64 bit machine

[zapper1998]

I want to build a amd 64 bit machine..

Anybody have any good luck with building a 64 bit dual amd machine ??

can some post the Motherboard type and manufacture, I am having a problem finding one..

I hope this is the right place to post??

Michael

[Lynx3d]

Cheaper ones:
MSI K8N Master2-FAR (http://www.msi.com.tw/program/products/server/svr/pro_svr_detail.php?UID=613)
ASUS K8N-DL (http://www.asus.com/products.aspx?l1=9&l2=39&l3=174&model=456&modelmenu=1)
or the no-compromise-solution:
Tyan Thunder K8WE (http://tyan.com/products/html/thunderk8we.html)
There may be others from Iwill and even Supermicro (sold under different brands, because Supermicro doesn't support anything different than Intel officially...) but at least over here they're hard to find...

[jacross]

I'd stay away from the cheaper options listed as neither currently support dual-cores for future upgradability. Also your RAM upgrade options are more limited because of the fewer memory slots. If you can afford it I would recommend going for this one: Supermicro rebranded H8DCE (http://www.monarchcomputer.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=M&Product_Code=110289&Category_Code=OMB)

It's only $100 more or so than the cheaper ones and it provides practically everything that this Tyan does but at a cheaper price: Tyan K8WE (http://www.monarchcomputer.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=M&Product_Code=110197&Category_Code=OMB)

I've owned both Supermicro and Tyan boards in the past and they've both been absolutely perfect. Just my $.02.

EDIT: No, I don't work for Monarch Computer, they're just the only ones I've found that are reputable that carry both boards. If in the end you go with the Tyan, you may be able to find it cheaper elsewhere.

[Lynx3d]

I'd stay away from the cheaper options listed as neither currently support dual-cores for future upgradability.
I don't believe that's true, you can't really overlook the large "dual-core ready" banner on the MSI site (they're in the QVL list too) and the Asus should support them since BIOS 1004, but apparently that information didn't make it to the support site yet...it's mentioned in their support forums though.

Also your RAM upgrade options are more limited because of the fewer memory slots.
Well okay, but IMHO 6 slots is still decent...the more important difference is 2x PCIe x16 and PCI-X slots i think...

But the price of the Monarch really is attractive compared to the Tyan, didn't know that. Definitely looks like good choice!

[jacross]

Lynx3d,

You are absolutely correct, I thought you were referring to the older K8T Master2-Far, not the K8N. My bad. 6 DIMM slots may be ok, but I'm waiting for the new iWILL that has 8 DIMM slots per CPU here (http://www.iwill.net/product_2.asp?p_id=102&sp=Y). Within the next couple of years 16GB of RAM won't be that unusual I don't think.

Regarding the 1004 bios, I've heard that there are some stability issues with it. I personally can't confirm so as far as I'm concerned it's 'buyer beware'. That board has needed a few bios updates just to handle NUMA memory access and have memory attached to both CPU's.

Also, although the MSI board has 6 DIMM slots, they're all hanging off of CPU0 so you don't get the benefit of the added bandwidth of AMD's NUMA architecture (Where memory bandwidth is doubled by having memory off of both CPU's).

[zapper1998]

thats what i am looking for

which cpu's are beter the opteron? or the other one's ?

[Lynx3d]

What "other" CPUs do you mean :question:

Could it be that you were looking for a dual-core solution with Athlon64 X2, rather than a dual-CPU system?
There are no other AMD64 CPUs that have something "dual" in the name *g*

Athlon64 X2 is the "desktop" solution, that means there are only single-CPU boards, doesn't need (nor support) registered memory and the boards typically don't come with stuff like PCI-X (although i think it will become less important anyway) or more than 4 DIMM slots etc.

@jacross: indeed, no NUMA on the MSI, that's weak :(

[jacross]

You could save money by going with a single AMD Athlon X2 dual core processor and non-registered DDR memory. I'm sure it would be blazing fast and the motherboard would be cheaper too :). The main downside to that configuration for me however is that you loose memory capacity, total memory bandwidth, and when you start getting into large memory installations (over 2GB) with non registered memory it could slow down the system as the processor has to do more to manage the memory. Just something to think about for scalability. I should point out however that since you only have one socket and two cores, with the improved memory controller on the X2's, the lower memory bandwidth is not really going to be an issue at all. Now if you tried to put two dual core cpu's and only have one memory controller (like the MSI), that would probably cause a slowdown. If you aren't gonna be at more than 2GB before you buy another machine, then it's a moot point :).

I'm looking at using some X2's for some dev and modelling machines as it should be pretty fast and cheaper than even a couple of fast dual socket, single core systems.

[KillMe]

i got some advice for you - DONT

i just dicovered that my;

digital camera drivers - dont work
scanner drivers - dont work
Printer drivers - dont work
sentinel drivers - work but not with FPrime

and to top it off i couldn't make it dual boot either install someon in one operating system and somehow i overwrote stuff on the otehre ven if they were on differnet phsycical drives

[KillMe]

jsut to add another to the list - my logitech optical cordless mouse driver dont work either so no thumb button for delecting geometry in lightwave =/ arghhhhhhh xp 64 is out now why haven't all the device manufacturere written drivers already - surely thats what the beta x64 period was for............... arghhhh

[stevecullum]

I built a dual opteron 244 machine a few months ago. It runs Lightwave very well and is very stable. I have seen good speed improvement over my amd 3000xp. One piece of advice though, which ever Mobo you go for, make sure you buy memory matched to the board from Crucial.com or similar. I think it has to be ECC for AMD opteron too.

[Verlon]

Epson has x64 printer drivers.
You need a USB dongle for sentinel to work.

Cameras are hit and miss. My real cameras work just fine (Nikon D70, Sony VX2000 video), but my webcam doesn't....go figure.

My Logitech cordless mouse works fine. Did you get the 64 bit drivers from them kill me? I hate to ask, but since my features ARE working, I thought you might have used the default setup.

Scanner? Well, I put my HP scanner on my GF's computer. I do not use it much anyway. The new Epson prints on CDs and will soon print a rather strongly worded letter to HP about their overall lack of support for x64.

I do not need the webcam that badly, so no tragic loss there.

Having to reinstall many things though. More critically, Starforce does not support x64 until 3.0 or so (3.x?). Who is Starforce? They make disk based copy protection. Many games which require the CD to run, like GTR, will not work and SIMBIN is not to responsive to requests t release a patch that per starforce "will only take a few minutes."

I am not certain who all uses it. Also, I have not been able to get photoshop 7 to reinstall, and I am wondering if an upgrade to CS will fix this. I do not particularly WANT to do this as 7 has done everything I need, but I do need a solid paint program from time to time. I might be able to get it to work later, but haven't played with it enough.

Also, my logitech momo racing wheel works with force feedback, saitek has x64 drivers, and so does Creative Labs (soundblaster)....it seems that HP is the big glaring exception to the rule.

[KillMe]

seemed my mouse wasn't one that was supported by the 64bit version of set point so i took the opertunity and upgraded to the latest in laser mice - and rechargable too so will save me a fortune in batteries :thumbsup:

ironically my webcam works my camera doesn't

my printer is a hp one and there no driver yet for it but it says there is a possible work around which i will try at somepoint

and my epson scanner likewise no drivers

i guess thigns will get sorted soon but abit infuriating

[jacross]

Many mfr.'s still don't have 64-bit drivers out, and even some that due have bugs. That's why I'm going to hold off until at least the end of fall as much of this should be sorted out by then. Not to mention I'm going to upgrade to LW9, but I still have an old parallel dongle so I'll have to switch it out here soon before going 64-bit.

When M$ released the 64-bit version of Windows they did so in a way that only appeals to the power users and tinkerers out there which make up a very small portion of the computer using population. This is why most mfr's are slow to get the drivers out the door because right now it's just for a very small minority. I just hope that I'm right and they'll be more available and stable come the end of fall. Here's hopin' :). But no matter what I'll be doin' the research to make sure that all of my systems components will be supported cause otherwise I'd be in a world of hurt.

[Lude]

http://www.mediaworkstation.com/articles/viewarticle.jsp?id=33905
:eek:

[Lude]

boxx are taking the piss :hey:

[js33]

Is that good or bad? 8~

Cheers,
JS

[js33]

I think once we start seeing 64 bit machines with XP64 preinstalled for sale in the stores rather than just online then the driver support will be much better.
So like others I'm waiting until the smoke clears. Also I'll wait for the next gen or two of dual core 64 bit processors. Having been through every transition with Windows since 3.1 I'm in no hurry to run headlong into a system with mimimal driver support. I can wait awhile.

Cheers,
JS

[KillMe]

holy cr@p 4 dual core cpu's :eek: thats liek 8 cpu's i feel inadaquate with just 2 now

[lots]

The Tyan K8QW is an impressive board. And it really takes advantage of the Opteron design. It's too bad though, that it is a single Nforce 4 Pro 2200 chip, and not the 2200 2050 pair that the K8WE has. Meaning you only get one true 16x PCIe slot...

[Promethius]

I have an AMD 3000XP Athlon running on WinXP64. I had to go online for my sound and LAN drivers to work with 64, even though I have the orginal factory disc. Drivers should get more popular for 64 as time goes by.

My main problem now is that my LW8.3 for sentinal is not working for my parallel dongle, due to the fact that I purchase my original 6yrs ago.

Verlon, you think that if I get a replacement for my parallel for a USB dongle, that it may solve my issue here. Right now I can run LW8.3 , but only in discovery mode.

promethius

[Lito]

IIRC the parallel dongle doesn't work in Win64 because there are no 64bit Parallel dongle drivers.

[KillMe]

having trouble with my HASP parrallel dongle for DXF+ here too though it seemed there were 64bit dirvers for it i still get nothing when i tried and start dxf =/ - i figured compositing softwarew companys would be very quick to get onto the 64bit bandwagon as it would seems like a dream come true for compositors

[Verlon]

I had the same exact problem.

I upgraded from parallel to usb dongle and got the drivers from the thread "Sentinel drivers for Windows x64 are these legit?" or something like that.

use those drivers when windows detects the USB dongle, then reinstall Sentinel 7.1.1 drivers from their web page. This will get lightwave running in full mode. So far, all of my plugins work EXCEPT those from Worley labs (FPrime, Sasquatch, and Disgust in my case). I am certain Sasquatch and Disgust will work once the dongle issue is resolved. I do not know, but believe that Fprime will also be ok.

If you upgrade to LW9, you can get a free dongle upgrade. You might talk to NT and ask if they will ship the new dongle early (I only say because LW9 was announced like 12 minutes after I called to upgrade).

See my thread on Windows X64 plugins for some of the stuff I have tested to see if it works.

Verlon

[Lynx3d]

Free dongle upgrade!? Indeed...
That's new, isn't it?
Hm...that'd almost be a reason to upgrade to 9...then i could use LW on my Laptop too.

[Verlon]

I thought it had been that way since 7. *shrugs*

[Lynx3d]

I'm pretty sure they wanted me to pay extra so didn't do it.
If they fooled me, goodbye, i'm finally pissed :cursin:

[Verlon]

Well I could be wrong.....it did happen once before. In any event, this has been posted on the faq since February 2003.

Can I change my LightWave version to another platform?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Yes. The price for a platform exchange, for example switching an Intel License to a Mac license, is $99. If you wish to make the platform exchange at the time you are purchasing an incremental upgrade, then the $99 fee is waived and your cost is just the price of the upgrade. Customer Services can provide information on the procedures for exchanging your hardware key and process your order for such a conversion.

That would seem to cover a dongle swap as well, so it would stand to reason you could upgrade your dongle at that time and keep your PC version.

[Lito]

Wow I never actually read the FAQ, but I was under the impression that if you had a USB dongle you could use LW on either a Mac or PC with no added cost. I did ask about a dongle swap in between paid upgrades and I am certain it was only $30 to do the swap. I ended up declining because I didn't want to mess with re-registering my plugins, but I decided to do it this time with the LW9 upgrade because it was free and I am planning on going to Win64 as soon as I see the drivers for my PC are stable.

[jmw326]

Hello Everyone,


Here is the procedure and pricing for swapping out a dongle.
A parallel or ADB to USB swap is $29.95 unless you have upgraded to LW9 then the fee can be waived and your only cost will be shipping.

We set up an order for the new Dongle and an RMA for the old. You ship us your old dongle and as soon as we receive it we process your order and ship your new dongle back to you (usually the same day). After you receive your new dongle you will need to call or email the customer service department to change your lock ID and get a new key. For plug ins we can email you an invoice that should be all you need to get those transferred to the new dongle by Worley or whomever they are from.

When shipping the dongle back to us we recommend that it be shipped in a way that can be tracked so that if it is lost or broken there is a record of it and that it be shipped in a secure package. Please do not ship dongles in a plain white letter envelope. They never make it back to us like that.

If you have any more questions about this please feel free to contact Customer Service.


Thank you,
James White
NewTek Customer Service
cs@newtek.com
1-800-862-7837