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Ideas Unlimited
03-18-2010, 11:48 AM
Firstly Iím not sure of the legalities in mentioning the name of the book that Iím talking about but I wish I could...
The title above may seem a little strong but thatís how I feel at the moment. I love reading, it could be fiction, fact or manuals especially Lightwave or anything 3D related books. Iíve been using LW for a while and usually read selective books that are published with the release of each new version, so when Lightwave 3D 8 *****ing was released I read it cover to cover and found it to be a very informative and a well written book. A few days ago I managed to get hold of a copy of Lightwave 3D 9 *****ing on the same subject and because IĎd enjoyed the last version I was really looking forward to receiving this book and increasing my knowledge of the subject... Oh how I was wrong!! Imagine my surprise when I eagerly opened it to see that it was exactly the same as version 8 but with a different cover. To say that I felt cheated would be a major understatement. I didnít expect to see it completely rewritten as you canít change the concept of the subject but I did expect to see some new chapters on the new features of LW9. I feel conned. If I read a book and learn one new and useful piece of information then as far as Iím concerned its money well spent, no chance here!!! Donít get me wrong I highly recommend this book in any version but I feel that Iíve been conned and have had the piss taken out of me for being a loyal reader of Lightwave books, EBay here we come

shrox
03-18-2010, 11:54 AM
Firstly Iím not sure of the legalities in mentioning the name of the book that Iím talking about but I wish I could...
The title above may seem a little strong but thatís how I feel at the moment. I love reading, it could be fiction, fact or manuals especially Lightwave or anything 3D related books. Iíve been using LW for a while and usually read selective books that are published with the release of each new version, so when Lightwave 3D 8 *****ing was released I read it cover to cover and found it to be a very informative and a well written book. A few days ago I managed to get hold of a copy of Lightwave 3D 9 *****ing on the same subject and because IĎd enjoyed the last version I was really looking forward to receiving this book and increasing my knowledge of the subject... Oh how I was wrong!! Imagine my surprise when I eagerly opened it to see that it was exactly the same as version 8 but with a different cover. To say that I felt cheated would be a major understatement. I didnít expect to see it completely rewritten as you canít change the concept of the subject but I did expect to see some new chapters on the new features of LW9. I feel conned. If I read a book and learn one new and useful piece of information then as far as Iím concerned its money well spent, no chance here!!! Donít get me wrong I highly recommend this book in any version but I feel that Iíve been conned and have had the piss taken out of me for being a loyal reader of Lightwave books, EBay here we come

That is fairly normal for updates of tech books. What would be the reason to completely rewrite something that works well?

dandeentremont
03-18-2010, 11:57 AM
I think i have the 8 version of the exact book you speak of.
Edit: Nick Boughen is active on these forums. You can probably PM him and ask about the book.

OnlineRender
03-18-2010, 12:06 PM
dude that sucks ! sorry you feel that way , totally understandble . PDF all the way baby .

" good read is the lightwave lighting guide ! .

cresshead
03-18-2010, 12:15 PM
if you read the user comments on amazon....we'll you'll see it's the SAME book just a new cover...

http://www.amazon.com/LightWave-Lighting-Wordware-Graphics-Library/dp/159822039X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1268936057&sr=8-1

Ideas Unlimited
03-18-2010, 12:25 PM
That is fairly normal for updates of tech books. What would be the reason to completely rewrite something that works well?

Like I said above I expected it to be similar but surely not exactly the same? I also read Inside Lightwave by Dan Alban series, similar in the beginning as you would expect but the rest of the books different


if you read the user comments on amazon....we'll you'll see it's the SAME book just a new cover...

http://www.amazon.com/LightWave-Lighting-Wordware-Graphics-Library/dp/159822039X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1268936057&sr=8-1

Looks like it's not just me then :)

shrox
03-18-2010, 12:31 PM
Like I said above I expected it to be similar but surely not exactly the same? I also read Inside Lightwave by Dan Alban series, similar in the beginning as you would expect but the rest of the books different



Looks like it's not just me then :)

Like I said, that's pretty common for updates of tech books. Revisions are different, and you would expect more new and corrected content.

akademus
03-18-2010, 01:35 PM
Thats why I stopped buying Inside LW series. They are great books but they all are pretty much the same.

cheers

jeric_synergy
03-18-2010, 01:50 PM
Let's give credit where it's due: I think Dan Ablan goes to pretty good lengths to address the version changes in the "INSIDE LIGHTWAVE" series: the spline modeling tutorial ("Caesar") in LW8 was a deliberate attempt to get away from the "model a pretty girl" tuts of previous editions.

I would expect coverage of anything new in the software: in this case, anything that changed in the lighting department.

Of course, the DVD would change too: new version demo and all that.

Weetos
03-18-2010, 04:51 PM
I didn't buy this book, but I own Inside LW 7, 8 and 9 and I didn't feel cheated or anything - each new version has new chapters, new ways of doing things and that really made me efficiently USE LightWave, while the manual was like "This button does this, or that. If you didn't understand what it does, or if you think this won't be of any use, that's fine, skip to the next paragraph."

Even if I did read the whole manual, Inside LW made me use tools I've never really thought I would use, while explaining how to use them and why they are used in this project. As in any other software packages, there are multiple ways of achieving one given task, and one of them is sometimes the best/fastest/easiest way in a given context. I owe Dan big time.

I'm sorry to hear you felt cheated, and I hope I'm sure this wasn't Nick Boughen's intention.

GCL
03-18-2010, 05:36 PM
Best way to avoid spending extra $$$ for each version is to wait a bit and fetch it on Amazon or any good used book sellers for a great price.
I never pay full price for LW or any other technical books.

aurora
03-18-2010, 09:03 PM
I'm the kind that never buys a book unseen, save textbooks (like I get a choice in that, grrr! I have a few [spelled a few dozen] changes that should have been made there!!!)

Silkrooster
03-18-2010, 11:05 PM
If you live in a city or even a large town odds are there is a bookstore to look at them before purchasing. However where I am the bookstore is extremely small and not a franchise. So Amazon is my place for books, so I am surprised that I haven't been bitten yet. But then again I don't own a whole slew of books either, but getting there. :D

calilifestyle
03-19-2010, 01:06 AM
But that series of book was strictly lighting. I really enjoyed the essentials lightwave v9

Skonk
03-19-2010, 04:14 AM
While Dan's books did repeat some of the tutorials (though they were generally tweaked, fixing any problems from the previous version so never really a like for like copy); there were always plenty of totally new things and the size of the books actually went up each time too; so they always felt well worth the purchase

Putting the exact same book out and labelling it as being for a totally different version of the app is plain wrong and is certainly a ripoff.

Ideas Unlimited
03-19-2010, 10:17 AM
I didn't buy this book, but I own Inside LW 7, 8 and 9 and I didn't feel cheated or anything - each new version has new chapters, new ways of doing things and that really made me efficiently USE LightWave, while the manual was like "This button does this, or that. If you didn't understand what it does, or if you think this won't be of any use, that's fine, skip to the next paragraph."

Even if I did read the whole manual, Inside LW made me use tools I've never really thought I would use, while explaining how to use them and why they are used in this project. As in any other software packages, there are multiple ways of achieving one given task, and one of them is sometimes the best/fastest/easiest way in a given context. I owe Dan big time.

I'm sorry to hear you felt cheated, and I hope I'm sure this wasn't Nick Boughen's intention.

Now there is my point I aslo have Dans books and as you would expect there are similar chapters, there's only so many ways you can explain how to use a primitive :) but the bulk of the book picked up on different tools for different versions. I know that lighting doesn't change much but there are still new lights to choose from with the new versions :(

CGI Addict
03-19-2010, 02:07 PM
That is fairly normal for updates of tech books. What would be the reason to completely rewrite something that works well?

So don't slap a new cover on it and pass it off as a new edition?

Goes both ways, especially when money is involved.

shrox
03-19-2010, 04:42 PM
So don't slap a new cover on it and pass it off as a new edition?

Goes both ways, especially when money is involved.

Sorry kids, I'm an old man who remembers when books were typeset manually. Rag all over it if you want.

Andyjaggy
03-19-2010, 04:53 PM
There are still LW books around? Amazing.

I still remember the transition in my local bookstore from shelves stocked full of LW books, to shelved stocked full of Maya books. That was the beginning of the end.

Cageman
03-19-2010, 05:12 PM
Never read Inside LW 8 Lighting... but I have Inside LW9 Lighting and it's a great book. As Shrox says, these types of books are usually updated to add information for the new version of the software.

Cageman
03-19-2010, 05:17 PM
This comment is hillarious...

"over 500 pages of bla bla bla theories.... i miss a lot of good tricks and hints & how to do in various situations....there are some good information's, but not too much, to help someone who wants to improve his work with good lightning. "go outside and study the light", man, i purchased this book to be helped study light from a pro and to use it correctly in all circumstances. sorry i don't want to play the bad guy, maybe there is someone who will love this book."

Uh... dude... why do you think some people are making great renders while others simply suck at it? Because they know what buttons to push? Come on... Light-theory and a fundamental understanding of light as well as observation IS what makes the pros.

:D

jeric_synergy
03-20-2010, 01:30 PM
Putting the exact same book out and labelling it as being for a totally different version of the app is plain wrong and is certainly a ripoff.
It's a bit reprehensible: the usual way of handling this is to clearly designate something "2nd Edition"-- if I pick up a "2nd Edition" I expect that there will be only minor tweaks in the text.