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cresshead
08-09-2009, 06:44 PM
post siggraph 2009 Debriefing
>>what's ahead for 2010 for lightwave users?

lets just sorta list it basically, so excuse my blunt and short overview of 3d apps of note.
lightwave 9.6 is the last version of lightwave bar a small bug fix and osx 64bit port.
lightwave core is currently being coded and at a resonable guess will ship in a 1.0 version either at the end of 2009 or early 2010 if all goes to plan, however as already noted it will not be 'complete' but will connect to lightwave to make it a production capable set of applications.

Maya's development slipped this year so nothing new as yet, the update is due later but it missed the siggy 2009 date and so autodesk bundled in a few apps insteead for now.
Softimage 2010 development didn't move much either so again a app was bundled in, this time face robot.
3dsmax doesn't update around siggraph anymore so the next version is 2011...due to announce/ship before april 2010.

Modo shipped a new version just before siggraph it's a bit buggy apparently but they'll patch it no doubt soon.
Blender is due to launch 2.5 in october with a total re write of blender and sorting out the u.i. is one of the main goals..2.5 dev should complete by summer 2010.
Cinema4d didn't ship a new version or point update, they seem to bring new versions 'when they are ready' rather than try to play the 'siggraph thing'

so other than modo nobody hit the siggraph date with a major update.
this sort of works out okay for lightwave as there will be no update, so we're in the same boat curently as max, maya, xsi and cinema with "nothing new".

With lightwave 9.6+ development going 'on ice' so to speak looking in the the near future and focussing on 2010 and next summer are many of you looking to just keep lightwave 9.6 going 'as is' or are you looking to add a new app or hope to join the lightwave core thing in due course once it's a shipping product?

cresshead
08-09-2009, 06:50 PM
so...cast your minds toward spring 2010>>

1.stay with 9.6
2.add blender in october
3.add modo
4.add maya
5.add softimage
6.add 3dsmax
7.add houdini apprentice/ple/starving artist [to learn it]
8.add messiah
9.add cinema
10. join hard core very soon
11.join hard core once it's released.
12.add a different app [list it]
13.give up and deliver pizzas!

non full on apps apps>>
14.add 3d coat
15.add mudbox
16.add zbrush
17.add vue
18.add sketchup
19.add rhino

3D Kiwi
08-09-2009, 08:47 PM
I have to dissagree on XSI not haveing a good update. It may have not recived alot of in your face features (not including face robot here) but under the hood i think they have done a good job.

http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/pc/index?siteID=123112&id=13571400#channels_What’s New

GigaCore III Watched the demo on the autodesk site and speed improvments were impressive (who will complain about more speed)

Performance indicators for ICE trees are going to be very handy. As with
the new scene debugger.

Improvments to the scene layer manager look good to.

Tweak normal tool looks intresting as well.

Improvments to the script editor.

And there are a few others (see link above).

All in all im happy with the release for two reasons, Autodesk arnt killing it (Yet). And i also think it is a good thing that they have spent some time optimizing the app and improving workflow rather than just throw on new untested features.
As far as facerobot goes, its not something i think i would use and it will be intresting to see how devlopment goes from now on.

I do agree about Maya tho, think there are alot of maya used feeling ripped off compared to XSI users. Adding toxik is great but will it be developed anymore???

So for now good on ya Autodesk and keep it up.

realgray
08-09-2009, 08:58 PM
gonna keep using 9.6. Taking a wait and see approach on Core. Looking to add Max and Zbrush end of this year.

Titus
08-09-2009, 09:10 PM
are many of you looking to just keep lightwave 9.6 going 'as is' or are you looking to add a new app or hope to join the lightwave core thing in due course once it's a shipping product?

I'm expecting Core 1.0 to appear around mid 2010 (this is my own personal guestimate), and while LW 9.6 still works for me I'm starting to consider another apps. for the short-medium term.

jasonwestmas
08-09-2009, 09:22 PM
Sounds like the same old tools that I'll be using. I hope to integrate core modeling though.

thomascheng
08-09-2009, 09:57 PM
I'll stick with Lightwave for most task and Maya for the animation side of things.

cresshead
08-09-2009, 09:58 PM
I have to dissagree on XSI not haveing a good update. It may have not recived alot of in your face features (not including face robot here) but under the hood i think they have done a good job.



Xsi doesn't exist anymore...they rebranded it 'softmage' just for those who maybe confused when we're talking about xsi or softimage>>they are basically the same thing now that Autodesk aquired all things 'softimage'

3D Kiwi
08-09-2009, 10:10 PM
Xsi doesn't exist anymore...the rebranded it 'softmage' just for those who maybe confused when we're talking about xsi or softimage>>they are basically the same thing now that Autodesk aquired all things 'softimage'

True true my bad, Its funny to watch some of the Softimage videos from autodesk, the presenter still slips out XSI every now and again.

cresshead
08-10-2009, 12:49 AM
I have LightWave 9.6 + LWCAD3 (+Core), modo 401, ZBrush and 3D-Coat. I'm not really looking for anything else at the moment since I'm covered for the things I need.

I don't need advanced animation, physics or simulation. So luckily I don't need to go to Autodesk for "protection" :)

you could always go to the tree huggers in the netherlands and set up a eco animation camp with blender, for fluid sims and character animation!
:thumbsup:

Titus
08-10-2009, 11:42 AM
you could always go to the tree huggers in the netherlands and set up a eco animation camp with blender, for fluid sims and character animation!
:thumbsup:

You mean with the memory hungry fluid simulation system included with Blender? It needs some tweaking to be production ready.

CGI Addict
08-10-2009, 02:00 PM
I'll stick with Lightwave for most task and Maya for the animation side of things.

Same road I'm going to travel. Lightwave for bulk of modeling and Maya for animation. Will eventually move to some Maya for some modeling just for familiarization but stay with LW primarily.

Intuition
08-10-2009, 04:09 PM
I added a new choice.

14. Give up and ORDER pizzas!

:D

Maya - Check
Max - Check
XSI - Check
Lightwave -Check
modo - Check

mental ray - Check
Vray - Check.
Kray - Check
F-Prime - Check.

Houdini.... um just started learning. Check with me in a year :hey:

Core... testing a few times a month to check progress.

So yeah, Time to order pizza and break out tutorials.

Jockomo
08-11-2009, 07:25 AM
It's really too bad Lightwave couldn't make a showing at siggraph. It might have helped dispel the rumor that I kept getting from the other developers (like Nvidia) who asked "Are they still developing lightwave?"

You know the saying... out of sight, out of mind.

Personally I've given up on Lightwave I am sorry to say. It's currently still my main tool, because 9.6 is a fantastic, mature program. However without any future in sight I have to move on to something that won't give me dead ends with other products in our pipeline.

3rd party support is fading fast now that they realize there will be no more updates to the existing program. Companies will be much less likely to adopt lightwave into their pipeline if they can't expect to have any support from the other elements of their pipeline.

NewTek should have just kept their mouths shut about core and discreetly invited existing beta members. That whole announcement of core may have been the deathblow.

biliousfrog
08-11-2009, 07:38 AM
I'm sticking with LightWave 9.6 and looking for alternatives but there's no rush. Lightwave's renderer is far too cheap and easy to use to just give up but I can't see the point in learning a new workflow for CORE when I could learn a new workflow in something more mature such as Softimage, Max or Modo...probably Modo would be my first choice currently so that I could continue using my saved objects.

beverins
08-11-2009, 08:24 AM
so...cast your minds toward spring 2010>>

1.stay with 9.6 - Yup, works great and it's not going anywhere
2.add blender in october - I will look at this "new UI". Willing to try.
3.add modo - Already at 401 here with EDU maintenance. Buggy but has some nice stuff.
4.add maya - upgrade to 2010 hopefully
5.add softimage - add in with Education Pack, hopefully
6.add 3dsmax - add in with Education Pack,hopefully
11.hard core renewal - gotta be hard core!
14.add 3d coat - this program impresses me
17.add vue - get the EDU maintenance up to date, get vue xstream 8 (even though they have really dropped the ball in regards to LW integration)

Despite the massive Autodesk wall that we have had no choice but to cave in to, this university still teaches Lightwave and will continue to do so.

Larry_g1s
08-11-2009, 09:36 AM
LW 9.6, with: LWCAD v3.1, Kray, fPrime, & HDInstance is still plenty enough for me. I'm also learning Maya for character animation, but I still believe LW is capable enough.
I'm already a HC member, so when ever CORE ships, that'll be gravy!

Titus
08-11-2009, 09:45 AM
Many, many companies skipped this SIGGRAPH. And I prefer no NT booth than a mediocre presentation.

BTW, a group of small studios from Mexico was present there. What do you think of what you saw?

jasonwestmas
08-11-2009, 10:22 AM
LW will be extremely useful tool-set for at least another 2 years. By that time I suspect that a program like Core; A clean program base where the programmers have less fear of breaking key features as they develop new ones will have Core all ready for full production; Furthermore, coders will finish what they need to finish in far less time than the older applications. This is probably the most significant reason for the rewrite and was stated in so many words by NT. NT had to do this as was predicted at least 4 years ago. The only question was when.

Should NT have kept this a secret for 1-2 more years? Well obviously NT wanted everyone involved as they seem to think that our opinions on these forums matter and don't consider us as just another user but as serious users and supporters to NT's success in the long haul. I think getting us involved early is really going to help solidify what the problems are and how to fix them very early on.

realgray
08-11-2009, 12:02 PM
Modo just got some rigging features and volumetric lights in 401, do you think that Core will take that long to develop?

jasonwestmas
08-11-2009, 12:25 PM
Modo just got some rigging features and volumetric lights in 401, do you think that Core will take that long to develop?

No. Luxology is not Newtek. Modo, isn't core either. I'm not making a prediction but I don't think that Modo was designed to support animation tools right from the get go, was it? Luxology seems to be taking that tacked on approach where they have to keep restructuring the code beneath in order to add more tools outside of modeling and rendering, which takes longer than pre-planning the code base to support a larger pipeline and workflow that includes modeling, rendering and animation together at once. NT was doing this tacked on approach for too long with Lightwave and decided it was a dead end. NT is now taking their time with the code base and considering all options and workflows. In the end or beginning, this will speed up programming dev and I don't have to be a programmer to understand that.:)

cresshead
08-11-2009, 12:25 PM
Modo just got some rigging features and volumetric lights in 401, do you think that Core will take that long to develop?

core looks to be a different development model from modo so there is no way to put them side by side.

core is more like houdini, maya, max, cinema4d, blender2.5 and xsi as it has modifiers, history and nodal connections for everything.

Lightwolf
08-11-2009, 01:29 PM
I'm not making a prediction but I don't think that Modo was designed to support animation tools right from the get go, was it?
They had a very early tech demo with particles, bones and animation.

So I think it actually was.

Cheers,
Mike

monovich
08-11-2009, 01:45 PM
I'm fine with 9.6

I'd love to peep in on CORE, but am avoiding the distraction of beta software.

robertoortiz
08-13-2009, 12:18 PM
Many, many companies skipped this SIGGRAPH. And I prefer no NT booth than a mediocre presentation.

BTW, a group of small studios from Mexico was present there. What do you think of what you saw?
Amen...
Newtek made the right call.
Not only that, they made the right call for the open beta for CORE (the Beta forum is doing great).
Now they just need to start building building bridges with companies like Nvidia, ATI etc.
Third party support will come, as soon as the CORE SDK is made public.
-R