PDA

View Full Version : It's Here. Messiah 4.5.



calilifestyle
03-09-2010, 01:26 AM
Demo also available,finally. Get it while it's hot lol

They even have a mac version now

http://www.projectmessiah.com/x6/shop.html

jin choung
03-09-2010, 01:52 AM
ok...

so newtek - pay attention!

that's how you make something look sexy!

look at those gifs on the front page!

man, i've written messiah off and i still pretty much do but i'm STILL gonna take a look at all their features....

jin

OnlineRender
03-09-2010, 05:32 AM
and it helped make tremors 3 , it must be a winner :P

Kuzey
03-09-2010, 05:58 AM
ok...

so newtek - pay attention!

that's how you make something look sexy!

look at those gifs on the front page!

jin

Ahhh...yes, those look good and the impact is instant...something to think about :D

Kuzey

Phil
03-09-2010, 11:32 AM
The Mac version is running via WINE - it's not a 'native' build, and the demo here simply crashes out during load on OS X 10.6.2.

Ho hum.

calilifestyle
03-09-2010, 11:37 AM
Are you sure. They have a video on Setuptabe, where he installs the mac version as a normal program. The only thing he installs is x-code.. Is xcode wine.

http://setuptab.com/index.php/board,24.0.html

i looked up xcode, it's not wine

cresshead
03-09-2010, 11:50 AM
Are you sure. They have a video on Setuptabe, where he installs the mac version as a normal program. The only thing he installs is x-code.. Is xcode wine.

http://setuptab.com/index.php/board,24.0.html

i looked up xcode, it's not wine

yeah looks to me like a full on OSX version from that video :thumbsup:

Phil
03-09-2010, 11:56 AM
Are you sure. They have a video on Setuptabe, where he installs the mac version as a normal program. The only thing he installs is x-code.. Is xcode wine.

http://setuptab.com/index.php/board,24.0.html

i looked up xcode, it's not wine

It's WINE. That's why X11 is needed, and the easiest way to direct a user to install that is to have them install XCode. Technically, it's a WINE-based system called Chromium - the same that is used to deliver many new Intel-only Mac games from the original Windows codebase.

You can take a look inside the Mac application bundle and see the Chromium system.

cresshead
03-09-2010, 12:10 PM
looks like the anisculpt setup for blender by pepeland


http://www.projectmessiah.com/x6/small_pix/PointAnimation.gif

i agree, the animated gif on the home page puts the features front and centre...you instantly 'get' what messiah is about.

Soth
03-09-2010, 12:15 PM
...do we have full tablet support now? I need to find my Messiah memory stick. ;)

probiner
03-09-2010, 12:18 PM
Modo + Messiah = wow? :D

cresshead
03-09-2010, 12:21 PM
have to say there's not much 'spec' info on the site regarding the mac version...just an apple logo!

Soth
03-09-2010, 12:39 PM
...do we have full tablet support now?

Nope. Messiah still not for people that have to use tablets (RSI).

I wonder if support email is still directly connected to the limbo. ;)

NewTek, please do not learn how to do sexy from pmG.

CGI Addict
03-09-2010, 12:50 PM
Finally a Mac version! I'm buying!

lwaddict
03-09-2010, 12:51 PM
Still life using Messiah?

Newtek, please do not learn how to do sexy from these guys.

CGI Addict
03-09-2010, 12:52 PM
And plays well with Modo to boot. Made my day.

jin choung
03-09-2010, 12:56 PM
and it helped make tremors 3 , it must be a winner :P

(y'all knew it was coming... and now here it is)

yes... nothing compared to lw which was used on such masterpieces as mega shark vs. giant squid.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fa7ck5mcd1o

"it must be a winner"

: )

jin

3dworks
03-09-2010, 01:01 PM
Finally a Mac version! I'm buying!

better test it first, it didn't even startup on my mac. it's not a real mac compile, but using a virtualization technique, that's maybe the reason for some imcompatibilities...

markus

jay3d
03-09-2010, 01:13 PM
(y'all knew it was coming... and now here it is)

yes... nothing compared to lw which was used on such masterpieces as mega shark vs. giant squid.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fa7ck5mcd1o

"it must be a winner"

: )

jin

Yeah sure nothing compared to LW which was used on such masterpieces as The Passenger

http://chrisj.com.au/thepassenger/movies.html

-

Lightwolf
03-09-2010, 01:15 PM
it's not a real mac compile, but using a virtualization technique...
Technically it's actually an API wrapper more than anything else. Which also means that it's basically just as abstracted from the OS as any Qt based application for example.

Cheers,
Mike

calilifestyle
03-09-2010, 02:08 PM
http://setuptab.com/index.php/topic,1312.0.html

CGI Addict
03-09-2010, 02:09 PM
better test it first, it didn't even startup on my mac. it's not a real mac compile, but using a virtualization technique, that's maybe the reason for some imcompatibilities...

markus

So far so good over here but I'm using the demo right now. I imagine it'll go through an soon-to-be-released upgrade for bug fixes. Intro pricing of $499 works for me.

jin choung
03-09-2010, 02:12 PM
Yeah sure nothing compared to LW which was used on such masterpieces as The Passenger

http://chrisj.com.au/thepassenger/movies.html

-

you're missing the point.

jin

jay3d
03-09-2010, 02:44 PM
you're missing the point.

jin

I'm just defending.

Could be missing the point .. yes, just became highly sensitive for those kind of posts :)

Soth
03-09-2010, 02:50 PM
So far so good over here but I'm using the demo right now. I imagine it'll go through an soon-to-be-released upgrade for bug fixes. Intro pricing of $499 works for me.

1. I bought using this promotion 6 months ago.
2. Try to use demo as long as possible before final dwecision, I liked Messiah but I could not use it cos bugs and they ignored my email and fixes did not made to 4.5... I finished having expansive toy. ;)

MentalFish
03-09-2010, 02:54 PM
Dang it, had the same experience with Messiah on my Mac as with Core, doubleclick-to-run-crash-before-even-started... bleh... back to LW...

I'll be keeping an eye on it though, looks pretty sweet, and plays nice with LW formats.

cresshead
03-09-2010, 03:10 PM
just to throw the thread sorta off topic but the "herd of cats is out the bag" over at autodesk....new feature lists on maya2011, 3dsmax2011 and mudbox as well....:devil:

Intuition
03-09-2010, 03:36 PM
Oh wow, didn't think they were going to show Maya 2011 already.

cresshead
03-09-2010, 04:43 PM
Oh wow, didn't think they were going to show Maya 2011 already.


yeah 3dsmax gets a node based material editor as well as keeping the old one...
also a FIRST...max can now save as previous version...defo a re write going on then!
also TOXIK is now bundled with 3dsmax.:thumbsup:

and then there's the new renderer....Quicksilver hardware renderer ultra fast by all accounts.

i'm off to look at the maya updates next!

:offtopic::hijack::spam:


yeh... well....:newhere:

zarti
03-09-2010, 05:55 PM
4.5 exports .dae! (good for core users)

taken from 'what's new' pdf:

"Now you can export your scenes to the popular FBX / Collada export formats! (based on FBX SDK version 2010).
Tested for compatibility with Maya and Unity 3d engine amongst others. Saves objects with keyframe animation,
animation as a point cache, or bone weighted animation, and UV textures."

Wegg
03-09-2010, 08:08 PM
1. I bought using this promotion 6 months ago.
2. Try to use demo as long as possible before final dwecision, I liked Messiah but I could not use it cos bugs and they ignored my email and fixes did not made to 4.5... I finished having expansive toy. ;)

I don't remember seeing any of your posts on setuptab. . . what were these "bugs" that were show stoppers for you?

Wegg
03-09-2010, 08:10 PM
Dang it, had the same experience with Messiah on my Mac as with Core, doubleclick-to-run-crash-before-even-started... bleh... back to LW...

We tested it on 10.4.11, 10.5.8 and then 10.6.2. . . and it worked. Then the release and more than one person have reported the problems you just described. Hard to nail down what it is exactly but yes. . . pmG/we are trying to figure it out. :-/

jin choung
03-09-2010, 08:34 PM
I'm just defending.

Could be missing the point

can anyone tell the class the point that i was trying to make?

bueller?

bueller?

jin

Titus
03-09-2010, 10:13 PM
We're starting to move to Blender for our internal projects. I'm really tempted to try Messiah again.

Wegg
03-09-2010, 11:07 PM
We're starting to move to Blender for our internal projects. I'm really tempted to try Messiah again.

Be tempted. Its really good stuff. With the new FBX support, point animation, autorig3, a whole host of new expressions. . . there is a lot of momentum behind it and the community around it is pretty stinking awesome.

With the .mdd interchange format it fits in with pretty much any pipeline and if your looking for it to take a bigger part of your pipeline. . . the renderer is pretty kick a55 (can't believe they censored that word. . . ). Its Arnold roots really shine through and all the newer stuff is icing.

Of course it isn't perfect. . . lots of annoying quirks that seem to linger year after year but whats there is sound.

Wegg
03-09-2010, 11:35 PM
Well Christopher Lutz wrote a BVH importer (http://setuptab.com/index.php/topic,33.0.html) that he is really good about supporting and I know I saw a script written by Vegard that binds that motion to an autorigged character but it isn't something I personally have any experience with. From what I can tell, Motion Builder is built from the ground up for motion capture where the solutions within the messiah:studio community are more bolt ons. I'd say go for it though. Once you start seeing the full potential of Armatures, the expression engine and get a feel for the realtime playback capabilities within the software it will be hard to imagine yourself using anything else.

Soth
03-10-2010, 02:42 AM
I don't remember seeing any of your posts on setuptab. . . what were these "bugs" that were show stoppers for you?

I have asked about this "bug" with youtube video explaining what is going on.
http://setuptab.com/index.php/topic,754.0.html
http://setuptab.com/index.php/topic,735.0.html

I even got private message on setup tab from someone saying messiah users are elitist and do not like to answer questions asked by newbies. This is so not true I got a lot of support from you guys but you cannot answer all questions and support email need to be checked from time to time by dedicated technical support engineer or developers. I am customer.

Anyway I do understand situation, Messiah user base is not big enough to implement all features. Tablet support is not finished... but I can use mouse only with my left hand - as I am right handed it does not work very well anywhere where speed and precision is needed - like DCC applications.

Wegg
03-10-2010, 12:36 PM
Soth: From what I can tell you were fighting with a bug in armatures that got fixed in 4.5. At least on the video you posted with the ribbon along the curve.

For the other post I'm not 100% sure I could follow what your problem was. Because most of the bones rotations are in Euler coordinates there are certain situations when things go haywire. Its kind of the nature of 3D.

Wegg
03-10-2010, 01:18 PM
Has anyone produced any significant tutorial series? I have one or two from Joe Cosman (sp?) and it would be great to see much more for the current Messiah. Perhaps someone with LOTS of Messiah knowledge could produce a training series along with Wes at Kurv. THAT... would be outstanding!

Thanks for the info Wegg! :thumbsup:

Check in the store (http://setuptab.com/index.php?action=store). There is training material for all aspects of the software.

The Dommo
03-10-2010, 01:40 PM
Messiah's renderer is based on Arnold?
Wow.... how? When? What?

Ulven
03-10-2010, 01:42 PM
looks like the anisculpt setup for blender by pepeland


http://www.projectmessiah.com/x6/small_pix/PointAnimation.gif

i agree, the animated gif on the home page puts the features front and centre...you instantly 'get' what messiah is about.

Yep, the anisculpt setup is indeed quite similar, but anisculpt is a lot more primitive once you get under the surface. This works over the top of your regular rig (you don't have to bake down first) so you can do everything while still animating your bones etc. Also all the transformations adapt to the relative space, so if you change the underlying bones etc, the point animation follows it very well, unlike object or world space morphs in anisculpt. The transformations are non linear with clever holds, so you don't get unwanted overshoot, but still get the smoothness of hermite spline interpolation of the verts you transform.

Soth
03-10-2010, 02:14 PM
Soth: From what I can tell you were fighting with a bug in armatures that got fixed in 4.5. At least on the video you posted with the ribbon along the curve.

For the other post I'm not 100% sure I could follow what your problem was. Because most of the bones rotations are in Euler coordinates there are certain situations when things go haywire.

I have checked armatures and when I click on them they jump a bit, I have tried many different options, I think everything except redoing the setup from scratch. I really doubt that this will help.

There is many things that I like in Messiah but looks like is not for me, even if this rotation bug is fixed.

[QUOTE=Wegg;997127]Its kind of the nature of 3D.
I really do not agree with this one, esp. that apparently it is tablet issue only.

Boris Goreta
03-10-2010, 02:50 PM
Hi Soth, I am Wacom tablet user and use it exclusively for over 5 years now. I can say that tablet works great with Messiah, I had no tablet issues with Messiah. I did lots of professional rigs of all types and if I ran into a problem it was never related to tablet but to things like pitch flipping and euler rotations which I solved by simple expressions or a better rig. Messiah is fantastic piece of software, it is easy to learn and fast, gives you a lot of tools that can all work together. The best thing is that it is very predictable once you learn what each tool does. Did I mention it is fast ?

For instance, it has a super great IK soft expression which prevents IK pops from happening, that usually happens when the limbs are just about to extent to their full length. With this expression you don't worry about that at all, you can even enable stretching so the limbs stretch automatically to follow the body.

Also there is parent in place expression which is very usable when a character has to pick some object up, carry it and than drop it. It is very easy to setup and totally controllable. Easy, easy, easy.

This 32 second commercial was rigged and animated singlehandedly in Messiah 4 : http://www.borisgoreta.com

Rigging and animation took the smallest chunk of time spent for this project because I used Messiah, the rig for a single character was done in approx. 10 minutes, and was maybe refined here and there during animation. That's how good Messiah is.

Boris Goreta
03-10-2010, 03:10 PM
Thanks, I plan on posting this on a couple of forums, just need to sort out my site so that there is at least a contact address somewhere. :)
People need to post more of their work done with Messiah.

Soth
03-10-2010, 03:30 PM
Hi Soth, I am Wacom tablet user and use it exclusively for over 5 years now. I can say that tablet works great with Messiah, I had no tablet issues with Messiah. I did lots of professional rigs of all types and if I ran into a problem it was never related to tablet but to things like pitch flipping and euler rotations which I solved by simple expressions or a better rig. Messiah is fantastic piece of software, it is easy to learn and fast, gives you a lot of tools that can all work together. The best thing is that it is very predictable once you learn what each tool does. Did I mention it is fast ?

Thank you for your post, looks like I run into the problems (I could not use armatures from example scenes) and I was asking questions on the Setup Tab (I even included YT video) and then tried to get in touch with ppl from pmG but it did not worked. I tried everything that I could so I gave up.

I like the program but I cannot solve the issues that I am having. Well looks like I will have another go when I will get some free time.

But, this is a bit frustrating.

Boris Goreta
03-10-2010, 03:36 PM
Well, you can send it to me and I'll try to resolve it, I am goal oriented so if it doesn't work this way there are at least two other ways to do it. I've seen the videos but I can't do anything without the source scene to reproduce your issues.

The Dommo
03-10-2010, 04:02 PM
That's some great animation work there Boris. It's good to see what just one guy can do by themself. Keep it up.

I assume then that as the animation was done in messiah, all the 3D itself was done in LW?

Boris Goreta
03-10-2010, 04:18 PM
Thanks, yes, everything else was done in LW 9.6.

Ulven
03-10-2010, 05:50 PM
Another great example of use of messiah is the fastest animator in the west. Joeri Christiaen: www.thuristar.com
He single handedly modeled, textured, directed and animated several webisodes of plankton invasion (www.planktoninvasion.com) spending on average 5 weeks per 3 minute webisode, which then inevitably got picked up by TeamTO and Canal+ to become a full TV series. Crunch those numbers! If that doesn't prove to you that messiah is the film-makers tool, nothing will.

geo_n
03-10-2010, 08:46 PM
how does messiah do lipsync?

geo_n
03-10-2010, 08:51 PM
Another great example of use of messiah is the fastest animator in the west. Joeri Christiaen: www.thuristar.com
He single handedly modeled, textured, directed and animated several webisodes of plankton invasion (www.planktoninvasion.com) spending on average 5 weeks per 3 minute webisode, which then inevitably got picked up by TeamTO and Canal+ to become a full TV series. Crunch those numbers! If that doesn't prove to you that messiah is the film-makers tool, nothing will.

wow that is seriosly great work for one person.

Nicolas Jordan
03-10-2010, 09:30 PM
how does messiah do lipsync?

You can import morph maps from Lightwave and setup sliders or setup muscle bones to animate mouth shapes.

GregMalick
03-11-2010, 12:58 AM
VERY impressive! :thumbsup:

Probably one of the best advertisements for Messiah I've seen!

Great work! :beerchug:

Actually, this is my favorite messiah animation.
Modeling & Rendering done in LW.

http://www.vimeo.com/7518131

And this is 4 years old.

mythek1
03-11-2010, 05:26 AM
This software looks tooo tempting. How do render times of sss shaders compare to Lightwave?

InfoCentral
03-11-2010, 06:37 AM
Looks tempting but I think I'll wait for the CUDA enabled version. I assume that will be 5.0 as companies are now coming out with their GPU accelerated versions.

Tranimatronic
03-11-2010, 07:21 AM
This software looks tooo tempting. How do render times of sss shaders compare to Lightwave?

After initial testing Messiah's sss is roughly 10 times faster than lightwaves.
The machine I ran the tests on died a few weeks ago, and I have the test scenes on a harddrive so I can't post examples right now.

I tried to push everything just to see what I could get. GI, SSS and hair. Lightwave took an hour and messiah took 6 minutes. I thought something was wrong, so re-did everything and got the same results.

Lightwave's looked better I remember that, but I put that down to me not being as familiar with Messiah's renderer. Messiah is tricky because there is a HUGE difference in small values - ie .01 and 0.15, and I often got overly bright or waxy looking results. Lightwave's looked right from the get-go, but really you get 9 re-renders in messiah to get it right.

In the end I rendered the character's face in messiah and everything else in Lightwave, then comped the face back into the lightwave scene

I still think there was something wrong in my tests, but when I needed results fast - messiah really produced the goods.

As soon as I get a new machine I will post my results if anyone is interested.

OnlineRender
03-11-2010, 07:21 AM
http://www.cgchannel.com/2010/03/autodesk-announces-new-features-for-max-and-maya-2011/

MentalFish
03-11-2010, 10:12 AM
http://www.cgchannel.com/2010/03/autodesk-announces-new-features-for-max-and-maya-2011/

Cool stuff.

Perhaps I should whip out my LW->AfterEffects LScript again and make it a bi-directional FCP<->LightWave solution, text in, text out... easy peasy...

mythek1
03-11-2010, 10:18 AM
After initial testing Messiah's sss is roughly 10 times faster than lightwaves.
The machine I ran the tests on died a few weeks ago, and I have the test scenes on a harddrive so I can't post examples right now.

I tried to push everything just to see what I could get. GI, SSS and hair. Lightwave took an hour and messiah took 6 minutes. I thought something was wrong, so re-did everything and got the same results.

Lightwave's looked better I remember that, but I put that down to me not being as familiar with Messiah's renderer. Messiah is tricky because there is a HUGE difference in small values - ie .01 and 0.15, and I often got overly bright or waxy looking results. Lightwave's looked right from the get-go, but really you get 9 re-renders in messiah to get it right.

In the end I rendered the character's face in messiah and everything else in Lightwave, then comped the face back into the lightwave scene

I still think there was something wrong in my tests, but when I needed results fast - messiah really produced the goods.

As soon as I get a new machine I will post my results if anyone is interested.
Thanks for the reply. :) Yes any info would be useful, thanks.

I'll download the demo to see how the interface feels.

Wegg
03-11-2010, 10:22 AM
This software looks tooo tempting. How do render times of sss shaders compare to Lightwave?

I think they look great and render fast. There is a video I did. . . Found it. (http://setuptab.com/index.php?action=store;sa=view;id=3)

Ulven
03-11-2010, 10:52 AM
Yeah SSS is pretty lickety split in messiah.
Here's a scene I modeled in modeler and rendered in messiah that has a nice toony SSS skin shader on it.
http://setuptab.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=11
About 14 minutes render time in HD.

mythek1
03-11-2010, 03:24 PM
I think they look great and render fast. There is a video I did. . . Found it. (http://setuptab.com/index.php?action=store;sa=view;id=3)
Great stuff! :thumbsup: very informative. The render looks really clean, (for want of a better word).


Yeah SSS is pretty lickety split in messiah.
Here's a scene I modeled in modeler and rendered in messiah that has a nice toony SSS skin shader on it.
http://setuptab.com/index.php?action...;sa=view;id=11
About 14 minutes render time in HD.
I really like the image and, (although I'm no expert), the short you did in 2-3 weeks was a class act. :thumbsup:

Julez4001
03-13-2010, 02:11 PM
Check in the store (http://setuptab.com/index.php?action=store). There is training material for all aspects of the software.

Wegg..you should put a copy of the tutorial images from the store on PMG site so ppl can see that you have 40+ new tutorials

Wegg
03-16-2010, 08:40 PM
Way more than 40! We are going to be re-selling Joe Cosman's training through SetupTab now as well. I don't think ANYONE will be able to complain that there aren't enough professional resources available for messiah now. :thumbsup:

The Dommo
03-19-2010, 11:02 AM
Way more than 40! We are going to be re-selling Joe Cosman's training through SetupTab now as well. I don't think ANYONE will be able to complain that there aren't enough professional resources available for messiah now. :thumbsup:

Hurrah - finally!

biliousfrog
03-20-2010, 07:31 AM
I bought Messiah waaay back purely because of the rendering side of things and it was very fast then. Unfortunately it still felt very much like a paid beta and the docs were very lacking. I'd like to give it another look at some point but it seems a bit of a waste considering that I never do any character animation. It certainly looks like PMG have moved forward though, they come across as a much more professional company now and Messiah looks great.

CGI Addict
03-20-2010, 12:56 PM
I wish I could find a comprehensive unbiased review of Messiah Studio 4. Something that explains not only the new features but also the existing ones along with how it works in the pipeline. I found a review out of 3D World mag for Messiah 3 but that was years ago. Anybody?

Wegg
03-22-2010, 02:58 PM
I actually wrote that review for 3D World. :-)

I THINK I'm pretty un-biased. What is it your wanting to know about it?

Julez4001
03-22-2010, 03:07 PM
I can give you one as well, what specifically do you want to know?

What type of projects do you want to throw at it?

CGI Addict
03-22-2010, 04:22 PM
Wegg that was a great review (3D World, issue 107, Sept 08) but I'm sure that MS4 can do with a review itself. What would I like to see? A review similar to the earlier mentioned review of 3 but updated to explain new and existing features:

workflows for both LW and Modo
AutoRig3
particle system
non-linear system
hair 4 system
soft body and motion dynamics
rendering and GI
point animation
advanced deformers
expression system

Thanks for any review you can put together.

Also I wasn't implying that you are biased, heck I didn't even know you wrote that great review. Julez4001 write something yourself if you don't mind.

Wegg
03-23-2010, 03:36 AM
Wegg that was a great review (3D World, issue 107, Sept 08) but I'm sure that MS4 can do with a review itself. What would I like to see? A review similar to the earlier mentioned review of 3 but updated to explain new and existing features:

Ok I'll try. :jam:


workflows for both LW and Modo

Well with lightwave you have a few more choices than Modo but the basic idea is that you model, texture, light. . . everything inside of Lightwave/Modo but when you want your objects to move, you use messiah. Simply load up your model in messiah, apply bones/deformers, animate and then export out an .mdd file. Apply that .mdd file to your mesh in LW/Modo and render. Eazy peazy.


AutoRig3

I'm ashamed to say I haven't tried 3. I have used the previous version, 2 a lot but I haven't messed around with what makes 3 any different/better. Vegard's rigs were used during the production of Andy's Airplanes so I am very familiar with them, love them etc. I have an instructional video showing you how to use them that can be found here (http://setuptab.com/index.php?action=store;sa=view;id=52). They are very very easy to set up and provide a powerful foundation for any character animation project. Simply load up your character, scale the provided default skeleton to the proportions of your character and hit the "autorig" button and you have a fully rigged character.


particle system

I use it a lot but, I have to admit its a rather un-explored, unique approach to particles. A lot less intuitive than hypervoxels. But they do render SUPER fast. There is a cloud video tutorial here. (http://setuptab.com/index.php?action=store;sa=view;id=40) And then a free one on my blog here. (http://www.eggington.net/~blog/?p=27) Its probably something I need to explore and document better thats for sure. People want the basics. Smoke, fire, steam etc.


non-linear system

The compose tab is VERY powerful. Layering in animation on top of your base motion is awesome. BUT. . . it is probably one of the least intuitive methods I have ever seen. :-( Once you SEE it done you go "OOOooo I get it" but just fumbling around on your own won't get you far. :eek:


hair 4 system

I love the hair in messiah. I was heavily involved in it's development and there are a lot of great things to say about it. Render quality. . . is not one of them though. Fiber Factory and Sasquatch still win for edge/antialiasing "softness". Its something I hope is improved. Realtime hair dynamics (http://setuptab.com/index.php?action=store;sa=view;id=34) can't be beat though. Super fun to play with and look great.


soft body and motion dynamics

I have had great success with the soft bodies in messiah but compared to the dynamics in hair, they are glitchy in their current form. They were actually a bit better in earlier versions. We are trying to track down the reasons why. I'm sure another point release will fix this problem.


rendering and GI

One of my favorite parts. :-) It's foundation is the old Arnold renderer from back in 2001 and all the bells and whistles that have been bolted on have only served to improve it greatly. Awesome renderer.


point animation

I have used it. And it worked very very well. Especially for "oops" things that you see wrong in your animation. . . clothes penetrating skin etc. Often times its just easier to go RIGHT into the points on the model itself and animate a fix rather than go back and re-rig that section.


advanced deformers

I don't know what this is. There are a LOT of deformers in messiah. Are they "advanced"? <shrug> Bone, Cage, Lattice, Bloat, Melt, Flex, FlexMotion etc etc. All pretty stinking cool. Especially FlexMotion. We spent a lot of time on that one during the last beta.


expression system

Very powerful. If your at all good at math you can come up with your own expressions very quickly. They aren't like XSI's ICE though where its all visual and nodal. Its hard core. . . typing out the algebra. Scary at first but once you get over the initial "AAAHHhhh MATH = HARD!" fears you start to feel right at home.


Thanks for any review you can put together.

Your welcome. :-)


Also I wasn't implying that you are biased, heck I didn't even know you wrote that great review. Julez4001 write something yourself if you don't mind.

Well I know I'm pretty biased. Not much I can do about that. :-) I'm just right in the thick of things usually. When something sucks with messiah its my personal mission to see it un-suck. And the developers are very awesome at listening to production needs so its a win win for me. They are NOT very good at returning e-mails or engaging directly with their user base. . . but SetupTab has really come to the rescue there. If you can't find it on SetupTab your not looking hard enough. :-)

probiner
03-27-2010, 05:22 PM
just to throw the thread sorta off topic but the "herd of cats is out the bag" over at autodesk....new feature lists on maya2011, 3dsmax2011 and mudbox as well....:devil:

This looks smart... Really unexpected xD
http://area.autodesk.com/gdc/ondemand14

calilifestyle
03-27-2010, 09:09 PM
wow 3ds motion bake, just way to awesome . Watching this video really make me miss 3dsMax.
The whole add-in of CAT is freaking sweet.

Julez4001
03-27-2010, 09:37 PM
Point Animation is akin to Zbrush Lite bit for Animation.

Definitely used as a fixer upper on one's animation.

WillBellJr
04-01-2010, 11:37 AM
... man, i've written messiah off and i still pretty much do but i'm STILL gonna take a look at all their features....

jin

I got burned by him when I purchased Messiah:Animate v3 - if I remember correctly, the softbody stuff didn't work right or something, the software is always a work in progress, never finished.

To get my problem fixed required me to pay for the following update - I swore he'd never get my money again...


Does the animations exported to FBX make it into Unity without problems?

-Will

PS - Technically I'm a user, would I get a discount?

rush
04-02-2010, 04:27 AM
Does the animations exported to FBX make it into Unity without problems?

-Will

Here's some info on Messiah - Unity workflow

http://setuptab.com/index.php/topic,1407.0.html

R

WillBellJr
04-02-2010, 07:55 AM
Damn, I will say that's a GOOD LOOK getting that dinosaur walking in that Unity scene like that...

This is what I'm hoping to ultimately be able to achieve with CORE.

I'll give the demo a gander but I still have my prejudices against this company.

-Will


PS - I see you need to register just to download the demo - I didn't feel like doing that since it wasn't mentioned that a license key would be emailed etc.

Does this demo allow FBX export for testing with Unity?

rush
04-02-2010, 09:26 AM
Damn, I will say that's a GOOD LOOK getting that dinosaur walking in that Unity scene like that...

This is what I'm hoping to ultimately be able to achieve with CORE.

I'll give the demo a gander but I still have my prejudices against this company.

-Will


PS - I see you need to register just to download the demo - I didn't feel like doing that since it wasn't mentioned that a license key would be emailed etc.

Does this demo allow FBX export for testing with Unity?

I think that all output is removed from the demo, but someone will need to confirm.