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View Full Version : Got PoserPro 2010 Fusion and Mimic 2.5Pro working with LW10



3DBob
01-02-2011, 11:55 AM
Hi All,

I bought into Poser Pro 2010 back in september, but never installed it. Was having a chat about lipsyncing and was recalling using Mimic Pro 2 back in the 7.5 days - and just thought I'd see if I could get it working in 9.6.

Well, didn't install as was 32bit plug and I was on a 64bit box and couldn't be bothered to install 32bit 9.6. However, on another 32bit box, I did get it to install into 9.6 and it works flawlessly. Really powerful and so much quicker on newer hardware - Was using a DUAL zeon and a really old graphics card last time. I tested it with some of my own chars and with FaceGen LWO2 exports..... Tweak, send to MorphMixer, lovely.

Anyhow got inspired to install Poser Pro, just to check out its lipsyncing tool, Talk Designer. Well, I installed 64 bit version, and after running it said there was a new version available. When I went to download it, it said there was PoserFusion for LW. Well, I thought, like that's gonna work.

Any how, Poser Fusion installed into 9.6 if you forced the install directory.

And IT WORKS..... it just works...... and it doesnt crash.....

So.... here's rough work flow.....

do your poser animation using walk designer, mocap, talkdesigner, dynamic fabrics or whatever, save the PZ3 - go to LW, "Load Scene", show all files, choose the PZ3 and after a couple of clicks, it is there, scaled, with textures, all animation done.

It adds a Poser deformer to the character

If you want to change the animation, drop into Poser, change, save PZ3 and go back to LW, double click on deformer and click the update button - he presto, all the changes are brought in.

So I thought, I'll see if I can get it to work with 10...... the installer did not even start, however, I had it in the 9.6 install - and after some fiddling about - if you put the plugin into

Support>Plugins folder

and the FreeImage_x64Release.dll into the "bin" directory - it fires up lovely and works like a charm in 10!!!

IT JUST WORKS......

inspired by this, I thought - maybe I can get Mimic 2 Pro to work in 10..... and guess what - follow the same logic above, install plug into

Support>Plugins folder

and the DLLs it asks for into "bin" directory and you are good to go!

Now until the end of 3rd January 2011 (that is today here) - you can get Mimic Pro 2 for LW for just $99 - it allows you to build morphs and for cartoony stuff - you can pretty much let it do it automatically if you don't care about the outcome too much. You can get very good results from it though with a little effort - but to get the best you have to make good morph targets.

PoserPro 2010 with Poser Fusion is just $250 for a hell of a lot of power - and the simplicity to just drop these chars in now is sweet.

You could just leave the char in default pose and burn lip sync / expressionsand blinks from either app to an MDD and then apply using DMorph in Messiah or MDD pointer before body animation in LW.

Anyway - the test I did was really nasty - Load Poser stock character that ships with 2010. Add 10 nasty body keyframes, load naff audio file and without giving text reference hit the Apply button. Save PZ3, open in LW, add HDR and change light to area and camera position and render.

Here is a still, don't expect too much - just a proof of process.

I'll upload a VPR preview in a while.

3DBob

cresshead
01-02-2011, 01:44 PM
both mimic pro and poser 2010 pro seem to offer some great solution for a tiny amount of cash...

if you want to rig up your own characters in poser>>
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8jxSOL_MAM&feature=autofb

btw don't be put off by the crappy poser marketing webpage they do a terrible job of selling their app.
no vids..hardly any screen grab images.

http://poser.smithmicro.com/poserpro.html

http://static.blogcritics.org/10/03/22/130099/Poser-Pro-201002.jpg

http://my.smithmicro.com/email_web/poserpro/buy_v2b/screen_lrg.jpg

http://poser.smithmicro.com/gallery/mid/kitty2.jpg


mimic pro
http://www.daz3d.com/i/software/mimic?_m=d

http://www.daz3d.com/sections/software/mimic/images/default/mimic_banner.jpg

3DBob
01-02-2011, 02:42 PM
Here is a LW10 render ( about 5.6s per frame on quad core i5) of the PoserFusion sequence I was talking about later. Just added a bit of hand keying on the camera to move it about a bit.

Now the voice over woman has a Lisp and there was no text given to support the syncing or post editing in this or in the next clip that was a similarly automatically generated in Mimic.

3DBob

Greenlaw
01-02-2011, 02:52 PM
Well, didn't install as was 32bit plug and I was on a 64bit box...
You might want to check your download links. Poser Pro 2010 and Poser Fusion for Lightwave do come in x64 flavor. (I only bothered to install the x64 version of Poser Pro and QueueManager, but I have both x32 and x64 versions of Poser Fusion for Lightwave installed.)

I haven't used Poser Pro 2010 very much but I recently puchased some Poser 'ruins' environments and props from Renderosity and used Poser Fusion to convert these assets to Lightwave. The assets converted perfectly to Lightwave 9.6.1 x64 with all objects in place and textures applied. Note that any assets converted this way have a Poser plug-in applied and you may want to remove the plug-ins from the objects if you plan to edit them. (Quick and easy to do if you use Notepad++ and search for all instances.)

G.

Note: I'm guessing the plug-ins applied to the objects are there to maintain a link between Poser and Lightwave, but I have to admit I have spent any time reading about it and I may be wrong. I got Poser Pro 2010 a while back thinking it might offer some tools for editing mocap, but haven't had time to check it out yet.

3DBob
01-02-2011, 02:55 PM
Unless I wasn't making sense - I explained I was using poser 64bit in my first post..... confusion because I was blending the mimic stuff in there which is only 32bit

3DBob

3DBob
01-02-2011, 03:58 PM
In this clip I used about 7 images of kelly brook at different angles in the background of face gen to adjusts its rather poor initial hash.

The result was sent to LWO2 object and I brought it into LW, applied mophmixer and then Mimic.

Double clicked on Mimic, roughly assigned the available phonemes to the mimic ones as best I could in 20 mins and ran ran an automatic lip sync without support text.

Parented head to a null at base of skull and moved it about a bit and scaled as it came in 1000 times too big! She deserately needs better eyes that can move, man she looks dead, but this is what cam out of Facegen.

The funny thing is you can see her lisp! Please bear in mind I was practically guessing which FaceGen morph to apply to the Mimic set - getting this right would have resulted in a much more believable sync.

Now I found that Mimic tended to be a bit keen and be on the sound - but it is sooo flexible, allowing you to blend morphs into new ones, vary strength throughout and has expression tracks and is soo fast. Best of all, it exports the whole lot to Morphmixer, so you can edit the results within lightwave for little tweaks. Additionally you might be able to save to Tafa for more organic and split morph control once the Automagic bit is done via the Morphmixer file.

Did notice that the Audio was not scrubbing in LW10, and choosing "scub audio" in scene manager did not seem to make a difference.

3DBob

3DBob
01-02-2011, 04:09 PM
Please read provisos in text otherwise you'll think that the automatic lipsyncing is poor due to the software. It is more to do with me knowing what it can do and just sloppily testing to see if the process works.

3DBob

Greenlaw
01-02-2011, 04:47 PM
Unless I wasn't making sense - I explained I was using poser 64bit in my first post..... confusion because I was blending the mimic stuff in there which is only 32bit

3DBob

No, it's me. I need sleep. :sleeping:

G

Greenlaw
01-02-2011, 05:11 PM
Please read provisos in text otherwise you'll think that the automatic lipsyncing is poor due to the software. It is more to do with me knowing what it can do and just sloppily testing to see if the process works.

It's been several years since I used Mimic Po for Lightwave but, yeah, if it's set up correctly, I thought it got me maybe 65-70% on the way to pretty darn good. About as good as you see in many low-budget TV and direct to DVD productions anyway. And of course that was just the automated results; nothing prevented you from tweaking and making it better. (For users who don't know, Mimic for LW automatically tranports data to Morphmixer so you can continue to tweak the lipsync in Layout if you wish.) I never went beyond testing the plug-in at work but I thought it gave me a pretty good 'first pass' results that I could build on.

IMO, Mimic doesn't beat what a really good character animator can do with adequate time and patience, but if you're in a crunch and on a shoestring budget, it does the trick.

Please keep posting! I'm curious to see more. :)

G.

Cageman
01-02-2011, 06:33 PM
OMG..

Ok... this is going to be harsh... well...before that... I think it is really cool that the pipe between Poser and LW works so well.... but my GOD... that lipsync looks so bad that it ain't funny. THAT is what happens when you start to replace animators with technology. If anything, that is a good showcase why I would never, EVER, trust a soundbased "mocap" solution for something as intricate as lipsync.

3DBob.. this critique is NOT directed at you. I want to make it clear that it is the technology that clearly isn't working that makes me puke.

Invest in some solid animators (1 can be enough) and move on...seriously. :)

3DBob
01-02-2011, 07:09 PM
Cageman, I tried to be very clear in both of my postings

You are the second person to just look at the vids - i can only assume, it's like showing a client a WIP and them moaning about it. This is programmer style testing when the programmer uses a few blobs to test an interaction it is not meant to look like avatar!

I did not do anything other than the bare minimum to see if it worked. For Mimic I didn't even bother trying to get the right morphs on and in both tech did not detail the script. I crippled the tech - because on the one hand (mimic) I new how to use it to its full and in posers case, it was about the rest of the interchange.

I explained I used Mimic years and years ago with good results. And the poser test is just that - a test - not just of "lip syncing" but that the rest of it would come in.

As Mimic was on special offer today (i just used my old licence from years ago) I thought someone might be interested

I have several animators I have been investing for 3 years.

3DBob

T-Light
01-06-2011, 03:08 AM
Hello, just adding to the mix.

Like 3DBobs stuff, this is purely prototyping and shouldn't be considered finished or even a finished workflow. Rather than poser fusion / poser pro this is created with plain poser 7 (available for $49) and a suite of scripts (MDDScripts) available for 20 from here...
http://www.vuescripts.com/_A/index.php?id=1,0,0,1,0,0

The model used is an old Daz Vic3. The Poser Talk Designer wasn't designed with Daz models in mind so you need to create a custom viseme file for each model you want to use. The viseme I used for this was created in the wee hours of the morning back in November, it could do with more work, I've included it below for anyone to pick apart and correct errors where neccessary. The basic mouth movement is there but no eye movement or emotions, I'm sure it can be improved upon considerably. Also, the voice is synthetic which may not be doing Talk Designer any favours. Still, this threads all about the possibilities right?

A good point about Poser 7 and MDDScripts is you can export Poser hair geometry, poser hair MDD files and poser dynamic cloth, you can also import Lightwave MDD's and use poser dynamics for cloth calculation.

The hair used here is an extremely simple example and something I used for speed rather than visual quality.

Here's some pics, an example vid and the viseme file mentioned earlier.

note 1:
There is a post process on the vid (free version of Magic Bullet looks for Vegas, It's 50% 'Berlin'). Even when I'm making something as raw as this, I'm vanity's b*tch, apologies in advance.

Note 2:
If you use this approach, It's best to load your exported wavefront figure model (*.obj) into modeler first and save as a lightwave object file (*.lwo). If you don't and you save your model at any point in layout you'll lose the point order of the model and break the MDD. That's important, Modeler exports the original point order, layout doesn't unless it's saved in modeler first. Saving in modeler also allows you to change your surfaces at a later date which is pretty much essential.

Edit - Oops, Sorry 3DBob, She does does Bob3D, my mistake.

cresshead
01-06-2011, 05:39 AM
tests of course just shown you 'it's working' they're not hoping for an Oscar nod! :D

3DBob
01-06-2011, 05:42 AM
Hi Brent,

Thanks for the very constructive addition to the thread, I use Steves' Vue scripts and will definitely get these added to the pipeline.

Been trying to get eon to allow MDDs in VUE for the past 4 releases, they keep saying not this release!

With respect to dynamic clothing - making the clothing in this would be great

http://www.marvelousdesigner.com/

and then using either of these techniques in Vue.

However, the MD team say they are working on allowing importing of animation. loading a char into MD with animation and making clothes and doing dynamics on it, then exporting it from here would be killer as this is just about the fastest way to create accurately moving garments that I know. Still doesnt help with hair unless you want to do anime style flat poly chains which is always an option for some stuff. Though you could do very thin chains I guess.

Here is a discussion on their forum which suggests that they will be producing a version for animators and PC2 and MDD related points are made. Please add your weight to the discussion so that we can have MDD I/O integrated in this version and hopefully it will allow for generalised instant cloth simulation and I/O

http://www.marvelousdesigner.com/forum/feature-request/52/point-oven-export-mdd

http://www.marvelousdesigner.com/forum/discussion/64/need-your-comments-regarding-animation-editor

Here is a cloth simulation rendered in MD

http://vimeo.com/17622300

oh and don't worry about the name - it is just a test!

3DBob

3DBob
01-06-2011, 06:35 AM
Oh and While we are at it, if you have ever attempted to make messy bed covers or curtains - you'll know what ta PITA it is.

Once you see this - you will not want to do it any other way - I warn you!

http://vimeo.com/16160128

http://vimeo.com/18416328

My opinion is that CORE should be come the "effects hub" of LW - with developers making Fire/Smoke, Fluids, Cloth/Hair as nodes to compliment Bullet and it would make a real addition to LW rather than another implimentation of the same (which can come later of course).

3DBob

Breather3D
01-07-2011, 08:21 PM
Hi 3DBob

I'm using a 64bit MacPro.

I'm trying to Poserfusion to work with LightWave 10. I copy the plugin from my LightWave 9.6.1, add/loaded it in LightWave 10 Layout, but I can't find the "FreeImage_x64Release.dll" that you said had to be put in the "bin" directory. Where can I find "FreeImage_x64Release.dll"?

Thanks,

Todd

Greenlaw
01-08-2011, 02:54 AM
On the Win side, it's in the Programs directory. I would guess it's the same for Mac? If you don't see it in the 9.6.1 Programs directory, check the 9.6 Programs directory. When you find it, just copy the file to the bin directory for 10.

G.

Breather3D
01-08-2011, 03:35 PM
Thank you for the advice!

I can't find it in my LightWave 9.6.1. The closest thing that I can find is in the attached image. I'm not sure what I need to do. Can you advise?

Thanks!

3DBob
01-09-2011, 11:08 AM
Hi Todd,

Not having tried this on a MAC - I don't know for certain - but my approach was launch lightwave, find what it complained about and then start saving into directories relevant to LW and retry launching the program o see if it complained still. When I found it didn't, I deleted it from the places that didn't work.

Let me know how you get on.

3DBob

Breather3D
01-09-2011, 03:21 PM
Hi 3DBob,

Thank you for the help.

I tried putting the plugin in the following:
MacHD/Applications/NewTek/LightWave3D10.0/bin
MacHD/Applications/NewTek/LightWave3D10.0/bin/plugins
MacHD/Applications/NewTek/LightWave3D10.0/support/plugins

Nothing worked.

Do you have any other suggestions?

Thanks,

Todd

Greenlaw
01-09-2011, 03:33 PM
What is it that you placed in the bin directory? You said plug-in but it I think what you want to put in there is a copy of the file called libfreeimage.dylib. (I'd like to stress the phrase "I think" here.) On the Win side, we copy a file called FreeImage_x64Release.dll, which I'm guessing is the equivalent file in the screen cap you posted. If not, I'm not sure what else to suggest. (Sorry not to be much help. I used to be such a big Mac enthusiast but my Mac chops have definitely grown rusty over the years.)

Hopefully somebody more knowledgeable will post soon.

G.

3DBob
01-09-2011, 03:36 PM
The plugin or the image handler?

3DBob

Breather3D
01-09-2011, 05:51 PM
Hi 3DBob,

I'm not sure what "plugin or the image handler" are? I'm never tried to do anything like this before.

I put "PzrForLW9x.plugin" in:
MacHD/Applications/NewTek/LightWave3D10.0/bin
MacHD/Applications/NewTek/LightWave3D10.0/bin/plugins
MacHD/Applications/NewTek/LightWave3D10.0/support/plugins

I don't know how to open the "PzrForLW9x.plugin" to get to the "libfreeimage.dylib". I'm only able to see "libfreeimage.dylib" when I chose "Edit Plug-in" in Layout.

Do you know how I could get access to "libfreeimage.dylib"?

Thank you for all of time!

Thanks,

Todd

3DBob
01-10-2011, 04:47 AM
Hi Todd,

The image library will be added automatically by the poser plugin if it is in the directory that it is expected to be found and I don't know what that is for Mac. You only need to add the poser plugin itself in the normal way - ie go to Utilities > Add Plugins

3DBob

Breather3D
01-10-2011, 05:59 PM
Hi 3DBob,

I tried the plugin in most of the directories, but no luck.

In LW Layout I chose "Load Scene", but I never get a "show all files" option. Could this be part of the problem?

Oh well, I can always just open Poser stuff in LW 9.6.1, and then open the converted files in LW 10.

Thanks for the help!

Todd

Padowan
02-16-2011, 12:51 PM
Thanks all for a very interesting (and for me - relevant) thread...

I purchased Vue Infinite 7.5, LightWave 9.6, Poser Pro 7, and had some pretty good results.

But now, I have Core on the way (supposedly), Poser Pro 2010, and still just Vue Infinite 7.5....Vue was incompatible with Poser 8, but it seems to accept imports from Poser Pro 2010. I only have Mimic for LightWave 2.0.

I also have Daz Studio Advanced, and Carrara Pro 8.

I am working on storyboards to accompany a screenplay.


*oops - spoke too soon. Poser pro 2010 and Vue Infinite 7.5 seem to be incompatible...

Padowan
05-16-2011, 05:20 PM
I know this is an old thread, but just wanted to thank 3D Bob, for the help. I have had some serious Poser Pro 2010 issues - crashing, library freaking out, etc. I finally had to uninstall all of my Poser software, run ccleaner, and re-install. The AIR library in Poser Pro 2010 updated itself, and though it still tells me I have an error (it can't find Content Paradise) I simply wait, dismiss it, and it's solid.

I remembered this thread, and was able to get Poser Pro 2010 working with LW 10.

I have Poser Pro 7, working solidly for import into Vue Infinite 7.5, and Poser Pro 2010 for import into LW 10. so far so good.

I also own Mimic Pro 2...

hmmmm.....

3DBob
05-17-2011, 03:14 AM
Hi Padowan,

No worries, you might be interested to know that after years of lobbying, VUE 9.5 now has MDD import

Vue 9.5 Features
(http://www.e-onsoftware.com/about/?page=PRIndex&date=April%207,%202011)

And you can upgrade from your version

So you can lip sync and animate in your chosen Poser, Mimic Pro 2 and LW and then bake and export the entire combined deformation to MDD for integration into VUE scenes.

3DBob

silviotoledo
05-18-2011, 05:51 PM
Didn't understand.

So Poser exports for Lightwave? Lightwave reads poser? No plugin needed?

Greenlaw
05-18-2011, 06:18 PM
Well a plug-in is needed but it's a plug-in that comes with Poser, at least with Poser Pro.

I have Poser Professional 2010, and the included Lightwave plug-in lets me exchange data between Poser and LW. I've use it a few times to get Poser-only assets (props and environments) that I purchased from DAZ or Renderosity into LW so I could cannibalize them for LW or Vue, and it works very well. I have to admit I haven't used it to exchange character models and animation but I imagine that's what it's primarily designed for.

I might be wrong about this but I think the Poser Lightwave plug-in does more than just convert data; it apparently syncs data so any changes you make to a file gets sent over to the other program. (Kinda like the Hub.) All I know is that for my purpose, I believe I had to remove a plugin from some objects in Lightwave so that Lightwave would stop talking to Poser.

It's been awhile since I did that but I think this an accurate report.

G.

silviotoledo
05-21-2011, 10:54 AM
really nice to know, once poser works fine with mocap.

silviotoledo
05-22-2011, 09:11 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rNdhzkAmY_c&playnext=1&list=PL50A77A810434673C

madno
05-29-2011, 03:03 AM
Newbie asking for help.
Currently making first steps in modeling, but found this thread and was curious.
Successfully loaded a figure from Poser into my model scene. But 3DBob mentioned:

If you want to change the animation, drop into Poser, change, save PZ3 and go back to LW, double click on deformer and click the update button - he presto, all the changes are brought in.

Well, I don't know where to find the "Deformer" I should double click (not yet done any advanced thnings in Layout). Can you give me a hint?