
when you see 3dsmax you wasnt able to render a decent thing before mentalray came with it. 3dsmax have many fanboy but out the package you cant render volume like Hypervoxel or maybe i miss the feature. you dont have VPR etc. If you dont buy plugin for 3ds you cant do manything as lightwave, Its my opinion...

I love lightwave renderer but as it was said i will like to see bucket instead of splitting my image in some parts.
I dont do architecture but each time i did radiosity test i wast able to get accurate radiosity with speed of other renderer
And a new volume renderer to be able to render geometry as volume like krakatoa.

But in my case its not hurry, i can wait for Core to be able to do that.

geo_n
04-21-2011, 10:37 PM
What I haven't seen with arnold renderer is variety. Is it as versatile as lw or vray renderer and can do photoreal, npr, stylized renders fast and easy to setup?

zardoz
04-22-2011, 03:16 PM
I don't understand why people keep asking for other renderers in lw. I work in a place with 20 other people. All of them use 3dsmax or xsi.
The ones who use max use vray because they say that the scanline tracer sucks. LW 1 - Max 0
So they have to pay some more to get vray. and licensing system is really bad.
Or they could use mental ray. but they always used vray so they will keep on using vray. and paying more.

The ones who use XSI use mental ray...because xsi doesn't have a render engine. LW 1 - XSI 0.

Maybe we should be asking to improve lightwave's renderer instead of asking for other engines.
Instancing, bucket rendering, better displacement, distributed rendering (a good one, not like vray where each bucket can look different).

Dexter2999
04-22-2011, 03:26 PM
Well, now you have productions insisting that everyone use the same modeling apps and rendering apps so everything has a consistant look, and Vray is the program du-jour for rendering.

pooby
04-22-2011, 04:26 PM
Well, I had been operating for years under the assumption that lightwaves shading and rendering was the fastest workflow and top quality.

I was using a workflow of xsi for animation and lightwave for rendering(fprime for characters) right up until doing my Greg Mutt Project.

I was invited to the Arnold beta shortly after completing it. I was not that bothered about that at the time and at best mildly curious until I tried using Arnold. But..I have to say that It was love at first sight. I had only tried xsi rendering with mental ray, which I had not enjoyed, and consequently had a negative association with it, but Arnold is nothing like mental ray.

The workflow is incredibly fast and fun. Most suprising to me was that its Far simpler to use than Lightwave. There is minimal fiddling with settings to be done. It looks great straight away, unlike Mental ray, which feels like they've deliberately played a joke on you with some wonky default settings that you have to undo first.

The previewer is ace and Arnold in general makes my work look crisper, more vibrant and polished. Bump looks more believable, displacement is better looking. Things just feel more real looking.
Hair and instancing etc all works properly with the previewer and GI, which is rock solid so you can do character work without issue and its very memory efficient.
Its just tied up all the loose rendering ends qnd issues for me and enabled me to just get on with things and not worry about what works with what and what needs comping together to work etc.
I still think Lw's renderer is it's biggest strength, but relatively speaking, I now realise its fallen behind more than I thought.
It would be great for core to have 3rd party renderers like Arnold and Vray.

cresshead
04-22-2011, 04:35 PM
Not to hijack the thread but here's what i got from "Faceware"

Hi

The software works as a plug-in currently to both Max and Maya so you can export whatever format those programs allow. Faceware itself outputs animation curves onto character rigs within those programs. I have logged requests for Lightwave and Project Messiah. Given enough demands we can look at prioritising this for future releases. Feel free to stop by the forums if you have any further questions.

Thanks
Nick

OT but anyone know the cost of this service?

GraphXs
04-22-2011, 04:38 PM
Yeah, I hope Newtek does more to the engine and does some catching up to Arnold and Vray. The big issues I have with the LW render engine is that it's got complex with having so many settings to mess with. It doesn't have the easy get pretty fast like VRay does. We have to mess with tons of GI setting, and AA setting,etc,etc and no bucket rendering.

Vray allows me to get into more setting if I choose to, but click enable GI and set the quality presets to Low/Med/High Animation or Still,....Done!