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Thread: NDI PTZ head

  1. #1
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    NDI PTZ head

    Not sure if this is right place to add this request. The new NDI PTZ camere seems cool. What would be great is a PTZ head with a Spark built in with lank and other controls so you can use what ever camera you want.

    For example we have 2 Sony PXW-X70 and 2 JVC 650. It would be awesome to be able to use them as a PTZ. Or the BMD Micro studio camera.

    The problem I have seen i all PTZ cameras for under $5000, is the bad image quality. They are mostly in same quality as a $500-1000 camera. Need a lot of light. And get easy bit noisy.

    /Johan

  2. #2
    NewTek System Integrator PIZAZZ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metodisten View Post
    Not sure if this is right place to add this request. The new NDI PTZ camere seems cool. What would be great is a PTZ head with a Spark built in with lank and other controls so you can use what ever camera you want.

    For example we have 2 Sony PXW-X70 and 2 JVC 650. It would be awesome to be able to use them as a PTZ. Or the BMD Micro studio camera.

    The problem I have seen i all PTZ cameras for under $5000, is the bad image quality. They are mostly in same quality as a $500-1000 camera. Need a lot of light. And get easy bit noisy.

    /Johan
    While not a NewTek product, we have heads we are using that do exactly what you are looking for. We worked with Mark Roberts Motion Control based in the UK to develop a NDI output module to work with their new Whisper head. The head is completely controlled over IP and passed the serial data to the camera whether it be LANC or other serial formats. Currently they have the 4k AJA RovoCams on them most of the time but I have seen BMD Micros on them too. Since the AJA cams use VISCA/LANC for lense controls the modifications to support the PXW-X70 should definitely be possible. For your older JVC 650 cameras, you might have to step up to a larger head like their AFC-100.

    Let me know if you would like me to make an introduction to you and MRMC. They are some great people with some great minds.

    My production division uses 4 of the Whispers along with 4 of the AFC100s. The movements are just amazing.
    Our custom video to NDI converter sits underneath the head.

    Jef Kethley
    PIZAZZ
    www.pizazz.com

    Using:
    All models of TriCasters + 3Play, IPSeries
    Panasonic UB300 4k cams
    Tactical Fiber/converters, SDI2NDI converters, NDI-Viewfinder, and NDI2HDMI

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    So Jeff, in this case, are you going HDbT to HDMI/SDI (RovoRX) to NDI, with two converters in-line? Or have you built an HDbT to NDI solution that doesn't have like 6 frames of total latency that stacking two converters would have? Been reading up on the AJA camera since you suggested it the other day. Just wondering how you're getting the video out of the Rovocam in to your NDI scheme.
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  4. #4
    'the write stuff' SBowie's Avatar
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    Don't get me going about HDbaseT ...
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by PIZAZZ View Post
    While not a NewTek product, we have heads we are using that do exactly what you are looking for. We worked with Mark Roberts Motion Control based in the UK to develop a NDI output module to work with their new Whisper head. The head is completely controlled over IP and passed the serial data to the camera whether it be LANC or other serial formats. Currently they have the 4k AJA RovoCams on them most of the time but I have seen BMD Micros on them too. Since the AJA cams use VISCA/LANC for lense controls the modifications to support the PXW-X70 should definitely be possible. For your older JVC 650 cameras, you might have to step up to a larger head like their AFC-100.

    Let me know if you would like me to make an introduction to you and MRMC. They are some great people with some great minds.

    My production division uses 4 of the Whispers along with 4 of the AFC100s. The movements are just amazing.
    Our custom video to NDI converter sits underneath the head.

    Nice what pricerange do we talk about on a head like that. What is the price on your HDMI or SDI to NDI? And what NDI codec do you use in your converter box?

    /Johan

  6. #6
    NewTek System Integrator PIZAZZ's Avatar
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    Johan,

    I believe the Whispers are in the $6000-7000 USD range last I checked. Depending on control options. Our conversion box uses NDI 3.0 and handles full 4K up to 60p. Contact me directly for pricing on the HDMI2NDI conversion box. jef at pizazz dot com

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by SBowie View Post
    Don't get me going about HDbaseT ...
    No kidding. Freaking irritating.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Lee-AVP View Post
    So Jeff, in this case, are you going HDbT to HDMI/SDI (RovoRX) to NDI, with two converters in-line? Or have you built an HDbT to NDI solution that doesn't have like 6 frames of total latency that stacking two converters would have? Been reading up on the AJA camera since you suggested it the other day. Just wondering how you're getting the video out of the Rovocam in to your NDI scheme.
    Lee I will have to look into the latency closer for you. I can tell you though that we have never noticed the latency impacting the productions. Granted we are going to broadcast and not doing IMAG right there on top of someone.
    Jef Kethley
    PIZAZZ
    www.pizazz.com

    Using:
    All models of TriCasters + 3Play, IPSeries
    Panasonic UB300 4k cams
    Tactical Fiber/converters, SDI2NDI converters, NDI-Viewfinder, and NDI2HDMI

  7. #7
    UniSon Gordon's Avatar
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    Actually, Steve, I would very much like to hear about your experiences with HDbaseT. It would be helpful information for us all, especially if we want to integrate a HDbaseT camera using a NC1.

    While I was telling the decision makers on the value of NDI, they almost flippantly mentioned that NDI is fine but everyone is going video over IP so they are all the same.

  8. #8
    'the write stuff' SBowie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gordon View Post
    Actually, Steve, I would very much like to hear about your experiences with HDbaseT. It would be helpful information for us all, especially if we want to integrate a HDbaseT camera using a NC1.

    While I was telling the decision makers on the value of NDI, they almost flippantly mentioned that NDI is fine but everyone is going video over IP so they are all the same.
    Not even close. I work regularly with two different HDbaseT d/a's - a cheap one (I won't mention a brand, but buy two or three because they break down frequently) and a much more expensive one (say 8x more $) - which, not surprisingly is much more reliable.

    That said, even the good one has a mind of its own. I am convinced that the problem isn't the d/a, but rather that HDBaseT is very prone to inductive interference. The problems diminished when I re-ran the cable runs to be as far as physically possible from fluorescent fixtures, but to this day one or the other of the monitors at the end of the longest runs (100ft, supposed to be good for much more than that) will intermittently 'go dark' for a period of a week or so. During this time I will try everything under the sun to resolve the issue without success; and then it will magically heal itself for some months before doing it again.

    Do a search for "HDBaseT unreliable". There's lots of info out there.
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  9. #9
    NewTek System Integrator PIZAZZ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SBowie View Post
    Not even close. I work regularly with two different HDbaseT d/a's - a cheap one (I won't mention a brand, but buy two or three because they break down frequently) and a much more expensive one (say 8x more $) - which, not surprisingly is much more reliable.

    That said, even the good one has a mind of its own. I am convinced that the problem isn't the d/a, but rather that HDBaseT is very prone to inductive interference. The problems diminished when I re-ran the cable runs to be as far as physically possible from fluorescent fixtures, but to this day one or the other of the monitors at the end of the longest runs (100ft, supposed to be good for much more than that) will intermittently 'go dark' for a period of a week or so. During this time I will try everything under the sun to resolve the issue without success; and then it will magically heal itself for some months before doing it again.

    Do a search for "HDBaseT unreliable". There's lots of info out there.
    You made me smile Steve with that story. Try keying a radio next to a HDBaseT camera... blinky blinky all the time.
    Jef Kethley
    PIZAZZ
    www.pizazz.com

    Using:
    All models of TriCasters + 3Play, IPSeries
    Panasonic UB300 4k cams
    Tactical Fiber/converters, SDI2NDI converters, NDI-Viewfinder, and NDI2HDMI

  10. #10
    'the write stuff' SBowie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PIZAZZ View Post
    You made me smile Steve with that story. Try keying a radio next to a HDBaseT camera... blinky blinky all the time.
    I have spent many hours not smiling trying to debug that system, Jef, believe me!

    Edit: Man, you just gave me an idea. I wonder if our wireless mic system is involved ...
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