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Exception
03-01-2011, 06:01 AM
Hi all,

I'm looking for a useful texture maker that can take parts of photos and generate seamless textures fast and easy. I've found a couple but none seems to jump out. Anyone have experience with any of these programs?

I found Texture Maker 3, Seamless Texture Creator, and Imagesynth (discontinued).

ch.schrul
03-01-2011, 06:31 AM
Hi Exception

Well, I've used Seamless Texture Generator and Imagesynth quite a lot until I saw Genetica last week...
With the seamless texture generator you are very limited (it's more or less like in photoshop with a blurred offset- filter).
Imagesynth is really impressive but as you already mentioned, it's discontinued.
Genetica IS really freedom for the seamless texture generation. I've bought it last week (the pro version) and all I can say after only about 1h of learning (they have very helpfull training- videos on the website) I was able to create my best seamless textures I've ever created. Really, seamless texture generation CAN be fun! :)

Cheers,
Chris

3dworks
03-01-2011, 07:22 AM
i'm a happy pixplant user...

cheers

markus

Traveler
03-01-2011, 07:26 AM
There's also Darktree. It comes with a plugin for Lightwave, which you can use with the surface editor (dont know about node editor). There is a demo you can try, btw

Exception
03-01-2011, 01:03 PM
Those are great suggestions...
Let's see...

Pixplant - 195$ and adds lighting texture generation
Genetica - 145$ and adds generative texture creation
Darktree - 399$ and adds a Lw plugin

Seems like for basic functionality Texture Maker 3 at 38$ still seems like a lot of value for money.

nickdigital
03-01-2011, 01:24 PM
There's also MapZone. I don't know how it compares to the ones previously mentioned though but it's free.

http://www.mapzoneeditor.com/?PAGE=HOME

Exception
03-04-2011, 02:23 AM
There's also MapZone. I don't know how it compares to the ones previously mentioned though but it's free.

http://www.mapzoneeditor.com/?PAGE=HOME

Nice!

How do you make seamless textures from an image with it though?

Exception
03-04-2011, 08:08 AM
Hm, seems Mapzone can't do that... any other suggestions? Experience?

toddd240
03-04-2011, 12:20 PM
http://www.spiralgraphics.biz/genetica.htm

I use Genetica. It will allow you to create textures using photos and it can generate its own and has a large library. For its own procedural textures, and the ones you can create, it has all the maps you need.

For the home grown photos I also use crazy bump to add displace, normals, etc.

It is a really good program, a bit pricey, but it is worth it.

Intuition
03-04-2011, 12:53 PM
Imagesynth discontinued?

What?

I use it everyday.

Bummer.

CaptainMarlowe
03-04-2011, 01:16 PM
There's also MapZone. I don't know how it compares to the ones previously mentioned though but it's free.

http://www.mapzoneeditor.com/?PAGE=HOME

I like it, thanks. It even works fine on Mac OS X with PlayOnMac.

wesleycorgi
03-04-2011, 02:52 PM
This thread reminded me about ImageSynth. I just downloaded from my Lux account. So if you have an account, you should be able to still download.

wesleycorgi
03-04-2011, 03:01 PM
Just installed into Mac Photoshop CS 5. Worked fine in 32-bit mode, but naturally didn't recognize when I ran under 64-bit.

meshmaster
03-04-2011, 05:40 PM
what about good ol gimp?

filter->map->make seamless

also... not sure all of these are useful... but...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_vector_graphics_editors

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3D_modeling_software

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_raster_graphics_editors

http://www.freedownloadscenter.com/Multimedia_and_Graphics/Graphics_Editors/Wood_Workshop.html

http://www.freedownloadscenter.com/Shell_and_Desktop/Wallpaper_Tools/flooring_contractors.html

http://wareseeker.com/free-popular-seamless-texture-generator

http://www.brothersoft.com/texture-generator-download-283505.html

http://software.informer.com/getfree-how-to-create-seamless-brick-texture/

http://www.bricksntiles.com/download/

http://www.3d-rekonstruktionen.de/de/download/

Tonttu
03-05-2011, 02:37 PM
Gimp Texturize is like Imagesynth:
http://gimp-texturize.sourceforge.net/download.html

steve0077
03-05-2011, 11:00 PM
This one does the job. http://www.texturemaker.com/news.php

gordonrobb
03-06-2011, 04:20 AM
I use Photoshop. From a photograph I have taken to make ones like this, tileable.

lardbros
03-06-2011, 04:39 AM
Yeah, I use photoshop too... it's not automatic, but ultimately I guess you get a lot more control, especially if you're using a tablet, it's as easy as pie. Although Gordonrobb, that one you've posted wouldn't be a synch! :D

gordonrobb
03-06-2011, 04:45 AM
Yeh you're right. It was one of the harder ones I've done. Just wanted to show what can be done.

daforum
03-06-2011, 04:53 AM
I like it, thanks. It even works fine on Mac OS X with PlayOnMac.

PlayOnMac, sounds interesting :stumped:

:question: Have you tried other Windows apps on this aswell?

lardbros
03-06-2011, 04:53 AM
To be fair thought, I'm not sure how the other 'auto' programs would even cope with that bad boy? :D Good job on even attempting it.

gordonrobb
03-06-2011, 05:12 AM
Yeah, I use photoshop too... it's not automatic, but ultimately I guess you get a lot more control, especially if you're using a tablet, it's as easy as pie. Although Gordonrobb, that one you've posted wouldn't be a synch! :D

Just realised that you meant this one might be difficult to do, not realising that this one is the tileable version.

lardbros
03-06-2011, 05:18 AM
Haha, I realised as soon as I'd posted my first comment. I thought you'd posted it saying that you'd done one from that image... then i realised when I looked at it closer, it was the actual one. You've done a good job on it for sure! How would you feel about people saving that file? :D

gordonrobb
03-06-2011, 05:20 AM
Not a problem. I will see if I can find the other two or three I did that were similar too.

lardbros
03-06-2011, 05:22 AM
Wow, thanks a lot... how kind. Cheers for that!
:thumbsup:

Exception
03-06-2011, 06:57 AM
Gimp Texturize is like Imagesynth:
http://gimp-texturize.sourceforge.net/download.html

I was happy to hear this, as I use the Gimp instead of PS. However this plugin doesn't work very well. If it doesn't crash it produces nonsense.

Exception
03-06-2011, 06:58 AM
I use Photoshop. From a photograph I have taken to make ones like this, tileable.

Yeah, that's how I've done it for years. For many things this is unnecessary though, like gravel, bunches of grapes, bark etc... you might as well use an automated system. Saves hours of work. That's what I'm looking for.

BTW, that is a superb job on that stone. I don't think I'd expect a program to do that quality of work.

Exception
03-06-2011, 07:16 AM
what about good ol gimp?

filter->map->make seamless


Yeah, that's inadequate though.
Example below.

I also installed Texture Maker 3 and found it to be extremely convoluted, buggy and totally unclear on how to quickly achieve good results. If a program already shows major flaws within 2 minutes of use, I'll give it a pass.

Exception
03-06-2011, 07:41 AM
Installed Genetica and it seems very useful. I was quickly able to achieve good, solid results. The tutorials are also a lot more helpful than with texture maker.

ch.schrul
03-06-2011, 09:44 AM
Installed Genetica and it seems very useful. I was quickly able to achieve good, solid results. The tutorials are also a lot more helpful than with texture maker.

First time I launched the trial I thought: oh my god - nodes... it looks sooo complicated! But it isn't! Just play a little with it and you'll find out very quickly how to use it.
Something I really like about this tool is the ability to pre- create a hole structure with color, specularity, bump outputs and reuse this structure again for the next texture. Just feed the structure with a new map, make it seamless, hit render and you are done.

toddd240
03-06-2011, 10:12 AM
First time I launched the trial I thought: oh my good - nodes... it looks sooo complicated! But it isn't! Just play a little with it and you'll find out very quickly how to use it.
Something I really like about this tool is the ability to pre- create a hole structure with color, specularity, bump outputs and reuse this structure again for the next texture. Just feed the structure with a new map, make it seamless, hit render and you are done.

Genetica is a handy piece of software. It takes a little getting used too, but with a little experience you can create anything you need with all the maps you need.

Philbert
03-06-2011, 01:03 PM
I'll put in my vote for Pixplant too, I was really happy to find that, especially since it will export color, normal map, and spec, which can also be loaded as a 3D-Coat material for painting with.

gordonrobb
03-08-2011, 09:37 AM
Not to hijack the thread, but here are the other textures I said I would upload. Feel free to use them if you like. Feel free to mention you got them from me too :)

CaptainMarlowe
03-09-2011, 06:00 AM
Thread hijack ON


PlayOnMac, sounds interesting :stumped:

:question: Have you tried other Windows apps on this aswell?

Well it's basically Wine with a GUI, but it appears to be more simple and reliable than Winebottler to me.

Didn't get it to work with Marvelous Designer demo, though (I had tried it at first to see if I could buy Marvelous Designer when it was heavily discounted). And didn't try to use it with other apps for now. Anyway, it's free, easy to download and easy to use, so even if it fails to work with some apps, it's worth a try.
It also wraps the wined-app in a Mac OS X app, so that you can launch it from the dock without launching playonmac. A bit like WineBottler is supposed to do, except I never managed to get any windows app working this way with WineBottler.


Thread hijack OFF

:)

Sekhar
03-09-2011, 09:14 AM
Am I missing something? I thought the OP was about generating textures using parts of an existing photo (something I'm very much interested in too). All the softwares suggested, with the exception of Photoshop, seem to either generate procedural textures or use built-in seamless photo-based textures. I.e., is Photoshop (or tools like that) the only choice if we're to make custom seamless tiles from OUR OWN pictures?

Philbert
03-09-2011, 10:18 AM
We mentioned PixPlant which makes seamless textures from any photos. I use it with images from CGTextures.com

http://www.pixplant.com/

ch.schrul
03-09-2011, 10:32 AM
Am I missing something? I thought the OP was about generating textures using parts of an existing photo (something I'm very much interested in too). All the softwares suggested, with the exception of Photoshop, seem to either generate procedural textures or use built-in seamless photo-based textures. I.e., is Photoshop (or tools like that) the only choice if we're to make custom seamless tiles from OUR OWN pictures?

For Genetica, take a look at this tutorial: http://www.spiralgraphics.biz/videos/importing_images_and_making_them_seamless.htm

Exception
03-09-2011, 06:15 PM
Am I missing something? I thought the OP was about generating textures using parts of an existing photo (something I'm very much interested in too). All the softwares suggested, with the exception of Photoshop, seem to either generate procedural textures or use built-in seamless photo-based textures. I.e., is Photoshop (or tools like that) the only choice if we're to make custom seamless tiles from OUR OWN pictures?

You're correct. However, Genetica, Pixplant and other texture generators can often also take photos and make them seamless. That was my goal. Genetica seems to work well so far, but I do have to say I was hoping for something a bit more dedicated to this task. It seemed like Texture Maker 3 would do that but to me it seems like a poorly constructed program.

Philbert
03-09-2011, 07:21 PM
I'm not sure you can get more dedicated than Pixplant, although it does also create normal and spec maps from the seamless texture. Genetica also looks pretty dedicated, though I've never used it.

PixelDust
03-09-2011, 08:05 PM
I don't know if Texture Maker would be a good choice - it seems to be abandonware. Their forum is down, and the last update was in 2006.

JonW
03-09-2011, 11:20 PM
I use Photoshop.

Here's one you can all use.

sculptactive
03-09-2011, 11:30 PM
I'm not sure you can get more dedicated than Pixplant, although it does also create normal and spec maps from the seamless texture. Genetica also looks pretty dedicated, though I've never used it.

I agree, if Imagesynth is no longer supported, then PixPlant looks the most dedicated alternative.

Traveler
03-10-2011, 02:28 AM
Great thread so far. And thanks for posting those images JonW & gordonrobb.

gordonrobb
03-10-2011, 02:34 AM
No probs, and thanks JonW

MDSPECIFIC
03-10-2011, 04:47 AM
My choice, Photoshop.
You can go freeway like Gimp (I love this software), the procedure is more or less the same.
You can always alter your tiled image and make it totally different with only one source. You could change color, brightness, add some unique detail, combine two or three sources etc. This technique can be pretty fast, for me now I can make unique PRO HI-RES tile in less then 5 min.
Little tutorial Technique is important, not the resulting grass image, and I'm not using Healing brush, neither Patch Tool, only Clone Stamp (http://psd.tutsplus.com/articles/how-a-turn-a-texture-into-a-seamlessly-tiled-background/) :)
Cheers!

JonW
03-10-2011, 05:34 AM
I find that I tend to use the same fairly small number of textures for my line of work. I would rather spend time getting a few right rather than a stack of rubbish.

Here's another one photographed locally. It's best (& much more enjoyable) to get it right in the camera, longer lens if you can, f8 or close, good even lighting. Then it's a lot less work on the computer. When I see something in the area I take note of what time of day would be best to shoot it & come back then when I get the chance.

Another one you can use.

gordonrobb
03-10-2011, 06:59 AM
That ones is really nice. I agree, you want to try to take the shot with as little distortion (otherwise you're going to have to fix it) and in as diffuse light as poss.

What is your process for creating the bump map, looks good.

JeffrySG
03-10-2011, 01:53 PM
Nice tiles gordonrobb and JonW. :) I don't do enough of them to use anything else besides PS.

JonW
03-10-2011, 03:50 PM
I usually try to have the images as 2k, but these I’ve been lazy!

Firstly I make the image 2k then offset the image.
Clone parts & sometimes you have to rotate some bits of the image for cloning.
When the image is finally finished, for the bump map I paste the image 4 times to make 4k.
Then offset 2k in both directions. If you have a large blur you really need to do this process so the blur at the edges of the image is ok.
The blur depending on the image I will build it up with a few blurred layers, some small, medium & large blurs to try to get the right effect, & add a bit of contrast of the image to break up the surface.
The more complex images I will keep this PS image with Alpha channels so I can make different versions of the blur.

Another local shot you can use. I haven't made a bump for this, I just use the image itself to break up the surface & it's good enough in general. It's easy enough to change the colour & tone for darker slate for this type of image.

Exception
03-11-2011, 10:25 AM
My choice, Photoshop.

Photoshop doesn't do what was requested at all. Can we skip this argument?
The point it to circumvent the hours of tedious photoshop work for textures that lend themselves to automatic generation of tileable versions of photos. PS doesn't do that easily at all.

Pixplant looks cool, but it's the most expensive of them all. Its extra features might be worth it for some, but it's pretty steep for a texture maker.

Philbert
03-11-2011, 10:48 AM
At least it's not as much as Crazy Bump! $300 to generate normal and spec maps from a photo.

Surrealist.
03-11-2011, 10:51 AM
I've looked at just about all of the Genetica Video tutorials and I am pretty sold on that one.

I like the interface and the multitude of features. Without digging into pixplant too much it looks like Genetica wins out on features.

You can also export your various maps (http://www.spiralgraphics.biz/gen2tour/tour1a.htm#tour1) (bump spec etc.) from Genetica as mentioned in this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-6P69fIG7KM&feature=player_embedded

You can export these effect maps in the basic version $149.00

But for normal maps and HDRI you have to jump up to the Pro version $399.00

And for animation you have to jump up to the studio version for $899.00

gordonrobb
03-11-2011, 11:28 AM
Photoshop doesn't do what was requested at all. Can we skip this argument?
The point it to circumvent the hours of tedious photoshop work for textures that lend themselves to automatic generation of tileable versions of photos. PS doesn't do that easily at all.

Pixplant looks cool, but it's the most expensive of them all. Its extra features might be worth it for some, but it's pretty steep for a texture maker.

Sorry for offering my solution. For the record the longest I've spent on a texture is about 30 mins.

Tonttu
03-11-2011, 11:51 AM
It's a pity Texturize for Gimp is on hiatus. The creators are quite highly educated:
http://www.rouquier.org/jb
http://manucornet.net/

I was in contact some years ago with a dev to get 2.1 win32 binary and remember asking, if the GEGL node system would help with future versions and he thought it might be a possibility.

lardbros
03-11-2011, 11:57 AM
Thanks for the textures GordonRobb and JonW!! Verily much appreciated guys, and very nicely done... thanks!

MDSPECIFIC
03-11-2011, 12:33 PM
Photoshop doesn't do what was requested at all. Can we skip this argument?
The point it to circumvent the hours of tedious photoshop work for textures that lend themselves to automatic generation of tileable versions of photos. PS doesn't do that easily at all.
maker.

How much tiled images you want to menage per hour, that's the real question?
You want extreme quality or enough quality for some purpose and low/mid/hi randomness with automated procedures?

Yeah, I've been there...
If you work with Photoshop/Gimp I really don't know how you can't easily manage and make whatever tile you want, between 5 and 20min. If I really want to fool around I will spend max 30min for making HI-RES Pro seamless texture with crazy randomness.
Sorry if I didn't help you.

jrandom
03-11-2011, 03:59 PM
Is there anything comparable to Genetica that runs on a Mac? (I have Windows 7 in a VM but don't use it much.)

Surrealist.
03-11-2011, 05:47 PM
http://www.filterforge.com/

Also somebody has experience running Genetica on a mac here:

http://www.spiralforums.biz/index.php?showtopic=9726

Philbert
03-11-2011, 06:52 PM
Can Filterforge load photos? That wasn't immediately apparent from the website.

Surrealist.
03-11-2011, 07:56 PM
On a closer look it does not appear to actually make the photo seamless. But I could be wrong. It is a filter, so it can work on a photo but unlike Genetica it looks like it will not give you the same control over creating seamless maps from the photo.

Philbert
03-11-2011, 08:31 PM
Of course 3D-Coat can also paint seamless textures in real time, also painting spec and normal maps at the same time. Including using photo reference if loaded from a material, although it can't generate normal or spec maps from photos. I made a really quick demo (attached), the wood texture I used had the normal and spec maps already made. Now 3DC will cost a little more than the other apps mentioned, but of course it also includes a lot more for that price.

jwiede
03-12-2011, 01:06 AM
I've used both Imagesynth2 (nice) and FilterForge (http://www.filterforge.com) to produce decent results. I run on Mac, so these are Mac-viable solutions. I believe I tried PixPlant at some point as well (too pricey IMO), but rely mostly on Imagesynth and FilterForge. FilterForge has a great library of available textures included as well, which is very useful in terms of figuring out how to make new textures.

I looked at Genetica, but seemed to recall it being expensive for the "HD+Anim" version I wanted, however if the price has dropped it did look like a nice package.

jwiede
03-12-2011, 01:35 AM
On a closer look it does not appear to actually make the photo seamless. But I could be wrong. It is a filter, so it can work on a photo but unlike Genetica it looks like it will not give you the same control over creating seamless maps from the photo.
Can you clarify what you feel FilterForge is missing in this regard?

I've used it and ImageSynth2 extensively, and while FF2 involves a different overall approach, making it generate repeating variants never struck me as a particularly difficult task, even given an input photo, but perhaps I'm misunderstanding the issue. It's not quite as simple as ImageSynth in that regard, but that is ImageSynth's primary function after all, while FilterForge's is a nodal-generated texture synthesis package.

I find having both useful, and am really disappointed to hear ImageSynth might be discontinued. For the tasks it was intended to do, ImageSynth was very versatile and easily generated excellent results, IMO. I'll be quite sad when even 32-bit PS stops being able to load it, though I suppose I can always use older plugin-compatible apps like PSP to load it.

Surrealist.
03-12-2011, 04:41 AM
I am actually not sure I really understand the limits of FF. I had not dug into it as far and read or watched any tutorials. It seemed that it had similar nodal capability to Genetica but for the Mac which is why I suggested it.

My question is, can you take a raw photo, apply a filter to it and have it make that photo seamless as well as give you all of the control Genetica has for this process?

Take a look at these two videos:

This one just gives you the basic import process into Synthesis:

http://www.spiralgraphics.biz/videos/importing_images_and_making_them_seamless.htm

This one goes into more depth of the actual control you get in creating the seamless texture. Pretty powerful in my opinion.

http://www.spiralgraphics.biz/videos/texture_synthesis.htm

What got me was this statement about FF:


Most filters in Filter Forge support seamless tiling – you can generate seamless textures, web backgrounds and tiling patterns without any need to remove the seams. Note that effect filters produce seamless textures only when the original picture is seamless (like in this example), because Filter Forge doesn't remove the seams from the original bitmap.

From here:

http://www.filterforge.com/filters/295-seamless.html

However there is a seamless filter:

http://www.filterforge.com/forum/read.php?FID=5&TID=7497&MID=85341

But the results to me do not look too fantastic and I am not sure about the level of control:

http://www.filterforge.com/filters/5161.html

So in short, if you look at the Gentica videos, does FF stack up to the level of control of Synthesis?

Exception
03-12-2011, 08:58 AM
I'm sad imagesynth went south. That one really looks as if it'd fit the bill quite well. Apparently it was pulled because of an unreliable code base and the effort to fix it to port it to x64 was too much.

I'm surprised that there are so few dedicated tools for this task.

jwiede
03-12-2011, 11:04 AM
Ah, I see what you mean now Surrealist, Genetica's "Synthesis" node does appear flexible in that regard. However, FilterForge's "image" node combined with the various transform, map, and processing nodes allow the user to execute the same kinds of process steps as are done within the Synthesis node in Genetica. The user still has to do manual adjustments in Synthesis as well, they're just doing them "within" that node, where in FilterForge they'd do them with individual nodes.

It's worth mentioning that FilterForge allows users to easily script their own nodes as well. From what I recall from the demo, and reading through the Genetica docs, there didn't appear to be a similar capability in Genetica. Being able to script up complex generators is definitely very useful, in my experience. Genetica does offer some interesting "canned" generators (hair/fur, for example) which would require a bit of work in FilterForge to replicate the effect using base nodes.

One issue that really sold me on FilterForge was that it offers a "free input wiring" node system (similar to LW's nodes), while Genetica V3 had some odd(-to-me) grouping requirements when it comes to wiring a single node's output to multiple inputs. I just found FilterForge much easier to "wire things up" than Genetica, and very similar to LW in terms of how nodes behave in the editor, while I found Genetica's way of wiring nodes a bit odd in places. Try both to understand what I'm describing, it isn't a huge issue, but I did find Genetica's approach a bit "distracting".

Genetica seems a bit more targeted at being a "one-stop bitmap shop", including drawing tools, etc. while FilterForge relies on Photoshop (or a PS-plugin-compatible source app) for those kinds of tools, though it also runs as a stand-alone app. I felt Genetica aimed a little bit more at giving users canned, pre-packaged effect nodes to use, while FilterForge seems more focused on providing users a broader set of base nodes they could use to build whatever they imagine from scratch. For the vast majority of tasks, I suspect both packages are similarly capable -- some tasks are likely quicker/easier to do in Genetica, while the ability to script new nodes probably gives FilterForge users broader raw capability.

I need to mention that my experiences were with a demo of Genetica V3, so V3.5 might be improved w.r.t. some of the issues mentioned. I think both Genetica and FilterForge are powerful, flexible, well-supported packages, and there's a lot of overlap in their feature sets. There are demos available for both, so I recommend users try both before choosing between them.

jwiede
03-12-2011, 11:22 AM
I'm sad imagesynth went south. That one really looks as if it'd fit the bill quite well. Apparently it was pulled because of an unreliable code base and the effort to fix it to port it to x64 was too much.
Yeah, I'm really saddened to hear it's discontinued. For the specific task of making seamless textures, it was one of the best tools available, offering a very focused, efficient workflow. Perhaps if enough users complain to Luxology they might reconsider their decision, though such reversals are pretty rare in this industry.

Surrealist.
03-12-2011, 12:07 PM
@jwiede Thanks for the review. You saved my ***! lol.

So it was a decent recommendation after all, as an alternative to Genetica for the mac. I like filter forge also and agree it has powerful features. Will definitely have a closer look at FF before deciding.