Holy Fintail Batman...

[hrgiger]

I started this model yesterday and this is about where I'm at. I hope to finish her up in the next couple of days and add in all the detail.

I love this car from the only REAL Batman movies. Tim Burton is King.

[hrgiger]

Oh, I should mention that both the wheels and the canopy on the car are stand-ins and will be replaced later. I just wanted to have something in there so I could kind of visualize the whole thing as I was modeling. So if it doesn't look like the canopy fits, well, that's why.

[Kuzey]

Oooooo...very nicce!!

:p

Kuzey

[robpauza]

That's going to be really cool.

Now you just need to model George Clooney to drive it. :)

-Rob

[hrgiger]

Boy, I hope that's a joke Rob...:D

[Rei]

Nice work so far, can we see a wire for it?

[lone]

looks like a good start - and i'll second the 'only real BATMAN movies' declaration.

[hrgiger]

Ok, well after working on this for a while I realized I there are some pretty difficult contours on the batmobile that was going to take some fairly precise modeling. The model above was made by the point by point method. Well, just experimenting around with splines today, I pretty much started over and decided to layout the car body with splines. Anyway, after working on it some today here's where I'm at. Here's the spline cage I have laid out (couple views):

[hrgiger]

And here's a layout realtime with a couple of views...

I'll post a wire once I get the fins done (which I'm still doing point by point) and a few of the other details...

[robpauza]

Too bad Clooney wasn't in the first two movies.

By the way... YES, I'm definately joking. :D

Can't wait to see more progress.

-Rob

[robpauza]

Whoops. You beat me to the post.

Nice, clean looking splines. I started a spline-based 350Z a while back but never got around to finishing it.

Again, cool stuff.
-Rob

[rmollame]

Great job, really. I long to see it finished.


Riccardo

[marvin]

That looks really cool so far. What happened to the hood on the realtime layout views? It looks like you have it layed out in the spline, but there is no hood. Either way, I can't wait to see more. It'll be great when it's finished.

marvin

[hrgiger]

Thanks for the comments. Marvin, the hood isn't there in that preview, I hadn't filled in the spline cages yet there. I have now though and here is the wireframe of the new model after spline patching. The fins I added as I said earlier using point by point. In the case of the fins, they were a little easier to create this way rather then with splines.

[Kuzey]

Now...that's even better than the first version!!

Kuzey

[hrgiger]

Well, I think so too. Modeling with splines is definately much easier to get the shape you need for something like a car. I'm pretty happy with the results thus far. I'm modeling the turbine and other small details right now and I'll post an update later tonight or tomorrow.

[j0SH]

thats lookin mad so far..not much crit to add yet lol

[hrgiger]

Breaking from the body for a little bit to work on the details. Here's a wheel...

[hrgiger]

And the turbine...

[facial deluxe]

Turbine is so phallic, me likes :)

..and car is pretty good too;)

[hrgiger]

Here's a little more progress and a couple of views:

[hrgiger]

And a front view...

[igorstshirts]

Nice and clean modeling. More.

[richpr]

Very nice!!!

[colkai]

Is it just me?
Or does the 'nose' of the turbine seem a bit elongated?

Just thought it should be a little less, well, nosey ;)

[hrgiger]

Maybe a bit Colkai. The only problem I've had modeling this is that I've been going off some schematic drawings I found on the net that gave me an accurate view of it from top, side, front and back but they seem to differ slightly from the car from the movie which is what I want to stay true to. I can tell already that there are some things that will need to be modified. Obviously, I'm not done yet but there are edges that need to be sharpened and some areas that need to be a bit wider or smaller. Anyway, you be the judge, here's one of my movie references...

[colkai]

Now it just goes to show don't it!
In my head, I was convinced the cone should be smaller, but nope, there it is. I think what it *may* be is that in black, it seems to receed slightly into the car as a whole, if you know what I mean.

It is rather large, (is Batman trying to compensate for something perhaps? ;) )

Anyhoo, nice modelling so far old chap, based on the reference, you are certainly on-track. :D

[hrgiger]

Yeah, after looking at it though I realize the length might be about right but the shape is all wrong. The actual one has a little bit of a conical shape while mine for the most part is more like a capsule.

Thanks for pointing that out Colkai. I might not have noticed it otherwise. That will help out a lot. I hope to work on it more this weekend and fix a few inconsistensies.

[colkai]

Originally posted by hrgiger
Yeah, after looking at it though I realize the length might be about right but the shape is all wrong. The actual one has a little bit of a conical shape while mine for the most part is more like a capsule.


Now you mention it - that may be the reason it looks odd. Strange how your eye knows its wrong, but your brain can't figure out why. Mind you, with my brain, that ain't saying much :p

[hrgiger]

I've just started adding all the fun details to the car (headlights, tailights, panels, etc...) although this update doesn't show much of them.

Here's a render I did tonight.

[hrgiger]

Thanks to Colkai I remodeled the turbine in the front so it's a little more true to the shape of the movie car's turbine. I know you can see through the car under the canopy but that's just because I haven't added a cockpit yet and I'm not sure I will, although I will add some geometry under the cockpit and improve the fit so you can't see through the car anywhere.

If anyone has any tips for surfacing a car, feel free to share them with me because I'm not yet done with her yet.

[si_kick]

hey Hrigger,
I making a car myself at the moment and was onedering how u got the reflections nice on the body, can u tell me anyhting that'll help,
cheers

[hrgiger]

Well, as I stated earlier, I'm no expert at car surfacing but it's a pretty basic setup I have right now. I'm just using a gradient on the reflection channel and using the incidence angle as the input. I have a hdr image loaded into image world surrounding the scene which the car is reflecting (although, I'm currently not rendering with hdr or radiosity). I desaturated the image somewhat so that it wasn't reflecting too much color. I'm using the BRDF shader on the car surface for the specular and I used a couple of area lights on either side of the car.

I should also add that this is all wrong for the car I'm doing. The batmobile is more of a gun-metal sort of color/surface and the reflections wouldn't be so strong or clear. It just works for now while I'm still finishing the modeling.

Search around here, there was a thread not too long ago on car surfacing...

[colkai]

Got to say - it's coming along very nicely, I think the surfacing is fine, just slap some overhead luminous polys for that showroom look in the reflections.

Otherwise, keep it coming buddy! :D

[mattclary]

Very impressive, Steve! Nice work!

[hrgiger]

Here's a render to show some of the detail being done on the car. This is taking longer then I thought it would...

[astro-sanchez]

that is looking very nice
everything seem to take longer that you think

EDIT
also can you post a wireframe of the new
details would like to see

[hrgiger]

Thanks astro.

Here's a wireframe for you. Unbelieveably, I've still more to add yet...

[astro-sanchez]

oh yes very good thanks

[Matt]

giger - that's some nice modelling there! nice smooth flowing curves and once textured and lit a gallery item if I may be so bold!

(man I sound like Proton! :) )

[Lewis]

Hi !

Looks ver very good hrgiger. I just wanted to reply with comment that you will have problems with insets and holes on body (due low poly subDs) and baam i see you freezed mesh and made it with stencil :).

Freezing car object is good and bad in same time. It gives you good beveling and stencilig options but it's bad on any other situation :). It's not suitable for very close rendering shoots (unless you freeze mesn at level 10 or more ;)) and it's very very hard to maky any changes on that due very dense polygon structure. But if you don't plan any of those you've just helped yourself from going nuts while you solve polyflow on holes and insets in SubDs mode :).

I personaly model everything in SubDs so i can control rendering density and i can render close shot of air valve if i want and don't need to be afraid of segmentation ;).

Keep us updated with progress.

[hrgiger]

Thanks for your comments guys.

Lewis, thanks for the advice. The batmobile has so many panels, seams, and vents on it, I would just love to know how you would add all those things in Sub-d mode. The only real openings that were made in sub-d mode were the headlights and I used D-storms edge tool to cut that in but it wasn't easy to get a smooth mesh over around it so I couldn't imagine doing the same things for the panels and other details. Do you work detail out or do you add in the details after you've made the general body shape? Any advice you could give me would be greatly appreciated.

As I said, this is my first car model so I bow down to your car modeling prowess.

[Lewis]

hrgiger - I understand your wories and question but trust me - anything can be modeled in SubDs but it takes more time than usaual stencil/drill/bevel :). For instance i model logos and letters on cars and all tiny detials in SubDs - no exceptions :) - i would model batman logo in SubDs if is my call. And reverd is that it looks great on rendering and there is no sharp edges and need for beveling or so. I can show you few wireframes of my latest Ford F-150 or some other close wire shots of maserati /viper / honda if you want ? Sometimes it's hard but if you have good will and lot's of nerves it's great at end :). I even drilled holes on brake discs on maserati in SubDs mode also ;). That's only reason why i want N-gon support for SubDs :).

In your case inseting panels on that default 68x polys mesh would be too hard 'coz it's too low poly :). Every time i start to model car i try to look overall shape and see where i need most details. Then i start wiht that part ans when i get enough poly rows i easy can solve all other parts without need to increase rows or so. It's just matter of practise also, nobodys car wasn't perfect at first time, especialy if is something complycated. Heck my first car had so many polygons that every single point move would make dent on body and it was modeled point by point (select 4 points and hit p to make polygon :)).

[hrgiger]

Thanks Lewis. Why yes, I would really like to see some close-up wireframes of some of the detail areas on your car like you mentioned. I'm sure a lot of us would.;)

I take from what you're saying that if you were modeling the batmobile like mine, that you would start on some of the areas like the panels where the detail is?

[Lewis]

Yes hrgiger i would start on area where i need more polygons but first thing would be spline cage as usual :).

Here is some of shade/wire parts of my previous works what i have on my WEB now. But i'll upload you real close shoots of F-150 when i get home (yeah it's sunday night and i'am at work so far 6 hours and 4 more to go :)).

www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/temp/maserati/Maserati_LOGO_1.jpg
www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/temp/maserati/Maserati_LOGO_2.jpg
www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/temp/maserati/Maserati_LOGO_3.jpg
www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/temp/maserati/Maserati_LOGO_4.jpg
www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/temp/maserati/tyre1_shade.jpg
www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/temp/maserati/tyre1_wire.jpg
www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/temp/maserati/tyre2_shade.jpg
www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/temp/maserati/tyre2_wire.jpg

www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/temp/lexus/Lexus_WIP_001.jpg
www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/temp/lexus/Lexus_WIP_002.jpg

www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/temp/honda/wip_011.jpg
www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/temp/honda/wip_012.jpg

And here is tyre for Honda - onyl tyre thread is not SubDs but that's 'coz polycount will go skyrocket after freezing (i often model cars for clients who need OBJ, 3DS and other formats so i freeze them if they aren't for LW usage but AFTER i model everything in SubDs).
www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/temp/honda/wip_tyre.jpg

[Matt]

I wish I could download your brain Lewis!!!

:)

[Lewis]

Heheh Matt :)

More goodies for hrgiger

Here is cleseup of F-150 as i promised

wireframe in normal mode
www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/temp/f-150/Ford_F-150_wip_wire.jpg

wireframe in SubDs (TAB)
www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/temp/f-150/Ford_F-150_wip_wire2.jpg

solid in SubDs (TAB)
www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/temp/f-150/Ford_F-150_wip_smooth.jpg

I hope this helps to understand how coll SubDs are and how to control them :).

[KillMe]

you know the batmobile would look so much cooler if it had low profile tires and some nice alloy's those wheels it got look like tehy came off a truck

[hrgiger]

Thanks Lewis, your help is appreciated and your cars are definately worth the work you put into them.

I just found your tutorial again ( I assume it's yours) on the ford mustang on the other Lightwave forum and I've been going through that...

Can I ask how you do your letters on the logo? Do you have a font already that you use, or do you draw out the polygons yourself and extrude them?

And just how long do you spend on making a car generally?

[Lewis]

Hi again !

OK hrgiger here is my explanation about logos.

Usualy i try to find *.ai (or other vector format) for logo trough one of many logotype sites. Then import "logo*ai" in modeler trough his native importer which give me pretty fine logo but since i want logo in SubDs i need to remodel all of that manauly :). Then imported logo becomes just decent blueprint for me and i put that in background layer and start to making logo manauly. Easyest way is to "kill" polygons and leave me only points in foreground layer. Then manualy selecting 4 points one by one and making polygon, also some points need to be deleted since in subDs i don't need dense structure. It's important to make polys manualy 'coz bandsawing will work only if polys are Quads so i tend to model all in quads. Then i cut and bandsaw edges + extrude for depth and again bandsaw with very small amount like 0,05 % to get sharp but still rounded edge on extruded deepth. All that would be OK if you can found all logos but sometimes it can't be found.

I found front hood logo for maserati but didn't found that "maserati" text logo so i had to recreate it manualy. Then i started to search at my 12000 fonts database wich can take 30 minutes. And guess what - i didn't found that font :). I found nearest one and changed it manualy + i needed to weld letters together manualy 'coz my nearest looking one was having separated letters. Rest is history :).

One complete car in my process is 25-50 hours of modeling (depends do i model exterior only or exterior/interior also, or exterior + light detailed interior). All that can be streched to 2-4 weeks often 'coz i work on few projects simultaneously (right now only 5 of them - not all cars) adn how many hours i spend on my everyday job (i work on TV station so weekends aren't different from any other day for me).

I can model car in 10 hours to look decent but i hate to do "half job" so i model everything what i can see (right now i finshed keyhole on doornabs for F-150 ;)) even if that small details won't be visible in 90% of renders or camera angles. I'am addicted to precise and detailed modeling and i love geometry (i don't like to make insets and bumps wiht texture maps or so). Details are thing what makes difference in renders - i get so many e-mails (daily) with questions how to render this and that but maybe 10% of them really did good job on modeling and rest of guys think that semi detailed car can give realistic results which isn't realistic to expect :).

Once i took stopwatch and timed my modeling process/time. I was modeling Mercedes W201 Ayrton Senna edition from 1986 year with complete detailed dashboard and front seats - rest of interior wasn't been so detialed but looked decent. Exterior was detailed as much is possible and complete time was - 26h 31m 25seconds :). I did that 'coz i get similar question many times so i found free stopwatch for windows wiht ability to restart time when i start with modeling tommorow or later.

I hope that helps ;).

P.S. i'll send few new screngrabs of Ford F-150 details

[hrgiger]

You model the keyholes? That's awesome Lewis. I want to see a closeup of your subpatch keyholes! (I hope that didn't sound dirty).

Thanks again for your advice and info.

[Lewis]

Originally posted by hrgiger
You model the keyholes? That's awesome Lewis. I want to see a closeup of your subpatch keyholes! (I hope that didn't sound dirty).

Thanks again for your advice and info.

Yes i model keyholes :). Check my F-150 thread i just updated images and one is just for you to see keyhole in SubDs :).

[Barred]

HR out of interest where did you get the plans from?
The reason that I ask is that the Batmobile was the first object that I ever made using the model kit for reference. It was built in Imagine on the Amiga and the Batmobile just happened tobe there.

If I can find the original DXF I will send it to you for a giggle.
Regards

[Matt]

Usualy i try to find *.ai (or other vector format) for logo trough one of many logotype sites . . . . . . . but didn't found that "maserati" text logo

one of the best I've ever found is this one : http://logo.nino.ru

It also had the Maserati logo you were after!

Lewis I have a question for you . . . when you're adding detail, small holes, fine surface 'run outs' or split lines etc. how do you go about 'cutting' the detail in? Do you ever knife or stencil detail into panels etc. Or is it all modelled in?

Cheers
Matt

P.S. those latest screen grabs actually help a lot! you should write a book on sub-d modelling!!!

[hrgiger]

I found some real basic blueprints off some toy website.

One good thing to use is to actually get Batman and Batman Returns on DVD and do screengrabs from the movie for reference. There are some good reference pictures that OnStar used for their commercials(which were actually pretty cool).

Here are the basic blueprints I used:

[hrgiger]

SIDE VIEW

[hrgiger]

FRONT VIEW

[hrgiger]

BACK VIEW

[Mclaren]

I've seen those blueprints before, you can find bigger one's too (i had a few) that people use to build lifesize replicas of the car.

[Barred]

Thanks guys it is appreciated. I still have the model car but not the plans unfortunatly.

I will try and find my old mesh.

[Matt]

Originally posted by hrgiger
One good thing to use is to actually get Batman and Batman Returns on DVD and do screengrabs from the movie

giger - what do you use to capture, everything I've tried just leaves an empty black box!

I wanted to capture some stills from Robocop for my ED-209 model (when I start to do it!)

[hrgiger]

Matt,

I wish I could tell you exactly what I used because I was on my brothers computer when I took the screen grabs. However, I think you'll find that a lot of DVD players on computers have a screen grab button on the main control. I then would just paste it into photoshop (or in the case of my brothers computer, I would just slap it into MS paint, save it to a jpg, throw it on a floppy to transfer to my computer).

Also, I might try download.com and do a search for screen grab or screen capture. I used to use a freeware program for screengrabs from my media player.

[Lewis]

Originally posted by Matt
one of the best I've ever found is this one : http://logo.nino.ru

It also had the Maserati logo you were after!

Lewis I have a question for you . . . when you're adding detail, small holes, fine surface 'run outs' or split lines etc. how do you go about 'cutting' the detail in? Do you ever knife or stencil detail into panels etc. Or is it all modelled in?

Cheers
Matt

P.S. those latest screen grabs actually help a lot! you should write a book on sub-d modelling!!!

Hi Mat !

I have that site in bookmakrs but there is NO maserati TEXT logo i was searching. I needed that Italic wierd font where it writes Maserati on BACK of trunk and not this font under logo :). Also bare in mind that i modeled maserati 18 months ago :) -
Download my animation and look at 24th second of animation - you'll see what logo i'am talking about in action - http://www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/anims/Maserati_final_web.avi

or just look at this image to see it modeled.
http://www.lewis.tomsoft.hr/temp/maserati/Maserati_LOGO_1.jpg

I didn't saw that text on any of maserati logos available on logotype sites ?

BTW Matt - i almost never use knife to add detials but i do use stencil very often + manual welding and reshaping plygons after. If i need to cut few polygons i just do it with bandsaw and if i need to bandsaw only few polys i just hide or flip last polygon in row and bandsaw will stop there instead go around whole row :).

Book idea would be cool - who knows maybe one day ;).

[norvman]

Thanks Lewis for all this information on building Mechanical Objects in Sub Ds ... I have been trying to do that very thing and haven't been all that successful at it... I was about to give up on the idea when I read your thread....

Looks like I am inspired to try it again....

:)

[Lewis]

Thanks Lewis for all this information on building Mechanical Objects in Sub Ds ... I have been trying to do that very thing and haven't been all that successful at it... I was about to give up on the idea when I read your thread....

Looks like I am inspired to try it again....

:)

I'm Glad you got new inspiration :). If you need help be free to contact me.

[norvman]

Actually I did a Little Battle Mech in all Quads... that turned out pretty good... don't know if you would really want to see it or not...

[hrgiger]

I was surprised to see this thread pop up again. :)

[peteb]

Nice one Hrgiger. I love the batmobile and was thinking about modelling it but you've beaten me to it. I actually bought the detailed blueprints of the car when the second film was released. If you want I could scan them for you.? They're highly detailed and even have stuff like how the engine works.


Pete B

[hrgiger]

Absolutely peteb. That's be great. I plan on remodeling it one day so it's subpatch friendly. That'd be a great help.

[Lewis]

Actually I did a Little Battle Mech in all Quads... that turned out pretty good... don't know if you would really want to see it or not...

Why not show to all LW community :)? Start your own topic and show us (drop me a PM when you do)

:)

[norvman]

Okay Lewis here's the new thread...

http://vbulletin.newtek.com/showthread.php?p=250222#post250222

[Dark-Whisper]

Matt

- As has been mentioned most DVD software players have a screen capture facility. I know for certain PowerDVD has, as I have used it.

[wavemaster]

great model! do you plan on texturing it?

[pixym]

I really like spline cage workflow. There is one thing really missing: History