Clouds

[johncmurphy]

Animations that make it appear like you are zooming over the tops of the clouds are commonly seen. How is this done?
Are these just 2D paintings of clouds, or is there a way to model clouds in 3D?

[SplineGod]

It can be done with a combination of both.
Clouds can be done using paintings, geometry, hypervoxels, Skytracer in Lightwave etc.

[karlieman]

Well the simplest and best looking way to do this is by using Hypervoxels. Here is a quick tutorial:

First thing is to create a bunch of particles in modeler using the spray points tool like this http://www.newtek.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=74637&stc=1&d=1245963189. Then save it and send it to Layout. Turn on Hypervoxels and use this texture http://www.newtek.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=74638&stc=1&d=1245963867 it sould look like this with some touch up in Photoshop. http://www.newtek.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=74640&stc=1&d=1245964530

[johncmurphy]

Impressive.
Thanks.

[karlieman]

No problem.

[yaschan]

I am curious about making geometry based clouds. Particularly I'm interested of what kind of geometry should it be, and how good results one could get. Perhaps multiple layers?
You could get interesting results maybe by using Iaian's concept of node based clouds while mapping it onto a geometry: http://iaian7.com/lightwave/FakingVolumetricClouds

[toby]

I am curious about making geometry based clouds. Particularly I'm interested of what kind of geometry should it be, and how good results one could get. Perhaps multiple layers?
You could get interesting results maybe by using Iaian's concept of node based clouds while mapping it onto a geometry: http://iaian7.com/lightwave/FakingVolumetricClouds
Those look incredible! :eek:

[SplineGod]

Ive used stacks of polys for years to create clouds, fog etc. That was about the only way to do it before LW got volumetrics or was a faster way to get it rendered.
The basic trick is to use layerd geometry like stacks of polys or concentric spheres etc.
Apply a procedural texture to the objects in the tranparency channel using WORLD coords so that the object moves thru the texture.
The next thing is to quickly vibrate the objects using an endomorph, displacement map or sizing and then use lots of motion blur when rendering. You can create a vibrating object and then fxlink it to a bunch of particles similar to how you would use HVs.
Heres a couple of examples:
http://www.3dtrainingonline.com/examples/ground_fog.jpg
http://www.3dtrainingonline.com/examples/volumetrics_test.jpg

[yaschan]

Yes, I have played with the moving poly+world coordinates texture + motion blur. It's great for still scenes.
But the problem for me is still the rendering time, as I need to use antialiasing to get rid of the noise introduced with the motion blur.
But this works well if you want to create sandstorm with tiny particles of sand, as the noise actually looks like sand.

[prometheus]

I wonder if microwave could be useful for fast good clouds

http://www.evasion3d.com/gfx/microwave/pics/clouds_2.html
http://www.evasion3d.com/gfx/microwave/pics/clouds_1.html
http://www.evasion3d.com/gfx/microwave/pics/x_flight_1.html
http://www.evasion3d.com/mw_lw_prodinfo.html

and I wonder how good results there were with nature fx clouds, it had a way of applying a cloud volume filter over a created geometry, to bad it´s not around anymore from dynamic realities, and they had some nice water effects too.

if it wasnt so hard to tweak quality and if it wasn´t for the long rendertimes I would be happy to see ogo taiki in Lightwave
http://www.asahi-net.or.jp/~pq1a-ogs/taiki_e.html

then theres ozone 4...slow to render too thou.

the techniques with geometry and faking it with vibration techniques are surely fast, but I don´t like the fact that you don´t have an atmospheric system and lighting properties to interact naturally with clouds as in ozone,vue or ogo taiki, so it becomes a comprimize of realism and fast results..can´t have and eat the cake huh.

would love to see new volumetric features in lightwave core once they start to focus on that area.
an L-system together with nodes and metaballs wich then are applied on the L-system and volumetric voxels on that could be a really cool way to
create complex cloud formations and animated L-system growth could
simulate rising forming cumulus clouds. (take a look at houdini metaclouds and image3d techniques)

About ozone 4..unfortunatly we can´t use metaclouds to shape clouds as in vue infinite/x-stream, Also in vue e-on hasn´t pushed the metacloud technology much further in latest vue releases in terms of being able to construct/manage metaspheres, or saving and reloading structures, no other geometry type than spheres are allowed either.

Im interested to see what techniques like the voxel sculpting in 3d coat could be useful for in terms of exporting sculpted cloud models to a lightwave core. maybe Lightwave cores volumetric handler could be built with that in mind so we could sculpt unbelievable cloud models in 3d coat and animate and render with lightwave core.

Makes me wonder if volumedic could handle such voxel format or dynamite perhaps..well maybe we should forget about dynamite, otherwise it had
a seemingly cool feature to load voxel formats.

Michael

[pdp editor]

what file type is the second link? psd and jpg does not work.


Well the simplest and best looking way to do this is by using Hypervoxels. Here is a quick tutorial:

First thing is to create a bunch of particles in modeler using the spray points tool like this http://www.newtek.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=74637&stc=1&d=1245963189. Then save it and send it to Layout. Turn on Hypervoxels and use this texture http://www.newtek.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=74638&stc=1&d=1245963867 it sould look like this with some touch up in Photoshop. http://www.newtek.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=74640&stc=1&d=1245964530

[karlieman]

Its a Hypervoxel texture go into Hypervoxels hit load at the top and open that file.

[Elmar Moelzer]

http://www.newtek.com/forums/showthread.php?t=52314&highlight=volumedic&page=4

You can use VoluMedic to make clouds as well. They render pretty fast too.

[prometheus]

http://www.newtek.com/forums/showthread.php?t=52314&highlight=volumedic&page=4

You can use VoluMedic to make clouds as well. They render pretty fast too.

Yeah Ivé seen that one before, would be nice if someone had the time
to show of a little more samples of that stuff, Its looking good but preferably with a little more depth and hight in the clouds to show off
the thickness and shadows in the volumetrics little better.

But the technique behind it is something I really would see as some
sort of new features inside of upcoming versions of lightwave, a sort
of voxel sculpting techniques ala 3d coat or modeled cloud polymodel conversions to volumetrics.

Dam..wouldn´t it be nice if some of the none landscape speciality programs
could take up the challenge of competing against vue when it comes to
digital nature and environments.

First thing is the interactiv viewer needed to preview Everything, so
the vpr in core is a start, now we need a pretty fast volumetric system
and a plugin of somekind of ogo taikis style, but with more accurate atmospheric air and fog setup with improved speed and UI..that would
be a big leap in to starting to compete with vue.
Next would be tree and vegetation creation..and some terrain editors.

If Newtek could pull that off, well they would leave vue in a corner for shame, pricewise and feature wise of what the package can do besides landscape generation and render.

And wouldnt that be nice having such system working more properly
integrated with everything else than fiddling with x-stream versions and
different renderers.

Well..is it a to Big challenge for Newtek? don´t they have the resources in
available personal,skills and money to pull it off?

Or is it just not worth it going that way since other solutions such as vue
xstream is out there..dahh.
Please..prove me wrong Newtek.

ohh..by the way, a few tips for point cluster creation.

You could use partigons emitters and create cloud clusters in layout
with procedural textures or images in the birth rate channels to shape a
general distribution and a shape of the cloud cluster.
since we are using a partigon emitter that can be saved out as point clusters through save as transformed object, and in modeler that can be further tweaked or cloned
in hight etc.

You can in modeler also cut out cloud shapes from point clusters by using
a prefered sculpted polymodel in a background layer and use boolean drill
with intersect mode, that will cut out points in the shape of your geometry...just a few tips for those not knowing who wants to cloud sculpt.

Michael