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View Full Version : Differences between TV and DC for Terminator Salvation



IgnusFast
12-04-2009, 09:50 PM
Sad to say, I didn't even know this site existed...

Good rundown on the differences from the Theatrical and Director's Cut editions of Terminator Salvation.

I personally really liked the movie, but I can understand if some or many didn't. :)

http://movie-censorship.com/report.php?ID=4991440

Mr Rid
12-05-2009, 12:11 AM
Just saw it yesterday. I didnt expect much, but kept thinking it was too bad that every action and character is motivated only by what the director thought would look cool and 'extreme'.

IgnusFast
12-05-2009, 02:25 AM
Yeah, I don't have much respect for McG, but I thought that Sam Worthington especially brought enough depth and emotion to it that I enjoyed it. Though the heart thing at the end was just SILLY.

cresshead
12-05-2009, 03:31 AM
blue ray only directors cut or not..it's stil poo...the best directors cut would have been to CUT the dirtector completly and use someone who can tell a story...also that idiot of an actor playting jon connor really needed terminating!

that's my cut...

hrgiger
12-05-2009, 04:43 AM
Very disappointed in this film. It looked so good from the previews.

Mr Rid
12-05-2009, 02:16 PM
Yeah, I don't have much respect for McG, but I thought that Sam Worthington especially brought enough depth and emotion to it that I enjoyed it. Though the heart thing at the end was just SILLY.

Yes, I credit the writers for centering on the Sam character (John Connor turned out to be a bore), although the 'borg that doesnt know its a borg' and 'human-machine intimacy' angle was done to death in Galactica.

But every minute I kept wondering, 'now, how is that possible?', 'why would anyone do that?', 'how did that guy ever wind up there?', 'how come they didnt see that coming?' I dont mind farfetchedness if the filmmakers dont take themselves too seriously. But every scene here is contrived for a superficial effect rather than being driven by a convincing character or physics.

One annoying, cheap trick of poor action movies is when the hero is fighting a monster/robot/baddie that is stronger and could crush the hero's pharynx in half a second, instead, the monster throws the hero around several times, giving them plenty of time to grab a weapon to leverage the fight, or time for someone else to intervene.

They even tossed in the most cliche kung-fu movie scene, where the cute girl is caught alone, suddenly surrounded by a gang of thugs and the hero pops up at the last second to stomp all asses with dazzling fu, and win the beauty's heart. In Salvation, they just sorta cut from a scene with Sam and the woman together, to... her alone inexplicably... as a cheap setup for the cliche.

A moment that particularly bugged me was when a group of people are standing in the dilapidated 7-11 with open walls and windows, they are all quiet for a moment before the roof is suddenly ripped off by a massive, 50 foot terminator... how in the hell could a bunch of wiley terminator survivors not hear 150 tons of steel stomping toward them in the middle of nowhere? A better movie addresses such glaring issues and comes up with a more engagingly relatable scenario.

GregMalick
12-05-2009, 02:44 PM
Mr. Rid,

Thanks for reminding me why this movie was so forgettable.

toby
12-05-2009, 03:18 PM
"The more money went into the movie, the more the investors wanted the movie to be seen by as much people as possible."

That's the #1 problem with movies.

Considering the fact that the original had some really bad acting, yet is still the best one of the four speaks volumes about the importance of good filmmaking over big budgets.

toby
12-05-2009, 03:21 PM
how in the hell could a bunch of wiley terminator survivors not hear 150 tons of steel stomping toward them in the middle of nowhere?
That was the best part! A tip-toeing giant robot! It's when I started enjoying the film as the comedy it didn't know it was.

LazyCoder
12-05-2009, 11:27 PM
Well my favorite part was when John Connor jumps out of a helicopter... thing... falls at least 100 feet, lands in the ocean, and then somehow ends up inside a submarine... oh but he's wet so that explains it all.

Or another great part was when the helicopter they're riding in manages to outrun a nuclear blast, ignoring the shockwave, wind, and emp such a blast would generate.

I'm just glad they survived so they could go on to perform open heart surgery in a field tent.

Red_Oddity
12-06-2009, 01:58 AM
Yes, I credit the writers for centering on the Sam character (John Connor turned out to be a bore), although the 'borg that doesnt know its a borg' and 'human-machine intimacy' angle was done to death in Galactica.

But every minute I kept wondering, 'now, how is that possible?', 'why would anyone do that?', 'how did that guy ever wind up there?', 'how come they didnt see that coming?' I dont mind farfetchedness if the filmmakers dont take themselves too seriously. But every scene here is contrived for a superficial effect rather than being driven by a convincing character or physics.

One annoying, cheap trick of poor action movies is when the hero is fighting a monster/robot/baddie that is stronger and could crush the hero's pharynx in half a second, instead, the monster throws the hero around several times, giving them plenty of time to grab a weapon to leverage the fight, or time for someone else to intervene.

They even tossed in the most cliche kung-fu movie scene, where the cute girl is caught alone, suddenly surrounded by a gang of thugs and the hero pops up at the last second to stomp all asses with dazzling fu, and win the beauty's heart. In Salvation, they just sorta cut from a scene with Sam and the woman together, to... her alone inexplicably... as a cheap setup for the cliche.

A moment that particularly bugged me was when a group of people are standing in the dilapidated 7-11 with open walls and windows, they are all quiet for a moment before the roof is suddenly ripped off by a massive, 50 foot terminator... how in the hell could a bunch of wiley terminator survivors not hear 150 tons of steel stomping toward them in the middle of nowhere? A better movie addresses such glaring issues and comes up with a more engagingly relatable scenario.

The big robot i could forgive, seeing it flew in on the back of the prisoner HK type ship, what i could NOT forgive though, was that Kyle Reese needs to die, yet the whole time Skynet lets him live, even though nobody apparently knows whether he's really alive or dead, why not had him shot or squished like a bug when they picked him of the conveyor belt with all the prisoners in the first place, nobody would have been the wiser anyway.
And indeed, when the T-800 can punch a heart to mulch that is protected by a metal skeleton, why can't he punch a hole in John Connors face in a second instead of throwing him around (against hardware that fold up like frigging card board boxes, i know it is a movie, but throw anyone against a real piece of industrial hardware or server rack and he ends up with a broken back.)

So much could have been so much better, it is a real shame, because the effect work is phenomenal (the single shot helicopter crash for example was amazing)

Ahwell, is still had fun watching it, watching it the second time around though you start noticing all the things that are wrong with the movie.

Mr Rid
12-06-2009, 02:08 AM
...

Ahwell, is still had fun watching it, watching it the second time around though you start noticing all the things that are wrong with the movie.

I started noticing while I was fast-forwarding thru half of it for the first time, and sometimes even before the wrong things happened. :)

Mike_RB
12-06-2009, 07:36 AM
"The more money went into the movie, the more the investors wanted the movie to be seen by as much people as possible."

That's the #1 problem with movies.

Considering the fact that the original had some really bad acting, yet is still the best one of the four speaks volumes about the importance of good filmmaking over big budgets.

Which is why district 9 was so fun. Jackson left neill alone to make his film.

Intuition
12-06-2009, 10:56 AM
You guys are forgetting the "new" 1st rule of filmaking. Make a film in which certain scenes can be made to make the trailer look "f'n" awesome. Hence getting people to buy tickets. Then when that is achieved get some shabby writer and director to try and stitch the trailer "esque" scenes together in a coherent story.

aidenvfx
12-06-2009, 11:32 AM
After watching some of the special features it came across that both McG and the producers wanted BIGGER and MORE and bragging rights to say ya we blew up that tanker truck, ya we did some major napalm explosions, etc
They then talked down about how it was so much better then using miniatures. I kept thinking how well miniatures were used in "The Dark Knight" I think McG would have being better off to have cut his budget by half. And used the magic of filmmaking instead of trying to do full scale everything then they could have told a much better story that would have worked and made it R (I refused to see the movie in theaters once they went pg-13.)

As for the movie itself until the movie got a little interesting I kept thinking how much better Micheal Bay is at doing action. I am still undecided if T4 was better then Transformers 2. Right now I think T4 might be winning because at least T4 did not have jar jar binks transformers in it.

Mike_RB
12-07-2009, 09:22 AM
My favourite mangling of a sequence... Bumblebee updates (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d9BKAXctcwo) - remarkably funked up. :thumbsup:

Haha I forgot how bad that was.

biliousfrog
12-07-2009, 09:41 AM
I made the mistake of renting T4 at the weekend, ideal movie to watch while the girlfriend's having a girl's night out...or so I thought. Some things that really stood out for me were:

The machines can detect GNR blasting out across the desert but can't detect body heat in the daytime or camp fire heat at night.

The machines can fly but rely on motorbikes to ride through a cluttered, sandy landscape.

The machines can only fly within certain areas...when near to a resistance base they must travel along the ground which is why magnetic land mines work.

The machines can detect a small explosion and intercept radio waves from a submarine but can't detect an entire army blowing up several acres of land in persuit of Sam's character.

...and finally, what the hell happened when Sam's character disappears for a moment and that female pilot is surrounded by thugs? I thought the DVD had skipped...Sam wonders off, she's in some little shelter thing, then she's standing in the open surrounded by thugs?!?...did I get a dodgy DVD or was it really cut that badly?

Intuition
12-07-2009, 10:02 AM
I watched T4 yesterday. I actually was really entertained by it. I saw it in the theater too and liked it there as well.

Yes, I admit, there are some stupid fridge logic moments and unintentionally funny parts.

Still the main reason I like this Terminator is because it does what the other films did not do, not because it isn't like the other films.

I like it because it takes place in the future. The other 3 films show us a little bit of the future but this one lets us stay there.

There are many things that don't add up at certain times but in general I thought it was great.

Sam Worthington was a great actor for the part of the half man half machine character. The whole theme, does someone deserve a second chance, wasn't bad at all. Its like this film is a glorified road warrior that just happens to have terminators in it.

I also like how the plot unfolds so that the humans using the "discovered signal" was the trap. Pretty cool.

Overall, the other Terminator films have the same flaws. Why not go back in time and kill Sarah Conner when she is a baby? Why not go back in time and kill baby Jesus? I mean you can do that to all the films.

This doesn't mean I don't see the flaws in the film. I mean when he falls into the water and becomes a human skipping stone I burst out laughing....but... that may have very well been the intention of the scene. Ridiculous circumstances can end up being funny.

Yes, I agree, if you can shoot missles at the truck, why shoot the bridge in front of it?

I don't know. I think this film gets a little bit too much negative crit. Its not all that bad. I mean, I thought T3 was pretty bad but the scenes where Arnold and the girl terminator are fighting are pretty great and inventive action sequences.

The part I really didn't care for in T4 was the snakey water swimming robots. Felt more like the matrix then terminator. Still, the scenes where the two kids are running away from the older beat up terminator with the gatlin gun and have it squashed was [email protected]$$.

Arnold showing up ala CG was kind of cheesy but I still loved it. Yeah, there are parts there where you go "He had a hold if him,,, why throw him?". Still all in all, lots of cool stuff in there.

Good fx and design even though the director has lots of trouble summoning up genuine motivation in certain plot points but you do have a clear line through the film.

Awright... Bring on the hate. ;D

dandeentremont
12-07-2009, 10:16 AM
It will never hope to be as awful as terminator 3 which, incidentally, is so bad, no one has bothered to take the full movie (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6DUwfbg880&feature=related) off youtube that's been there for 8 months.

tischbein3
12-07-2009, 11:26 AM
Simple example? My favourite mangling of a should-be easy sequence... Bumblebee updates (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d9BKAXctcwo) - editing, viewing directions, 180-rule... remarkably funked up.
... oh actually didn't noticed that, was a lot more distracted by the rapid day / night cuts
(and the usage of the same earth mate painting across the whole movie... although this one is filed under nitpicking)

tischbein3
12-07-2009, 11:46 AM
The part I really didn't care for in T4 was the snakey water swimming robots. Felt more like the matrix then terminator.
Agree, also had the same feeling about the skynet "plan reveal" scenes at the end of the movie.

Intuition
12-07-2009, 11:47 AM
Oh, I guess they did send a terminator back for baby Jesus already.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LkPPYeBEmpQ

Red_Oddity
12-07-2009, 05:25 PM
It will never hope to be as awful as terminator 3 which, incidentally, is so bad, no one has bothered to take the full movie (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6DUwfbg880&feature=related) off youtube that's been there for 8 months.

You gotta love the ending T3, it was written so badly, the script writer forgot they actually made Skynet commit suicide by nuking all the cities (just after they audience is explained that Skynet is basically a torrent like system of all the computers in the major cities...way to go numb nuts.)

Both movies had their merits though, just neither movies make me want to go out and buy the DVD/BluRay to watch it over and over, both times one viewing is enough (which i can't say for the Cameron Terminator movies)

Red_Oddity
12-07-2009, 05:33 PM
Also, i'm glad there is still room for good sci fi flicks.

I loved District 9, it may be simple and the anti racism message is pretty thick smeared across it, it is very well executed with an incredible performance by Sharlto Copley, not bad for his second acting gig.
First time i actually thought a mecha warrior was done well.

And let's not forget Moon, stellar performance by Sam Rockwell and totally not what i expected (the atmosphere was incredible), and even though here too the message was pretty thick, it did not hamper the movie in any way.

Both movies by pretty 'wet behind the ears' movie directors but both executed extremely well.

Can't wait to see what Duncan Jones and Neill Blomkamp come up with next.

stevecullum
12-09-2009, 04:06 PM
I think the main problem with T3 and T4, is that they could never hope to compete with T1 and T2. Those two films are classics, and thats a tough act to follow!

As films in their own right, I thought both were entertaining enough - but mainly for the action scenes.

What 'grinds my gears', is the fact we get a constant stream of 'franchised' sequels and prequels - District 9 was a fresh and enjoyable departure from this.

Stooch
12-10-2009, 03:16 PM
Which is why district 9 was so fun. Jackson left neill alone to make his film.

HAHAHAH we are tearing into dumb movies with stupid plotholes and you bring up D9 as if its not. that movie had even more plot holes...