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simonlion
09-13-2010, 01:29 AM
Hello Every-One.

I was looking at the Lw10 Demo, and it looks like F9, is done automatically, so do we need to have Fprime for Lw10 or not.
Dose Fprime is going to work withe Lightwave 10 ?
If we can see the Render scenes in real time, Do we need to have Fprime ?
Thanks
simon

Phil
09-13-2010, 01:48 AM
No-one who knows will be able to tell you much about LW10 beyond what has already been shown by NewTek themselves. There are NDAs in place with NewTek.

meshpig
09-13-2010, 01:54 AM
... FPrime doesn't run on quad core macs at least.

Dreamcube017
09-13-2010, 07:30 AM
Hm... from what I've seen, I don't think you'd need FPrime because of VPR... unless there's some specific thing in FPrime you need that lightwave 10 doesn't have.

stevenpalomino
09-13-2010, 07:52 AM
Unlike the VPR ( as far as I know ) FPrime has the progressive render.. that alone to me is worth the purchase cause you can render your scene in low quality.. bring it in to after effects to set up your scene while it refines and then just switch out the footage with the better quality one..

hrgiger
09-13-2010, 08:24 AM
Well, It I think they are working on saving renders out of VPR but the one huge advantage (so far) that Fprime has over VPR is that you can stop renders, and then continue them later. So you could render out a fast low-quality preview animation, and then put those same frames back to work later for further refinement. It's an amazing feature of Fprime.

brunopeixoto
09-13-2010, 08:31 AM
FPrime is a preview render and a final render and runs on iMac with core i5 - quad core.

Dreamcube017
09-13-2010, 09:21 AM
Hm, I see. FPrime does seem pretty cool. But we'll just have to see when VPR inLW10 is fully released.

Dreamcube017
09-13-2010, 09:23 AM
Hm. Well I guess we'll see when VPR is finished and fully released.

FPrime does sound pretty cool though.
Can FPrime do post proccessing effects like the VPR can though?

probiner
09-13-2010, 09:40 AM
Nope.
That and some materials.

Dreamcube017
09-13-2010, 09:44 AM
Soo... you're saying that it can do NOT ONLy that, but that and some extra shader types?

...wow this sounds like one of those lame comercials trying to sell me something.

"WOW it can do that AND THIS??" lol but that's pretty cool though.

I have a feeling VPR will improve though.

monovich
09-13-2010, 09:07 PM
Fprime rules
I dunno about 10 and Vpr but right now prime is worth it's weight in gold... Whatever that means.

Dreamcube017
09-14-2010, 02:05 AM
Hmm.. well FPrime's a piece of software... so... how much does lightwave weight exactly?

zabu
09-14-2010, 09:49 AM
fprime has some very strong features like select surfaces in the prewiev window and pan/zoom in (without see pixels because it renders allways)...so check surfaces is a snap…, that without altering the camera settings (like modo does)… VPR for me never worked…hope newtek guys will look at fprimes technology for the new lightwave 10 ;)...i cannot immagine use lightwave without fprime…

speismonqui
09-14-2010, 11:33 AM
Zabu, you're absolutely right! paning and zooming is a really helpfull feature, we all are very use to it. Will VPR work this way? would it be a progressive renderer?
For now, is great to see VPR in lightwave's viewport, but I think FPrime is still the King!

Dreamcube017
09-14-2010, 11:39 AM
I said it before and I'll say it again... I WANT FPRIME... no chance of there being student pricing is there?

Stephen0523
01-05-2011, 08:42 AM
Hi, I just tried to load the FPrime plugin into LW 10 and no luck. I just find FP much faster.
See attachments.

-EsHrA-
01-05-2011, 09:08 AM
One can only hope NT and Worley had a good and open conversation about this.

mlon

wyattharris
01-05-2011, 12:53 PM
I haven't seen any bit of information from Worley regarding changes in FPrime since the first signs of VPR. I'm wondering if he's even going to support or update it anymore.

Phil
01-05-2011, 12:56 PM
Hi, I just tried to load the FPrime plugin into LW 10 and no luck. I just find FP much faster.
See attachments.

There's no 64-bit version for Mac. Not that this is important - none of Worley's plugins work in LW10 in either 32-bit or 64-bit mode. They'll render (except FPrime), but all of the user interfaces are entirely absent. The change to Cocoa broke everything and it needs Worley to completely redo the interfaces for Cocoa LW. There's no sign of this work being underway.

prometheus
01-05-2011, 01:06 PM
paning and zooming in fprime is indeed valuable and surface selecting, and
from what I can tell It seems that fprime is faster with radiosity, but Itīs two different radiosity engines.

and progressive render in fprime to be able to pick up and continue refining frames is very nice.

one Major advantage I could see in my daily work for VPR in lw 10, That would be VPR and perspective can rendering vertex normal map smoothing correctly from exported geometry..solidworks-deep exploration to lightwave, Fprime can not handle that correctly and ergo you get smoothing errors on triangulated geometry.

Michael

Snosrap
01-05-2011, 07:06 PM
Must be a Mac thing as G2 and FPrime work fine for me in LW10.

Phil
01-06-2011, 08:28 AM
Must be a Mac thing as G2 and FPrime work fine for me in LW10.

That's why I mentioned Cocoa and put Mac in the first sentence. Given that it was clear that the poster had a Mac (check the screenshot), it seemed obvious where the comment was directed and why. There's only so much hand-holding that I can put in each post.

zpaolo
01-10-2011, 04:16 PM
I'm testing Lightwave 10 with VPR right now and it looks nowhere as fast as FPrime... I mean, VPR is good because you can preview the exact same radiosity settings you'll see in the final render, but when setting up materials FPrime is much more responsive, lightweight, you can keep it open without even noticing it and while rotating objects or moving lights feedback is almost instantaneous, while VPR still needs time to catch up. If only refractive materials worked correctly in FPrime :/

Snosrap
01-10-2011, 08:40 PM
I'm testing Lightwave 10 with VPR right now and it looks nowhere as fast as FPrime... I mean, VPR is good because you can preview the exact same radiosity settings you'll see in the final render, but when setting up materials FPrime is much more responsive, lightweight, you can keep it open without even noticing it and while rotating objects or moving lights feedback is almost instantaneous, while VPR still needs time to catch up. If only refractive materials worked correctly in FPrime :/


What kind of hp do you have? For me, FPrime is faster on heavy scenes by a considerable amount. For small to medium scenes VPR is just fine, plus the added ability to work in a perspective window and not having FPrime taking up real estate is an advantage. Clicking on surfaces to select them would be nice, but I use a Wacom and it doesn't work so great with FPrime so I really don't utilize that feature that much.

prometheus
01-11-2011, 01:00 AM
If only refractive materials worked correctly in FPrime :/


And vertex normal map smoothing wich doesnīt work in fprime, but it works with perspective cam and lightwave VPR.

True..in many cases fprime is more effective in workflow and speed, especially radiosity, It refines progressivly much faster in the initial steps it seems, where VPR takes much longer time initially, but over a certain treshold
of slow progressive refinement, the VPR seems to finalize the final passes to almost full quality much faster.

I do hope newtek still has some refinement left to do on the vpr department thou.
VPR does a better job me thinks with volumetrics such as volumetric lights, voxels and fluids, Im waiting for lensflares too if possible.

Im not sure, I donīt think you could rip off the VPR and have it as a moveable preview window like fprime, but that would be a nice addition if possible.

Michael

zpaolo
01-11-2011, 01:00 AM
What kind of hp do you have? For me, FPrime is faster on heavy scenes by a considerable amount.

I only tested it on my laptop, it's quite old with only 2gigs of ram and a 1.66MHz processor, bur LW9 with FPrime work perfectly on it. Of course VPR is gonna be faster on higher specs machines, but the fact that you see the difference only on heavy scenes proves it is still heavier than FPrime. My test is a sort of "stress test" where you put the software head to head in an uncomfortable environment.

That said, and always speaking of my machine, VPR is slower than almost any modern progressive renderer I've checked: Shot and Keyshot are both faster, and we are talking unbiased rendering engines that work at full resolution (HD 720p). I ususally work with models exported from CAD systems with high detail, reaching easily 1 million polys, and sometimes many million polys, the speed difference is really noticeable.

cresshead
01-11-2011, 03:09 AM
one thing you have to factor in is that VPR is IN lightwave and not a add on commercial plugin so long term it'll be cheaper/simpler to maintain.

VPR is of course version 1.0 that was quickly ported from core to layout, so just give it a few months and a point update or 2 to really show what it can do.

zpaolo
01-11-2011, 03:57 AM
VPR is of course version 1.0 that was quickly ported from core to layout, so just give it a few months and a point update or 2 to really show what it can do.

I agree, being integrated in lightwave is a plus (although why on earth can't I detach it from the interface scheme? :O)

Anyway let's not forget that progressive realtime rendering is no more an "outstanding new feature" at all: software traditionally aimed to computer graphics like Fryrender, Modo or Mental Ray has already introduced realtime progressive rendering, but true pioneers like Keyshot and Hypershot set the bar to a really high level of speed and quality, and this happened not months ago, but years ago. In the field of product rendering and product visualization realtime preview is a must 'cause we were spoiled when the first Hypershot went on the market :D That's why I hoped that LW VPR would be at least as fast as them at its first launch...

cresshead
01-11-2011, 05:17 AM
I agree, being integrated in lightwave is a plus (although why on earth can't I detach it from the interface scheme? :O)

Anyway let's not forget that progressive realtime rendering is no more an "outstanding new feature" at all: software traditionally aimed to computer graphics like Fryrender, Modo or Mental Ray has already introduced realtime progressive rendering, but true pioneers like Keyshot and Hypershot set the bar to a really high level of speed and quality, and this happened not months ago, but years ago. In the field of product rendering and product visualization realtime preview is a must 'cause we were spoiled when the first Hypershot went on the market :D That's why I hoped that LW VPR would be at least as fast as them at its first launch...

"Mental Ray has already introduced realtime progressive rendering"
err not on 3dsmax 2011, maya or softimage as i understand it.
I have 3dsmax 2011 and it's defo not real time with mental ray or iray.

Iray has some implementation of realtime but again NOt on 3dsmax.
the concept that realtime previews are on every 3d app is not true at all.


modo: realtime yes
messiah studio: realtime yes
Lightwave 10: yes

maya: no
3dsmax: no
softimage: limited use
Houdini: no
Cinema4d: no
Blender: no



Renderers that have realtime previews:
Fprime
vray 2.0
Arnold
Final Render
Holimatrix Rendition
Maxwell
+ some graphics card based renderers.

Skywatcher_NT
01-11-2011, 05:26 AM
I agree, being integrated in lightwave is a plus (although why on earth can't I detach it from the interface scheme? :O)

Anyway let's not forget that progressive realtime rendering is no more an "outstanding new feature" at all: software traditionally aimed to computer graphics like Fryrender, Modo or Mental Ray has already introduced realtime progressive rendering, but true pioneers like Keyshot and Hypershot set the bar to a really high level of speed and quality, and this happened not months ago, but years ago. In the field of product rendering and product visualization realtime preview is a must 'cause we were spoiled when the first Hypershot went on the market :D That's why I hoped that LW VPR would be at least as fast as them at its first launch...


Whaw! It ( Shot pro ) can do turntable animation, HDRI lighting and raytracing for only 3495 ???? WT...
And it only needs a bunch of highend Tesla cards etc... to do it...
Well .. I think you should try VPR for real and check out what it can do
in the real world and not just product shots of cars and archviz low poly models.:devil:

zpaolo
01-11-2011, 05:52 AM
"Mental Ray has already introduced realtime progressive rendering"
err not on 3dsmax 2011, maya or softimage as i understand it.

I did not say that 3dsmax or maya have it, I said that Mental Ray (better, Mental Images) introduced it. Bunkspeed Shot is using iRay, Pro/Engineer will, and basically every customer of mental images technology will have it (RTT integrated iRay in their products, and that's quite a big deal in automotive...).



Iray has some implementation of realtime but again NOt on 3dsmax.
the concept that realtime previews are on every 3d app is not true at all.


Mental Ray 3.8 includes iRay AFAIK, so if 3dsmax doesn't implement it it's because of Autodesk choices/strategies. But if not this round, they'll have it next round, and it's not going to be a "new" or "experimental" feature because, right now, iRay is already on the market.

But my point is that today one should expect a product like CORE to have a capable realtime preview because other players already have or will have a mature solution for that... I hope when the "full" CORE hits the market it will have a better realtime preview, that's all...

Paolo

zpaolo
01-11-2011, 06:02 AM
Whaw! It ( Shot pro ) can do turntable animation, HDRI lighting and raytracing for only 3495 ???? WT...
And it only needs a bunch of highend Tesla cards etc... to do it...


First, I don't understand your aggressiveness and sarcasm, besides you are not well informed, Shot can do realtime rendering using CPU only or CPU + GPU. The selling point of Shot and similar software is that a company (not a graphics studio) can buy one and do product rendering easily because they don't need to remodel parts AND they have a material selection that "just works", no need to tweak dozens of parameters to obtain steel, or polished metal, or shiny plastic or glass (I mean, do we have to always re-invent the wheel? ;) )


Well .. I think you should try VPR for real and check out what it can do in the real world and not just product shots of cars and archviz low poly models.:devil:

"just" product shots of cars? Consider that this "humble" product shots are not subDs models of cars made for CGI visual effects, but polygonal exports of CAD data in full detail (internal + external + mechanics etc), and can be made of a huge number of polys.
That said, I already tested VPR on my machine with a quite large scene and it's slower than FPrime. It looks like other people experienced the same.

Paolo

prometheus
01-11-2011, 06:20 AM
If I can solve the issues we are having when exporting our gym machines from solidworks-deep exploration to lightwave and back to obj format and then to octane renderer, then I would most likely use Octane for our product renders, Itīs faster than fprime and VPR and by default you have more physicly correct material models and lighting, so I beleive I will be able to create our product images much faster within octane.

The problem is that Octane crashes after lightwave obj export with vertex normal map smoothing, a direct export from solidworks-deep exploration with normal map smoothing works in octane thou, Itīs just something that happens when It goes through lightwave and obj export.

ordinary lightwave objects from scratch is no problem for octane, I could merge the objects points before export but that screws up the vertex normal map smoothing.

Ivé contacted the support team for octane and sent them some testfiles to see if thereīs a solution.

Otherwise Ill need to stay with lightwave and use the vpr, fprime is out of the question since it doesnīt work with vertex normal map smoothing..Unless using true arts obj importer plugin.

As soon as the Modo trial comes out I will take a look at that workflow too, since they have native sldasm import, so I could probably skip
the deep exploration export, the question is how fast it will be compared to lightwave and octane and how realistic the lighting and materials will be.

Edit..I have yet to compare poly amount size between vpr/fprime and octane..Generally our gym machines comes out between 200 000 to 800 000 polygons, but in the future I will need
to have several machines lined up for some plan views, so It will perhaps be some millions of polys to handle, the open gl handles them quite well for a starter thou.

Michael

zpaolo
01-11-2011, 06:35 AM
If I can solve the issues we are having when exporting our gym machines from solidworks-deep exploration to lightwave and back to obj format and then to octane renderer, then I would most likely use Octane for our product renders, Itīs faster than fprime and VPR and by default you have more physicly correct material models and lighting, so I beleive I will be able to create our product images much faster within octane.

I understand your pain here, in fact I used to export OBJs from Pro|E and render them in LW. I use LW rendering engine for final image, but FPrime for previews, where the loss of normal map data is not so critical. I don't use FPrime for final shots also because it doesn't work well with refractive materials :/



As soon as the Modo trial comes out I will take a look at that workflow too, since they have native sldasm import, so I could probably skip
the deep exploration export, the question is how fast it will be compared to lightwave and octane and how realistic the lighting and materials will be.

But hasn't solidworks introduced PhotoView360 with realtime rendering licensed from MODO? That would be the best option if you are modeling in Solidworks... I tried MODO but I prefer LW interface, I know it better and MODO is to some extend too complex for what I have to do :/

Skywatcher_NT
01-11-2011, 06:46 AM
"First, I don't understand your aggressiveness and sarcasm, "

Aggressive ? Sarcasm ? Cool down:cool:
This is a forum to discuss things ... so...


" besides you are not well informed, Shot can do realtime rendering using CPU only or CPU + GPU."

Well, then don't compare CPU only to CPU + GPU setups ;)
And show an example of CPU only maybe ?



" The selling point of Shot and similar software is that a company (not a graphics studio) can buy one and do product rendering easily "

Nothing wrong with that, except for the ridiculous price.


" because they don't need to remodel parts AND they have a material selection that "just works", no need to tweak dozens of parameters to obtain steel, or polished metal, or shiny plastic or glass (I mean, do we have to always re-invent the wheel? )"

Ever heard of presets ?
And even creating plastic or metal or glass just takes a minute from scratch in lightwave + you can tweak it in real time in VPR.
So paying almost 5 times the price for less functionallity:stumped:

prometheus
01-11-2011, 07:05 AM
I understand your pain here, in fact I used to export OBJs from Pro|E and render them in LW. I use LW rendering engine for final image, but FPrime for previews, where the loss of normal map data is not so critical. I don't use FPrime for final shots also because it doesn't work well with refractive materials :/



But hasn't solidworks introduced PhotoView360 with realtime rendering licensed from MODO? That would be the best option if you are modeling in Solidworks... I tried MODO but I prefer LW interface, I know it better and MODO is to some extend too complex for what I have to do :/


Well the problem with using Fprime for previews are that many metal reflective materials is so quite different to how lightwave renders them, so
having a metal logo on a machine will yield very different look between fprime and lightwave renderer, so Yes I initially have been using fprime for previews and final renders, but I was lucky to get away with some images because they have not been in larger sizes where you can notice smoothing errors that easy.
So if I canīt use fprime neither for preview or final renders, then Itīs perspective cam and VPR for tweaking thatīs more effective.

For modo, I didnīt have the chance to validate the demoversions before expiration, but at that time the photo view 360 was not impressive and poorly featured (modo 401) ..How well it know works with solidworks I donīt know, we have a slightly older solidworks version so I donīt think photoview 360 would work.

And besides, we need to remodel more organic shapes such as cushions, and that is a little hard to do within solidworks for our solidworks guy, I donīt know, maybe he could do good models with curves surfacing, I generally get the files from him and convert, do some remodeling, weld seams etc..and the surfacing/rendering, If not ..I would be out of job,
or at least just would have to do illustrations of instruction plates wich I also do currently:)

No really my best bet Is on octane, If it can handle the exports, and if
it can handle the poly account, my impressions of he speed and how easy it is to get good metal reflections and lighting is a very positive one.

Michael

zpaolo
01-11-2011, 07:18 AM
" besides you are not well informed, Shot can do realtime rendering using CPU only or CPU + GPU."

Well, then don't compare CPU only to CPU + GPU setups ;)
And show an example of CPU only maybe ?


Err... maybe I did not explain well... I WAS actually comparing CPU only setups: VPR, Fprime, Shot, Keyshot and MODO (these are the one I tested) can work in CPU only mode, so the comparison is fair :) And my machine can't do GPGPU so Shot on my machine is CPU only :)



" because they don't need to remodel parts AND they have a material selection that "just works", no need to tweak dozens of parameters to obtain steel, or polished metal, or shiny plastic or glass (I mean, do we have to always re-invent the wheel? )"

Ever heard of presets ?
And even creating plastic or metal or glass just takes a minute from scratch in lightwave + you can tweak it in real time in VPR.
So paying almost 5 times the price for less functionallity:stumped:

5 times? Shot costs 995$ and can do all except animation, I'm not a fan of Shot (Hypershot/Keyshot is faster when your GPU is not supported and can do animation at almost the same price) but these price positioning looks correct. Lightwave is an extremely aggressively priced software for what it can offer, but imagine being a company looking for product rendering, I'd rather spend the money on an easy solution like Shot than on something complex like LW and have to deal with file conversions later on...

Paolo

lardbros
01-11-2011, 07:29 AM
I did not say that 3dsmax or maya have it, I said that Mental Ray (better, Mental Images) introduced it. Bunkspeed Shot is using iRay, Pro/Engineer will, and basically every customer of mental images technology will have it (RTT integrated iRay in their products, and that's quite a big deal in automotive...).



Mental Ray 3.8 includes iRay AFAIK, so if 3dsmax doesn't implement it it's because of Autodesk choices/strategies. But if not this round, they'll have it next round, and it's not going to be a "new" or "experimental" feature because, right now, iRay is already on the market.

But my point is that today one should expect a product like CORE to have a capable realtime preview because other players already have or will have a mature solution for that... I hope when the "full" CORE hits the market it will have a better realtime preview, that's all...

Paolo

Bunkspeed has implemented Iray, but have you seen the video? It's not massively quick... and they don't even say what machine they are working on... the iray demos they showed at the Autodesk stand at Siggraph last year was running on something like a quad 'quadro tesla' or something equally as ridiculous (or possibly more... but can't find the specs online)

So, my point being, that those Bunkspeed videos, (which they edit to hell anyway, to cut out the actual rendering/resolving time), could be running on a crazy-priced, stupidly powerful cluster of tesla GPU's... unless you know different.

The demos at Siggy on these tesla machines were extremely disappointing considering the horsepower behind it... what Newtek have done with VPR in version one, is pretty awesome.

Skywatcher_NT
01-11-2011, 08:04 AM
"5 times? Shot costs 995$ and can do all except animation"

So all you can do is stills ?

Shots Pro = 3495 ;)
Ok that's not 5 times ( my bad ) but it's alot !!
Shots = +/- price of LW and it can't even do 5 % of what LW can do in rendering alone... nobrainer...

And shots can't do animation ? Well, that's not all...

it also can't do : -Sun Study Animation
-Turntable Animation (as mentioned)
-Displacement Mapping
-Queue™: Rendering Manager
-Real-time Camera Post Processing Options
-32bit Image Output
-Time of Day Lighting Model
-Camera Positioning (????)
-Multiple Environments/Backplates

cresshead
01-11-2011, 09:44 AM
last time i checked lightwave was a 3d app not just a plugin renderer...

zpaolo
01-11-2011, 12:47 PM
So, my point being, that those Bunkspeed videos, (which they edit to hell anyway, to cut out the actual rendering/resolving time), could be running on a crazy-priced, stupidly powerful cluster of tesla GPU's... unless you know different.

Hmm you can download the demo of Shot and check it out... why everybody is talking as these things actually don't exist or are like future relases? Shot is not the fastest preview render, its mental ray heritage is visible from the fact that it first do final gather and then refine the detail (it was the same on Alias Imagestudio), but overall it was, on my machine, on par with VPR, maybe a little slower but consider that iRay is an unbiased rendering engine...

I think there's a broader point here, and that is the "war" between product visualizers and full fledged 3d apps. This, like every informatic war, is quite silly I admit, but I'd like to clarify what I think about it...

Every tool has its market and every market has its price range. LW is superb, i REALLY love it, and it costs a fraction of Shot Pro, but also a fraction of 3dsmax. It's not unusual to see companies spend money to buy 3dsmax or 3dsmax design and end up doing more or less what they could do with Shot or Keyshot, but in an unoptimized environment and unoptimized workflow, with data conversion problems and so on. A company that splashes 8000$ for a single license of a CAD package will find Shot to be "really cheap" and will value its directness and ease of use more than the actual amount of features they'll never need to use or they'll never have time to train people to use.
But in the end this doesn't mean that product visualizer are the dumb cousins of 3D apps, on the contrary the push of software like Hypershot and Keyshot forced many developers to adopt technologies like realtime rendering, material databases and so on to allure the product visualization market, and to show that even their products can be "simple" and "direct". In the end the users are the ones who will benefit from this competition, independently from the market they work for.

At the end of the day, there's nothing wrong in saying that VPR is slower than FPrime or Keyshot, I like Lightwave rendering engine more than both the other mentioned here and I'd really like to see its VPR burn every competitor in speed :D

Tartiflette
01-11-2011, 02:01 PM
Please, guys, all those render engines are NOT realtime render engines, but technically more something like "progressive refinement render engines". :)

They are NOT working realtime, but they "just' refine the render until it looks like the "real", fully featured, render engine.

Otherwise, i qgree with Zpaolo, every market has its tool, and products like Keyshot are a real godsend for some design studios, in that they are accessible to any designer, even those who don't understand anything about generalist 3D apps.

And for sure, from a 3D man PoV, they are too expensive (i for example like the keyshot immediate render engine, but i don't have any professionnal use of it and can't afford to pay 900$ just for fum, so it's too expensive for me...) and look like a rip-off compared to tools like LightWave which cost less and can do almost everything.


Cheers,
Laurent aka Tartiflette :)

Serling
01-13-2011, 01:40 AM
Hm... from what I've seen, I don't think you'd need FPrime because of VPR... unless there's some specific thing in FPrime you need that lightwave 10 doesn't have.

I'm using fPrime with LW 10 because it renders much faster than VPR. However, fPrime does not render everything in the scene, neither does it render as well as VPR does. So I use fPrime when surfacing objects (especially with the Node Editor) for the really fast feedback I get. But to get a really good idea of how the scene is going to look fully rendered, I use VPR. And I still use F9 renders a lot, to see the scene in full, final resolution.

DP Lights also work in LW10 (if anyone uses them) but don't try to use them with VPR: doing so always locks up my Layout.

Hope this helps.

zpaolo
01-13-2011, 03:58 AM
So I use fPrime when surfacing objects (especially with the Node Editor) for the really fast feedback I get. But to get a really good idea of how the scene is going to look fully rendered, I use VPR. And I still use F9 renders a lot, to see the scene in full, final resolution.

That's exactly what I'm doing: FPrime for material and lights preview, VPR for a quick preview render (it's faster than having to change render parameters...) and final rendering with F9.

Paolo

Netvudu
01-13-2011, 04:14 AM
Fprime does not work in LWF, right? thatīs rules it out for everything in my book. I will never work again without Linear workflow. Itīs just dumbing down my render capabilities....

geo_n
01-13-2011, 06:16 AM
Fprime does not work in LWF, right? thatīs rules it out for everything in my book. I will never work again without Linear workflow. Itīs just dumbing down my render capabilities....

Someone posted a nodeflow that would work with fprime for linear workflow.:)

Snosrap
01-13-2011, 08:29 PM
VPR is slower than FPrime, but for us the real problem is that it doesn't refine enough. We do furniture design and the textures are very poorly rendered. We typically render at 900 x 900, which works out really well when using VPR, but it might as well be 300 x 300 because image maps are so poorly rendered. It would be nice if NT could speed it up (which I'm sure is on the agenda) and fix the texture issue.

speismonqui
03-01-2011, 01:46 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WHx5iJbKo4

maybe they already did it

bgraves44
07-31-2011, 08:44 AM
I said it before and I'll say it again... I WANT FPRIME... no chance of there being student pricing is there?

I don't think they offer it officially, but my wife got me Sasquatch a few years back and was able to talk them into a little discount somehow. They seem to be pretty cool over there :)

B

Snosrap
07-31-2011, 08:54 AM
I said it before and I'll say it again... I WANT FPRIME... no chance of there being student pricing is there?They have recently lowered the price to $199.

bgraves44
07-31-2011, 09:24 AM
Uugh.. Don't tell me that, hehe. for $200 FPrime is a MUST have IMO!

abdelkarim
07-14-2012, 08:18 PM
hahaah some one said . i dont need fprime Cz i have VPR . VPR crap vs Frprime . fprime fast witout interpolate as lw do in GR . vpr cant show u the finale result with full Gi . but fprime he does . pretty much like Kray or like Vray . if u find tricks how to use Fprime . u cant not said Vpr better then fprime . if worley hear u . he will close his laboratory . or his company .

Snosrap
07-14-2012, 11:00 PM
VPR keeps improving. We have pretty much weened off of FPrime now. The linear color workspace with VPR that was brought to LW10 spelled an imminent death to FPrime and it looks like that time is very near.