View Full Version : Carbon Scatter Open Beta

10-07-2010, 03:42 AM

no LW but I was informed soon(ish) ,if there is high enough demand .

its beta if you have MAX .

if the thread title says SHATTER i appoligize i did change it to SCATTER !

10-09-2010, 06:20 AM
I think Iīll wait!


10-09-2010, 09:36 AM
"using the native instancing technologies of 3ds Max, Maya, Cinema4D, Softimage or LightWave*"

Native instancing in LW? :)

10-10-2010, 08:55 AM
Umm..just speculating, but if it isnīt for lightwave 9.6-10 series, it would be of little use for anyone If Itīs only for core, since core wonīt be fully equipt withing a long time
with what lightwave has today.

Im curious of what advantages carbon scatter would have over HD Instance thou.


10-10-2010, 02:45 PM
CORE v1 is supposed to be able to work in conjunction WITH Lightwave 10. Instancing within CORE would be pretty useless if you can't really USE it. So I would bet that Newtek does have a procedure that will use CORE and LW10. Though IMO, CORE won't be good enough for serious production use until v2 or v3. Hopefully I'm wrong.

Since we have no idea what ALL of the features of Carbon Scatter are/will be... there is no way to compare the two right now at all. Right?

isn't LW 10 CORE? Is there a difference? I'm confused. Hopefully it's not like Quicktime 7 going to Quicktime X. lol

10-10-2010, 02:53 PM
CORE is a part of the next version of LW. There is LW10 - which consists of Modeler and Layout (still) that has been updated; and there is CORE which will work in conjunction WITH Layout and Modeler. We probably won't be "rid" of the old Lightwave until CORE reaches v3 (IMO) when classic LW is retired and CORE can take over completely. CORE IS LW, but you will still have the old style LW to go along with it. It's good to differentiate them so people know what part of LW you're talking about. Well... sort of.... :bangwall:

thanks for the info. It will be a great day for me, in the future, to have v3 of Core working on a 16-core Mac Pro with two 30" LED Displays. Ahhh the dream. LOL

10-10-2010, 03:33 PM
K signed up.

So far it's only in beta for max, no lw, c4d or maya versions.

However it's already working with vray for max, which is promising in terms of the development.

Still, if you are a LW user, sign up or show your interest in this and it will be around for LW asap ! :thumbsup:

ps. the forum uses full, real names! achhh .. so 90s. So probably better to email, my name is now at the top of the posters, I hate that.

10-11-2010, 02:35 AM
Umm..just speculating, but if it isnīt for lightwave 9.6-10 series, it would be of little use for anyone If Itīs only for core, since core wonīt be fully equipt withing a long time
with what lightwave has today.

Im curious of what advantages carbon scatter would have over HD Instance thou.

Depends on how they do it, I suppose. Veggipaint does basically the same thing and it generates nulls or points that can be then used with HDInstance or K-ray... and as for the advantages, well. If it works similarly to what they have in Vue you would be able to paint instances - always a plus, that - but more important, since it apparently uses Solidgrowth, no two instances would look the same, which is pretty much THE difference when you're dealing with vegetation. If this works, it'll be one of my dreams come true.


10-11-2010, 07:26 AM
Hm .. maybe the veggiepaint comparison is more accurate than you realise.

This app does not REALLY use normal vue ecosystems, but a cut down version.

It has 4 versions, plus LOD variations. Still, that's probably as much as you want in most cases, but lets see how much Ģ$ they charge for the plant libraries ......

Imagine you already own vue, and tree libraries, but have to buy them again for this ... ? Ok here I'm speculating :)

Quoted from here:


SolidGrowthCS is a special version of SolidGrowth, e-on's unique vegetation technology. SolidGrowthCS plants are prepared from their SolidGrowth counterparts and precomputed for seamless operation using native instancing capabilities.

SolidGrowthCS plants are available in 3 levels of detail (user controllable) and will automatically create up to 4 variations when added to an EcoSystem.

Carbon Scatter ships with 8 SolidGrowthCS plants. A vast library of additional SolidGrowthCS plants will be available in the near future from Cornucopia3D.

Please note that Carbon Scatter is NOT compatible with regular SolidGrowth plants (as found in Vue).

10-11-2010, 09:31 AM
This app does not REALLY use normal vue ecosystems, but a cut down version... It has 4 versions, plus LOD variations.

Aye, saw that, only four types - bummer, it sounds like a "fake" Solidgrowth then. Still, as you say, four would be enough in most cases and if Ecosystems work similarly to Vue, it would be a huge timesaver. I've never liked Vue much for an amount of reasons - materials editor, slow renderer, slightly wacky interface, blah blah and more important, the fact that it crashed every five minutes - but Ecosystems is fantastic. I've always found it amazing that VistaPro on the Amiga had something similar back in the early '90s.

Price, I don't know, Ozone isn't exactly cheap (especially compared to Vue) so perhaps not a good precedent. But since - at least on the Lightwave side - it's still vapourware, I wouldn't worry about that right now :)


10-12-2010, 12:38 AM
I stopped using Vue long go (when Vue 6 Infinite shipped, it was so buggy that it was impossible to use it on a Mac, and when it was fixed, Vue 7 as already announced, but if you had skipped Vue 6, you couldn't have an upgrade to Vue 7, you had to buy a full license again, so I let it go... Not every company is as friendly as NT as for upgrades pricing...), but I have to admit that ecosystems were pretty pleasant.
As for Ozone, I bought Ozone 3 just to find out it didn't interact with volumetrics (HV, HDI instances...) so that I now basically use it only to create HDR sky probes for environment.
I didn't buy Ozone 4, because I was afraid I would find out another limitation of this type after upgrading. Then Ozone 4 will only work in 32-bits for Mac, since 9.6.1 isn't gold yet, and you'll certainly have to upgrade to an hypothetic Ozone 5 to get 64 bits on Mac. With E-On, every new feature has to be paid. Free upgrades are generally only bug fixes.
So I can get along with HDInstance right now. Especialy since there is a plug-in that allows you to paint weight maps (http://www.flay.com/GetDetail.cfm?ID=2489) in Lightwave which is pretty like painting directly instances.

I would say that the big improvement would be vegetation system, but if you have only a few not-really solidgrowth vegetation types and have to purchase lot of them on C3D after because you can not create your own ones, well... it looks like to me it will be quite expensive in the end. Quite the E-On experinence I had before jumping to Lightwave...

Also, as it has been mentionned above, in my experience, E-On products are often quite unstable. Ozone 3 is terrible for that.
When the beta is available for Lightwave I'll still have a look though. I do think that E-On is more than capable of creating really cool and innovative products. What bugs me is their pricing policy, and over all, the fact their products are always so unstable.